Notre Dame joins ACC W/ Exception of football
http://twitter.com/PreSnapRead/statuses/245879343249780737
"RT @McMurphyESPN Notre Dame will join ACC as full member w/exception of football. ND will play 5 FB games annually v ACC, sources told @ESPN"
September 12th, 2012 at 12:07 PM ^
Every move Notre Dame makes seems to piss me off.
Sometimes I wish Michigan, MSU and Purdue would tell them to suck it and stop playing them. If they want to build their reputation beating the weaklings from the ACC, so be it.
September 12th, 2012 at 6:23 PM ^
Don't worry, they'd find a way to screw it up somehow. They wound up losing to fellow future ACC member syracuse at home while their student section threw snowballs at them.
September 12th, 2012 at 12:09 PM ^
on their schedule, it will continue to prevent the B1G-Pac12 cross-scheduling concept from coming to fruition: Stanford and USC were the two schools who voted against that, on account of not wanting to have ND, a B1G school, and 9 conference games every year. Which sucks big-time, because that cross-scheduling arrangement would have been the ultimate way to leverage the advantages of superconference-hood without the downsides. I'm still broken up about that falling through.
In conclusion, to Hell with Notre Dame!
September 12th, 2012 at 12:21 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 12:23 PM ^
Interesting read in Pennsylvania's local paper. The takeaway is that ND is purposely trying to schedule ACC cupcakes in order to bring down their strength of schedule, which would guarantee them a BCS bowl and allow them to keep 100% of the revenue derived from such BCS bowls.
September 12th, 2012 at 1:13 PM ^
nd's scheduling trend under the current AD has been to beef up the schedule, not water it down. texas, oklahoma, miami, etc. have been added to the near future under swarbrick. i don't think this was bout making the schedule easier, but about making scheduling (finding 12 teams) easier. nd doesn't really benefit from just getting into a BCS game anymore, because their share was hugely trimmed under the current deal. nd makes more money by playing high profile games and maintaining their national profile.
of course, we'll know soon enough. nd and texas have talked a lot lately...if we hear an annoucement about a long-term scheduling deal, it'd be hard to argue that nd is watering the schedule down.
September 12th, 2012 at 5:32 PM ^
Anyway you slice it, this is a net gain for a school that has done nothing to deserve it. It makes me hate them even more. And not the healthy hatred you should have for a rival. More like the hatred you have for that annoying rich kid in your school who skips class all the time and gets D's but still gets a brand new Porsche and a $200/week allowance from his parents.
September 12th, 2012 at 3:36 PM ^
"The University of the Notre Dame has informed us that it is joining the Atlantic Coast Conference in all sports other than football," Big East commissioner Mike Aresco said in a statement. "Notre Dame has been a valued member of the Big East Conference and we wish them success in the future." - from McMurphy's ESPN write-up
You know, I actually feel rather sorry for Mike Aresco now. It was Notre Dame who helped blow up what could have been a comparatively lucrative TV deal for the Big East, and now Notre Dame is taking its non-football sports to the ACC. This leaves Aresco trying to convince what's left of the Big East to stay, and it makes getting the exposure they nearly got in the first proposed deal that much harder. The reason they brought Aresco from CBS was to actually renegotiate with the networks too. I imagine that, somewhere in Aresco's office may have been the speech he would have liked to read to the press...
September 12th, 2012 at 3:38 PM ^
This does help pave the road for a nice three round playoff though. It firmly kills off the Big East (if ND joined the Big East in football for some reason it might have breathed a bit of life into the corpse). Now all we need is for the B12 to go through another round of implosions and we'll be at the point where we only have four conferences. So then you have what is basically a three round playoff. Conference championship games, two bowls featuring the ACC, SEC, PAC, and B1G champions. Then a plus one for the winners. Basically as soon as Texas and Oklahoma manage to make that "join the PAC" plan work (or make the PAC16 work), everyone who matters is in one of those four conferences. Every traditional power and major fanbase would be in one of them and we could move forward.
