Notre Dame to look at ACC before Big 10

Submitted by hart20 on

ESPN is reporting on their ticker that while Notre Dame prefers to stay independent in football and in the Big East in all other sports, if Notre Dame was forced to join a conference, they would look at the ACC before the Big 10. 

 

Haven't found a link yet, but I'll post one as soon as I find it.

 

To me, this makes no sense. What rivals do ND have in the ACC? There's Boston College,Georgia Tech and Miami, and Pitt. Of those, BC and Pitt are the only rivalries that I'd consider real.The ND-Michigan and ND-MSU rivalries dwarf the ND-Pitt and ND-BC rivalries.ND plays Purdue every year too. And they play Penn St. and Northwestern occasionally. Notre Dame to  the ACC just doesn't make much sense.

LJ

September 20th, 2011 at 8:50 AM ^

If that's true about the city being "in the footprint," that is insane to me.  Who cares where the school is located?  It should simply be about who wants to watch.  Like the previous responder said, I'm sure many more people in NYC want to watch Michigan games than Rutgers games, so if we don't already have the TV market there, I don't see why adding an irrelevant school that happens to be close to city should change things.

EDIT: This was meant to be a reply above--not sure what happened.

oakapple

September 20th, 2011 at 8:51 AM ^

This is a huge misconception that pops up on Michigan message boards — that B1G schools should stop scheduling Notre Dame, to “punish them” for their arrogance, their refusal to join a conference, their BCS deal, or whatever the fans are annoyed about.

This is simply wrong. Purdue and Michigan State get far more out of playing Notre Dame than the Irish get out of playing them. Purdue is fairly obvious. Notre Dame is their only rivalry that anyone outside the state of Indiana cares about. If they dropped Notre Dame, they might not have a nationally televised game ever again. The Irish can schedule anyone and get it televised; Purdue can’t.

The Spartans are in only slightly better shape. They’re a more popular and better known team than Purdue; still, there is no opponent they could schedule regularly that is as high-profile as Notre Dame. Whereas the Irish could easily replace Michigan State with a comparable opponent, the Spartans could not so easily replace the Irish.

That leaves Michigan, which could replace Notre Dame with comparable opponents, if it wanted to. But the notion that this would “penalize” the Irish, or “teach them a lesson,” is just daft. There was a 35-year hiatus in the Michigan/ND rivalry between 1943 and 1978, and Notre Dame did just fine. If Dave Brandon thinks Michigan would be better off without ND, he can go ahead and drop them, although I think Brandon is smarter than that. If he does so, it should be because it makes Michigan better, not in the delusion that it makes Notre Dame worse.

For the record, the ACC makes quite a bit of sense for Notre Dame. They will never have trouble recruiting their own back yard (the midwest), while an East Coast schedule would help them recruit that part of their country. Plus, there are a lot of Catholic fans in the Northeast. I am not saying the Irish will go to the ACC (I think they will remain independent), but it is not such a bad idea if they do.

justingoblue

September 20th, 2011 at 12:10 PM ^

They could easily schedule a home and home with an ACC, SEC or Pac opponent. ASU scheduled Wisconsin and Illinois in recent years, Cincinnati and Tennessee are in the middle of a home and home, Illinois has gotten one of the Arizona schools, it's very possible for them to schedule another decent opponent.

I have no idea how their fanbases would feel about dropping ND, but quality games are out there for schools that want to schedule them.

dahblue

September 20th, 2011 at 9:04 AM ^

First, fuck Notre Dame
Second, I don't recall where I heard this (and don't know if it's accurate) but ND could look to the ACC because they don't share revenue equally as does the B1G.
Third, the ACC still sucks.
Finally, fuck Notre Dame.

MichiganStudent

September 20th, 2011 at 9:05 AM ^

Lets just say we "have" to get to 16 and ND is not an option because they decide to head over to the ACC. Who do we get then?

To me, it looks like it would be any of these teams: Missouri, Rutgers, Kansas, K-State, Iowa St, Louisville, UConn, Cincy. 

Its going to come down to these criteria as well: Money (expanding B1G footprint with media markets), Football (competitiveness and appeal), other sports (i.e. Uconn has hockey for the B1G hockey conference, etc), and geography. 

dahblue

September 20th, 2011 at 10:10 AM ^

Ugh...Looking at that list of schools isn't a pretty thing.  Thinking in selfish terms, there isn't one school on your list that I'd want to see in Michigan Stadium more than even the worst B1G opponent.  Minnesota or Iowa St - who cares?  Northwestern or Kansas - stubhub?

