OT - Ndamukong Suh and Why the NFL Needs a Rookie Pay Scale
I don't know if Suh is a diva, or if his agents are just greedy. Either way, this is getting ridiculous. Supposedly he wants 6 years, $90 mil, with $56 mil guaranteed. I think there is no way he should get more than Stafford got ($72 mil, $41.7 mil guaranteed.) What do you guys think?
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_/id/14201/wait-ndamukong-suh-wants-how-much
Bradford was the higher draft pick, how could Suh want more? I thought the overall #1's deal set the bar for the lower picks?
Eugene Parker, one of Suh's agents, is the same guy that had Michael Crabtree hold out for the first part of last season, arguing that he should be the highest paid reciever, even though Darrius Heyward-Bey was picked ahead of him.
Eugene's client Crabtree made a great argument as to why he deserved more then Darrius Heyward-Bey.
Darrius Heyward-Bey 2009 Stats(11 Games Played):
9 Receptions 124 Yards 1 Td 13.8 Yd Avg
http://www.nfl.com/players/darriusheyward-bey/careerstats?id=HEY279111
Michael Crabtree 2009 Stats(11 Games Played):
48 Receptions 625 Yards 2 Td's 13.0 Yd Avg
http://www.nfl.com/players/michaelcrabtree/profile?id=CRA111040
I too hate the business side of the NFL, but i can appreciate the need for it. I am hoping that when the new CBA is finished, that a rookie pay scale is set. I think it would protect the teams and make the players play harder for the large pay days.(I.E. Jamarcus Russell).
Just my opinion, take it FWIW.
But Heyward-Bey should be getting more money because he has to play for the Raiders. C'mon, we all know this.
What difference does Bradford's salary make? Suh's agents could, very reasonably, argue that Suh would have been the first overall pick if the Lions had gone first (no way they would have taken Bradford (unless Millen was still around)). They could also argue that Suh will be more likely to have an immediate positive impact. Maybe Bradford's agents didn't push hard enough and Bradford could have gotten more.
Regardless of whether you agree with these arguments, the whole point of a sports agent is to get the maximum salary possible for his client. It's a negotiation - Suh's agents will ask for more than the Lions are willing to pay, because they want to get the maximum amount the Lions are willing to pay and they need room to negotiate.
Are NFL rookie contracts too high? Probably, but at the end of the day the teams are still signing on the dotted line, so it's their own fault.
Asking for more money does not a diva make. The NFL is a business - the Lions are going to use Suh to make as much money as possible, so he'd be a fool to not get as much as they are willing to pay. As others have said, I'll change my opinion if Suh actually starts making an ass of himself, but there is a big gulf between asking for a bigger contract and changing your name to Ochocinco.
you weren't the #1 pick, you are not going to be enough of a difference maker where you can strongarm us into a huge contract this season and if you want to take your chances with the new contract provisions next year and hold out, more power to you.
the lions would win one, maybe two more games with Suh this season and are still not a playoff contender. they have all the time in the world. i like that he showed up for OTAs but this is a bit much.
Queue rookie pay scale in the next CBA. Much needed.
suh isn't a diva. his agent is just trying to get the most out of the market.
i dont completely blame him for trying to get the money - i mean i would try and get the money if i were in a profession where the vast majority of my earning potential was tied directly to my health. and my health was constantly threatened by on-the-job dangers.
i dont think he'll get that much money, but this is capitalism. he'll get whatever the market will offer him. and he'll try his hardest to get the best deal for himself. im sure he'll make it into camp quickly.
now if he pulls a jamarcus and holds out forever, then i'll start changing my opinions.
I think they get paid way too much without proving anything in the NFL.
Just realized my headline should read "Pay Scale".
If it bothers you, edit it.
For some reason I was thinking it was like a comment, and couldn't be edited after replied to.
GM's need to crack down on this a bit. If he doesn't want to play for a lesser (but still rediculous) amount of money, then let him sit and get nothing. It's not like the Lions are a Super Bowl contender this year. Send a message that they're not going to deal with this crap.
