OT: Anyone here with 14-18-y.o. kids? How do they spend their summers?
Little brother is in tenth grade, dreams of attending U-M, and just got into a selective five-week long summer boarding camp. I told parents he got a full scholarship to attend, which is half true (I'm paying what's left and his travel expenses). What I consider an awesome opportunity, my parents – well, our mom – are treating like it's some sort of punishment. I just think mom is going to miss her "baby" for half the summer. My brother would sit on the couch or by the pool all break on his iPhone if you let him, so I figured an camp (academic day, athletic afternoon, leisure night) would pay numerous dividends. Plus half the camp are girls his age from around the world, how is that punishment?
Perhaps I'm out of touch and there are better alternatives. What are your teenage children, younger siblings and cousins up to?
there was a law passed within the last few years mandating that the 4 year schools stop being such dicks about transfer and AP credits. Pretty much everything she's taking AP and at CC will be directly transferable to Michigan.
They retroactively charged my parents upperclassmen tuition for my very first semester based on AP credits. Usually I got to schedule super early in exchange for the $800 or whatever, but that semester, I'd done my schedule during summer orientation with everybody else. So that was some bullshit.
But they can help you lop years off college if you want to. I'm pretty certain I could've graduated with one concentration (but probably no minor) in 2 years if I had spent all of my credits checking off requirements.
Yeah, I screwed up, I typed junior year, but I was definitely paying upperclassman tuition either second semester freshman year or first semester sophomore year. That whole thing was a bitch.
March 12th, 2015 at 10:42 PM ^
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It's also great to start core classes sooner by getting to skip some prereq's that don't matter much for your degree.
Although the AP classes I took were interesting to me and a few I'd have liked to take in college.
Last paragraph of OP is your leader in the clubhouse for humblebrag of the day.
(RIP Harris Wittels)
My son will be playing baseball in his high school travel league and in his spare time, he has an internship at a PC tech support shop in town. Keep them busy. They're actually happier when they have stuff to do.
To answer question seriously, a camp would be fine, although you don't earn any money. A job is a good thing to have to bank money for college. Both can probably give you some good connections as well as experience. Or take additional classes so you have room to get calc, etc. stuff out of the way in high school, then you can get college credit.
Just don't sit on your ass for most of the time and you'll be fine. Unless you're living on a beach in which case that's acceptable for a good chunk of the time, particularly if you have Oberon to drink and a good book.
So you're going to secretly pay for your brother to go to the camp, and lie to your parents about him getting a full ride?
This sounds like something out of a sitcom.
Really? I had a buddy in undergrad whose tuition and expenses were paid by his older brother, who was rich working in Palo Alto. Scholarships are pretty common for summer camps if you have decent grades, come from a region that doesn't have much placement in the program, etc. Either way, my parents have no concept of what the sticker price of the program is.
And your buddy also had some secret agreement where his brother paid for everything and they both lied to Mom and Dad and claimed it was all covered by scholarships?
Something tells me this is not your "brother's" story but yours. You seem way too invested in this - and too angry at your parents - for it not to be about you personally. (I love my brother and all, but hell, I'd never pay several grand for him to go to a summer camp.)
I can tell you this: you don't need to go to a $8,000 summer camp to get admitted to Michigan, if that's what you're worried about. That's a lot of money to spend. I don't blame your parents if they're balking at paying, quite frankly. They'll have to deal with paying for real college soon enough.
Professional teacher here-- I've seen the full gamut of what kids do (or don't do) with their summers.
Kids with parental involvement go to camps, classes, get jobs. Kids without it hang out with their friends, get into local trouble (at least in my town), and more often than anything else, stay inside and play Call of Duty online all day.
University summer camps are great experiences for high schoolers. You go, you meet other teenagers who have the same interests, maybe you meets some girls or boys, whatever you're into. If nothing else it'll give him good things to write about on college applications, just from the experiences. Will he learn anything academic? Depends on the program and the teacher.
I remember back when I was 15 I went to a similar program, and got on a bus knowing I was going to reinvent myself as someone cool and confident, the person I wanted to be (I was a cripplingly awkward teen before). Got there, no one knew me. I went for it and basically that's been my personality ever since.
As for lying to your mom, sometimes you gotta lie to your mom. Especially with money. We've been secretly giving mine back the money she sends for birthdays for years. She can't afford it but she'd be hurt if we didn't take it, so we lie. It's the right thing to do.
We’re in full agreement of busy kids vs bums and how it translates to upperclassman success in high school and onto college. Now how do I convince two middle class parents with blue collar sensibilities to let him go? The camp is at Phillips Andover. I think it sounds freaking awesome. My parents have never heard of Phillips Andover, naturally. To be honest, it could be Summer@Harvard and they'd have the same reaction.
don't try to convince them. Just tell them that this is what's happening. It's an excellent opportunity for their son and it would be selfish for them to not let him go.
