Agreed. The thing is, both teams had lost their All-Big Ten caliber big men. Everyone else was playing. I'm sorry if I don't put the Dawson "injury" in the same category. It's not Michigan's fault that our players don't do stupid shit like that.
MSU and the Injury mantra
The guy brings in a slew of McDonald's All Americans every year. If his bench isn't ready for prime time, that's his creation/problem.
at full strength when they lose in Ann Arbor.
I watched most of the second half due to work. I dont know baout the frst half but for whoever complains about injuries at MSU they should look at the officials as the reason that game was even close. 9 times out of 10 when a player drives to the basket and there is a lot of contact there is a foul. Michigan had 4-5 plays where the player drove and there was a lot of contact and nothing was called. There was also the Spike timeout right in front of a ref that didn't get called and the Jordan Morgan ( was there even contact?) foul.
Michigan beat a very good MSU team on the road. Injuries or not
sometimes the better team does not win. However, this was the case where we were the better team, poor officiating or not. I had tickets for the game but the weather was not good.
This is the first time since 1987 where a team has beat 3 Top 10 teams consecutively. We showed why we are the best team in the Big Ten and possibly the entire Country. I cannot wait for the polls to come out. Maybe a top 5???
Now I will also agree that we get preferential treatment, all things considered. But I am not complaining.
wouldn't it be nice if Michigan was at full strength when sparty loses at Ann Arbor?
Who gives a shit if they're at full strength or not? I want to beat them when they're healthy, I want to beat them when they have injuries. It all feels like rainbows and butterflies to me. Fuck 'em.
Appears to be the one to their pride. They're making excuses because they have to. Good.
I say let them not take us seriously. Others, including recruites, already do. And by the time they catch on, the table may have completely turned.
Respect was lost last night?!
Say it ain't so!
I'm sure he has Michigan unranked in his AP ballot. Isn't Sharp a UM alumnus? I wonder what god-awful experience he had that made him have so much contempt for the university.
In the legal profession, there's an old saying: "If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the facts are against you, argue the law. If both are against you, pound the table."*
I have never heard this said about journalism, but to coin a phrase: "If the story isn't compelling, rely on your writing. If your writing isn't good, rely on the compelling story. If you are a talentless hack and couldn't recognize a compelling story if it bit you in the ass, troll the hell out of a fanbase and claim you are keeping it real."
(* So, I guess by this logic, the facts and the law were really against Dawson, amirite?)
Person. Seems like some childhood demon.
I'm sure DS would say, "I don't write the headlines."
Sharp is just the biggest troll of ALL time. It's not even close.
It's funny at this point. It's so blatant.
If I ever saw Drew Sharp...I'd kick him in the stomach then knee him in the face. Say "Go Blue" and walk away.
Then he'd go ahead and sue the entire University of Michigan.
I think Jason Whitlock was an even bigger troll when he was at the AA News. Dunno if he's still pulling the troll act in KC or whereever he "writes" these days. Talentless hacks, both.
It should be "Michigan State's lost, Michigan shows it has what it takes to win it all"
I especially love how MSU was decimated by injuries, but Michigan is in some ways better without McGary. Their injuries are devastating, but ours are beneficial.
A few more injuries and we will be the prohibitive favorite for the tournament.
Please don't click on that link. It's click-bait and almost nothing else.
%*$& the Freep.
It's an image file so at least it's not giving them clicks
Pushing the injury meme, complaining that the refs were biased in favor of Michigan, bitching about how Stauskas is not classy.... They're doing everything but say Michigan played a good game. Even the ESPN headline was "Michigan downs short-handed Spartans".
I had to tweet to Jeff Goodman of ESPN because he was going on about Payne and Dawson. I'd also have a lot more sympathy for Dawson if he were out because of basketball and not slamming his hand on a fucking table during film.
