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OT: 2012 Kentucky Derby

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Last post
May 4th, 2012 at 3:57 PM
#1
BrewCityBlue
BrewCityBlue's picture
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: 1468
OT: 2012 Kentucky Derby

Well the first Saturday in May is upon us as of tomorrow and that means the annual Run for the Roses is here. 

I realize the great majority of this board probably doesn't care but I have to imagine there's at least a few other degenerates like myself who enjoy bettin' the ponies. This is your place to discuss with your fellow M brethren what you think will go down in the fastest 2 minutes in sports (outside of Denard running the 2 minute offense of course). 

I think Trinniberg will get out front early and set a blistering pace through the first 6-7 furlongs before fading. Hansen and Bodemeister will be right behind him slightly off the pace. I don't think Hansen has the distance anyways but even if he did I don't think he'll be able to resist the temptation of trying to keep up with Trinniberg early, further burning him out before the finish line. If Bodemeister breaks well he has a chance (duh, he's the favorite) but I don't know if he can rate off the pace like he'll need to to win this race. Bode will want to go early because of Trinniberg and Hansen, and his rider will want to hold him back and save something for the longer classic distance of 1 1/4 miles. This will waste valuable energy for Bodemeister, though, he may just be good enough to win it anyways. 

This frantic early pace sets up the race perfectly for a middle of the pack stalker or a deep closer from the back. Anytime you have 20 horses racing on a track meant for 14 things are going to get crazy and luck will play a big part. I like Gemologist and I'll Have Another's outside post positions because they'll be able to settle in nicely coming into the first turn and not get caught up in the mix inside. If they can be placed favorably I like their chances for a stretch run as stalker types. 

Union Rags is probably the best horse in this field and if he gets the right trip should win the race. However the right trip is tough to get in this race as it is, much less with starting from the 4 post. This leaves his connections an interesting decision. Try to get in a good stalking position early but risk being bumped and closed off, or, sit back early if the horse isn't fighting and try to come from further off the pace than they'd probably like. I don't know what they'll do, but he's a horse that can win this race from either scenario if it breaks right for him. 

Daddy Nose Best has been the hot training horse this week and it seems like he's setting up for a real good race. 

Dullahan is a deep closer who I like but he's been much better on grass and synthetic surfaces - I just don't know if he likes dirt all that much, and being a closer, he'll have plenty of dirt being kicked in his face the first mile of the race. 

Alpha had a bad trip in the Wood Memorial and still almost beat Gemologist, but he missed a critical work due to an infection after that race and he starts from the 11 gate, which gets loaded 1st with the 1, and he has had gate issues in the past. 

Creative Cause has been very consistent but lost a shoe shipping and hasn't trained well this week. He's still very capable, but I don't like seeing things "not go to plan" the week leading up to the derby when everything has to fall into place perfectly to win. 

El Padrino will go off at longer odds just because of a bit of a dud in his last prep race the FL derby, finishing 4th. I don't put too much stock into that. He's a good horse, and can come from the back late. If it's raining, I'll have him involved in more tickets, his Mudda was a mudda!

Wow I can't believe I've typed all this and I've barely broken down half the field. Sorry for so TL;DR - I've got Derby fever!!

I'm sure I'll change my mind 5 times before actually placing my bets, but, currently I have it...

I'll Have Another (12-1)

Daddy Nose Best (15-1)

Union Rags (9-2)

Gemologist (6-1)

El Padrino (20-1) (you can't bet on 5th place but I couldn't decide between him and Gem)

HAIL.

"Where's the threat? Oh, it's right here, and it's devouring us alive." -Ace<

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May 4th, 2012 at 4:15 PM | I think a horse is gonna win. (Score:3 Normal)
Brhino
Joined: 09/08/2009
MGoPoints: 1367

I think a horse is gonna win.

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May 4th, 2012 at 4:34 PM | Supposedly... (Score:1)
French West Indian
French West Indian's picture
Joined: 12/28/2011
MGoPoints: 928

...over a long enough distance (like 50 miles),  a human can outrun a horse.

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:05 PM | yup (Score:1)
superstringer
superstringer's picture
Joined: 02/04/2009
MGoPoints: 970

especially, driving a car or something like that.

