OT - First Gen/Low-Income Student Experience

Submitted by AeonBlue on

I never attended Michigan, or any college for that matter. School was never my thing so I joined the Air Force shortly after graduating high school (I worked an IT contract on campus for 6-months prior to that) because they would let me do what I wanted to do (computer programming) without having to go into a bunch of debt taking classes I wasn't interested in. 

A friend of mine that graduated from U of M a few years back just posted this link and captioned

"Speaks so much of my undergrad experience at UofM! Not enough done to welcome those with low income"

I feel like it's an important read, especially for current students. I have no experience to base it on but I feel like maybe this should be more of an idictment on students and student leadership than the institution itself. 

Where I work we get a bunch of people from all different walks of life. We have the 3rd generation military people, we have the rich kids, we have the poor kids, we have the "I would have probably been on drugs or dead if I didn't get out" people. We have people who can barely speak english because they're first generation Americans. We're led by officers who are college grads from places like Duke as well as places like Eastern Pennsylvania State College University of California Technical Institute. We're led by officers who are academy grads.

My point is this: no two people I've come across in the military have the same back-story but we have to pull together and find common ground to make the mission happen. It may not be apparent but you can find it with even the most seemingly disparate people. If you're the 3rd gen Michigan student and you find yourself in this situation, it doesn't mean you have to act like their parents just died when they say their parents are home-makers or bus drivers or whatever. Chances are they're proud of being the first person in their family to overcome the odds and make it there. And if you're the first-gen/low-income college student it doesn't mean that your peers (yes, your peers) think you're sub-human. Chances are that they're pretty afraid of offending you and that's why they're looking at you like your hair is on fire. 

Too often we focus on what makes us different (race, orientation, income, political preference, religion, etc.) that we lose sight of what makes us similar. It's a bitch out there in the world as it is. It's not too far out of the way to make others feel like they're a part of something bigger than themselves regardless of how different from you they might seem.

Also, Harbaugh. That is all.

o0MaizeNBlue0o

January 30th, 2015 at 10:48 AM ^

I took a bunch of middle class kids to Mexico once.   We built homes for families and for "orphans" whose parents traveled for 6 months of the year for work.  The rich kids went too... on a separate plane... right to the all inclusive resorts where their parents owned a timeshare.  

 

Who is closeminded? 

I've met so many "rich" kids who are well traveled, but are sheltered to the real world.

diag squirrel

January 30th, 2015 at 12:01 AM ^

"You can tell the wealth of someone by the clothes they wear, the car they drive"

Hm. The wealthiest kids I knew dressed like bums. I mean cheap old sweaters, skinny jeans and beatup Vans or Converse as an undergrad is a pretty wardrobe. As for cars, sure seemed like half never had a car during undergrad. I'm trying to think of rich kids that did...I mean maybe a couple had nice cars, but few and far.

diag squirrel

January 30th, 2015 at 11:05 AM ^

I think my point is that there's always going to be a divide, many less affluent are always going to feel a little awkward, life isn't fair, this isn't something the University can social engineer away, and (the part I think irritated some of you) less affluent kids tend to do many things that push away kids not like them, e.g. higher means peers, different races. I think most of the stories or takes on this topic play the lower means kids as victims, and wealthy kids as insensitive and exclusionary. In my view, lower means would feel more welcome if they checked some of THEIR OWN behavior. But I guess calling them out on that behavior is mean or insensitive.

oriental andrew

January 30th, 2015 at 11:35 AM ^

many less affluent are always going to feel a little awkward, life isn't fair, this isn't something the University can social engineer away, and (the part I think irritated some of you) less affluent kids tend to do many things that push away kids not like them, e.g. higher means peers, different races."

It works both ways.

diag squirrel

January 30th, 2015 at 11:53 AM ^

"It works both ways." I agree. Yet I rarely (never) see anyone focus on what lower means kids can do differently, aside from joing programs...full of other first-gen kids. There's a pattern of blaming the University or wealthier students for their discomfort. e.g. rich kids are demonized, the University could do more, less affluent kids are always high character and perfect angels who keep getting shut out of social groups and feel awkward on campus because of external factors.

Hail-Storm

January 30th, 2015 at 12:25 PM ^

At Michigan, it is way tougher to to be rich than poor. Poor students have the system tilted in their favor. I've had to deal with the poor and they rarely add to conversations about French films I saw when my family went yachting in the French riviera. They actually tried to talk to me about some poor people subjects. I'm not sure what they were cause I wasn't listening, but it was probably pretty low brow stuff.

And I'm not saying we don't need the poor, we do, I'm just saying we probably should accept less of them into programs that produce high pay and progress, because they wouldn't know what to do with the money anyway, so it's kind of a waste.