September 12th, 2012 at 5:43 PM ^
I don't think that will happen because the Big 12 looks pretty stable now. Their new TV deal with ESPN and Fox will net each school a cool $20+ million a year and it runs through 2025. Also, trading Texas A&M and Missouri for TCU and West Virginia was a net gain for them.
September 12th, 2012 at 6:11 PM ^
He won't have any trouble convincing the remaining schools to stay, because they have nowhere else to go. The biggest name in the current group of football-playing Big East schools is Boise State, and their rural location far from any major TV market and lack of national appeal limits their options. This move by Notre Dame was pretty much the fatal blow to the Big East's status as a power conference. They're officially a mid-major now.
The biggest mistake the Big East made was rejecting Penn State back in the 80's. They failed to recognize that football, not basketball, was the engine that drove college athletics.
September 12th, 2012 at 12:40 PM ^
This is a non-story. It's the equivalent of Duke joining the B10 for all sports except basketball.
September 12th, 2012 at 12:56 PM ^
"Notre Dame had flirted with a scheduling arrangement with the Big 12 and joining that conference in other sports, but this move appears more logical than playing games in obscure Midwest markets." (from SI)
Like South Bend?
So instead of playing in Austin, Norman, Stillwater, Lawrence, Ames, Manhattan, Lubbock, Waco, Fort Worth, and Morgantown...
or Minneapolis, Evanston/Chicago, Ann Arbor, East Lansing, Madison, Iowa City, Lincoln, Columbus, State College, Bloomington, West Lafayette, and Champaign-Urbana...
they'll play in Clemson, Boston, Miami, Atlanta, Tallahassee, Durham, College Park, Chapel Hill, Raleigh, Winston-Salem, Charlottesville, Pittsburgh, Syracuse, and Blacksburg.
Which of those groups does South Bend best belong with?
September 12th, 2012 at 2:07 PM ^
the key is 5 games. if the deal was 5 games with the B1G, that may be where nd would have ended up. the only options with 5 games on the table were the acc and the big 12. 5 games means that nd doesn't have to fill the whole schedule on their own and it also means that they have the flexibility to maintain a national schedule.
full B1G membership basically consigns nd to a midwestern footprint. this season nd plays the B1G, big 12, acc, big east, and pac 12. that's not feasiable when they're looking at 8-9 conference games. the national footprint is the key to nd's revenue. its how they maintain the nbc deal even with a mediocre product on the field, and sell the t-shirts.
September 12th, 2012 at 7:04 PM ^
Not to mention the fact that Big 12 country and Big Ten country are a lot more football-crazy than most of ACC country.
I think ND settled on the ACC because the Big Ten, Big 12, SEC, and Pac-12 would never have been open to such an arrangement. In typical domer-like fashion, they're spinning it as ND having chosen the ACC over the other power conferences even though the other power conferences would have laughed in their faces if ND had tried to approach them with such an idea.
September 12th, 2012 at 12:59 PM ^
I think this probably makes it more likely that the Big Ten stays at 12 for the foreseeable future. Without ND, there aren't many desirable, geographically reasonable (if that matters) schools out there, and it's not like the next generation BCS will leave out a conference with UM, OSU, Nebraska, and PSU. That could change if Texas ever wants in.
Personally, I'm happy at 12, so this doesn't bother me much.
September 12th, 2012 at 2:30 PM ^
I don't even think ND is that desirable anymore. Their so-called national profile is in serious decline since they've failed to accomplish anything significant for over 20 years. Recruits and younger fans don't give a shit about Notre Dame, and in 10-20 years, they'll be just another football school. They will have no leverage to maintain the sweetheart deals they keep landing and they'll be forced to join the ACC full-time. Even now, if we were at 11 schools and both Nebraska and Notre Dame were begging us to become the 12th, I would choose Nebraska.
To hell with Notre Dame.
September 13th, 2012 at 9:44 PM ^
Texas? Were you paying attention?
They make Notre Dame look grounded in reality.
September 12th, 2012 at 1:15 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 1:39 PM ^
I listened to the press conference and I thought I heard that they will rotate through the entire ACC, alternating 3/2 2/3 home - away series.
