drjaws

June 17th, 2016 at 1:34 PM ^

Seriously, I am.  On what scale?  Water can kill you if you drink too much . . . is water bad?  Oh, it isn't a "drug"?  OK then . . . .

What if the potential health risks on ingesting said drug are far outweighed by the benefits the user gets?  Is it still "bad."

Pot is far less harmful to your health than either alcohol, pain pills OR tobacco . . . are they bad? 

Are anti-depressants are bad?  What about cholesterol medication?  What about gout medication?  What about psilocybin mushrooms that have zero negative effects on health but are really fun, are they bad?

As a toxicologist, I fing the statement "drugs are bad" to be illogical and asinine at best.

 

Also, I get the SouthPark reference so if that was the point, ignore everything above this sentence.

stephenrjking

June 17th, 2016 at 1:13 PM ^

Doping allegations have been simmering around Russian athletes for a long time now. It seems to be more systematic there, though they are certainly not the only European country with serious multi-sport doping issues.

 

stephenrjking

June 17th, 2016 at 2:19 PM ^

Are you referring to the old East German Venom pipeline, or now? 

Since we're naming names anyway, one country that has been mad suspicious for years with oddly un-curious local government enforcement is Spain, across multiple sports. 

This is not to say that I think the US is somehow a haven for heroically clean athletes. However, our sporting culture is so large and so diverse that it is harder to pin down a "national" trend. It is easier to identify trends by sport here. Track and cycling, for example, or the mysterious absence of any doping busts in the NBA at all.

mlax27

June 17th, 2016 at 2:56 PM ^

Interesting observation on the NBA.  I would counter that I think the NBA is so much about skill (hand/eye coordination) that doping won't help like it would in the NFL, cycling or Track.  You need to be tall (so HGH until you are about 6'6) but after that, it's about being skilled.

In the NFL, you can fully exert your muscles on just about every play if you are along the line.  For cycling/track it's about pure endurance or pure speed.  In baseball it's been about hitting a ball as hard as you absolutely can, or pitching over 100 MPH.  You don't see NBA players at a true full sprint for more than 20 feet at a time, and given the "no contact" nature of the game, you aren't going to be using your full strength very often either. 

I'm sure it happens some in the NBA, but the success of people like Curry make me think there isn't as big of an edge to be gained as in other sports.

stephenrjking

June 17th, 2016 at 3:39 PM ^

That's the typical argument given by every sport defending why that sport doesn't have doping and others do.

It proceeds from the wrong questions.

The correct question is: "would there be a benefit to doping in this sport."

Your analysis of the benefits of doping is inadequate. Doping doesn't just affect one stat (top end speed or home run power) in an EA Sports video game. Doping can increase explosiveness. It can increase strength. It can aid agility. It can improve recovery time and cardio performance. A basketball player who dopes can, for the same amount of off-court effort, play more effectively in more roles for more minutes in every game.

No, it won't make them shoot better, any more than it makes ballplayers hit curveballs better (baseball made identical arguments to yours for years until they could not anymore). But it is a sport of athleticism, and doping provides that in spades.

It can give an undersized guy the extra explosion he needs to be an effective guard. It can help a tall guy recover from injuries, or turn a 7-foot statue into a dominant, agile world-beater. It can give a 6'8 guy the quickness to stay in front of the guy he's defending and the endurance to play at a high energy level for 42 minutes a game.

So some guys will try to get an edge by doping. If they are not caught, they will succeed. Some of them learn to or already shoot well. They will play. And others will dope to stay competitive.

And nobody is getting caught. So the ways to beat the system are, almost certainly, well known.

DairyQueen

June 17th, 2016 at 3:51 PM ^

The thing is, that in Russian culture, "cheating" (or what we think of cheating in America) isn't necessarily seen as a bad thing.

In fact, they see it as a positive really, like a sort of cunning, a cleverness.

I taught in a school of mostly Russian immigrants (the school was in Europe), and the kids there cheated systematically. It sounds crazy (as an American), but, for them cheating was like PART of the test.

And the parents didn't see it as a problem either. It wasn't seen with the same sort of shame and outrage. They pretty much didn't GAF, and/or thought the kids should just get better at taking the test, which either meant study better or cheat better, makes no difference.

It blew my mind grapes.

M-Dog

June 17th, 2016 at 9:06 PM ^

The thing is, that in SEC culture, "cheating" (or what we think of cheating in the Big Ten) isn't necessarily seen as a bad thing.

In fact, they see it as a positive really, like a sort of cunning, a cleverness.

I taught in a school of mostly SEC kids (the school was in the South), and the kids there cheated systematically. It sounds crazy (as a Big Ten fan), but, for them cheating was like PART of the test.

And the parents didn't see it as a problem either. It wasn't seen with the same sort of shame and outrage. They pretty much didn't GAF, and/or thought the kids should just get better at taking the test, which either meant study better or cheat better, makes no difference.

It blew my mind grapes.

Fixed it.

 

LSAClassOf2000

June 17th, 2016 at 1:39 PM ^

The Russian ministry said it was "extremely disappointed" by the decision to ban the entire team from the Rio Games. It appealed to the International Olympic Committee to "consider the impact that our athletes' exclusion will have on the dreams and the people of Russia."

You know, on the surface, it doesn't seem like it would be that hard - just don't engage in doping. I mean, even submitting a report which states that you've cut it down to Tuesday and Thursdays only and never after 3 PM seems like it would satisfy the IOC's requirements 9 times out of 10. That they couldn't manage even that is....oh, I'll say it, chuckle-worthy.

JamieH

June 17th, 2016 at 6:48 PM ^

There is no question that Cabrera had an alcohol problem, and that he seemed to be what one would call a "mean drunk".  By all reports, he really got a handle on his issue and turned things around.  His play on the field has certainly been nothing but consistent for years, which wouldn't indicate any kind of relapse into drinking issues.  I give the Tiger's organization some credit here for providing him the support system he needed to make this happen, though in the end only he could make the choice to follow through. 





The guy seems to be unbelievably nice when sober.  I sincerely hope he really did get a handle on his problems and continues to do so, since so many kids idolize him.  He's easily one of the top 3 or so  baseball players to ever play for Detroit.