OT - My Trip to Michigan so far
Damn dude, you missed out. Glad you finally can experience them though. I'll be sad when I move out of Michigan this year.
Mayweathers gonna punish Mosley tomorrow, and then hopefully Pacquiao decides to agree to drug testing and Mayweather can get in that ass.
wow, MMA really has put a lot of pressure on them.
How does it feel to get ripped off buying an over hyped deli sandwich? :P Don't get me wrong, I trekked from MOJO through the damn snow in freezing weather on Sunday's to treat myself but that deli is a tad over rated. My brother is so in love with the place that my sister in law will have it flown cross country so he can have their turkey and honey mustard on his birthday. I'll stick to my Hungary Howies flavored crust pizza.
I'm afraid I have to agree. I mean, they are fine sandwiches, but I think it is more about the tradition and hype than it actually being the best sandwiches on the planet.
what does Hungary Howies pizza have in it? kebab?
...authentic Gypsie blood in it instead of the processed crap!
More likely lard. Lots and lots of lard. Can't get enough tasty animal fat and garlic!
Yeah, I only had Zingerman's once in my 4 years in AA... it was definitely overpriced. I think that Maize and Blue on south U has sandwiches that are just as good if not better, just cheaper.
Zing's is all that, i think it just depends on how you look at it. I can see why it might be over-hyped and too expensive for some.
Personally, I live in San Fran and am surrounded by some of the best, and cheapest, food the world has to offer and Zingermann's still factors into my favorite food list.
I grew up eating them on various games days as a kid (alternating with Blimpy Burgers) and then all throughout my time as a student and there areb times when i crave them here in California b/c there is nothing remotely like it here. Yes, I have had them flown in on occasion.
Z's is more than just the sandwiches also, the deli stuff, breads, cheeses, fish, etc., etc. are all pretty unique and delicious.
My $0.02.
I do not know how, but I grew up within 30 min of AA, both my parents graduated from UofM, I graduated from UofM, and i STILL have NEVER been to Zingerman's. Do not ask me how or why this could have happened, but at this point, I think I may have to ride it out just because it's so idiotic.
Buzz, your girlfriend ... WOOF
I have no relationship with Zingerman's, its Community of Businesses, Ari Weinzweig, Paul Saginaw or any other employee of that company. However, I've studied their business model extensively since I'm a business consultant by profession, and I am firmly committed to how the ZCoB does business.
Yes, Zingerman's might seem higher priced than most places for what you get, (I mean, do you really need a sandwich made from "free-range" mustard that's so expensive it could be traded on a merchantile exchange?). However, its important to keep in mind a few things about how Z's set its prices:
1. They don't pay slave wages. Zingerman's is very clear on its policies regarding its employee's salaries. They are much closer to a "living wage" than folks working at the local McDonald's.
2. "Sustainability" costs money. The products they source are made by small purveyors who use sustainable farming and manufacturing methods. It is more expensive up front and, (I think) the results are in the taste.
3. They are providing health insurance and other benefits that businesses of its type almost never provide.
In other words, you really do get what you pay for.
not just sustainability, but also locality - they get a lot of their supply from local farms etc - e.g. calder dairy
you really have to give them credit for committing to ann arbor and not franchising. this was an intentional decision.
quality, quality, quality. if you don't notice the difference, then by all means, don't pay the extra money. most people eat food looking for a mish mash of tastes. if you pay attention to the ingredients, you'll find that every ingredient they use is high quality. at least, that's how i ended up getting hooked. the bacon they make there may be the best thing i've ever tasted.
you should try the bacon at sparrows market in kerrytown, its amazing
Zingerman's is truly involved in the community, it's not just lip service. Zingerman's is overpriced, but they readily admit that. They offer things that you can't find anywhere else around here, and if you can it's not all in the same place. Don't forget to sample several of the $30 per lb cheeses, that always bumps up the value for my experience.