/s (is this necessary?)

pescadero

January 30th, 2015 at 11:40 AM ^

I think my point is that there's always going to be a divide

 

There will always be in-group and out-group dichotomies - it's inherent in humans evolved tribalism - but there is absolutely no inherent need for group definition to be based on material income.

Clarence Beeks

January 30th, 2015 at 12:44 AM ^

"You can tell the wealth of someone by the clothes they wear, the car they drive, the fact they can put up a 150 dollar tab at the bar every Fridaly, etc."

I've met just as many people, if not more, who don't have the money and do those things to try to impress (even though they can't actually afford it). Many of the wealthiest people I know, you'd never know it.

thethirdcoast

January 30th, 2015 at 10:44 AM ^

...a first-gen alum (EE '01) from a small town in Michigan, and I can state that Dr. Armstrong's conclusion mirrors my own life experience very closely.

To summarize, I would say that the students of lesser means find it hard to truly jibe with the students from greater means. On the flipside, the students from more humble backgrounds will never really return to a great fit back home after their Michigan experience.

I believe there is an underserved demographic here that has been falling through the cracks for a number of years.

ak47

January 30th, 2015 at 12:43 AM ^

Yeah when all your friends go out to dinner and you can't or they plan a trip and you can't go or by the time you get off work they are already out and drunk. The list of things is endless but if you didn't have to worry about it you never think about it and that's the issue.

JamieH

January 30th, 2015 at 1:14 AM ^

All of my friends (my first two years) ate dinner at the dorm cafeteria or used their meal credit at the dorm snack bar.   There wasn't any "going out to dinner". 



Once I lived off campus, "going out to dinner" usually consisted of putting a Tony's pizza in the oven. 

 

I dunno, maybe I just had a bunch of really cheap friends. 

Hail-Storm

January 30th, 2015 at 9:55 AM ^

so there are going to be a large spectrum of different experiences especially when you add in the different experiences over decades.  

Mid 90s fashion was a cheap grunge look.  I think early 2000s started to bring name brand into things more (I'm really bad at fashion, though, so don't take my word on the last one.  My favorite pair of pants were from bugle boy at late HS and early college).  

My experience;

when I first got to campus, I was hanging out with a group of very wealthy out of staters who didn't mind skipping meals to go out to eat and going to coffee houses.  As a cheap person in general, this wasn't my style and I moved away from that group.  Most of my good friends after that had families that were well off (I'd say the most common job held by friends parents was Doctor).  I was aware, but it was never an issue.

I would say that on average the diversity of friends at Michigan, when it came to family wealth and education, was much less than my friends from home. Although it didn't really matter there either.  

 

youn2948

January 30th, 2015 at 9:59 AM ^

As someone who paid for their entire college, had massive loans and worked full time during this is on the money.

You can go out to the bar and blow a ton of cash, or go out to dinner, I cannot afford to go out to eat, I have ramen, rice and hot pockets because I can afford it, not sushi.  Nope can't afford to go skiing, guess what?  I'm working that weekend two jobs, and every single break.  

I had friends of all economic status and have done tons of world travelling and like sushi etc but hard to be friends and in the "in-circle", of "rich friends", when you can never be included in things because you cannot afford them.

I borrowed 5 different cars during college but never owned one.

But wow yeah that comment was over-generalizing based upon a few of his ignorant extended family.  Just as people over-generalize based on a few rich pricks out of touch.

Your perception is reality though and everyone has a different perception based upon their environment and surroundings.  My suggestion, get uncomfortable, see things in another light, talk less and listen more.

Baughlieve

January 29th, 2015 at 10:58 PM ^

Very informative read about something that I've never really thought about. I wish people were more open so we can help them in any way possible. I have dealt with depression in the past and it really makes me feel better that people are taking mental illness more seriously now a days. It's something that is no longer just being swept under the rug.

UM217

January 29th, 2015 at 11:07 PM ^

I'm sure that it's possible that it comes up in social situations but I never experienced it in college. As many others in this thread have mentioned, it was not an issue in their experience at Michigan. At times, many people (including me) have felt uncomfortable around people who are far better off in socio-economic terms but often it has more to do with our own ideas of where we belong than any externally imposed assumptions about our position in society.

LSA Aught One

January 29th, 2015 at 11:28 PM ^

I never thought about it, but my friends that had cars on campus and whose parents were well-to-do weren't lording it over others. If I needed a ride to Meier to get food, it was around. My roommates freshman year came from elite families and made a point to show it. I worked in WQ Dining hall all four years. Nothing tells people who you are like showing up to class after washing dishes :)




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EGD

January 30th, 2015 at 3:23 PM ^

As a rule, I don't think you can tell an awful lot from cars.  Yeah, I knew a handful of people who drove expensive German cars or SUVs, but other than that it was a very mixed bag--both in terms of who had a car, and what kind of car.  After my freshman year, I always had a car at M because I needed it for work--and I knew plenty of other working-class students who drove.  But I also knew plenty of affluent students who drove shitty cars like mine, and then I knew lots of students who didn't drive at all.

