The official(ly) too early BBQ 2015 thread

Submitted by DennisFithian on
Gonna be another great day. High of 88 Who will be in attendance?

BigBlue02

July 26th, 2015 at 9:03 PM ^

And the RichRod haters still somehow believing he just forgot how to coach his 3 years here.

And your analogy is shit because you implied the Freep wasn't on a witch hunt. You don't need to be part of "The Faithful" to realize they were on a witch hunt and greatly exaggerated everything in their piece

JonnyHintz

July 26th, 2015 at 10:16 AM ^

Brought probation to the program, forced a 3-3-5 defense on a team and DC fit for the 4-3, recruited vastly undersized players at nearly every position (a starting LB had to move to safety under Hoke because he was too small), almost completely ignored OL recruiting (8 scholarship OL on roster for Hoke's first season), also ignored DL recruiting (although not to the extent of the OL), then there's the whole "lack of family values" accusation by Boren.

But yeah.... Let's go with not winning games as his "only" wrong-doing.

Magnus

July 26th, 2015 at 10:25 AM ^

As long as we're listing all the bad things (and only allowing one good thing to be noted), I'll toss in a few to balance it out:

He also recruited Taylor Lewan, Michael Schofield, Jake Ryan, Jeremy Gallon, Desmond Morgan, and Devin Gardner, among others. He developed David Molk on his way to winning the Rimington (after Rodriguez left). He helped develop Brandon Graham into a 1st round pick. He increased the win totals by 2 games each year and built the foundation for Brady Hoke's 11-2, Sugar Bowl-winning season.

JonnyHintz

July 26th, 2015 at 10:55 AM ^

It was acknowledged that he did a lot of good things here in the original comment. It also said the only thing he did bad was not win games.

I wasn't saying he only did bad things here, but he did do a lot more negative than simply not winning games. You mentioned 3 good OL there. But aside from those 3, he left Hoke with 5 other OL total. Regardless of who was coaching, there would have been some serious OL issues the past few years.

I also forgot to add the worst two defenses in program history came under RR's watch as a negative.

Lewan, Schofield, and Molk would mean more if he had the OL numbers to match. Gallon would mean more if he had recruited WR's with size. There was a time when Junior Hemingway was our biggest WR at 6'1". Greg Robinson is actually a pretty respectable 4-3 DC, but Rich Rod had the team run a 3-3-5 instead.

I wasn't simply bashing Rich Rod. I was responding to the comment that "the only bad thing he ever did was not win football games," which is completely and utterly false. Not that he didn't do some good things too, so don't misinterpret what I'm saying.

BigBlue02

July 26th, 2015 at 7:55 PM ^

Ah, the midget WR talk that is ridiculous in nature and a pretty stupid point. Considering his first full recruiting class got to be redshirt sophomores and true juniors, I'm not sure how you can say he left Hoke with anything less than a question mark. It is kinda weird to think Hoke got to coach Lloyd's redshirt senior class though

The Mad Hatter

July 26th, 2015 at 11:29 AM ^

But a close second for sure. A football team is like an army, you go to war with the one you have, not the one you want. I honestly think Debord would have done better as HC in 09.

RR's biggest problem was hubris and an inability to adapt. He should have let the DC run whatever scheme he wanted to and adapted his offense to fit the QB's we had, one of which was rated #9 in the nation when he was recruited IIRC.

BigBlue02

July 26th, 2015 at 8:05 PM ^

It's amazing with his inability to adapt that he's been able to be extremely successful everywhere he's coached other than Michigan. I can't believe he forgot how to coach his three years here.

Also, the fact you mentioned adapting his offense and didn't mention that he got an offense that returned one starter and the whole decimated defense tells me you might have a bit of a bias

The Mad Hatter

July 26th, 2015 at 8:31 PM ^

I'm a Michigan fan. I'm biased towards Michigan, not any coach in particular. If Harbaugh or any other coach posted a similar record I'd be calling for their heads too.

50 years we went without a losing season. Lloyd didn't leave the cupboard that damn bare.

BigBlue02

July 26th, 2015 at 9:09 PM ^

Did you actually watch the talent on that team? Yes, Lloyd did leave the cupboard that damn bare, even simply from a numbers standpoint as a large chunk of his recruiting classes were not on the team before RichRod even got here.

Go read decimated defense and let me know how stocked the cupboard was

JonnyHintz

July 26th, 2015 at 9:12 PM ^

Appalachian State was a dynasty at the FCS level. 3 straight national titles during that time frame. I'd put them as being better than a 3 win MAC team, especially when you go and watch North Dakota State put up more wins against the Big 12 the past 3 years than Kansas has.

The top teams in the FCS can easily compete with the middle tier of the FBS, and pull a big upset every now and then. A 3-9 team from the MAC, I have a hard time saying the same.

BigBlue02

July 26th, 2015 at 11:30 PM ^

When you look at an upset, you also have to look at the team that is being upset, not just the upsetter. The reason Harbaugh's Stanford upset of USC was one of the best of all time was not just because USC was really good that year, it was also because Stanford was awful. USC had a 35 game home winning streak and Stanford was coming off a 1-11 season.

The team that lost to that amazing FCS dynasty had NFL draft picks all over the roster, including 4 year starters at QB and RB to go along with 2 high draft picks at WR and possibly the best offensive lineman to come through Michigan. The team that lost to Toledo had the same record as them and was not a good football team. The Appy State loss will go down as one of the greatest upsets in college football history and the Toledo game will be remembered by no one other than RichRod haters

Magnus

July 26th, 2015 at 11:31 AM ^

That loss was not nearly as bad as the loss to Appalachian State. We were expecting to be national championship contenders in 2007, and we lost to an FCS team. Regardless of what expectations were for 2008, it was a bad team without much talent that (if you subtract the Toledo loss) was still 3-7. Only six players accounted for more than 100 yards of total offense, nobody rushed for more than 533 yards, and nobody caught more than 433 yards of receptions.

I shrug my shoulders at the Toledo loss. It was a bad loss in Michigan's worst season during my lifetime. The loss to Appalachian State is widely regarded as one of the biggest upsets in college football history.

coldnjl

July 26th, 2015 at 6:19 PM ^

I see your point, but RR was fired because he NEVER won the big game. We kept improving by beating the teams we should, but never once did we beat someone who was a power. Furthermore, the inability to field a functional defense at any time during his tenure suggests that he wouldn't have got to the 11 win mark that Hoke did in his first year. 

Overall, a bad loss is just one game. A bad 4 years with little suggestion that he would ever field a long term winner imo is a greater blotch