They got their stadium and once again they're saying suck it to Marlins fans. It's pretty amazing what they did.
Insert pic of snake oil here.
They got their stadium and once again they're saying suck it to Marlins fans. It's pretty amazing what they did.
Insert pic of snake oil here.
Not to hijack, but Torii Hunter is also in Detroit meeting with the Tigers. That would be a good get.
Hopefully he has got one more good in him. I don't want another Johny Damon.
He'd be a perfect fit, he's the ideal 2 hole hitter and immediately upgrades our defense, I don't expect him to sustain the .389 BABIP he had last year but if his average stays around .280 it's just what the Tigers need.
Eh, I don't really see him as a #2 hitter, preferrably you'd like to see a player with some speed there to avoid double plays. Now if they could somehow get Bourne, and slide Jackson to the #2 hole, that would be awesome.
Disagree. Torii is a perfect fit for the Tigers at the 2-hole. He will be a cat-bird just like Anaheim, between Jackson, Cabrera, and Fielder. Even considering a .280 BA is more plausible, he clobbers left-handed pitching, and the Tigers need that. When you consider the financial side that seals it. Bourn, Pagan, Swisher and others all are going to want long contracts, which the Tigers should avoid right now. He’ll come with a 2 yr contract & maybe an option, just long enough to cover and not be saddled with another prolonged aging contract. He is great defensively, and can tutor Jackson as he did Trout. Has some pop, and enough speed. Plus is a strong, vocal, veteran leader in the clubhouse. An asset the Tigers needed desperately after losing Vmart. (My only concern is I hope they don’t clash, but doubt they will) As soon as I heard the Angels didn’t offer Hunter, I was knew he was the perfect get at the right cost.
I'd be happy with Hunter in Detroit. That all depends on the contract length he wants. It would certainly give Leyland a good outfield with plenty of pieces to mix and match. I assume Garcia makes the big club: Jackson, Hunter, Dirks/Garcia.
Now he’d REALLY be a good get, if he likes Detroit so much he wants Torii Jr. to switch and be a Wolverine WR. /s
Alvarez and Nicolino are good prospects, but this is pretty crazy. Interesting to see if they go after Hamilton now, or if they really did just sign all these guys last year to get the stadium. I certainly wouldn't put it past Loria.
No way they go after Hamilton. They would have to spend money to do that. Unless, they backload the contract and then trade him right when they need to pay him what he is worth... oh, that is what they just did with Reyes. Yeah... you may have a point.
Actually the best prospect in the deal is probably Marisnick. This deal really sucks for Miami baseball, especially after they finally gave Loria his domed stadium. I do, however, note that three years from now, people might look back on this deal as a piece of genius: Buerhle is getting up there in age; Johnson and Bonifacio have injury issues; Reyes was not a $20 million player in 2012; and Buck is, well, Buck. If a couple of the prospects pan out, the Marlins might be sitting pretty in 2015 with guys like Jose Fernandez and Christian Yelich in the pipeline.
No way! Miami wouldn’t get Hamilton. Not unless they guarantee him all GROSS stadium receipts of the next few years. Would have to be front-loaded, not back, because Loria would never be trusted again to not have another fire sale. (I hear Giancarlo is livid about the trade.)
Miami has shot themselves in the foot. The only way they EVER get significant free agents is with Tony Montana included on their negotiating team. Otherwise, they will always have to include a massive premium to induce a signing or there has to be something significant detriment to the player signing elsewhere. (maybe a Melky situation)
Jays fans have to be dancin’ in the streets as this addresses most of their needs with quality not just band-aids. Including swapping out Escobar. Makes them a huge player in AL East.
The problem is he isn't an All Star without the drugs. If wanting to prove you're good is all it takes he wouldn't have had to juice.
Braves fan here. Simply put, you don't want that POS.
As a tiger fan I would love to see Michael Bourne in Detroit.
More pressing question: Do you want Jason Bourne?
But seriously, I have no idea how Loria conned Miami into paying for that place. Guy always has been and always will be a cheapskate perfectly content to field uncompetitive teams as long as he's making his money.
Well uhh you can have Michael Bourne and we'll keep Micahel Bourn. Sound Fair?
Neither of these dudes are the one you want.
So I wonder what the asking price is for Giancarlo Stanton then, might as well see if they'll take Castellanos and Garcia. The Marlins got boned in the returns on this deal.
Why would they trade Stanton right now? He is a cheap player (for his ability).
Because he's pissed and doubtless wants out.
I'm actually semi pissed off that the Tigers wern't the ones making this trade, I mean the Marlins are basically the Tigers farm team.