September 12th, 2012 at 1:42 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 1:47 PM ^
the big ten should just drop ND from the schedule completely, ND joining the B1G could of also helped the hockey out in the B1G.....
for nd this sets up nicely
5 acc games ( BC, Pitt , 3 others --gotta assume a road trip to florida every year ) , USC, Stanford, Michigan, MSU, Purdue, Navy , and whoever they wanna play for exposure which i am sure will be a big time school to help recruiting ( Texas , Texas A & M ) come to mind here.
September 12th, 2012 at 1:56 PM ^
From an academic standpoint I can see why ND likes the ACC because of its strong academic profile, but athletically it feels like a lateral movement. Outside of football, the Big East is a good sports conference, and the ACC isn't demonstrably better in sports ND would care about to make the switch.
Regardless, I'm sure they'll enjoy being in the same conference as other perrenial underachievers FSU and Miami.
September 13th, 2012 at 7:09 AM ^
but, it was a lateral move off a sinking ship. even though the big east was always a basketball conference, football brought enough money in to create some consistency. with the death of the big east as a football conference, its going to be unstable for awhile.
the acc, what with the $50 mil buyouts, is going to be stable. a mediocre football conference, to be sure, but stable.
September 12th, 2012 at 2:34 PM ^
So now they get the scheduling benefits of conference membership but still don't have to give up their independence or their sweetheart deal with NBC? Why do the powers that be continue to put up with the bullshit of a program that has sucked for over 20 years?
I guess the silver lining is that when their massive on-field ineptitude catches up with them and they lose the leverage to keep negotiating sweetheart deals for themselves, they'll have to join the ACC full-time and will end up in worse shape than they would have been had they taken their chance to join the Big Ten back in '99 (and they'll probably still suck despite playing in a conference that sucks).
September 12th, 2012 at 2:36 PM ^
I can't wait to read TWIS when ND loses to NC State or Wake Forest. Sweet tears of infinite sorrow, I can already taste ye.
September 12th, 2012 at 2:57 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 3:38 PM ^
From what I've heard about the next NBC deal, they still won't be making much more (if at all) than teams in the B1G or the SEC. Numbers I heard were $20M, which might be high given how mediocre their ratings are. But even then, the average B1G school gets a little over $23M/yr from their TV deal, and that should only increase going forward. This almost feels like ND is giving up on the BE from a non-revenue sport perspective, which seems weird to me.
September 12th, 2012 at 3:53 PM ^
The thing is, that $23M/yr for B1G teams includes all the non-football TV that airs on BTN. While the majority of the money may come from football, there's still money coming from the rest of BTN's lineup. If ND is able to get $20M for football alone, then get a share of ACC Network money from other sports, they may still come out ahead.
September 12th, 2012 at 5:37 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 2:47 PM ^
I think ND's thinking is that they're such an established brand in the Midwest, that joining the B1G won't help them recruit/gain markets, etc. So, by joining a conference on the East Coast and maintaining the West Coast games, they think they can achieve domination. Conversely, outside of a couple schools in the ACC, there's no history there at all. They will probably try to play all the marquee teams, as that's the most beneficial to both sides, meaning they can keep teams they do have a history with as "OOC" games, like BC, but still the bulk of people they're playing are just random, if ranked. It would almost be like if Michigan joined the Big XII or something.
September 12th, 2012 at 4:46 PM ^
Putting aside my disgust for Notre Dame and all that it represents, this is actually a very smart move for them. Right now, they have eight rivalry games that they play almost every year: Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue, Navy, Pitt, Boston College, USC, and Stanford. They fill up the rest of their schedule with four or (in years in which one of their rivals rotates off their schedule) five games against one-off or home-and-home opponents. Their five-game ACC rotation will swallow up two of their lesser rivalry games (Pitt, Boston College) and leave them with seven slots in which to schedule the remaining five or six rivalry games. That actually opens up a slot for either a new rivalry, a one-off, or a home-and-home. They'll still play Pitt and Boston College, just not every year, so those rivalries will survive in some form. The annual hassle of finding opponents to fill the remaining slots on their schedule is relieved by the ACC arrangement, yet they don't actually have to become a member of the ACC or share their revenue with the conference. The only drawback for them is that they lose their flexibility to schedule one-off home games against opponents who don't have the leverage to negotiate a home-and-home. But since they often lose to those opponents anyway (e.g, Tulsa, UConn, Syracuse, South Florida), what's the difference whether they lose in South Bend or some random ACC city? Losing to weak opponents on the road instead of losing to weak opponents at home like they currently do just gives their delusional fanbase one more excuse to explain their perpetual ineptitude.
