OSU Asst Coaches

Submitted by Ziff72 on

The thing that I find most unreal in this whole scenario is that everyone is treating L. Fikell like he is the clean guy  to lead the team.   You would think the asst. coaches on OSU would have even more information than Tressel.  How all these coaches are allowed to stay I don't know.

Is the obvious answer that the whole staff from Gee down to the equipment guy are going to be broomed come December but they are just allowing these guys to finish the  season because it is impractical to get a new staff in place right now?    Does Fikell have a chance to be retained as coach?   I just find it hilarious to picture Tressel's brother just sitting there in the Buckeye offices going man this is crazy who knew any of this was going on.  

This is the question I always wanted to ask Valenti.   If you think Tressel is such a scumbag and a cheat how can you adore your coach who was Tressel's right hand man and learned at this knee.

The asst's have to go.

andrewG

June 9th, 2011 at 10:02 AM ^

um, might have something to do with the fact that the ncaa doesn't possess hard evidence (emails) that the assisstant coaches clearly knew of ncaa violations and actively lied about it...

Logan

June 9th, 2011 at 10:23 AM ^

um, i don't think that's the issue of that he's making that claim. not sure if you've been reading the news recently but it turns out osu's program has been quite rotten from the inside out for years. for the assistant's not to know something was going on is laughable regardless of hard evidence. 

andrewG

June 9th, 2011 at 11:19 AM ^

from the OP: "You would think the asst. coaches on OSU would have even more information than Tressel."

tressel was the one getting emails from cicero, not the staff. i'm sure the assistants all had their suspicions, but not asking questions isn't nearly a big deal as an active cover-up.

Logan

June 9th, 2011 at 1:47 PM ^

I understand your point but based on everything that's coming out, the right thing for OSU (not the NCAA) to do is to say this was a dirty regime and all of Tressel's cronies/assistants (and possibly many in the AD's office) need to go.  This has nothing to do with whether or not the NCAA finds hard evidence that the assistants participated in the cover-up. At this point , it looks like they were either assisting in the violations or completely incompetent.

andrewG

June 9th, 2011 at 4:27 PM ^

my problem is with the argument is that i don't see the connect between what happened and the entire regime being dirty. clearly the compliance department sucks, but if tressel had gone to them instead of covering up (an individual act), he would still have a job. the problem for the coaching staff wasn't that shady shit was going on, it was the tressel's active cover up. with the current information out there right now, i don't see any reason that the rest of the coaching staff has to go.

joeyb

June 9th, 2011 at 10:03 AM ^

I think their goal is to try to leave the winning regime as much intact as possible and hopefully it will blow over by November. I don't think that's going to happen and I think they'll all be out at the end of the season.

EGD

June 9th, 2011 at 10:03 AM ^

I am not entirely sure that the OSU people have a fully-conceived plan for how they are going to deal with their upcoming NCAA-imposed beat-down.  But my assumptions regarding the promotion of Fickell and the retention of the other assistants are that (a) given the timing of the Tressel resignation, it would not be practical to hire an outside coach for the 2011 season, and (b) the Buckeyes figure they will want to get a big-time coach eventually, but they need someone to have the job until they are in a position to recruit a "real" head coach.

Farnn

June 9th, 2011 at 10:13 AM ^

OSU coaches aren't dumb, they had to know this was going on.  I really don't think any of this was encouraged by the university directly, it was simply allowed to happen.  Either they knew it was a recruiting advantage, or it was too big a mess to clean up without causing sanctions.  And it seems Dantonio has the same mentality, let them do what they want until law enforcement finds them, then bring them back when the legal penalty ends.

Six Zero

June 9th, 2011 at 10:21 AM ^

is truly delusional.  His responses over the past three months reinforce a ridiculous lack of grip on reality. If I didn't know any better, I'd swear he's just sitting over there singing in his chocolate factory and licking the walls trying to perfect the taste of 'snozberry' while the real world is closing in outside.

It's becoming harder and harder to believe that this won't be a gutting of the entire football program, leadership of the athletic department, and the school's top executive officers when it's all said and done.  I don't know how anyone over there could be sitting in their office right now without honestly expecting the axe to fall.

CRex

June 9th, 2011 at 10:23 AM ^

If you gut the entire program right now it means having to hire someone from outside the program.  You then are stuck with that person for a few years.  Right now tOSU has a coach and can try to struggle through the year with the Tresselball system the players know.  

Then at the end of the year you go "Oh Fickell was named in the infraction report", fire him and start backing up dump truck loads full of cash to Urban Meyer's house (actually they should already be filling up the dumptrucks).  .

If you gut the program now you have to make a speed hire from outside and then you're stuck with that guy for a few years unless you want to be a total prick and fire the guy after one year.  So longterm it is better for tOSU to use Fickell as an interm.  It does tank recruiting and the like, but it also gives them time to get a big name on the phone.  Or a hot young name if Meyer isn't taking their calls.  

pdgoblue25

June 9th, 2011 at 10:24 AM ^

Fickell was one of the main recruiters that built these teams over the last few years.