I agree with this. Johnson and Reyes would have been boss in Detroit.
They would, but at the same time the Tigers probably wouldn't increase the payroll to acquire yet another $20 million player in Reyes. As much as Iliitch is putting into this team I don't think he would have increased payroll to that sort of level with acquiring Reyes, Buerhle, and Johnson.
I agree 100 percent. In addition, with the Tiger's working on re-signing Sanchez, we clearly wouldn't have room for both Buerhle and Johnson. If we can get Sanchez to stick around, I'm totally fine without cherry-picking the marlins here. We currently have awesome depth at SP.
Realistically at the end of the season I thought we had a good chance at keeping Anibal but after reading this http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/winter-meetings-anibal-sanchez-free-agent-contract-110812 I'm not so sure he'll be back.
Regardless the Tigers have a little bit of money to play with still, so hopefully they get another bullpen arm and maybe some catching depth with Laird likely to seek more playing time from another team (this is assuming we sign Torii Hunter as well, which looks more and more likely everyday.)
15 million a year for 6 years. Guh. Maybe not at that price.
I hope we don't sign a closer since you pretty much have to overpay. Sign a bunch of low risk, low money guys and hope one or two work out for bullpen depth. Sit Coke, Benoit, Dotel and Bruce Rondon down together and say "who wants to close?"
I will be pissed if they bring him back for that....THAT IS ROBBERY. He is at best a number 2 starter and at worst, a number 4. No way do you pay him ace money
Not sure I'd call the Marlins' situation a "plight" as it implies it's not their fault. Jeff Loria is the best in the world at running a franchise into the ground while siphoning off every last cent.
they have been doing it for every few years. Not exactly running them into the ground. They always find ways to field teams playing above .500 ball.
Marlins are 569-564 under Loria. While you are correct, they are only 5 games over .500.
Firesale --> slowly rebuild --> playoff team --> WS --> Profit --> Repeat process
Not saying it's wrong, but they keep coming back with young players and then trade them away at their peak value or close to it. Their biggest mistake, trading away Miggy to Tigers and got literally nothing other than trading away Willis contract.
Yes, if I was the Marlins fan, I'd be tired of it.
may face serious pressure in their division, as if they didn't this year. But the Orioles and Blue Jays are coming.
...have really looked oold the past few years. I don't know how they've managed to hang on but it wouldn't shock me in the least if they finally crashed in 2013 and finished 3rd or worse in the East.
They could fall to third, but anything lower than that I think would be unlikely. I expect to see Baltimore regress next year. They are not going to win that many 1 run and extra inning games again. The Yankees are going to spend a bit less then then they usually do to get under the luxury tax threshold in I believe it is 2014 to avoid the most punitive tax. I'd expect them to go on a spending spree after that, especially with Soriano and Swisher off the books this year and possibly Granderson the year after.
would love to see MLB get rid of a couple teams. Miami would be a great place to start.
Just play the all-star game in the nice stadium but get rid of their team. Hell nobody wants to even watch Tampa and they are pretty good.
It's not accurate to say that no one watches Tampa Bay, but rather that no one wants to go watch Tampa Bay. Plenty of TV viewership, but no wants to actually go their games. Understandably.
...they been around for a few years now but I still find it baffling that Florida has a baseball team. Guess I'm just old fashioned.
Isn't this going to be the Marlins' 20th season upcoming? The Rays are at about 15, as well.
The Marlins find a way to build the team up for 2 or so years then replenish. They've won 2 world series since their inception.
Also, their fans just don't show up, for starters. Maybe it's because they sucked this year, or maybe because fans in Miami just have better things to do in the summer.
That said, I don't get how hot/cold they can be. Last season was the exact opposite approach to managing a team... with long-term deals.
EDIT: more random notes... the Marlins are the only thing that stood in the way from the Yankees winning the WS for 1996 - 2000. If you factor in another expansion team (D-Backs in 2001) they both helped prevent the most dominant streak in modern US Sports (potentially ever)
The 1997 Indians beg to differ
What ChopBlock said. Not only did the Yankees not play in the World Series, but they lost in the ALDS. Would have had to go through Baltimore if they had beat the Indians.
I've been saying for over a decade that baseball needed to contract two teams at least. Especiallynow that the Astros have moved to the American league meaning there's an odd number of teams in each league and every day will feature an interleague matchup.
There are some teams that simply don't have the fan support regardless of their talent. Some of the places with crappy attendance actually have decent franchises, but no one comes to see them. Oakland was a crazy environment in the playoffs and down the stretch, but for years they've drawn fewer than 20,000 per game, while a half dozen teams are doubling that.