The best part is, they are all acting and talking about their basketball team in the way they accuse us of acting and talking about our football team. Take Valenti for example. His theme on the Friday show? "This game doesn't really matter to MSU" and "we don't care about beating Michigan, we only care about a national championship while Michigan doesn't have national championship expectations"
Straight from coach Izzo.
I'm his interview after the game he said sobbingly , "if Gary Harris isn't the best player in the Big Ten, god bless whoever is." Poor Izzo, dealing with injuries in sports is so unheard of. Losing five out if seven hurts too.
Signs for the home game
"God Bless Nik Stauskus!"
I think many, many reasonable people would say that Gary Harris is the best player in the B10.
I'm one of them.
That doesn't take away from Nik Stauskas and how well he's playing, but Harris is on another level defensively.
Conversely, many highly educated, good-looking, well-liked, affable people who are kind to both strangers and animals, contribute to charity, inspire greatness in others and generally make the world a better place don't think Harris is the best player in the B1G 10.
I'm one of those guys.
I think you're the most narcissistic person I've ever "seen" on the internet. Get over yourself.
Timmay you actually thought i was being serious and not teasing MgoBender about his use of the phrase "many reasonable people"? Wow I figured it was so over the top anybody could see it it. Guess not.
Dude you really have to get over this thing you've got against me. It's not healthy.
It's still early for me, late night. I did 100% think you were serious, or I obviously wouldn't have said that. In fairness, all of those things you mentioned, you have mentioned before (except for calling yourself good looking). I epologize for my over-reaction.
No problem and thanks for saying that (I think). Hey -can we call a truce and start over? Generally speaking I agree with most of your points and if you've noticed I havent talked about the thing that got you riled up in several months.
I don't hold any grudges or anything like that. I'm just very quick so say what I'm thinking I guess... Let's hit the "RESET" button (no politics).
And yes, I'm glad for all of our sake that "that thing" that caused us all so much grief is over and done with. May we all prosper from said thing!
Win one for mother Russia.
My bad - pulled on Hoek on that one.
Just call me mini-Hoek.
should get a room.
I don't know what your point is. Are you just patting yourself on the back for all your wonderful attributes? Are you saying I'm not educated? That I don't contribute to society? That I think people that think Stauskas is better are bad people? Did I say that?
My only point was that it's not ridiculous to call Harris the best player in the B10. It's a great debate to have and its awesome that the two best players in the league (Payne is up there too) are on teams from this state. I think getting on Izzo for saying GH is the best is lame - why shouldn't he back his player after a great performance? I'd expect JB to do the same thing.
I think last night Harris proved he's a notch ahead of Stauskas in the race, but I'd love to hear arguments otherwise. That's my certified E-pinion. I've watched the game twice now and I think they are similar shooters (slight edge to Nik), similar creators, and similar finishers (slight edge to GH). I think GH showed he's got a discernable edge defensively and athletically, though. Then, at the same time, Nik hit the big shot and GH front rimmed the big shot late. (Nik was 5/6, GH was 4/6 from 3 last night). GH was able to get his shot with more regularity and obviously pouring in 27 is a big deal. All that together, I think GH is the better player. I think it's clear, but I also don't think it's clear by a wide margin, if that makes sense.
I think it's very even, it's an awesome matchup, and I can't wait to see it again. To say it is definitive or discount GH is wearing the maize and blue glasses.
Oh my goodness I was just teasing you. You and Timmmay have convinced me to use the damn "s" next time I try that which until now I have refused to do.
It would have made sense if I said all reasonable people would say Gary Harris was the best player. But I didn't.
Note to self - don't tease MgoBender.
don't tease MGoBender
Note to self - don't tease MgoBender.
Ha, okay. I still don't understand what your entire point was, even with the sarcasm. Your point was to tease me? That's... strange... but whatever.
Like I said, it's a great debate and I sincerely would love to discuss it in detail. Unfortunately, I guess you only were looking to tease. Which, in that case, why post? Anyway, moving on.
I feel like unless you set out to read that with the intention of getting pissed at mGrowOld, you would have caught the sarcasm.