When I was a senior at OSU I wanted to fill some hours, so as an elective I took the class that Vest "teaches" with my friends.  Of course every story about the Vest teaching that class is pure horseshit, he would come in and take attendance and then leave.  At the end of the class he was supposed to sign one item for each student.  I didn't bring anything obviously because I couldn't have cared less, but every student in the class sure as hell did.  The bastard didn't even show up that day, I couldn't believe it.  You should have seen most of the guys in class, they looked like their dog had just died. 

Anyway, Fickell taught a lot of those classes, and while I can't verify how good of a coach he will be, it does pain me to say that he seems like a guy that players would run through a wall for.  With his ties to the program, and his youth, he's also the kind of guy that will be willing to ride out the sanctions that they're going to get nailed with.

I completely agree with the premise of your post though, there's no way that everyone was oblivious to what was going on, and because of it they should have cleaned house.

pdgoblue25

June 9th, 2011 at 4:04 PM ^

He's very direct, intelligent, looks people in the eye.  I could really tell that the man believed every word he said.  I remember sitting there and thinking, "wow, the players must love being coached by this guy."

Mattison was a homerun, there's no disputing that.  However, when Rod got canned I was hoping that if D-Coordinators were going to be interviewed that Fickell would have been at the top of the list.  I remember when Weis was still at ND, he tried to pry Fickell away from OSU.  I was praying that he would because at the time ND was no threat and I was worried Fickell would eventually do big things at OSU.

I realize the man is fuckeye through and through, but with a young coach, and the chance to be the only D-coordinator, not just the co-defensive coordinator, and maybe offering some more money, I figured we might have a shot at him.  Plus the guy is a great recruiter, and we all know where Bo was an assistant at...  Then Mattison was hired, which we all know was a hire that was knocked right out of the park.

BlueDragon

June 9th, 2011 at 5:33 PM ^

He sounds better than half the teachers I've had in the last three quarters.  It's too bad he didn't become our DC, but Mattison is the man.

This is almost the doomsday scenario for the second-in-command of any large enterprise.  The boss is down and out, and you have to take over the reigns of a wounded program.

Tater

June 9th, 2011 at 10:29 AM ^

If THE Ohio State University wants to show the NCAA they are "serious" about ending their systemic cheating, and possibly mitigate the penalties resulting from the growing investigation, they need to fire every coach who was within "sniffing distance" of any violations.  In other words, they need to "clean house" and start over.  If I was Gene Smith or Gordon Gee, I certainly wouldn't be signing any two-year agreements for cable or satellite service at home, either.  

When it's all said and done, I want THE Ohio State University to be like a modern update of the old joke: whenever you look up cheating, NCAA probation, NCAA investigation, or death penalty in any search engine, the entire first page is about THE Ohio State University.  Only then will they and their fanbase have gotten what they truly deserve.

CRex

June 9th, 2011 at 10:30 AM ^

Reply fail:  @pdgoblue25

As a Michigan fan that in theory has access to Tressel's signature you have two options:

1.  Show up with a voodoo doll and ask him to sign it.  The little doll must be wearing a little sweatervest.  To reflect recent times said doll should also have some nice ink work on at least one arm.  

2.  Have him sign something nice and then make a lot of money selling it.  Taking money from Bucknuts is always a legit move.  

angry byrne

June 9th, 2011 at 10:31 AM ^

I completely agree, unfortunately none of the people who run osu have any: 1.) balls to get rid of who is to blame or directly connected to the events, 2.) brains to think logically and realize that bending over and taking a whack now would probably lessen the blow that the NCAA is going to send their way later, and 3.) respect for anyone outside of their brotherhood.

 

On a completely separate note, has anyone seen the movie with luke fickell and that fat guy? I heard it was terrible.

2Blue4You

June 9th, 2011 at 10:34 AM ^

So do we assume that OSU is the subject of SI's level 6, 8, and 10 scandals?  Or do we have more to come?  

So when is the NCAA going to be hiring to deal w/ all the corruption going on right now.  I think they need to make an example and they have their perfect sacrificial lamb.  

jblaze

June 9th, 2011 at 10:36 AM ^

and the penalty to OSU should simply be, new AD, new compliance department, new coaches. Period. Bowl bans, sanctions... are all nice, but in reality who do they hurt and how much do they hurt?

USC could very well win the Pac-10 this year and play in the NC this or next year. If Pryor only served 5 games, OSU could win the B1G this year

The NCAA should clean house and make OSU fire everybody in sight. This will do 3 things.

1) All compliance people around the country will know that if they look the other way and get caught, they will be fired. This is motivation for everybody to blow the whistle when appropriate

2) This will punish the adults directly responsible for this mess at OSU, while not hurting the players (aside from going through a coaching transiton)

3) Prevent (or at least greatly hinder the ability of the AD, staff, and coaches) in finding new employment, because they were fired from their previous position for cause.