Nitro

January 30th, 2015 at 8:38 AM ^

In college, I made friends with some people who came from wealthy families. There were also rich kids I encountered who I didn't make friends with -- they tended to be extremely insecure, meaning they outwardly judged anyone different from them as inferior to satisfy a need to feel better about themselves. As those types tend to pack together and project their resources in a non-individual manner it furthers the obnoxious rich kid stereotype. The ones I did befriend were secure, down to earth, and humble, and didn't want or like to be judged based on their family's money.

That being said, I also noticed a certain amount of misplaced resentment from a small portion of my non-rich towards my more well-off friends, despite the fact that the latter did nothing to outwardly project their family's wealth.

MainStreetMagic

January 30th, 2015 at 12:50 AM ^

You know, I fit this demographic to the letter (i.e. first generation college grad, lower middle class family, and went to UM on loans), and I honestly never felt this way.  Many of the best friends I ever made came from much more affluent backgrounds than me, and never once did I feel like I was riding in steerage, so to speak.  More concerning, to me, is the fact that skyrocketing tuition is making it damn near impossible for many lower income students to attend school without crippling amounts of post-college debt.

MGoBender

January 30th, 2015 at 11:45 AM ^

I feel like we're the same person.

Every once in a while I did feel awkward talking about my parents, who had solid working-class jobs but never went to college.  But for the most part, it was no big deal.

My bigger hurdle was missing out on social stuff because I was working so many hours at my campus job and/or felt I couldn't afford to do as much as I wanted.  Every once in a while I sprung for a big date/night out, but more often than not it was Natty and house parties.  As it should be in college, though.

Steve in PA

January 29th, 2015 at 10:45 PM ^

When you are in a high pressure situation like being surrounded by strangers with the rest of your life hanging in the balance little things can get blown up.  These are still young kids full of insecurities and haven't learned just to be who they are.  It doesn't seem any different than thinking the zit on your face is the size of a tumor but others don't really notice it.

 

 

JamieH

January 29th, 2015 at 10:44 PM ^

I don't think I ever asked ANY of my friends at Michigan what their dad or mom did for a liviing, nor did I really care.  I found out through knowing them for years because we would talk about things, but that was it. 



One of the main points of college is that you are starting over with a clean slate and can pretty much re-invent yourself as whoever you want to be.  For the first time in years you are with people who don't have a huge preconceived notion of you. 



Sure, being from a poor family stinks and I'm not going to say it isn't rough.  But I didn't give a crap about how much money my friends had really.  We spent most of our time playing basketball and video games, neither of which cost THAT much money, except that someone had to buy the video games, but that meant that only ONE friend had to have money!    Maybe it would make hanging out in certain circles tough, or if you want to impress certain people, but a lot of people couldn't really care less. 

The whole point of going to college IMO is what are YOU going to make of yourself, not how much money do your parents have. 

Wolvermarine

January 29th, 2015 at 10:46 PM ^

I'm a senior at Michigan right now. First generation college student, lower class background, also started undergrad at 25.  I've never personally felt like I was excluded or not welcomed or anything like that.  Though I do remember quite distinctly in a freshman year composition class taking out our laptops to do some work in class.  I was pretty much the only one in class without a Macbook, and my 5 year old Toshiba laptop sounded like a jet taking off when you turned it on.  

maizenbluenc

January 29th, 2015 at 11:17 PM ^

and roomed with a guy with an Apple II after Freshman year so I never had to type a paper on a typewriter again.

As for the OPs point - whether we realize it or not and even if we have acted in inclusive ways, at least some students from a poor background probably do feel outcast - especially in first year or so. I read enough angst about rich out of state students that I wonder if some do act boorish. I also agree this is somewhat a responsibility of the students to make sure other students feel included.

That said - some of the best times my Freshman and Sophomore years in Couzens were when people just walked down the hall knocking on doors and getting an impromptu group up for dinner, or to go to a party, or traying or something.

EGD

January 29th, 2015 at 11:13 PM ^

I find this interesting because I was a poor kid who attended Michigan (1993-97) myself, but I actually felt much more at home in the university environment than some other places I've been. At M, there were certainly some things I wasn't able to participate in because of my background (some of the Greek organizations weren't really going to be an option, for instance, and I had to work a lot which limited my ability to get involved in various student activities), but I never really felt disrespected or isolated because of my socioeconomic situation. By the time I graduated, I had a broad group of friends from pretty much every segment of the economic spectrum. When I left Ann Arbor and went to law school (Louisville, KY), suddenly I found myself in an environment where lots of people actually seemed to care who my parents were or what kind of high school I attended. Maybe things have changed since I was there, especially with the far bleaker tuition/student funding picture, and it's good to draw attention to these issues regardless. But Michigan really was among the most meritocratic environments I've ever experienced. Everybody's experience is different though, I guess.