Wow. No lie. Most super geniuses think that a person would have to want to find a reason to be insulted if he or she was insulted by such an amusing post. I am one of them.
Complaining so much about MSU's complaining is getting just as tiring. MSU does have significant injuries and have has significant injuries. While I'm sure Izzo and Co could just deflect and act like they put their best unit out there, they didn't. Beilein doesn't talk about McGary, I respect him for that, but does any of it really matter?
This, again, is people taking way too much from press conferences. A lot of what is said in these pressers is for the team as much if not more than for the actual media. Like how Michigan coaches in both football and basketball use the media, they do it in a way that they feel helps their current team the most. MSU isn't really that different. You talk youth, luck, injuries, etc, if your team needs it to get to where it wants to go. You don't if it just coddles them and doesn't help in the long run. In the end, it doesn't really matter though, in regards to that game.
Michigan won. Get over the rest. You have the upper hand; the high ground. Michigan won. Everything else is just hope for the future and speaking for the team. This may be unpopular opinion, because obviously there seem to be a lot of Michigan fans that really care if MSU has injuries and if they are allowed to talk about them, but why? I don't understand. Michigan won.
I do find it pretty funny how similar Michigan basketball fans are to MSU football fans and MSU basketball fans to Michigan football fans, though. Honestly, the parallels and the way we treat each other is freakishly similar.
Is why. Nobody calls Michigan State on their bullshit. Nobody. They get a free pass for everything they do or say. The post was an opinion piece. It is fair to specifically point out when they are full of shit, because nobody in the local mainstream media ever does about anything.
I feel like all fanbases look for reasons to get angry. The media is against them. The commentators are against them. The refs are against them. Luck is against them. The world is against them.
But it doesn't matter. We won; Michigan won. Stop getting so upset about the rest of it and just be happy Michigan won instead of looking for things to be upset about, especially things that don't even speak to Michigan. Michigan has won 5 out of the last 7 and two at Breslin. They won again last night. Who cares about the rest of it. Worry about Michigan.
Guess it doesn't "matter" but it just is. I am not worried about it, but it is noteworthy. Out of all the coverage of this game not once have I heard from anybody local or national that basically everybody in that program is dealing with that game and that loss with the maturity of a 3 year old. That is the most accurate narrative but also the narrative nobody will address. Michigan State is treated with kid gloves. It seems almost unacceptable for them to be accurately assessed in this regard. So I thought it should be said. That is all.
You must be a real hit at parties!!
It doesn't "matter" so much to me as this is more of an opportunity to set the record straight, complain-ey as it may be.
Why does it matter to you that people are upset about it? You're acting pretty high and mighty to everyone who is pointing out the truth of the situation, it's kind of ironic actually.
So much unnecessary drama with fan bases these days. If you would just watch and support your team(s) and stay away from what rivals are saying you would be amazed not only how much more you enjoy watching your own team but sports in general.
I agree with Space Coyote on this. MSU made a bunch of excuses, or the media made some for them. Big deal? They still lost. At home. That's all that matters. M fans making a huge deal about the MSU complaining is almost as bad as the complaining itself.
When I was at Butler, ever time we would win a big game the media would overdue the under dog storyline, rather than analyzing the game. On several of those occasions the game was won by a great game plan and just outplaying the opponent. It was obnoxious to out and out win games and have it basically chalked up to luck, grit or otherwise. Eventually, it happened so many times that the media/announcers had to start acknowledging that the team was for real. I guess what I am saying is the best way to shut them up is to beat them on the court, repeatedly.
from your last sentence is the Michigan basketball fans are insecure and that Michigan football fans are not. While I appreciate all of your contributions about Michigan football, I certainly didn't see that secure crowd on this Board this past Fall--particularly as it related to Sparty.
what do you expect? We as a fanbase, are by no means above petty finger pointing, complaining and gloating just like any other fanbase.
You make it sound like it's just Michigan fans that take note of this. I visited some Wisconsin boards after our game against them and they all noted Dakich's jab at Izzo for whining about injuries.
