The work ethic factor is a
the best way to judge
the best way to judge character is to ask a guy if his mom has or ever has had sex in exchange for money.
sports talk radio BLARGH!
It's impossible to evaluate
It's impossible to evaluate how a certain kid will react when signing a contract worth 50+ million dollars. That type of thing can have many different effects on different people, sometimes it gives them motivation to prove they're worth it, sometimes it makes them think they've already made it and no longer have to put in the work.
Also, I have a problem with the players who hold out after being drafted. That says something, I think. Maybe it's not as correlative as I think, but to me it says something.
I always thought so, too
The league is definitely a "get your money while you can" league, since the risk of injury is so high, but do you really think if you get injured your first year and never recover, you were worth that extra 5M you were holding out for?
Umm, how do you evaluate
Umm, how do you evaluate intangibles again?
Are you a park ranger at Yellowstone? Say hi to Yogi Bear for me. - the_big_house 500th
I may not be a 70 year old man. - Herm
According to most of the same
According to most of the same NFL gurus Tim Tebow's intangibles were off the charts. I'm not sure that makes sense, but I read it repeatedly prior to the draft.
Oui
He had that je ne sais quoi.
well his college play wasnt
well his college play wasnt entirely horrific. i dont think anyone would have guessed he would be so awful. scouts and analysts will never be 100 percent correct, now matter how close Mel Kiper is to being Robert Goulet.
Agreed, but its one thing to
Agreed, but its one thing to say that a 1st-rounder should have been a mid-to-late rounder in retrospect, or to say a mid-to-late rounder should have gone undrafted.
But its quite another for the concensus #1 pick to turn out to not even have the level of talent needed to play in the league.
The buzz all week has been that Russell mad end up dethroning Leaf.
Every time an MGoBoard poster complains about a thread topic, God kills a baby panda.
IIRC, he wasn't supposed to
IIRC, he wasn't supposed to be the top QB in the draft. But after the college season ended, he jumped with his "measurables" and his arm strength. I think there were questions about his conditioning and QB-intelligence. It exposes a huge weakness in the people who make decisions based heavily on the combine and individual workouts. Essentially he worked his ass off to do well in, essentially, 2 major workouts and shot up the draft board. Hindsight is 20/20, but I really don't ever remember thinking "This guy could be a hotshot in the NFL" based on his college game.
I thought one of the ESPN
I thought one of the ESPN "gurus" said that Jamarcus was the most sure bet to be a top NFL QB since Elway....
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Discussions that aims to find facts, highlight different points of view and strengthen opinion.
Mel Kiper said that
He said he'd be a top five QB within... Right now.
I never saw it.
also...
kiffin never wanted to draft him... he told al davis that he couldn't win with him at QB and davis didn't care and told the GM to draft russell...
I really think NFL coaches
Obviously. . .
Now good luck trying to convince Warren of that.
T
The man has all the
The man has all the measurables to be a great nfl qb, but like Dark Blue said, he just doesn't have the work ethic or devotion needed to reach his potential. Talent will only get you so far...
There are any number of
There are any number of things that could contribute to players not living up to their hype/potential. The huge leap in quality of the competition and how players respond to the increase in personal responsibility are just the first two the popped into my head.
Scouts obviously consider these things, but it's just a matter of not being 100%. I don't know much about Russell specifically, but scouts probably just over estimated how well they thought he'd transition. Humans are complicated (and thus somewhat unpredictable) animals.
Now someone like Charles Rogers, on the other hand, should have had a massive red flag waving over his head since his high school days.
i think it's simple really.
i think it's simple really. people get lost in the idea that great physical ability wins out. turns out that in the pros, especially at QB, you have to have it between the ears to go along with good physical talent.
go blue go
New job?
I wonder if someone will try him at TE or H-back? He would have to lose a little weight, though.
How could so many
How could so many teams, scouts and analysts have been so wrong?I wonder why he got so much PT and wasn't benched sooner.
Michigan Resurgent? Michigan Resurgent!
The beatings will continue until the uniforms improve!
A 1 number overall contract
A 1 number overall contract will do that.