Candor for Sale

January 29th, 2015 at 10:48 PM ^

I aligned myself with people who, even if they grew up with college-educated parents or high SES backgrounds, never made me feel like less just because that wasn't my experience. I think most people do that, (find friends with similar values) but there are definitely those who just assume you've had similar experiences without thinking twice (e.g., I recall being asked 'you don't know how to ski?' as if skiing was a birthright for everyone and not just those who could afford it)

morepete

January 29th, 2015 at 10:50 PM ^

Anyone who says that no one ever asked them about their income level probably comes from a higher income level. I went to college decidedly middle class, and I had a lot of friends who never had to work a side job to have spending money. Many of them asked me why I was working all the time. It's not offensive, it's just reality. If you can afford to go out every weekend without working, your family had, at least, more savings than that of a lot of students. Probably, your family is richer than you think of it.




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JamieH

January 29th, 2015 at 10:59 PM ^

maybe we weren't going out every weekend?  My friends and I rarely spent any money at all outside of pizza delivery.  I would say we were boring, but I remember it being a blast, so it must not have been boring at the time. 

Of course, part of that was being stuck on North Campus. 

I won't deny that I wasn't poor by any means, but I was on a pretty strict budget. 

Mgotri

January 29th, 2015 at 11:04 PM ^

My family is decided not richer than I think it is. Both of my parents worked for the university and their income was published in the daily every year. My father works in the dorm kitchens and my mother works at the hospital (med tech).

Nobody ever asked me what my income level was. I didn't work in college and went out frequently. I have a lot of student loan debt as a result. Happily, I chose chemistry as a major instead of (insert major that is not obviously high earning).




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austinnt

January 29th, 2015 at 10:51 PM ^

I personally never had any bad experiences in college (Stanford for my undergrad and masters at Oregon State), especially pertaining to my familys background or net worth.

My family is "well-off" and all educated, however my parents had the mindset that I needed to work for whatever I had, so I was closer to a low income student than a trust fund baby. Maybe he just had a really shitty experience? I don't know how family background could come up unless he brought it up. 

UM217

January 29th, 2015 at 10:57 PM ^

Your post is a bit unclear but, if I understand correctly, it's about the difficulties faced by first generation or low income students at Michigan. I went to Michigan as a first generation, working-class kid and when I told people that my dad was a mechanic I never received a negative response about his position, nor mine. Instead I found that I was appreciated, or denegrated, based on the quality of my ideas. Maybe things have changed, but I found Michigan to be a place where I was evaluated reasonably. This raises a question posed by your friend who said that "not enough [was] done to welcome those with low income." What would be an appropriate welcome?  

StephenRKass

January 29th, 2015 at 10:53 PM ^

I loved the article. I came from regular folk, although not first gen. I live in a community that largely does not go to college. I have learned a lot of hard lessons about elitism over the last 20 years. This article definitely raises those issues. Thank you.

EastCoast Esq.

January 29th, 2015 at 10:56 PM ^

I didn't go to Michigan for undergrad, so I can't speak to that experience.

I will say, though, that in graduate school, it was fairly obvious who had more money and who had less money based on the gadgets in their rooms, how much they spent on good food, how often they were willing to go out drinking, etc. Having fun costs money.

YakAttack

January 29th, 2015 at 11:26 PM ^

Joined the military right out of high school. Bounced around between middling, barely above minimum wage jobs once I got out, Started community college at age 29, transferred to EMU  at 31 with an eye on a Master's by the time I'm done. I grew up in section 8 housing, on food stamps, focus hope, the works. My mother was an alcoholic who also liked drugs. I was never pushed to succeed in school to the point I went from a 4.0 after my sophomore year in high school to barely graduating on time.

I am in the first generation to pursue college as an alternative to the auto industry and I take a lot of pride in where I've come from to where I am now.

EDIT: My long term goal is a PharmD from U of M. I fully expect to be the oldest person in my P year. So I will be very atypical when I enter.I fully expect to experience weird looks or thoughts from 22 year olds that will leave with no student loan debt.

drjaws

January 29th, 2015 at 11:06 PM ^

But I have no sympathy. I worked all through undergrad, the last year and a half full time 3rd shift.



Last couple years of my doctoral work I also worked full time (45 hours a week) while spending a minimum of 45 hours a week in lab. Slept 3-4 hours a day 5-6 days a week with one day off.



If you don't like your financial situation, do something. Yes, you may have to work 80 hours a week and miss some stuff. It's a choice.