Guilt is an excellent motivator.
Yet they were willing to sign the application form and submit the $65 application fee to Phillips Andover? Your brother also wrote the application essay, got recommendations from his math and science teachers and yet never bothered to mention any of this to your parents? I also don't see anything about scholarships, partial or otherwise. Phillips Academy application
Yeah, I have a suspicion the OP is not being entirely honest with us here.
the shit's getting weird...
Prior to his application process they had never heard of Andover, hyper-literal guy. They still don't "get" what it is. Their capacity is that it's a "good" school. Do you even know what Phillips Andover is?
My 17-year old daughter coaches/teaches diving at the local pool, as well as participating on the team herself.
My 16-year old son would play video games if given the opportunity, so he's spending July at the iD Tech camp learning computer programming, video-game programming and some electrical engineering. He's spending 2 weeks a at "day camp" and 2 weeks overnighting. He did the day camp last year and liked it.
I'm ok with him getting a couple weeks in June to loaf and some time in August. Other parts will be a vacation.
I have a 21 and 19 year old. The older is a junior at UofM. He took a lot of AP courses in HS along with being captain of the football team. The younger only took 2 AP courses but didn't play sports. She didn't get into UofM despite 4.1gpa and 30 ACT.
The moral of the story: if your borther is a high achiever during the school year (AP courses, sports, band, robotics, etc), I don't think a summer program is necessary. He'll be busting his balls for the foreseeable future. Let him play on his phone and hang out with his boys. I know that's difficult to allow, but he won't be the only college freshman to do it.
Your daughter didn't get in with those stats and a brother who's a current student? I thought the sibling legacy thing gave you a boost. Wow. What was her unweighted GPA? She go to State or Hope? Plans to transfer to U-M?
Not only is her brother there, both my wife and I are alums. We're not happy about it. She's a freshman at Bama.
Didn't you say you had some connection with the football team too? Someting about being in the locker room in '86 after the "Harbaugh Guarantee" win over Ohio State? As a player?
You would thnink that would carry some weight with admissions.
BTW, the Harbaugh guarantee was cool, but it was Jamie Morris who bailed out the guarantee and provided the win (and Matt Frantz). I was at the game, at field level.
I would have been livid if my parents tried to send me to academic camps.My parents were totally involved with my life but were fine with me playing sports, working a pointless job, and hanging out with friends....
I always worked full-time, and I will expect my son to do the same if he's not doing sports or something academic-y like your brother. Your brother is lucky to have you, I hope he doesn't waste this opportunity!
WTF is up with all the Humble-Brag posts from you?
The first one I noticed the other day was the "Job, Car, Mustifitinwiththeelites? Social pressure"
Now it's: "I've done something expensive & awesome for a sibling, COMPARE"
I honestly don't care that much & I'm certainly not trying to call you out as a troll or anything, but in two threads I've learned SO MUCH about your residence, fine automobiles, your social peers, family, your endearing altruism, what success means to you, and how desperate you are to rise above the shameful miasma of your upbringing. Good for you I guess.
Why are you asking this again?
Edit: OP upvoting his own post. Quality.
I'm waiting to hear about his hot girlfriend. Or hot wife.
Or both!
I think you're likely a terminal cynic and I'm a new member, so you're seeing what you want to see and trying to internet bully me. Cool. The point of this thread was to hopefully view and consider alternatives to what I was encouraging my little brother to do with his time. Perhaps my parents are right, and he should stay home, or perhaps members here have other cool ideas, I don't know. All due respect, you have to be a pretty miserable person to see anything negative about a guy trying to provide experiences and opportunity to family.
I also believe you took the automobile thread entirely the wrong way. You thought I was faux-coy bragging? I was highlighting my insecurities and very real social pressure amongst my colleagues and peers to project success. Half the board acknowledged this is real and you're attacking me. I'd recommend an iced coffee, buddy.
I long for the halcyon days of cynicism.
e-bully? . . .
I'm hoping this isn't your first message board, but either way I'm sorry i hurt your feelings, and perhaps in a future post we can look forward to your choice of top-shelf therapists & scotch.
I'm in a bad mood, so I'll hapilly sit in the penalty box til tthe weekend.
No worries. I removed the sarcastic ending of my original post. The whole "wish I had an older brother [spend money on me]" was tongue in cheek and in retrospect I see it doesn't translate well on a forum.