People aren't just reacting to one press conference. Injury whining is one of Izzo's talking points all the time, whenever he has a microphone around. If it's not that, it's complaining about players leaving early. Next year, he'll whine all year about how Gary Harris is gone.
This doesn't in any way affect my enjoyment of our victory; it just makes me appreciate Beilein all the more so.
Okay, I wasn't 100 percent after all your ludicrous defenses of Borges, but now I'm convinced that you're full troll.
Sad, there was a time you made interesting contributions to this board.
I don't give two shits if they had zero starters available last night. We won and that is all that matters in the long-run. The media has "feel-good" narrative to promote - poor, gritty MSU having to overcome almost INSURMOUNTABLE obsticles placed in their path last night" and they will pound it and pound it and pound it till they move on to the next one.
Notice how little or no mention is being made of us doing something NO team has done since 1987? Paying attention to that nagging little detail might actually give credit to Michigan winning the game instead of MSU almost prevailing against all odds.
EDIT: Although it certainly appears like I was responding directly to Space I wasn't. We were typing somewhat contrarian (as we are want to do) views on something at the same time in the same thread..
As Alanis would say "isn't it ironic........"
Let's just put it out there like this:
Michigan lost two players to the NBA and one of their best players to a season-ending injury.
MSU lost one of their best players to injury, one starter to European bball and one to an anger-related injury.
I'd say Michigan has had to replace more this season. When MSU loses at home, they've been out-coached and are grasping for straws.
a mixed crowd. Actually some otherwise normal Sparty folks outside of sports.
In the first half it was "we will beat you EASILY despite our injuries". Last year was a "fluke" run in NCAA tourney.
Mention McGary is injured and you get a blank stare like they don't know who he is or he's not any good.
Late second half it became the injuries mantra and the refs have it in for us.
Then when the dagger was in the heart it became a team built to make a tournament run and Gary Harris is a top 3 pick. One guy went so Farr as to say he was POY last year over Burke and a better Shooter than Curry.
Like in his press conference when a blabbering Izzo felt the need to say Harris is the best player on the floor vs giving our team any credit. They are a classless delusional bunch.
I hope iowa blows sparty's doors off. That is all
if the gutty Spartans were at full strength. Oh my, the injuries.
they will. msu will be lucky to stay within 10 pts at iowa.
It's the Spartans, I'm not sure how this is remotely suprising to anyone.
I went into the game and knowing that that was exactly what Vitale/ESPN were going to talk about all night. They are so predictable it's funny. Only mentioned McGary a couple times meanwhile they gave a thorough breakdown on every player injured for MSU and how it impacted the game. Injuries are part of sports suck it up pussies!
Vitale is one of the most annoying Commentators out there. Been begging for him to retire for years.
I hit the Mute button early on. I couldn't take it after just a few minutes. Holy crap he needs to go away, somewhere, anywhere, just go.
his best UD team's loss to Michigan in the sweet sixteen back in '77. He's the Lee Corso of the hardcourt.
but then, I don't speak Cronilogic.
But seriously, should the order be based on the date of the defeat to a team wearing Maize and Blue? Or on the ascention of the coach to the ESPN announcing pedestal?
It's not just the loss in 1977. Dickie V wanted to schedule regular season games with U-M to provide a spectacle to attract recruits and Don Canham wouldn't give him the time of day. It really irked him. When he announced one of the games where U-M knocked off a Magic Johnson MSU team, all he could say was that it was a great game for "college athaletics".
It's long past time for Dickie V to go.
editing on Chrome/Android leads to double posting, apparently.
Mush Mouth Holtz, Moronic Corso, and Blabbering Vitale all need to follow Madden's example. They can take Gumball with them.
That State lost, the things I head ranged from State isn't neccesarily worse than UM, to I can't wait till the Spartans get them at Crisler in Feb.They showed Izzo saying how he thought Harris is POY "If he isn't than God bless who is? OMG stick my finger down my throat. Pure sickening.
