None of Notre Dame Suspended Back at Practice
Thought there was a thread created Monday implying we would hear something on the ND front on Tuesday... well today is Wednesday and per ESPN ACC/ND reporter none of the suspended 5 have appeared at practice. [Insert Allen Iverson quip here]
Kelly is on record saying that the players stauts can change in an instant once he hears from the administration but at this point even if they were all reinstated tomorrow they'd have 2 days of practice to immerse themselves into all things Notre Dame football. I also do think ND takes this kind of thing seriously and reinstating players Thursday or Friday - even if that is going to happen down the road - would be a horrible look from an optics standpoint.
So from this perch these players are not coming back before Saturday.
September 3rd, 2014 at 9:53 PM ^
Here is the tweet for those who did not click on the hyperlink and are saying they are at practice but it is not being announced. This came out this evening 6:00 PM hour:
#NotreDame official says none of the suspended 5 back at practice.
September 3rd, 2014 at 10:05 PM ^
If the suspension holds, I will be the first to give Notre Dame credit for standing on their principles.
Say what you want, but they really are different from, say, your average SEC team. It's one of the reasons it will be sad to see the rivalry go.
September 3rd, 2014 at 11:21 PM ^
Pretty decent with principles except when it came to Michael Floyd.
Although Brain Kelly did surprise me with the one game suspension for Tommy Rees after he assaulted an officer and resisted arrest.
September 4th, 2014 at 8:47 AM ^
Lizzy Seeberg is an even better one. Every time I fall into the mode of lauding ND for sticking to its principles, that awful case jumps out at me. "Don't do anything you would regret. Messing with Notre Dame football is a bad idea." That's a PSU level scandal, but somehow never gets the amount of attention that PSU ultimately got.
I'm usually joking when I write this, but To Hell with Notre Dame. Seriously.
September 4th, 2014 at 2:42 PM ^
September 4th, 2014 at 6:46 PM ^
You're likely correct that the PSU situation is worse (so many years and so many kids involved, not to mention the actual and constructive knowledge of so many in the Athletic Department and administration), but I'm not sure that things like the Seeberg case "happen all the time".
But the reason that I brought up the PSU scandal is that in the case of Lizzy Seeberg, the university not only responded inadequately (which supports your "not better than the average bear" position), but to my knowledge the ND police ignored the situation altogether until well after the young woman committed suicide. And the local prosecutor apparently tried to whitewash this. The football player who allegedly committed the assault sent her texts suggesting she'd best let this all drop, because you don't mess with ND football. (That part seems familiar, I'll admit.) And ND itself went on a character assasination against the Seeberg herself, as noted in the article I linked:
But Notre Dame officials have painted and passed around a different picture of the dead 19-year-old. Sotto voce, they portray the player as wrongly accused by an aggressive young woman who lied to get back at him for sexually rejecting her the first moment they were ever alone together. AND ...
One Notre Dame parent and longtime donor I interviewed, who asked that his name not be used because his daughter had reported being raped by a fellow Notre Dame student, said a top university official told him Lizzy was without question the aggressor in the situation: "She was all over the boy."
With that sort of institutional support, the school never pulled the accused player from a day of practice. Because? Well, you don't mess with ND football.
Is it an exact parallel to the PSU case? Of course not. But the culture of idolizing the football program at the expense of basic human values, having a culture that makes speaking up about sexual abuse frowned up, and having an administration who appeared to be complicit in the cover-up of a horrible act? Those are all common elements between Seeberg's case and the PSU scandal.
September 4th, 2014 at 3:25 PM ^
At the risk of ruining my welcome, what was Lewan purported to have threatened?
September 3rd, 2014 at 10:33 PM ^
September 3rd, 2014 at 11:17 PM ^
Even if they're cleared, I highly doubt they're all ready, physically and mentally, to take the field on Saturday. Stranger things have happened, but I'm betting Kelly is preparing to play without them.
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September 3rd, 2014 at 11:36 PM ^
September 4th, 2014 at 4:07 AM ^
September 4th, 2014 at 4:23 AM ^
Somewhat equivalent, Hoke won't speak of injuries as to make it difficult for ND to predetermine who will be on the field. I think the technique is as old as the hills. The press is going to jump on any tidbit and amplify it nationwide for all to read/hear about. I would think the more experienced coaches are going to swim right thru this as they plan for everything.
September 4th, 2014 at 8:31 AM ^
The investigation was complete late last week. So, the school (academic body, not athletics; athletics was not involved whatsoever) was finished collecting whatever evidence they had and closed the investigation last Thursday/Friday. At that point the issue gets kicked over to the Honor System or Honor Committee, which is made up of students and faculty. As I understand it this committee meets only once per week, and apparently - much to the chagrin of ND fans - cannot be bothered to reschedule or expedite their hearing. This committee is rumored to meet on Thursdays (today). This is all pieced together from various reports, statements from Kelly, statements from Swarbrick, and ex-students that have been through the process.
What else do we know? We know that the four, plus Hardy (the safety who was pulled out of activities late last week just before the Rice game) are not participating in any team activities. This includes film study. They are enrolled in school, I understand they continue to work out, but they are not currently 'with the team' so to speak.
