Wait, you mean that the Freep is NOT your favorite newspaper???
well that's just, like, your opinion, man
Wait, you mean that the Freep is NOT your favorite newspaper???
You clearly don't appreciate quality investigative journalism.
But that is very fine writing by Rhoden. Good link.
Good writing and while I clearly see Rhoden believes that in his mind Tressel deserves punishment and punishment would be harsh for him to stay, I don't see it that way.
If he keeps his job it might as well be vindication for Tressel or essentially a slap on the wrist. As the quote from Brionte Dunn's father clearly indicates, players don't give a darn as long as they aren't missing out on TV exposure or bowl games. If the players keep coming, the Buckeyes keep winning and Tressel ascends back up his mountaintop where this whole episode becomes a small anecdote to the storied career of the Sweatervest. For Tressel to keep his job is basically OSU thumbing their nose at the NCAA and getting away with it. No way. He's got to go. If he stays, the NCAA ought to shutter the doors to their compliance office because there is clearly no point in following the rules.
Keeping a job in which your falsehoods and cheating have been have been exposed seems like a medieval notion of purgatory. We're not living in the middle ages. He should be fired, like any other flagrant cheater.
Although I disagree that him keeping his job is the worst punishment (I would argue losing his $3.4 MIL salary would be a bit more harsh), it is a different perspective on the whole matter.
I'm not sure how this will play out but I believe that the vest keeps his job. I do think the NCAA will hand down a significant punishment to the vest however. I don't think this will sink OSU just provide a minor setback (in which Michigan passes them by and becomes the dominate school in the B1G Ten again).
This whole scenario may work out well for us. Tressel is susspended 5 games, he comes back coaches 1 or 2 games and thinks he's in the clear. Then the NCAA comes down with their punishment and OSU has no choice but to can him in the middle of their season. All the recruits open back up. We swoop in, snatch up all their tallent. We beat them, and Pryor goes all LeGarrett Blount on some fans, and is black balled in the draft.
I like the way you think
Not to get technical, but the quote was from Dunn's father.
I thought TomVH kind of blew that whole idea up in the past couple days. Dunn is taking his visits but still considers himself committed to OSU, I thought.
Now sleep in it. I want him around for a few years to kick around. Plus if he leaves, a new guy can come in and talk to recruits without Tressel's baggage. I want JT to wallow in his own muck here for a while. Agree with the NYT
The only meaningful punishment in college football is to be banished from college football. I want Tressel exiled into oblivion, gone and disgraced. That's the only suitable punctuation for this affair.
then I do not understand how he could coach during the week at practices. If ultimately, the NCAA forces his suspension, then I do not understand why it would not be a full suspension without pay.
If Ohio wishes to take the high road which they always espouse, then how can they avoid firing Tressel soon? If they keep him on any basis, then the spin will be interesting.
If you do the math, he's actually earning extra money for being suspended. If you say Tressel makes $3.5m, and say 50% of that is for actually coaching on gameday, $1.75m/12 = $146k. Multiply that by a five game suspension, and subtract the $250k and Tressel nets close to $500k for his vacation.
What they would do if they actually wanted to punish Tressel and the program he runs is make it a true five week suspension and fine him 10% of his pay, at minimum.
Personally, I think he deserves to be fired and he deserves a show-cause.
"The turmoil resonates beyond Columbus. Running back Bri’onte Dunn of Canton, Ohio, gave a verbal commitment to Ohio State. In a phone interview Wednesday Dunn’s father, Brion, said his son will make other visits. Most notably to Michigan."
I had to take a second look when I came across this part of the article. Then it when on how Dunn was "looking forward on being a buckeye" and "wanting to just be on teams that win".
It was disheartening to see that there are fewer players that just want to come to Michigan to be a part of it all. In my opinion, going to a school for the wrong reason only sets you up for failure.
The highlight for me was the line: "Every Buckeyes coach since Paul Brown has been fired." Brown coached in the 40s, is that accurate? If so, then that is awful.
but Tressel/Ohio won't lose anything if they keep winning games. As it was stated before his legacy is already shot.
tressel reminds me a Sgt. Shultz from Hogan's Heroes .... "I know nothing". He lies, and lies, and lies ... end of story !