I watched it twice to make sure I didn't miss a "pro-Michigan" segment. It was awkward actually. They spoke more about MSU...never said "Let's talk about this Michigan team" or "Let's talk about a great job Beilein is doing over in Ann Arbor." It was all Izzo and they were damn near apologetic. I usually find they do a great job but last night was off.
Damn, B1G, sorry we went into Breslin and beat your boys. We will try not to do it again until next season. Love, Michigan Basketball.
DID YOU KNOW:
Michigan State has NEVER lost a legit game to Michigan in any sport at any time ever.
Any loss to Michigan has been either due to bad officiating or injuries.
Well, since they caught the injury bug this year I guess we'll have to wait until next year to finally have a chance to beat MSU.
You just admitted 3 of them.
That's 3 more than I've heard State admit in a LONG time.
Lead-off on Sports Center is the MSU-UM game, and right off they point out the obvious that BOTH teams are missing key players due to injury. The thing I've always respected about Izzo is his ability to get a lot of production out of his bench. Last night, our subs were better. Lets face it, the NC game last year came down to Louivelle's 6th man being better than our 6th. That's how it goes.
Aaaand a certain block by Burke called a foul...
But hot damn, every time I think about that block I wonder what would have happened if the ref didn't shit the bed on that call.
by itself didn't decide the game. But the absolute asshatted officiating that occured all game did. The fact that the Big East (yes, 2 of the 3 officials were almost exclusively Big East) officials allowed the game to devolve into a rugby match favored Louisville so heavily that the whole thing was ridiculous. Pitino could have paid off the officials and not gotten better results.
it didn't decide the game but it effectively ended it.
Depends on who you considered our 6th man. I figure is was Spike. He matched anything from UL's sixth man.
Its not like their other guys that filled in are crap players either. Costello was highly ranked coming out of high school. Its BS they want to discredit our w on the road when we lost mcgary as well.
MSU wouldn't be going through a lack of depth if Izzo didn't put all his effort to getting Jabari Parker.
The excuses are flowing freely there. If we beat them at home in a few weeks this senior class of Spartans will have only 2 wins but 6 losses against Michigan.
And when they're not in the final four we can stop hearing about that as well
their collective head pretty cheaply. Mike Hart realized this.
In her WWL article entitled "No Asterisk Needed for Michigan's Win," Chantel does a nice job trolling Izzo by cherrypicking a quote that makes it seem as if Izzo is magnanimous in defeat. My motivated bias aside, I have visions of Izzo's head imploding when he reads an article portraying him as giving Michigan credit.
“Don’t take anything away from them,” Izzo said. “They made some shots. They made some plays. We had our chance.”
On Thursday, when Dawson's injury was announced, one of my coworkers (an MSU alum) told me, "Looks like we are giving you a freebie on Saturday." The excuses were coming even then.
A 17-1 team* is reviewing film. A starter gets soooo pissed off that he breaks his hand slamming the table. What does that say about the locker room mood?
Got to believe more is wrong with that team. 3:00 left in the game and the bench was defeated.
*before last night!
The sun rose in the east this morning, winter is cold, dogs bark, fish swim, and Sparties are whining and making excuses. Yup, things are back to normal.
That fan base is completely insufferable and it follows the lead of its coaches. The officiating and injury whining right now especially hilarious. You can complain about injuries, I guess, if a string of bad luck gets you. Payne, like McGary, got unlucky and had to sit out. Dawson just did something quintessentially Sparty-stupid. You don't get to claim bad luck for that.
As for the crying that people have mentioned, the story on Izzo being at or near tears supposedly has to do with Appling playing hurt with back pain and a wrist injury that he's had since last month, so there were a few articles out there with quotes from the MSU locker room regarding that, so take it for what it is worth. So, it seems like it was tied to the "we had guys who stepped up" portion of the postgame talk, if indeed that is the reason he was upset.