What is a reasonable guess? I think a reasonable guess is the school's investigation found 'something' on each guy, otherwise they would not have to go in front of the Honor Committee. How much 'something', no one knows for sure. The scuttlebutt is that at least Russell is going to be cleared. There is a rumor that he may have known about others cheating, but did not report it. Apparently that is in the Honor Code so he violated a 'no snitchin' policy. F'ing ridiculous, if true. The overall investigation is allegedly centered around Russell's girlfriend typing papers for the players. The whole thing started from an email chain that inadvertantly was cc'd or forwarded to a professor (ouch!) The issue is was she just typing them from handwritten sheets, typing + proofreading and making suggestions, typing + proofreading + editing, how much editing is too much, or did she straight up write the papers? Daniels and his father were quite vocal that it was proofreading only before ND apparently put a radio silence order on all involved.
Personal takeaways: 1)I don't understand why the players are being held out of all practices, film study, etc. The games? Sure, if they think they may be ineligible. But I don't understand why they're held out of everything. They are still enrolled in school, the players (some, if not all) have been seen studying for classes, etc. Seems like a typical ND Administration over-reaction to make a mountain out of a molehill. The initial press conference and press release, in my opinion, was horrible. What was the purpose of volunteering that they will vacate wins in previous seasons, when no one asked or even went there? Issue a statement that X player(s) are being held out and move on. Who has a press conference with the President of the University and AD for something like that? Regardless, that act has appeared to make this a bigger deal than it actually is. Made it look more UNC/institutional thing than a couple guys.
2) Swarbrick must have some sort of iron-fisted 'no leaks' policy, because no one knows $%#* about this. Very reminiscent of the Te'o thing where there was literally nothing leaking out of that investigation until the press conference.
3) I'm not going to venture a guess about who's getting cleared, who, if any, are getting kicked out, etc. No one knows yet.
4) 95% sure that even if cleared they're not gonna play much or at all against UM. Can't imagine they'd be ready from a game plan perspective.
5) Hardy getting added to the other four is terrible news. He was Collinsworth's backup at safety. Then Collinsworth got hurt, Hardy held out, and now Shumate is the starter. Shumate + Redfield making calls for the secondary terrifies the crap out of me, with all of Nussmeier's motions. I foresee mroe than one complete busts this Saturday.
September 4th, 2014 at 8:38 AM ^
Thanks for the insight. Sounds like there should be news today then, but as others have said - throwing anyone out there with what would amount to be a walk through tomorrow after weeks on the back burner seems counter productive.
September 4th, 2014 at 10:02 AM ^
It's troubling that your post on a rival's message board is the most coherent snapshot of where things stand that I've seen anywhere in the media. I'm sure many of us appreciate your analysis and synopsis.
September 4th, 2014 at 10:27 AM ^
September 4th, 2014 at 11:17 AM ^
Everything we had heard was the honor committee could meet on Tuesday. It was good to hear an explanation for the delay. I agree that the seriousness of the press conference hardly squared with allegations of mere proofreading and typing. Presumably the players involved were all interviewed beforehand, so that explanation was already out there. It was either an epic overreaction by experienced people that should know better or there's some wishful thinking from the fans. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out. I have a fair amount of confidence that ND isn't going to whitewash this.
September 4th, 2014 at 12:17 PM ^
On the rescheduling bit. It's virtually impossible to schedule a meeting that requires a quorum of faculty members on short notice (and I'll bet this committee has bylaws that it can't meet and make a ruling unless a significant majority of the committee is present), particularly at the beginning of the semester. There's so much backlogged business within departments after the summer that the set meeting time is a necessity. Plus, you have to give the members 4-5 days before the hearing to read the evidence. People are busy, yo.
If the case is what you present, ie another student typing, proofing, and editing the paper without ackowledment to the professor, that would cross the bar of academic dishonesty for me. Editing work to make ideas more clear is an important part of learning to write well. It also constitutes submitting a piece of writing that is substantially someone else's work under your own name. I would probably refer a case like this to my institution's academic discipline board (particularly if I found out about it via a random email mistake). It probably wouldn't be "fail the class" bad, but it would be a significant grade reduction.
September 4th, 2014 at 12:17 PM ^
Always great to have friendly rivals on the board.
Your take seems objective and fair to me. It's very interesting to get some perspective from the other side.
September 4th, 2014 at 12:35 PM ^
MGOBLOG is the best run college football site on the internet, and I do wish ND had an equivalent. The closest is actually nbcsports.com, but they have to be more generalized and unbiased about everything.
The one thing from BK's presser that concerns me a little bit is the hearings "are close to taking place" (read: today). I think there may be something in the Honor Code about 7 days to render a verdict AFTER the hearings, though. It's either 7 days after the investigation or 7 days after the hearing. If it's the latter, then the players are for sure not playing Saturday.
September 4th, 2014 at 9:19 AM ^
If they are cleared before Saturday, I am fully expecting them to play. Maybe not start, but play. I know, I know, limited practice and all that, but if it looks like ND needs them, I'd expect them to be out there. They still know the offense and defense so unless they've all gotten fat and out of shape, I wouldn't count them out. Either way, UM still has the roster to get the W.
September 4th, 2014 at 10:24 AM ^
September 4th, 2014 at 10:30 AM ^
of course they will keep them out. It shows they retain a high road when dealing with academic scandals AND it gives them an excuse when we smash them saturday. There really is no other option in my opinion (which matters so much, I know).