That worked so well for the Raiders.
so the Lions let him sit out for the season, lose his draft rights after a year and lose him in the 2011 draft, making their second overall pick a total waste. sounds like a great strategy for running a football team
And letting agents/players dictate dangerous contracts isn't the right answer either. I'm just saying that playing hardball, at least for a little while, might not be a bad idea. I'm not saying the GM should hold out for league minimum, but a reasonable contract doesn't seem that far fetched.
I obviously understand the agent's job, but drama like this makes professional sports frustrating to follow.
Considering there is going to be in all likelihood a lockout in 2011, the Lions can hold their ground and say look, take what we're going to offer, or you can sit out all of 2010 with no money, and then when/if you get drafted in 2011 it will be in a new pay scale system, you won't be the #2 pick, and you won't be getting as much. Not to mention that you probably won't see any of that money until the lockout is settled sometime deep into the 2011 season.
By holding out for a prolonged period of time, Suh is losing money. If the Lions want to be real assholes to Suh and his agent they can basically guarantee he won't see a dime for well over a year. And given the way things are going to change, not committing $45+ million to a DT over the next 5-6 years wouldn't neccessarily be a bad thing for the Lions. Its not like Suh is going to be the difference in them making the playoffs this year or even next year.
I agree on the need for some sort of cap on rookie compensation. But you'll have to explain to me how wanting to get paid as much as possible makes someone a "diva."
It isn't like he's promising a lengthy hold-out, and isn't raising a stink in the media. This is a negotiation; Suh's agent says "90 million, 56 million guaranteed." The Lions respond with "HA. We'll pay him 50 million over 6 years with 30 million guaranteed," and they settle on something like $65 million, with 35-40 million guaranteed. The article even says that the number "likely represent a negotiating tactic rather than a hard-line from agents Roosevelt Barnes and Eugene Parker." Plus, you never know how much they might be willing to pay. This is the Lions we're talking about.
If you thought your employer would pay you more, would you accept less without at least asking him to pay you the larger amount?
I just wish they could've done this a week ago, so they could've met somewhere in the middle, and Suh would've been to training camp on time. I'll admit, if he signs within the next couple days, there's probably not much harm done. I just don't want negotiations to go on late into preseason, or even the season.
But I suppose there isn't much incentive for the team to cave to a higher number before there's a risk that they might not have him at camp.
....it's because it's the Detroit Lions. SUh wants as much money up front because he knows he's going to be a bust!
This is the result of the NFLPA and NFL Owners negotiating contracts. Everyone realizes this is a problem and paying a 1st pick that much is dangerous, but that's the way the game is played.
Suh getting more than Staffors is simply the result of an extra year's NFL inflation.
I suppose, but he also wants more than first overall pick Sam Bradford. His agents have a reputation of basically saying "F**k it, we don't care where our player was picked," and trying to get a contract based on how good they feel the player is.
That's how agents should negotiate...
Who would have been the #1 pick if the Rams hadn't sucked a little more than the Lions last year?
I don't disagree, however there was some debate about Suh being the best player/DT in the draft. There were people that thought McCoy was better than Suh. And that's the problem with negotiating that way. Obviously you think your client is the best. That doesn't mean everyone does.
It's really just passing the buck, saying "It's not my fault!"
I have a hard time feeling anything other than disgust for both sides. Not necessarily at Suh specifically, but entitled professional athletes, their sycophant agents, attention-whoring news networks and the greedy owners.
Around this time of year I need a reminder why I watch very little pro sports anymore. But I'm in the middle of the new Tebow mania, and I can barely turn around without seeing/hearing about that guy.
I agree that at the moment this appears to be posturing by the agent. I'd be stunned if Suh isn't in camp early this week. If this is still an issue a week from today, we've got a problem.
And re: a rookie cap, the NFL owners appear to be willing to burn an entire NFL season over getting one. Next offseason is going to be a rough one. Enjoy the NFL this fall, boys. It might be a while before we see it again.
That's okay. I'll watch the kind of football where the only pay is an opportunity to learn and get a college degree.
And a sweet house for your parents and a free Impala?
That's a "USC Exclusive" benefits package.