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May 4th, 2012 at 4:28 PM | Thanks For the Post (Score:2 Informative)
B-Nut-GoBlue
Joined: 09/30/2011
MGoPoints: 1680

OP.  I look forward to the Kentucky Derby every year.  I'd love to see another Triple Crown winner, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.  I'm definitely not a horse racing connoisseur but I thoroughly enjoy watching the races in May and June; Hashtags:BandwagonFan.  Again, thanks for the info., I've done a bit of reading on this year's field but this right here is great.

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:34 PM | I hope (Score:2 Underrated)
BrewCityBlue
BrewCityBlue's picture
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: 1468

I hope I get to see a Triple Crown winner in my lifetime. I was born in '79 a year after Affirmed last did it. 

I only bet the Triple Crown races and the Breeder's Cup Classic. I just don't have money or time to follow it all year round. 

I sure love this time of year and the build up to the Derby though. 

HAIL.

"Where's the threat? Oh, it's right here, and it's devouring us alive." -Ace<

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May 4th, 2012 at 4:53 PM | Great Rundown (Score:2 Insightful)
Fhshockey112002
Fhshockey112002's picture
Joined: 11/08/2010
MGoPoints: 1275

One other horse you should look into is Take Charge Indy, who won the Florida Derby.  For no other reason than this horse can dictate it's own trip.  Everyone knows Calvin Borel (Bor-Rail) wants to get his horse to the rail and keep him there.  From the 3 position he should have no problem getting there.

Edit: Picks Doomed to Change

#15 Gemologist (6-1)

#4 Union Rags (9-2)

#3 Take Charge Indy (15-1)

# 8 Creative Cause (12-1) 

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:32 PM | Excellent (Score:2 Interesting)
BrewCityBlue
BrewCityBlue's picture
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: 1468

Excellent point on Take Charge Indy. Originally I threw him out since Borel is on him the public will probably over-bet him and take away a lot of value. But when I saw the post position he drew my first thought was "man, I have to have him in a couple tickets now". 

Also he's probably the best-bred horse in the field for this distance. I'm not big into breed-handicapping, but it definitely carries some weight with a lot of people out there.

He'd be a good bet but I have so many horses I like I have to draw the line somewhere. Not a bad pick at all though, especially with Borel on his back breaking from the 3 slot. 

HAIL.

"Where's the threat? Oh, it's right here, and it's devouring us alive." -Ace<

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May 4th, 2012 at 4:53 PM | bodemeister (Score:3 Funny)
SteveInPhilly
Joined: 08/26/2010
MGoPoints: 90

I haven't paid as much attention to the prep races this year as I have in the past, so my opinion isn't that informed, but I'm going with Bodemeister. He is far and away the fastest horse speed figure wise. He hasn't really shown any rating ability, but if he can carve out a spot just off the leaders, that will keep him out of the traffic that can be a crap shoot to navigate for closers.

I also feel that Union Rags hasn't really taken a step forward this spring, so I'm a bit skeptical if he is fast enough, despite his tactical ability.

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:48 PM | You (Score:1)
BrewCityBlue
BrewCityBlue's picture
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: 1468

can't really go wrong with Bodemeister. I'm not a speed figure handicapper but anyone who is should be on Bode no doubt. He kinda came on the scene this year and caught everyone off guard with those huge Beyer figures he's been throwing up. 

I have a rule that I don't take favorites, so he's out for me, but I would not be one bit surprised if he held on to win. He's lightly raced but Baffert trains hard and will have him ready. Will hurt him a little bit that he's inside of the other early speed horses (Hansen and Trinniberg) but he seems like he's plenty good enough to overcome that. 

I agree with you on Rags as far as what he's shown this year - I'm hoping Pletcher has been gearing him up for his best race to be this one. I have a feeling he wasn't being pushed for his all in the FL derby. But a horse can only have so many "excuses" until he's just not as good a horse as originally thought. I may be a bit sentimental with Rags since I've liked him for a while. Hopefully that doesn't bite me too hard on Saturday. 

HAIL.

"Where's the threat? Oh, it's right here, and it's devouring us alive." -Ace<

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May 4th, 2012 at 8:50 PM | I think (Score:2)
SteveInPhilly
Joined: 08/26/2010
MGoPoints: 90

Matz is the trainer, not Pletcher, but the point still stands as Matz is a measured trainer who knows how to get his horse peaking at the right time. However, Union Rags would have to make a jump, more so than peaking, which is what gives me pause.

I did think the same thing with Bodemeister being to the inside of the other speeds and that's less than ideal, but with a couple furlongs to the first turn, there is time to find a good spot if Mike Smith can get a hold on him.