Even Tampa Bay has been a competitive team but struggles to draw over 24,000.
I personally think MLB has 24 markets that can sustain major league baseball.
My recommendation would be to contract to 24 teams, increase rosters to 27 or 28 players, and put an end to guys like Ryan Raburn ever starting baseball games at the major league level. More teams would be competing because theorhetically the talent gap would be smaller (I'm guessing more players would rather start on some team than ride the bench on a loaded team).
Most of the lower attendance teams are in warm weather cities. Marlins, Rays, Diamondbacks, Astros, Athletics, and Mariners. Perhaps MLB should start the season a week or two earlier but instead of having games in Japan, have these fairer weather cities host games the first 2-3 weeks (with some other teams like the Braves, Rangers, Giants, Padres, Dodgers, Angels, etc. hosting home openers) Even it out so no team got an unfair number of home games and divide the revenue between the 24 teams while investing some into the stadiums that host the games - perhaps letting the reform impact the minor league system and having stronger minor league teams at the top level playing in some of the fringe major-league markets.
Roll out a draft to distribute the players in these systems through the rest and allow all their coaches and scouts to be free agents. I promise you would see better baseball and scarcity would drive demand.
Agreed. And in my estimation expanding the playoffs was a horrible idea.
1) Since when is Seattle a warm weather city? Maybe in 50 years w/ global warming ...
2) The Mariners may have had lower attendance last year, but I don't think it has been persistently low like those other teams.
"Toronto is reportedly set to receive shortstop Jose Reyes, catcher John Buck, infielder Emilio Bonifacio and pitchers Josh Johnson and Mark Buehrle, a roster infusion that immediately makes the team a serious contender for the AL East in 2013. In exchange, the Marlins will receive (among others) shorstop Yunel Escobar, shortstop Adeiny Hechavarria, starting pitcher Henderson Alvarez, catcher Jeff Mathis, pitching prospect Justin Nicolino and tens of millions of dollars cut from the team's payroll."
So, if I understand this correctly, the Marlins are pretty much trading Dade County are the southern half of Broward for Etobicoke and part of North York. I dare say that the Blue Jays may have just become next year's Baltimore Orioles. It seems to me like this is an abdication of the goals stated by the organization coming into last season by signing the A-list players that they did, and if I were a Marlins fan, that would be infuriating to me.
Of course, we're talking about the same Jeff Loria that helped the league and former Marlins owner John Henry create "Expos Baseball, LP", and the same Jeff Loria who then sold the Expos to the partnership, making them a ward of the MLB. Of course, Henry then sold the Marlins to Loria, and Henry bought the then owner-seeking Red Sox. Loria then moved the Expos' management to Florida, essentially abandoning them in Montreal. As a parting shot to Canadians, Loria also announced that the Expos would be no more on Rememberance Day (Veterans Day in the US), and not shockingly, they remember Jeff Loria.
Yep. He is loathed in Montreal. His ownership group destroyed the viability of the Expos, allowing local TV contracts to expire without renewal (how do you have a major sports team with no TV rights?) and dumping every quality player on the roster. It is criminal that MLB allowed him to take over a new franchise.
The trade will help the Jays next year, but Johnson is a free agent after that and considering what guys like CJ Wilson got he'll be looking at a 5 or 6 year deal for probabllly over 100 million. Take a look at Buerhle and Reyes contracts. They are good this year but after that they become awful. Buerhle's last 2 years are for 18 and 19 million. Reyes last 3 years are all worth 22 million.
I LOVED the Marlins as a kid. Every fire sale has steadily killed my fandom. I can't name 2 players on that team anymore. I probably couldn't name more than 4 for any MLB team either.
You need to read the thread better mejunglechop, you should be able to name at least 5 players. Yunel Escobar, Adeiny Hechavarria, Henderson Alvarez, Jeff Mathis, and Justin Nicolino.
Never heard of them.
The Marlina are also expected to unload Ricky Nolasco as well. From their opening day roster they have traded I think it is 11 of the 12 largest salaries on the team from last year.
Tigers just signed Hunter, so this might be moot thread now.
Tigers need to extend Verlander, Scherzer and Fister. Find two or three buy low SP, and find a closer that, you know, closes games out. They need to non-tender Boesch, Raburn and Porcello, and grab better bench players or get some young champs some time.
The FA market is tough this year, and several average players will get way too much money. Got to be smart.
The defense won't woo any one, but it will be enough to get the job done. If V-Mart comes back to his old self, Tigers will be tough again next year.
tag line, are you a truck driver?