Letting tressel keep his job reinforces the fact that tressel and tsio can do anything they want to without reprocussion. IMO - if the media keeps scratching they will uncover that this is just on the surface of the issue. This is systemic and Smith and Gee are just as "dirty" in these schemes as tressel is.
There is simply no way that Smith did not know about this ! C'mon tressel is going to forward emails to TP's "mentor" (read ... cash laundry agent) about TP's dealing with a felon and not tell Smith ? Really ? And then tressel knowingly lies to sign a statement to the NCAA ... and this guy doesn't get fired ? Why ? What - so he can keep his $3.4M salary ... yeah, he gonna feel real bad about this .... some people (writers) just don't have a clue.
Go Blue !
I didn't think this necessitated a new thread, but Brian is on WTKA right now discussing the OSU/Tressel situation. Nothing really new, but some pretty interesting discussion if anyone is interested. I'm sure the podcasts will be up after also, for anyone that wanted to check it out later.
EDIT: Also this new scoring thing is confusing me. I don't seem to have any buttons for moderating, and this post just automatically went grey and folded up as soon as I posted it. Is that normal?
Ok, if Tressel has tarnished his image and caused a great problem for the OSU football program, why would they keep him? Sure, it is a nobel idea to make him stay and serve his punishment, but what is more important, punishing the Senator or recovering as quickly as possible? If you keep him around to let his legacy become more corrupted in the public eye, that hurts your recruiting more than him leaving, I would think... "Come play for our cheating coach as he rides out his sentence" is not all that appealing.
No, I think the best thing for the university is to "let" him retire and move on, even if it means a year with an interim coach. They have more than enough talent to get by for a year. This still leaves some amount of his legacy in place (expecially for the OSU pinheads), perhaps even portraying him as a martyr who "died " for his players/administration.
Letting Tressel retire after this next year may well be the course of action that is followed, particularly since there is no way the NCAA renders its decision until well into the season.
The NYT article is premised upon Tressel having guilt and will be suffering pain if left to coach. The other side of that is that the guy feels he did the right thing "protecting his players" (or his winning record) and will feel no guilt at all. Another possibility is that Tressel did walk down the hall and had the conversation with Smith or perhaps met with Gee. If that is the case, as the fall guy, he might not have any guilt at all.
Because he beats Michigan. That is all they really care about down there.
I think this may be the first article that's pointed out the tradition of OSU football coaches getting fired, every single one going back to Paul Brown of the early 1940's.
When the Maurice Clarrett stuff was conveniently swept under the rug several years ago, I started thinking Tressel might break that streak since he was officially untouchable thanks to his (at the time) 2-1 record against Michigan.
Not only is it the first article to point out the firings, but it may be the first article to go into detail as far back as YSU to show how this has been an ongoing problem with Tressel. I know there have lots of overtures on this blog about what he has done in the past but so many of the articles lately either skip the older stuff or only mention the past transgressions in passing. This seems to be the first (and I have not read all the articles) that ties together a history of issues with Tressel since the NCAA came down hard on tOSU over the past few months. Even if i am wrong about other articles going into past details, it was a great article and probably hit a wider audience outside of the Big 10.
I'm not sure that's exactly true. Paul Brown got called up to serve in WWII then came back to pro football, not OSU; he did try to go back to OSU in 1954 but the athletic board rejected him and hired Hayes. Wes Fesler resigned (though I think it was one of those "resign or we'll fire you" resignations). And Carroll Widdoes won a national title with OSU in 1944 and left after two seasons and a 16-2 record--hardly the kind of resume that would suggest he was fired, though he might have been. What is true, though, is that from 1954 to 2001 OSU had three football coaches and all three of them were eventually fired.
He believes he is above the NCAA. They need to take old Jimmy down a notch or two. He obviously doesnt get it.
Tressel has done whatever he wants to while running two consummately corrupt programs for over a decade now. He has probably committed every violation in the rulebook, but has never suffered any consequences for it. How could he possibly see himself as anything but "untouchable?"
Made only b/c the NYT doesn't want to be trite and say what everyone else is saying. "Fire Tressel" at this point is very late to the party.