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May 6th, 2012 at 5:31 PM | Yeah (Score:1)
BrewCityBlue
BrewCityBlue's picture
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: 1468

you are totally right - i was confused. 

Rags had a tough trip again. 

I hit a real nice score on I'll Have Another - it was one hell of a derby day that I barely remember 

HAIL.

"Where's the threat? Oh, it's right here, and it's devouring us alive." -Ace<

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:31 PM | Love the Derby. I went two (Score:1)
icefins26
icefins26's picture
Joined: 02/01/2009
MGoPoints: 10521

Love the Derby. I went two years ago and it was one of the best sports/party experiences of my life. I am taking Trinniberg as my sleeper and Daddy Nose Best as my favorite.



Trifecta:



Daddy Knows Best

Dullahan

Bodemeister

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:50 PM | Can't even (Score:1)
BrewCityBlue
BrewCityBlue's picture
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: 1468

Can't even imagine going to the Derby. That would be amazing. I was there as a kid but not for live races. 

Only track I've been to for live races is Arlington Park - it was awesome, but nothing like a big race, much less the derby. 

HAIL.

"Where's the threat? Oh, it's right here, and it's devouring us alive." -Ace<

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:41 PM | Javier Castellano (Score:1)
Fhshockey112002
Fhshockey112002's picture
Joined: 11/08/2010
MGoPoints: 1275

For the "betting public" Javier Castellano (jockey for Gemologist) was just thrown off his horst in the American Turf race.  Javier was taken off on a stretcher, but seemed in ok spirits.  

Hope he can keep his ride on Gemologist tomorrow.

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May 4th, 2012 at 5:44 PM | Just saw that. He was (Score:1)
icefins26
icefins26's picture
Joined: 02/01/2009
MGoPoints: 10521

Just saw that. He was smiling going into the ambulance though. He should be OK. Those jockeys are tough as hell.

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May 4th, 2012 at 6:12 PM | WOW TOUGH!! (Score:1)
Fhshockey112002
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Joined: 11/08/2010
MGoPoints: 1275

Not only does Castellano look ok, he actually is taking his ride in the Kentucky Oaks.  That's one tough guy! 

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May 4th, 2012 at 6:10 PM | Living in Louisville means (Score:1)
Mr. Rager
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Joined: 11/16/2011
MGoPoints: 743

Living in Louisville means this is the best time of the year.  Derby parties and Churchill Downs!  Going to lose a lot of money tomorrow!

"to make a complete evaluation off video w/o seeing guys in-person - I don't believe that at all." - Josh Helmholdt

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May 4th, 2012 at 7:20 PM | I'll be there! And rain or (Score:2)
jhender85
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Joined: 10/25/2008
MGoPoints: 1381

I'll be there! And rain or shine, I'm betting on El Padrino. Only difference is if it's raining, I'm raising my bet big time. Like you (and Kramer) said, he loves the slop!

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May 4th, 2012 at 7:47 PM | well be here as well sporting (Score:1)
goblue7612
Joined: 03/02/2010
MGoPoints: 1018

well be here as well sporting the maize student shirts. we've seen plenty of Michigan and Michigan state ppl down here already. everyone must be pretty bored.

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May 4th, 2012 at 8:31 PM | 1st Derby experience for us (Score:1)
thisisme08
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Joined: 12/02/2008
MGoPoints: 1458

1st Derby experience for us but we will be heading over to Keeneland to watch the race.  Definately need to get brushed up on all the lingo.

Blue is Faster

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May 5th, 2012 at 9:57 AM | I live (Score:1)
LightTheLamp
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Joined: 04/20/2012
MGoPoints: 267

In Louisville and it stormed all night and the track is an absolute mud pit. Really is anyones race

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May 5th, 2012 at 1:18 PM | Nice thread guys (Score:1)
BeatOSU52
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Joined: 11/14/2011
MGoPoints: 590

I'm from Grand Rapids so I used to go to Great Lakes Down in Muskegon for each Triple Crown race.  As you may now, Great Lakes Downs got torn down about 4 years ago and so there aren't any tracks around me.  I got pretty good at betting on the Preakness and Belmont because I would take the shorter and longer distances into factor and find some sleepers in the field.

As for the Race, I like Creative Cause and Daddy Nose Best in exacta box.

We're not teaching them about sports, we're teaching them about life!

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