If nothing else, at least ESPN - what I saw this morning anyway - did point out that both teams had players out due to injury, which several other outlets failed to mention. As for the use of this as a qualifier for the result by Spartan beat writers and other media on this particular occasion, it is difficult to primarily blame injuries really when you led as late as the four-minute mark in the second half, at least in my opinion. That same lineup - without Payne and Dawson - probably beats a lot of teams still.
them wrong. I love how Beilein said we're going to practice like we lost. He's looking to get better which is why he's so great and why this team continues to improve.
They have to go out and win to show these people Michigan is for real. I have no doubt, it will take longer for others.
I hate to quote Vitale but "Just win Baby!" is what they need to do. The rest will take care of itself.
You're quoting Al Davis.
Slightly OT: This could be Izzo's last chance to make a deep tourney run for a few years. Subtract Payne, Appling, and Harris from the team and you're left with ... what? Dawson, Valentine, and a few role players. (You could make the argument that both those guys are role players.)
There doesn't appear to be much in the pipeline, either. Izzo could very well end his career on a losing streak to UMich (or, at least a losing record over several seasons).
I just want to beat them by double-digits Feb 23 then. Hopefully Payne will be back, but Dawson probably won't be. I hate how MSU fans are always allowed to make excuses and talk about the past 15 years, but when UM fans do it, we're delusional and living in the past. Drives me nuts!!
McGary isn't injured. He's just hurt.
They're still recovering from the loss of Erazem Lorbek.
This is all hear when sparties whine about Payne and Dawson.
In any contact sport, injuries are a common occurence. Coaches just deal with them, shuffling their lineups and providing players down the depth chart with opportunities to show their stuff. Just field the best five, eleven, or whatever number you need and go play.
People who after a loss say "well, if we'da had Boomer or Sledgehead or whoever in there, we woulda won," are routinely and properly dismissed as whiners and excusers, just like those who blame losses on the "bad calls" the officials made, "bad calls" being defined as calls that went against their team.
Such complaints are in the end pure speculation --- nothing more. If M had had Devin at the Wild Wings Bowl, would M have won? Who knows? And to balance the equation, if last night MSU had a healthy Payne and Dawson and M had a healthy McGary, would MSU have won? Again, maybe, maybe not. But it's worth nothing that even with a less-than-fully healthy McGary, M came very close to beating the number 1 team in the country, and MSU still had some plenty good athletes on the floor last night.
Bottom line is both teams fielded the best players they had available and M won. Any other interpretation of the win is stuff and nonsense.
Three years ago now actually. Darius Morris game: Get the f*ck of my court Sparty.
Burke leaves early for the NBA
Hardaway leaves early for the NBA
Harris comes back to play
Dawson comes back to play
McGary is injured
Dawson is injured
Payne is injured
Michigan is playing the game WITHOUT 3 NBA players who could have been playing in this game
Michigan state is playing WITHOUT 2 CBA players who could have been playing in this game.'
The game is AT MSU.
Knowing the above, who would you think should blow who out?
Bielien is finding a way to win with less incoming talented players on the floor YET AGAIN.
The biggest news items in the days leading up to the game were the injuries to Payne and Dawson. There was no way they weren't going to be a big part of the narrative no matter the result of the game. We were talking more about them here than our own team. Whether to play Payne was the toughest decision of Izzo's coaching life, after all.
In a couple of years, when talking about how Michigan has won 9 of the last 11 against MSU, no one is going to mention injuries.
During our NCAA tournament games there will be a lot of talk every game about what Michigan has been able to achieve despite losing McGary to injury.
I'm grateful we have coaches that win and lose with class. I'm grateful when our rivals are led by whiny drama queens. Details in the media coverage don't matter. The overall story is that Michigan is winning in remarkable fashion and MSU is hurting. The details don't bother me one bit.
This post is pure Sparty.
I have scrolled this thread somewhat so forgive me if I repeat something but a group of teenagers and just twenties went to EL in front of 15,000 soon to be out of work farmers and won a game in arguably the toughest arena in the toughest conference in prime time against the #3 team in the country.