...Zingerman's create a Dollar Menu for us cheapskates?
the workers higher wages and insurance benefits don't help me get what i paid for, so in reality i'm not getting what i paid for when I can get the same "sustainable" oysters from small oyster farms at whole foods for 1/4 the price or at real seafood for 1/2 the price. there are a lot of great places in ann arbor to eat that you can't find anywhere else, its just that zingermans isn't one of them ($30 for a rack of ribs, c'mon)
beer is cheaper at the grocery store and drank at home.
sex is cheaper when it's someone you're dating or married to.
food is cheaper when it's from a lower quality provider.
however, if you take a girl out for drinks and some food from zingerman's... well my friend, it might just balance the ledger.
what im saying is that the oysters from whole foods or real seafood aren't lower quality, just more expensive. and the ribs aren't that good, so how does so-so ribs end up being higher quality?
You will not find ribs or oysters at Zingerman's Deli, which is what most people think of when they hear "Zingerman's". You will find those items, and plenty more, at Zingerman's Roadhouse.
The ribs, and much of the pork served at Zingerman's (both Deli and Roadhouse) is supplied by Niman Ranch, a network of family farms in Iowa. Many, many food critics regard Niman Ranch as having the best pork available in North America. They also use sustainable agricultural methods.
If you don't like the ribs at Zingerman's, it is therefore the preparation, not the meat itself. And, you're not going to find Niman Ranch ribs on the menu at Applebees.
But, all of that is beside the point. You cannot fairly compare what you buy in a store like Whole Foods to what you buy at a place like Zingerman's. They are two entirely different types of businesses, with different overhead costs, etc. In case it hadn't occurred to you before, check the prices of a bottle of wine sometime. Same grape, same vintage, same vintner will be 2-3X in a restaurant versus what you will pay in a store.
While it is fair to compare the prices of similar items at Real Seafood to Zingerman's Roadhouse (both are restaurants) I can assure you that the employees at Real Seafood are earning a fraction of the wages and benefits paid at Zingerman's. They are also much more reliant on tips, whereas the base salaries at Zingerman's are reflected in the menu prices.
Finally, if you don't understand the reasons for the higher prices, vote with your wallet. That's your right. But, next time you're marching for "sustainable" this-or-that, cap-and-trade policies, etc., think about whether you're putting your money where your mouth is.
All I know is that Zingerman's makes some freaking delicious sandwiches. I'm willing to pay the price regardless of how or where the meat and mustard come from. Oh, and the service is great.
April 30th, 2010 at 10:15 PM ^
I'm not sure what you aren't understanding, im not complaining about the incoming product, i'm complaining about the markup when the food comes out to my table. why do i care about the wages of the workers there? do I work there? I can get MUCH better ribs at Slows in detroit, let alone st. louis, MO or Memphis, TN, and get them cheaper. so if I go to zingermans and the overhead costs cause me to overpay for food, why would I go there? why would anyone go there? its just like anyother designer product, you're just paying for the name. you take somebody to zingermans and they are like "oooh, zingermans, you must be well versed in food" . this is just another example of some of the people here thinking that ann arbor is the mecca of sophistication.
You say that about married sex, and yet....well, I guess it is cheaper in bulk.
There is no such thing as "married sex in bulk" unless you're a Mormon.
April 30th, 2010 at 10:22 PM ^
Tru dat, my brother lives in SF and has friends that work there and they do alright and really, really enjoy what they do.
I'll back that and take my business to places like that any time I can.
The same is somewhat true of Whole Foods, I used to piss and moan about their prices and considered it just a result of yuppification, but the more I understood their policies and the basis for the pricing (sourcing locally, providing better rev share to growers, supporting sustainable methods), the less I pissed and moaned.
I also try to shy away from businesses that do the opposite, i had never set foot in a Wal-Mart until last X-mas, but that was only b/c it was the only place open and i had to gtet a part to fix my mom's toilet that was leaking.