Are you a park ranger at Yellowstone? Say hi to Yogi Bear for me. - the_big_house 500th
I may not be a 70 year old man. - Herm
In honor of DocSat...
| A | G | QBRat | Comp | Att | Pct | Yds | Y/G | Y/A | TD | Int | Rush | Yds | Y/G | Avg | TD | Sack | YdsL | Fum | FumL | ||||||
| 15 | 63.0 | 196 | 364 | 53.8 | 2444 | 162.9 | 6.7 | 12 | 20 | 36 | 106 | 7.1 | 2.9 | 3 | 26 | 195 | 10 | 3 |
| B | G | QBRat | Comp | Att | Pct | Yds | Y/G | Y/A | TD | Int | Rush | Yds | Y/G | Avg | TD | Sack | YdsL | Fum | FumL | ||||||
| 15 | 77.1 | 198 | 368 | 53.8 | 2423 | 161.5 | 6.6 | 13 | 8 | 17 | 127 | 8.5 | 7.5 | 1 | 31 | 210 | 12 | 7 |
Look at the above lines. one is Jamarcus Russell, 2008-2009 (He only played in 4 games in year 1). The other line is Mark Sanchez, 2009-10. Who is A and who is B?
And let's keep in mind that the Jets had a competent rushing game and defense last year. I'm not sure you can say that about Oakland.
Yes, I think Mark Sanchez is
Yes, I think Mark Sanchez is very overrated. I can tell the top line is his simply because of the INT's, he threw 5 alone in one game. The Jets had a pretty solid team last year, they would have made the playoffs with just about anyone at QB.
I dunno about that last
I dunno about that last statement.
You put Ryan "Percocet" Leaf under center, and that team in floundering in marshes.
This is home...
Jamarcus is the Lebron of
Jamarcus is the Lebron of Football....without the desire and concentration.
Those who stay will be champions!
One thing scouts can't predict:
How hard will a player work in the weight room and studying film once they're given $40million.
Yet another reason why it's stupid to pay rookies more money than established veterans. I really, really hope they are able to pass a rookie wage scale.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't
Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't really trust schools/programs/coaches that haven't put out good quarterbacks in the past. Therefore, I never really trusted LSU and Jamarcus Russell. When's the last time LSU put out a good NFL quarterback?
I know it's a flawed theory, but I don't think there's a perfect theory out there. I'd pick a quarterback coached by Pete Carroll or Lloyd Carr before picking a guy who had been coached by some Joe Schmoe with no pedigree.
I agree 100%
It's why I was so upset Matt Millen drafted Drew Stanton in the 2nd round, when Chade Henne would be there the following year... It just makes sense to draft from a team that produces NFL level/ready QBs.
Henne vs. Stanton was round
Henne vs. Stanton was round 2. Round 1 was Brian Griese vs. Charlie Batch. I remember Lloyd going ballistic (as much as he ever would, in print) over the lunacy of that decision.
If that's the case then RR
If that's the case then RR shouldn't have trust from the NFL for his QBs.
It's all about incentives. In
It's all about incentives. In his mind he had done all those workouts in college for the big pay day on draft day. If you want to be great in the NFL you have to want to be great, not want to make a great deal of money.
or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.
In baseball is this known as
In baseball is this known as having a million dollar arm and a ten cent head. Happens a lot sadly...
Are you a park ranger at Yellowstone? Say hi to Yogi Bear for me. - the_big_house 500th
I may not be a 70 year old man. - Herm
for some...
reason todd van poppel comes to mind...
also known as
Brien Taylor
or...
jaret wright...
I traded a Frank Thomas rookie card for this....
need rookie salary cap
plain and simple
kinda funny...
lane kiffen wanted calvin johnson but al davis said no. just couldn't resist a guy who threw 80 yards from his knees,
Even in college Russell was very good, but not great.
His stats were very good, but how many times did you hear the phrase "watch out for LSU because JaMarcus Russell will kill you." In comparison to Ryan Leaf, Leaf looked way more impressive as a passer in college than Russell did. Vince Young also looked way more impressive in college than Russell and wasn't 1st overall.
"Everyone gets dumped Gabe. Let me give you some advice: a little coverup on your Adams Apple will make it appear smaller. Which will make you appear less like a transvestite."
The work ethic factor is a valid point, but scouts must have ways of evaluating that character attribute the same as they do leadership, toughness and other intangibles.
Every time an MGoBoard poster complains about a thread topic, God kills a baby panda.