7-0. Next please.
is kind of weird...
The selection committee doesn't care who played and who didn't. We won, that's it.
I'm bored of MSU.
They are northern hillbillies.
THAT has got to hurt up in EL. Interesting that this story line is not getting as much play.
When he was asked about the struggles after a quick start he said (about MSU), "It was their defense. They did a terrific job of stepping it up a notch. Their defense was the reason we struggled."
Then he was asked what adjustments coming out and he said something to the effect of "If Gary Harris didn't come out for the 2nd half, UM would be fine."
He's a class act and I could hear Izzo talk about having to use guys he hasn't used in a month and a non-sequitur regarding Harris being POTY in a post game news conference.
He mentioned that MSU two main players were injured and would not play though he had hoped they would have been able to. He wanted to play MSU at their best.
While it is true injuries are part of sports, one cannot overlook the impact the lost of critical players. Nadal lost today and the media pointed out he was hobbled and could not play his best.
FWIW, since McGary has been out Michigan has been unbeatable. Coincidence? Probably.
I think it's one of those things where there's no waiting or uncertainty as to when Mitch gets back or how he fits in. Everyone knows what to do in his absence and there's enough talent on the rest of the team to make up for it. They'd be better with a healthy Mitch but they were worse when he was at 50-75%.
then Izzo starts whining.
My favorite part of the game was when the camera showed Izzo and it looked like he was about to cry. My wife, who in the past has not watched a lot of BB, says "Oh my God is he actually going to cry? It's just a game." I laughed for like 3 minutes straight before letting her know that is pretty standard for Izzo when things are not going his way.
My wife was watching the game with me and said the exact same thing! However, I just said that Izzo is a whiny little bitch and left it at that.
Did they play badly? No. Would they have been better with the injured players available? Yes.
We'd say the same if it happened to us
Not necessarily. Had the injured players been healthy and played they could have played poorly.
A win is a win and they are staring up at us this morning in the standings :)
When talking to sparties, please don't mention us "losing" 2 NBA guys. That makes the argument worse. They'll use that every year then. It's fair to say we lost McGary but leave Burke and thj out of it, makes us the ones who sound whiny.
Who exactly has Sparty sent to the NBA in recent years?
All the Spartans in the nba are forty years old besides Green. I'm going to be upset when Keith leaves. That guy has been an honorary wolverine over the past four years. Wish he could stay and play point forever. Shoot 20% and turn the ball over in crunch time.
UM's point guards have owned him every game except one: trey burke's game against him @msu as a frosh, but i would call that game a push.
burke had two 20+ pt games and an 18 pt game; morris averaged 15 in his two games and walton had a better game last nite.
appling peaks at 11 pts (last year's blowout by msu) and his assist-to-TO ratio is barely over 1:1. and he shoots at about 30%.
That's Keith in a nutshell.
They can't use the early departure argument, because they don't have early departures. MSU hasn't had an underclassmen declare for the NBA draft since 2006.
Where 5* players go to have solid 4-year careers. Roe, Dawson, Paul Davis...
Payne was on that track, but 2013 (last year B1g to this injury) have seen him be an all-American, and Gary Harris is obviously not in that category
In the nearly 20 years Izzo has been at MSU, he's had, I think, only 4 "true" early entrants: Richardson, Randolph, Taylor, and Brown. Beilein's had that many in the last four years.
It makes me feel good to know that even if MSU is owning us in football, we're taking it to them in basketball. 5 of the last 7, and that's really got to hurt for a school that traditionally prides itself on its basketball team. Here's to making it 6 of the last 8 next month.
Payne and McGary a wash and does Izzo (or any Spartan fan) really think Dawson would have played better than Ellis? Maybe a couple more rebounds, but no more.
Which also reminds of a comment from Vitale who said Payne and Dawson represented 26 points per game. I've always hated this logic. It's not like MSU would have scored 101 points with them playing. For them to get 26, they have to take away from other people scoring.