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My parents both had strict "you get a job as soon as you can" childhoods so I was told that as long as I did well in school and played sports (which ended up just being football by the time HS rolled around) that I didn't need to get a job.
Of course I (generally) stayed out of trouble and didn't cause too much of a fuss so the agreement stood until I dual enrolled and got a job on campus (because why not?).
In retrospect I would have loved to have known about dual enrollment before I did and I educate as many people as I can about it to this day.
Similar to my philosophy. "Your job is to get good grades." Seems to have worked alright for us.
last summer working as a day-camp counselor, and I'm spending this summer at a summer camp with the same position. I'll be heading into college with roughly 3 grand, which is nice since my parents have agreed to pay my tuition as long as the price is wihtin reason.
Worked that job from age 16 until my first internship between junior and senior years of undergrad. I stocked produce. The hours were long and the pay sucked (min wage was $4.10 when I started, I think I finished at $7.50 or so in '97), but it was good exposure to the real world and real people. I think many teenagers, no matter what decade/generation, live in this protective bubble and have no concept how much a certain job will pay them, how much things cost, or how tough it can be to work a manual labor job for 60 hours a week, etc.
They were some interesting people; we had our fair share of dumbasses for sure, but we had some smart, hard-working people there as well that came from Pontiac (store's in Waterford) and just weren't given the opportunity to go to U-M like I was. I really learned to appreciate my education.
Baseball, lifting, working for me, and occasional part time cash work. That's what my son who is a senior has done. Summer league basketball when it didn't conflict with baseball too. Our deal has been if he gets good grades he doesn't have to work while he's in sports. He has the rest of his life to work but only a few years to play sports.
manual labor, 3 summers, from 16-18. minimum 60 hr weeks sometimes 100 at American Rentals on grand river. Riding all over the state in trucks/semis, swinging sledgehammers, carrying heavy shit, literally pumping shit outta toilets, getting tan, putting on muscle, learning to dip, going to college parties in EL, and having a great time.
Still look back at as one of the best decisions I've ever made. Learned about the world, got outta my surbuban bubble, learned why I needed to do well in school, picked up a lot of common sense, developed a thick skin and a sharp wit, and have hundreds of funny stories.
Wore the American Rentals 'We're In-Tents' shirts till they literally fell off my back. Hated that place when it was hot and I was full of dirt, but would love to go back in time at 17 and do it for another summer.
EDIT: was 10 years ago.
so all the kids work. lots of livestock to handle and 'harvest' by the end of summer, and crops too.
plus we school 12 months/yr though we slow down in the summer and take day trips to fish, swim, see family,etc.
when a teenager i crewed on a ship, painted houses, was a camp counselor among other jobs. work is a good thing and kids that grow up without will likely have big troubles later in life adjusting to the real world.
I spent all of my high school summers working part time, playing local soccer games, and hanging out with friends. By hanging out I mean playing outside all day and playing video games all night (I was a bit of a nerd). I didn't know about any summer camps so I can't speak to that, but I needed money from working to pay for gas, insurance, and going out to dinner/movies/etc.
FWIW, I was in high school from 99-03 and never had a problem finding work. I also worked part time during the school year, though.
I have an 18 year old senior in high school that was admitted into Michigan for Fall 2015. Besides very good grades in rigorous courses and ACT/SAT test scores, the key is showing passion for 1 or 2 extracuriculars (ECs). This could be art, sports, a volunteer item (hospital, etc.), music, etc. etc.
For example, my son loves baseball and will play all summer as he has every summer. But, he'll also umpire baseball and has lent his support at clinics for our youth baseball association. He also stays involved with other community volunteer stuff like the local foodshelve and Habitat for Humanity but baseball is where his real passion lies and that came through on his application.
If you brother really wants to go to this camp and it is related to interests that he has shown in the past and can demonstrate to continue with in the future, then it is probably worth it. Best of luck to him and you.
kids, and especially boys, need work ethic instilled in them. They need structure and direction. A game that evening is no reason for a kid to sit on the couch all day. They aren't 30, they have tons of energy.
In 2000s, before i could drive I had a nice little neighborhood hustle going: about 5 houses that I'd mow lawm, pull weeds, spread fertilizer, dog watch, baby sit, clean pool, rake leaves, shovel snow, spread mulch, plant flowers. From 12-15 i was making a couple hundred a month, tax free and no expenses! Loved doing that bc I did them for free at my parents house.
Too many soft kids around now, eyes glued to a screen. #oldman
Luckily, I was able to transfer to a decent 4-year school, but still got denied entrance to UM grad school.
Gotta work hard if you want to be a wolverine! I'll have to settle with being associated to the university by birth (born in AA) and legacy (mom and sis went to UM).