It's a great way for them to have their cake and eat it too. Why the ACC is letting them get away with it is a mystery.
September 12th, 2012 at 3:30 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 4:23 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 4:26 PM ^
notre dame self destruction
September 12th, 2012 at 4:38 PM ^
To the contrary, I think it's actually a smart move for them (see my post above). In any given year, their slate of five ACC games is likely to include at least one of the halfway decent teams in the ACC (FSU, VaTech, Clemson). That leaves four games against mediocre opponents, but they already play at least four mediocre opponents a year. Last year, they played South Florida, Air Force, Wake Forest, and Maryland (and incidentally, two of those are ACC schools).
I don't blame Notre Dame for taking advantage of all the slack they get from the powers that be despite their perpetual ineptitude on the field. I do blame the powers that be for giving them that slack.
September 12th, 2012 at 4:45 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 4:51 PM ^
I'm not saying it helps us, I'm saying it helps them because it relieves some of the scheduling headaches they face as an independent without forcing them to actually join a conference.
And it really doesn't help them in terms of wins. It's true that the ACC is bad, but I'm sure ND will find a way to lose to the likes of Wake Forest and NC State the same way they found ways to lose to the likes of Tulsa and South Florida.
September 12th, 2012 at 5:01 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 5:16 PM ^
True, but the Big Ten would never allow a member school to exclude a revenue sport from full participation in league play. They probably wouldn't even allow it for non-revenue sports. Frankly, I like it that way, since part-time conference memberships benefit the part-time member more than they benefit the conference.
So yeah, it would be nice to have Notre Dame compete in a hypothetical Big Ten hockey league, but not at the cost of letting them exclude football. I always looked down on the Big East for letting Notre Dame use them like that. And now, the ACC has fallen a few notches in my eyes.
September 12th, 2012 at 5:31 PM ^
September 12th, 2012 at 5:53 PM ^
They are going after Miami. The NCAA investigation is ongoing and probably won't be wrapped up for a while, but when it is, Miami will get hammered.
September 13th, 2012 at 7:06 AM ^
money makes college football go round. nd, in spite of a mediocre product on the field, still sells tickets and brings ratings. as long as that continues to be the case, they'll continue to get able to (mostly) get what they want.
eventually, they'll have to win football games to maintain their revenue generation...but the brand has proven surprisingly resilient over the last 20 years.
September 12th, 2012 at 9:33 PM ^
How ignorant is this? Are they that scared of the B1G?? Wow.... Atlantic coast as opposed to midwest, they are really smart in South Bend.
September 12th, 2012 at 10:08 PM ^
to hell with notre dame!
the've won 4 bowl games in the last 20 years. if it weren't for the b10 propping them up they would be as relevant as Marshall.
September 13th, 2012 at 9:22 AM ^
for this particular move.
Notre Dame did what was best for Notre Dame. Their independence in football is a huge part of what they are. They're not obliged to fully join any conference. The B1G wouldn't give them such a deal, and that was our decision.
Cutting them out of our schedule for spite would only hurt us. Teams line up to play them, past power or not. They afford us the opportunity to play a marque program who also gives you a really good chance of winning.
September 13th, 2012 at 9:38 AM ^
is sadly coming to an end... Even though, football is not joining, they will be scheduling 5 ACC teams per year. Say goodbye to Michigan, MSU, and Purdue matchups.
This makes this coming matchup all the more important. How lovely it would be to finish out ND by sweeping Kelly!