I saw Dawson having a grand old time on the bench. He was laughing and joking with teammates as Payne looked on very seriously and concerned. I buy the Payne effect in this game but I'm over everyone acting like Brandon Dawson is anything other than what he really is, a decent rebounder. The guy is athletic but can't score consistently and gets hurt if you breath on him wrong. He's over rated and won't play at the next level. If the guy took his team seriously and if he cared at all about his program he would have changed over the past few seasons. Now in reality all he is is a let down and an excuse.
ellis and kaminski provided more than dawson would. and izzo chose to give byrd minutes instead of shillling, who is clearly better. that's just a bad coaching decision.
We always knew this day was coming... We started over and built it the right way. Now it's something we can be proud of. Msu knows that and that's what hurts them the most. The tide has changed... Now keep the recruits coming and lets make a dynasty. Go Blue!
Not sure if this has been discussed in this thread, but does anyone know if Payne will be back for the game in AA? I know Dawson is 5-6 weeks. Would be nice if he is back for it so we can beat them and not hear all these excuses. 5 out of 7!!!
and shows izzo's true colors was the fact his first comment out of his mouth at the press conference was blaming the refs for not calling a foul when appling chose to drive the lane against two bigger UM guys standing there with their hands straight up. and moments later bitching about the double technical and having to take appling out. he didn't have to take appling out. and yet that T caused morgan to foul out; albeit a minute later.
he lacks class bigtime when things aren't going well. if he would have started his conference saying that he was proud of his kids stepping up, despite the obvious injuries, and playing a hard fought game against our biggest rival. we still had a chance but came up short. they made some key plays at the end...yada yada yada.
he would have come out looking much better instead of the whiney bitch that he is.
MSU came into the game averaging 79 points and 39 rebounds. They finished just under those numbers with 75 points and 35 rebounds.
Michigan State gave up 80 points. Even with the argument that Dawson's defense was missing, Stauskas scored 19, LeVert scored 17, Walton scored 19. He wasn't going to guard all three.
ISO can't develop talent anymore.
His players are regressing.
Recruiting doesn't matter though.
It's all the fault of injuries.
Guess what so did UM! LOL. They were just too young. Both teams started three sophs and one frosh and one SR. Sounds very familiar to UM Football fans. Izzo only has one NC to his name in 20 years of coaching, hell Lloyd Carr did better than that. He should be proud the way another team of his fell short of promise and just became mediocre.
Agree that Izzo was "classy" until he finally started losing to Michigan. Beilein is drinking his milkshake and Izzo is feeling the pressure.
We're missing our preseason All-American. You're missing your good big man plus an idiot. Both teams had injuries, deal with it. You lost fair and square (at home no less)
Why did Beilein lose his mind in the second half?
Izzo seemed classy until he started losing. People show their true colors when they lose. Izzo just looked classy but he is poor loser. He was always classless. We just didn't know it. Badgers probably knew it before we did. Even that disgusting Bo Ryan is classier than Izzo.
one announcer say they thought UM would win. In fact all I heard was the Spartans this the Spartans that. After UM won the game they all said, oh well, MSU was hamstrung by injuries. (paraphrasing here) So even though they picked Sparty they couldn't give UM credit for winning the game. The way I see it, the Sparties Blue it with 13 min. left in the game and then sucked it after 3 min. left in the game. It was theirs for the taking and they just plain Blue it. Or as we used to say in the day CHOKED, and yes I missed spelled Blew on purpose.
I'm no Izzo supporter, but it looks to me like people are giving Izzo a bit too hard of a time on this one. Unless I'm missing something, these post games quotes are not indicitive of the response he's getting on here.http://www.msuspartans.com/sports/m-baskbl/recaps/012514aac.html Comparing his comments to Beilein's, you can tell JB is def. more classy, but I'm not seeing the hatred for Izzo justified based on his comments here. Maybe the presser told a different story, however.