I don't know what's going to happen with all the expansion, but it seems too much too fast (just ask TCU).

gopoohgo

September 20th, 2011 at 9:07 AM ^

http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/nsf11313/pdf/tab31.pdf 

 

Most recent National Science Foundation (FY 2009) research expenditures, all sources.

Michigan and Wisconsin are #2 and #3 in total research spending annually, about $1 billion each

Iowa is the lowest of the current B1G, around $330 million

Notre Dame spends like $95 million.  Saw a thread on Rivals board about this last night, and the ND poster stated that ND has more in common with the private, smaller ACC schools like BC.

They may be right; I think the CIC entrance may be much more difficult than football fans may believe.  Michigan and Wisconsin voted to boot (supposedly) Nebraska out of the AAU for God's sake.  There is no way that ND is anywhere near AAU status yet.

MichiganStudent

September 20th, 2011 at 9:13 AM ^

Nice research. Thanks. 

I just clicked the link and it shows Rutgers and Cincy ahead of Iowa in terms of research dollars. If nothing else, its a positive for both those schools if they wanted to join. 

I still stand by this: if its emminent that we are expanding, then losing out on Pittsburgh hurts. They have relatively good academics, they spend money on research, geographical fit, potential showcase rivalry with Penn State, good "secondary" sports, and another media market that would expand the B1G Network. 

neoavatara

September 20th, 2011 at 9:13 AM ^

 

This is just ND, Texas and everyone else trying to leverage power.

Everybody is going to hint they are going everywhere, until the dominos fall.  Otherwise, they have no leverage.  Notre Dame will hint about every alternative before coming to the table with the Big 10, because they are under the delusion that the Big 10 needs them more than they need us, and thus, will get nervous and make a quick and advantageous deal to ND.  

ND doesn't gain anywhere close to the same results by joining the ACC or anyone else.  Monetary is just one advantage.  How would is suck for their other sports to travel those distances?  Despite what anyone is saying that eats at the bottom line too.  

I think the Big 10 is playing this right.  If you are a big school like ND or Texas, you got a phone call...but not much more.  And if you want to go elsewhere because you don't like financial parity, fine by us.  If you want to join as equal partners, give us a call.

And anyone that doesn't like that, fine by me. 

M-Dog

September 20th, 2011 at 9:53 AM ^

"if you’re going to tie your football program to a conference for the next 50 years, do you want to do it in a region of the country (the Midwest) which is growing at a far slower rate than the Southeast and Mid-Atlantic?"

This is the part that scares me in all of this.  That the B1G gets locked into a permanent Midwest Rust Belt conference status while all of our major rival conferences are in high-growth areas. 

The ACC and Pac 16 are fast locking up all of the appealing teams that we would want to invite for eastward or southward expansion.  If ND is off the table, there goes our National trump card.   

oakapple

September 20th, 2011 at 9:30 AM ^

A lot of the expansion talk is along the lines of, “If the Big Ten has to add 2 (or 4) teams, who would they be?”

But they don’t have to add anybody. When conferences expand, it is usually about the following:

  • Academics
  • Football
  • Money

No conference expands unless it will make more money than the payout it will owe to its new members, and no conference expands unless it will get stronger (or at least preserve its strength) in football.

Conferences sometimes make minor academic sacrifices (e.g., the Big Ten accepted Nebraska), but not major ones (no way they would’ve taken Louisville).

No conference has the combination of academic prestige, football prestige, and financial payout of the Big Ten. Because of this, it’s hard to come up with schools that would make the Big Ten better. In fact, Texas and Notre Dame just might be the only ones.

If Texas and/or Notre Dame are interested, the Big Ten would listen. But no one is going to tell the Big Ten that they have to add teams.

bluesouth

September 20th, 2011 at 9:49 AM ^

ND to the ACC?   I am willing to bet ND ends up in the BIG.  This ND to the ACC is just leverage really, basically the oldest barganing chip is to say I'll take my business elsewhere if you don't meet my demands.   ND is pretty much a defacto BIG team and they really have no other bargaining chip. 

A side note if you will.  ND does not meet the research standards set to be a BIG Team.  You see high ranking research universities get high ranking grant money.  Since ND is not in the top 50 of research institutions which is the conerstone of BIG schools, they cannot join the BIG for that reason alone.

Conspriacy theory:  ND does not wan to be a part of the BIG because somemany schools are engaged in research that is contrary to ND/Catholic doctrine.  Ie. stem cell, abortion

 

M2NASA

September 20th, 2011 at 9:51 AM ^

This would be consistent with the word on the Pitt board after SU and Pitt jumped to the ACC and how it went down.