When you go back to Ann Arbor after having graduated and worked for a few years, it's like a whole new world. I went back for the Spring Game this year and afterwards, I went out to eat on Main Street. I guess when you're on a student budget and paying your way through school, eating at the Prickly Pear vs. Hello Faz is a pretty easy choice.
on Stadium and Maple (near Jackson) is definitely worth going to. Ari and Paul often wait tables and the family teamwork is great. No question they are involved in the community and the community is better for it.
will swing by Zingerman's Roadhouse and order waffles?
Was never crazy about Zingerman's when I was at UM (always pricey for a student), but I have to say that eating there with a bit more change in my pocket changed my mind. The sandwiches are a mixed bag, but the meat selection is great and you really do feel like the community benefits from having them there versus, say, a Pot Belly Sandwich or similar chain.
Something else I totally overlooked when I was a student was just how beautiful central campus/the Diag is at night in the spring. Just walking from the law school to the Diag reminds you how a college should look.
April 30th, 2010 at 10:18 PM ^
I want to go back.
I don't know a single person I went to UM with that didn't think when they left after graduating that they appreciated the campus and Ann Arbor sufficiently, only to find that when they went back after several years later that they did not.
I grew up visiting Ann Arbor all the time b/c my parents met there and even though we lived near East Lansing, my parents loved and still love, Ann Arbor and the campus and pretty much everything about U of M. I remember so many football games and Art Fairs and day trips and such during my childhood and loved Ann Arbor before I ever went to Michigan. Then, as a student i got a completely different perspective and fell even more in love with the town.
After I graduated, I thought I had had enough of Ann Arbor and took off to California and though I came back to Michigan periodically for holidays and such, I didn't really make it back to Ann Arbor for several years, until my brother (who also went there), got married and moved back there. I walked around the town in early fall and I realized just how much I missed it and while I am not typically an envious person, I envied all the students I saw that day and the time they still had left there.
I am 42 now, I have lived in London (twice), Zurich, Paris, spent 2 years traveling throughout Central and South America, I have been to Cuba, all over Europe and some of Asia and I still have never been anywhere that I love as much as Ann Arbor.
As the the father of a 5 year old boy here in San Francisco (who already knows the fight song), it would be my dearest wish that he attend UM and fall in love with it the same way I did. My fingers are crossed and I will be ponying up for plane tix and game seats to be sure the seed is planted.
To those who are still students there, relish your time b/c you will miss it someday more than you know. to those that get to live there, you are lucky bastards ;)
I'm someone who ended up staying in Ann Arbor after I finished school. Although I didn't intend for that to be the case, I pretty much love it here. (Be warned, I feel some nostalgia-waxing coming on...) I've at times gotten irritated at how the city has changed over the past 23 years (and continues to). I'm not too thrilled about the emergence of chain stores/bars/restaurants downtown. In 1986, there was very little of that. And some of the architectural changes.... blech. Still, one of my favorite things to do is walk around downtown in the winter, when there's snow on the ground, it's about 15F out, and maybe a scattered flurry. Ann Arbor is a beautiful place in many ways. I think I'll stay. Besides, leaving here and giving up football Saturdays... unthinkable. Although if they ever tear down the Fleetwood Diner, I'm outta here.
As for Zingerman's... yeah I think the average sandwich was about 7 or 8 bucks when I moved here, and we complained about it then, too. I go there a couple times a year, mainly because one of my gameday buds usually wants to go when he's in town. I always get the same thing, because I'm just not sure anywhere else in town makes this particular sandwich... at least not quite like Z's does. It's the D-$'s Cuban Conudrum. (If you're familiar and know where in town I might try something similar, I'd love to hear it. And also how the hell I'm supposed to verbalize "D-$'s" when I order.) I don't mind that I paid $15.50 for it last time I had it because it is SO DAMN GOOD. I will say, though, that their pricing is a discussion had every time we go there.