Farnn

June 9th, 2011 at 10:45 AM ^

I've been thinking that there need to be actual financial penalties to the University to make other schools think twice about breaking NCAA rules.  The payoff for cheating comes from increased alumni support and clothing sales and such.  So instead of a TV blackout which punishes opponents, and future players, instead you don't let them profit from their TV contracts for a couple years.  Make them hurt financially, prevent them from having the money to hire a good coach, or from upgrading their facilities.  Something along those lines might make schools think twice.

angry byrne

June 9th, 2011 at 10:46 AM ^

It would put some fire under those people to do the right thing, but after all, they already know that if they get caught they'll most likely be fired, right?  This just removes the 'most likely' and replaces it with 'certainly'.  I would still have the scholie losses and postseason bans, because that's a kind of a way to level the past and the future.  They cheated and were better on the field for it, so now to balance it they should have sanctions that will hurt them on the field in the future.

Mr Miggle

June 9th, 2011 at 11:20 AM ^

USC won't win the NC this year. It's the second year of their post-season ban. The scholarship reductions start with the 2012 class. It's premature to dismiss the severity of their penalties.

Sanctions for schools can be levied for violations they should have known about. While not disagreeing about punishing the individual offenders, show cause orders need to meet a higher standard of proof.  Most will get off the hook.

Who do you punish for hiring a coach with a track record of cheating and allowing him free rein to continue? The coach, of course, but the school needs to take most of the hit.

EJG

June 9th, 2011 at 2:56 PM ^

The post season ban and scholarship reductions will have a significant impact on wins and loses because players who will no longer be able to play in a bowl game are eligible for immediate transfer without sitting out.  Put a two year bowl ban on OSU and they will lose some Jrs and Srs to transfer.  Put a three year bowl ban on them and they lose Sophs as well.  Small numbers of upperclassmen and reduced numbers of underclassmen due to scholarship reductions wreck havoc on a program.  USC took a step back to 8-4 last year, but the worst is yet to come.

maizenbluenc

June 9th, 2011 at 11:03 AM ^

Has anyone heard that the NCAA is strapping on the gloves and saying "bend over and cough" yet? I have this foreboding sense that somehow, the NCAA gets bamboozled into thinking now that the liar, and the the car guy are gone, no need to look any closer, and then OSU goes to their hearing stating "we have taken action, are we good now?"

JC3

June 9th, 2011 at 11:19 AM ^

Apparently one of Ohio State's biggest boosters, (and some of his pals), are not fans of Fickell. A lot of more reasonable Buckeyes that I've talked to who are close to these boosters don't think Fickell will make it past 2011. 

oakapple

June 9th, 2011 at 11:54 AM ^

The NCAA has more lax rules of proof and weaker rules of discovery than the criminal law. Nevertheless, to penalize the assistant coaches, they need more proof than just the mere suspicion that they “must have known.”

I could very well see a scenario where Fickell has a season that’s “good enough,” while the big names outside the program (Meyer, Gruden, etc.) might be reluctant to take the job before it is clear how severe the sanctions will be.

Now, if the whole thing is wrapped up by January, and if OSU is socked with nothing worse than a 2-year bowl ban, then I think they could still attract any big name they want. If the sanctions are more severe, or if they are still unknown, it could be tough.

justingoblue

June 9th, 2011 at 11:57 AM ^

My question for a while has been: if the NCAA finds OSU/Tressel guilty of the tat infractions and they go on probation in 8/11, then the second COI hearing in March or April of 2012 results in new findings, are they repeat violators based solely on that? Does there have to be more time between the NOA, or what?

Bb011

June 9th, 2011 at 12:22 PM ^

This was my exact same thought. They are just as dirty as tressel.  With that said, I'm sure they will probably give them all the boot after this year.

chewieblue

June 9th, 2011 at 2:10 PM ^

more than a few HS and small college coaches have told me that the entire tOSU staff was told to put their houses on the market 'cause they are all gone at the end of the year.

michelin

June 9th, 2011 at 2:38 PM ^

Joe Daniels, QB coach and Darrell Hazel, WR coach were the two coaches who reportedly met with Sarniak in Jeannette, PA just before TP's visit  to UM.   The link below also details the possible OSU-Sarniak relationship.   Although I am not sure how much stock to place in this hearsay report, it is a report that long predates current knowledge about Tressel's lies and his extensive communications with Sarniak, including 77 phone call and text messages.



Unrelated to the Sarniak matter, I wonder how much was known by other coaches no longer at OSU.   Current MSU HC, Mark Dantonio had a major role in guiding OSU during the Clarrett era and the superficial investigation into his allegations of benefits and academic improprieties (2001-3).  Although MD was the defensive coordinator, I have trouble imagining that the improprieties were confined to the offense.   I also have trouble believing that MD knew nothing about the improprieties, which went unreported, if they were as extensive as now reported in the media.  



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