Word was that ND coupled themselves with Pitt and Syracuse and would go wherever they went.  There was obviously conversations with both the Big Ten and ACC.  When Florida State voted to start an exploratory committee on conference expansion, the ACC became proactive.  Swofford then called Norderberg and Pitt and Cantor at Syracuse and said you're in or you're out right now, which is why it happened so quickly.

SU and Pitt committed on the spot, and now ND feels spurned which is why Swarbrick has had such vitriolic comments.  ND feels that they are academically more aligned with the ACC schools and have had good relationships with SU and Pitt, and values exposure to the NY market with SU (they currently have a 10-game series scheduled with SU with 5 games at the Meadowlands).

So that's one rumor that would make sense.

BobMass

September 20th, 2011 at 10:11 AM ^

This whole realignment clusterfk is about money, period. Honor, tradition, academics, integrity, etc. have nothing to do with it. Everybody's putting their souls on eBay. The decision maker in all of this is Benjamin Franklin and some dead Presidents. 

What all of this has to do with providing quality higher education in this country escapes me.

Our beloved Big 10 is no different. Watching that idiot in the bowtie masquerading as the President of Ohio State slobber all over the morally bankrupt douche bag coach and his cast of future felons was not enlightening. Almost as bad as the IU idiot that shredded his dignity to keep from firing his psychotic basketball coach a few years ago.

If there was any justice in this world somebody would have arrested both teams last week when Oh Shit played Miami and sparred us all the fake NCAA "enforcement" BS.

As for ND? They're two vodka martinis way from starring in the remake of Sunset Boulevard. It ain't bragging if you can do it; but they can't do it anymore. Frankly, who cares about ND, except ND?  

Somebody needs to take the crack pipes away from the these college presidents and lock 'em in a room without the networks, moneychangers, and lawyers. When we're grillin' brats for the Little Ceasars Pizza Bowl, or the Papa Johns Bowl from Dunkin Dounts Stadium or whatever, somebody has snorted a whole lot of something.

I am not stupid or naive enough to believe in any "purity" of college sports or "student/athletes". There is way too much money in college sports for that anymore. And nothing will change that as long as we are willing to buy tickets or push buttons on the clicker. 

But... is this really what we want college sports to be about? Just askin'

 

 

Moonlight Graham

September 20th, 2011 at 10:24 AM ^

I agree the ESPN ticker about Notre Dame preferring the ACC is a smokescreen and a negotiation ploy for both the B1G and ACC to consider. Either way, Notre Dame is no longer going to be a "national" program anymore at least as far as scheduling. Either conference is going to have 14-16 teams, leaving ND only three nonconference games. if they join the ACC, will those be UM, MSU and Purdue? No more Southern Cal or Navy? If they join the B1G, will the nonconference games could BC, Southern Cal and Navy, and they'd still play UM, MSU, and Purdue along with, for goodness sakes, bus rides to Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern, Ohio State, and Penn State. What? That's only 8 conference games? How does ND-Nebraska sound? Absolute no-brainer. 

Pdeaner

September 20th, 2011 at 10:57 AM ^

ND can make demands and push around the ACC.  They can't do this to the BIG 10 and schools like Michigan.  So they will go look for a sweetheart deal from the ACC.  They would rather be a big fish in a small pond.

jblaze

September 20th, 2011 at 11:51 AM ^

because of the Irish, and Catholic connections. They have a lot of fans/ alumni and get top talent from the area. I think they want to preserve this. If they joined the B10, the closest they would get is Central PA.

WolvinLA2

September 20th, 2011 at 1:21 PM ^

Um, ND's biggest fanbase is in Chicago. It's where the biggest chunk of their alumni go, and as it turns out, there are some Irish-Catholics in Chicago too. If ND joins the Big Ten, the alumni in Chicago and the students can drive to about any game, and the East Coasters will come, just like M alumni. Going to the ACC means the Chi alums and the student body won't be at many away games.

gajensen

September 20th, 2011 at 1:54 PM ^

Ugh, if we're not getting Pitt or ND I'd rather stay put at 12.  I would have liked to have found a way to add Mizzou but I can't think of a partner for them and an uneven conference is one of the last things I want.

Brodie

September 20th, 2011 at 4:01 PM ^

ESPN is pushing this whole bullshit ACC getting Texas and ND thing because the ACC is the only conference 100% under ESPN's control. If the Big East had taken ESPN's last contract offer, they'd probably have Notre Dame considering joining for football to save the league.

If Notre Dame is willing to join a conference and they end up somewhere other than the Big Ten, I don't care what concessions they're given... Delaney will have failed and wound up the biggest loser of the conference expansion. If we sit pat now and lose out on the only appealing candidates near our borders (Mizzou and ND), we've failed and we'll have nobody to blame but ourselves when we start falling behind in revenue.