I don't see how keeping Tressel as coach is smart if you're OSU. If they care about the reputation of their school and program, you'd think they would come around to the conclusion that amputation is the only treatment at this point. But, keeping him is going to hurt their recruiting for sure I would think. That alone should convince Buckeye Nation to dump him. Loved the quote from Dunn in the article. Having him commit to Michigan would send massive shock waves through TSIO and it's boosters.
Quite the Oxymoron you've got going there :-)
This idea is so stupid it's either brilliant or... incredibly stupid. The writer is probably thinking of Pete Carroll. But the NFL isn't calling Jim Tressel. He'd likely be done coaching.
OSU is his dream job. Letting him keep it will affirm the idea of OSU fans that it was no big deal. The media questioning would die down soon. It would mostly be friendly local media anyway and he would have a regular outlet to repair his image..
“If he survives this people are always going to associate this whole mess to his legacy,” Noon said.
If he is fired for it that will definitely be true. If he isn't, who knows? Would most people even remember Woody punching Charlie Bauman if he was suspended for a couple of games and went on to win a couple more Rose Bowls and an NC?
OSU isn't going to to "punish" Tressel. But they are going to fire him, once the NCAA makes it clear it's in their own best interest.
It was in the Gator Bowl. As in, "Not the Rose Bowl." By that time in Woody's career, Bo Schembechler was more or less stealing Woody's lunch money on an annual basis. We had beaten OSU like three times in a row. Including an embarassing shutout one year, and a pounding in Columbus. I was at the 'Shoe for Woody's last game there. As we filed out, the largely-silent losing home crowd could be heard rumbling about how Woody finally had to go. That was all ocurring before the bowl game against Clemson.
That's one big difference from the present day.
Ohio Pres. G. Gee is an obstinate SOB. He has fought agaist sensible playoff systems in favor of the ridiculous BCS and he'll stick with Tressel until the bitter (or not so bitter) end.
How is my question of Mr. Rogers off topic? Whoever thought so, I wonder, did you even bother to read the NYT article which this thread is about, wherein William Rhoden compares Tressel to Mr. Rogers?
Thanks for the 2 cents and the upvote. I do know the rules around here, but doesn't mean I can't get peeved at someone for not paying attention.
Letting him keep his job would hardly be a punishment. He's in his late 50s. If he's fired he'll probably never again land a job this prestigious (and this may be the only job he wants, anyway). If he and his staff can remain in place, the NCAA punishment will likely only be a temporary setback. Firing him forces OSU to try to find an equivalent coach, which will be very difficult.
Also, if he's fired now, and 2010 is vacated, he'd then go down to 94 career wins at OSU. Being denied a chance at the 100-victory plateau (he has 106 if the victories stand) would have to smart.
I agree that if he keeps his job it won't be much of a punishment to Tressel, but he will have to carry the embarrassment and deal with any recruiting impact.
The only way to really punish him (other than the unlikely scenario of OSU actually firing him) is to start beating him, one game at a time. That is easier said than done, as a lot of competitors and their fans learn, year after year.
I don't know when, and I don't know just how, but when the NYT starts mocking your program and coach, even the cretins in Columbus have to realize this is not good for the university's image. They have worked hard to upgrade the academic image that they have for the last decade--this isn't helping that. Tressel likely lasts the year, but I think he is gone in 2012.
I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that the NYTimes is not the paper-of-choice for the rank-and-file OSU fan. Now if this article appeared in USA Today, you might be on to something.
In any event, I think the NYTimes article is a bit silly. If OSU retains him, the fan base and many alumns will forgive and forget, and it will be business as usual with that team from Ohio.
No but the NYT is likely the paper of choice for people who run in the same circles as their Trustees and Gee. Hopefully the WSJ calls him out and then we'll know for sure that they're hearing about it in private.
The cretins don't matter too much. When the Board of Trustees and Gee start running into people who are asking "why are you employing a person like that?" that's when the hammer drops, IMO.
If they start feeling personally attached in a way they don't like, they'll cave to outside pressure.
Given Gee's pathetic "I hope Coach doesn't fire me" attitude, people may be asking the Trustees why they're keeping him employed, too.
That was about the weirdest comment I could possibly imagine. Imagine a high level government official getting involved in something and having Obama saying "I hope he/she doesn't fire me." or a CEO saying the same thing about a CFO who fudged some numbers. I can't think of one example like that.