How can a DT (an unproven one at that) get 13 million a year. This whole system is problem how can Darrell Revis the best CB in the league (no disrespect to Woodson) have to fight to get 12 million a year but Suh might get 13 million a year. If the Jets traded Suh for Revis everyone would say the Jets are crazy yet Suh is going to make more money.
This happens in all sports...
and a good DT brings in more value to a franchise than the best CB. Elite CBs are a dime a dozen these days...
If elite CBs are a dime a dozen, why can't the Lions find even a serviceable one? I mean, other than the fact that they are the Lions.
Because they haven't drafted any and Detroit is a tough sell.. so you won't be convincing many free agents to go and play there.
If he was a free agent he would earn much more, therefore he has a right to make whatever contract demands he desires. The NFL's player union is weak. If a player doesn't use leverage whenever he has it, his agent is doing that individual a disservice. The Lions won't hesitate to cut players they deem overpaid, so Suh has to get paid when he can.
That's the one caveat with the NFL is that a player can be cut. There is usually a certain amount of gauranteed money, but it really defeats the purpose of a "contract".
I remember reading that top picks are generally albatrosses unless they quickly become pro bowl caliber players. That's why so many people were reluctant to pick a DT so high. The second pick commands solid QB money, which is more than just about any DT in the league.
Looking more and more like Glenn is doing the stealing here.
... that was a bad pick from the begining. He lost everything he had after that chop block against auburn ruined his knee, I don't know how an NFL scout couldn't see it.
... It's expected that the clients of certain agents will have similar tendencies. Suh's agent is eugene parker, who represents michael crabtree (heldout), Devin hester (heldout), cedric benson (heldout), and a few other high profile players. This is what he does, he also made larry fitzgerld the highest paid rookie in the 2004 class after he was picked 3rd. I don't like it, but he is not my least favorite agent. i thnk i have a tie for first between scott boras and drew rosenhaus
I'm 100 percent in agreement that there should be a rookie cap. It would have to be negotiated as part of the new contract to be legal. I am guessing the owners would be in favor because they wouldn't be throwing money away at potential, and the players would be in favor because it would leave more of the money for them. That leaves only those who profit the most, the agents, as those who would be against it.
I think it is very safe to say that agents will do all they can to convince players that a rookie cap would somehow be infringing upon their rights. If the NFLPA is smart, they will pretend to be against it and use it as a bargaining chip for something like all contracts being guaranteed.
No matter what happens with a rookie pay scale, agents will still get their share of the pie from the current NFL players. If less money goes to rookies, then more will go to the vets, and either way, the agents win. In fact, with a slotted system like the NBA uses for drafted rookies, the agents would more-or-less just have to collect their check for wherever their clients get drafted. It would take all of the work out of haggling for every last dime for them.
as much as the vets hate the fact that the rookies get paid so much money without ever playing a single down, they won't be opposed to the draft pay scale slot like the NBA because they will get paid more money than the top pick if they have been proven to be one of the better player in the league.
The players using a rookie cap as a bargaining chip in order for them to get more money is ethically wrong because the players that stand to get negatively impacted from that decision will have no representation.
The NFL player's union is for NFL players. Not kids in the NCAA. No matter how blurred the line is between the NFL and the NCAA, the union is only for the guys in the NFL. And with the way their union has things set up now, a huge chunk of the profit pie is going to guys that only enter their union the moment they put pen to paper on their new contracts. Every NFL player should be in favor of a rookie cap because it would mean more money for them.
edit*
nm...
Actually, the point of a union is to benefit the members of the union, not people outside of the union.
On another note, a rookie cap might help competitive balance by making the high draft picks more affordable/tradeable.
Footballs players have the rawest deal of any pro atheletes. They have shorter careers, large sums of non-guaranteed money larded into their contracts, and the absolute worst pension plans. So a guy who's going to have 350+ pounders crushing him 60+ times a game wants to make as much money as possible? SHOCKING.
I'm not arguing that the Lions should pay it, or that it's a sensible number. I'm merely saying that trying to make as money as he can, in his position, isn't "greed", or "being a diva". When you guys get a new job, do you try to maximize your salary?