It might have just been a stupid comment, but I don't believe for a second that people in academic communities haven't heard that quote and look down on OSU for having a president who would say that. I wouldn't be happy at all with Gee if I was a Trustee there.
It was Gee that said it, not Smith, their AD. But I definitely agree. Sports media is as high profile as these guys will normally get (Gee isn't Larry Summers) and they take the oppertunity to make their school look like a joke. When IU fired Kelvin Sampson, there were no ridiculous statements like that; when the Ed Martin scandal came to light, MSC damn sure wasn't in a mood for jokes.
In every other case, there was at least a modicum of respect for the institution, and Gee made a mockery of it. I'm very glad I'm not a student there about to interview for jobs with a degree from a school so clearly centered on athletics.
Whether they do or not is not the point. If he was forced to stay and coach making minimum wage and had to endure 8-loss seasons for five years, that would be a punishment. Since none of that would ever happen, and, since he he has a history of transgressions, what would be just would be a prompt firing and the NCAA banning him from coaching for five years.
Either way, he should not be allowed to coach the team at all this season. The ridiculous idea of "suspending" Tressel for five games, is pointless if he is allowed to coach during the week. He should be banned from all football related activities from the opening of camp thru those five games. Let's see how the bucks play then.
Intil I see that the NCAA really punishes OSU and takes away wins, recruits and bans bowls and Tress and Gene Smith are fired, I have no faith that the NCAA wants to punish anyone. I'm still pissed about the USC "sanctions", yeah, right. They signed 31 players. By the time the NCAA takes away the 10 schollies per season, they'll be playing in bowl games again. Some punishment.
I'll take Kevin Noon in the mgoblog death pool, please.
I live in DC and, as usual, happened to be listening to the local sports talk radio station late this morning, a radio station owned or controlled by the owner of the Redskins, a man who is quite possibly the most disliked team owner in the history of sports (not to exaggerate). I have heard a lot of stories yesterday and today about how professional football players have shown up at their training facilities and been allowed into the building but not been allowed to use the equipment in the building or talk with coaches. The announcer was screaming about how people were untruthfully reporting that the players were not being allowed into the buildings and how untrue and unfair that was, while largely ignoring the part of every story that indicated that players were not being allowed to use facilities in the manner they would be used but for the strike and lockout. In other words, he was trying to convince everyone that it was unfair to suggest that the players were being kept out of the facilities when they were being allowed inside but not being allowed to do anything except look around inside the building. The announcer was, of course, no more than a mouthpiece for the Redskins, trying earnestly and vociferously to make his listening audience think the owner was being a good guy and was being unfairly castigated by uncaring and dishonest reporters who were on the side of the players. Were Tressel to stay, Ohio radio stations would probably be equally vociferous in defending him, with the folks currently complaining about him going on with their lives. In short order, it would be as if nothing had ever happened, even for recruiting. After a year or two or maybe even three, recruits would look at how many games his teams had won and how many of his players had gone on to play in the NFL and would ignore tatgate and his other peccadilloes. For him to have any real punishment, he has to go, cut off without a golden parachute and with him having a lot of time on his hands to reflect upon his past misconduct and realizing what kind of guy he is every day when he looks in the mirror to shave.
I listen to both but usually to WTEM in the morning for either Mike & Mike or Tony Kornheiser. A draft special was on instead of Tony this morning, and it involved the ranting apologist.
But his head isn't. There are a couple of issues with this article: there's a difference between guys like Calipari and Carroll, who jump ship before having to deal with the mess they created, and guys like Mike Leach, who get punished for screwing up. That difference being that the former are gainfully employed while the latter—not so much. Although it is the worst school that man ever created, to coach at the D-1 level (even at OSU) is still a position of honor and responsibility, two components of the job that Tressell has completely disregarded for the entirety of his career. Furthermore, the way the sports media works today, no matter what the offense, whenever some pulls through a tough spot and comes through the other side, they’re seen as martyrs. One needs to look no further than Cam Newton last year. By the time the National Championship game rolled around, I heard the words “adversity” and “perseverance” applied to him so many times it made my head spin—as though NCAA rules were a burden, and that the American public should be to blame for any sort of animosity applied in his direction.
When the man’s not fit for the job, fire the man.
I never get tired of tressel bashing.