This is getting ridiculous. Borges tries to throw and it's "OMG! Run the ball, that's the only way to win with Denard!" Then when he sticks to the bread and butter running game and a good defense shuts it down, it's "Where's the counter-punch, Borges?"
We need to face facts as a fan base. With Denard at the helm, this is a one dimensional offense. If we try to open up the passing game, we become extremely vulnerable to mistakes and negative plays. If we stick to the running game regardless of what the defense shows, we risk being shut down.
This was not a great game for this offense. There may be another game like this. But just because this offense puts up 45 on Illinois and Purdue, it does not mean that they should be doing it every game, and the only reason they wouldn't is coaching mistakes.
Enjoy the Denard offense for what it is. It may be the most exciting offense this school will ever see, but that does not mean it's the best.
[EDIT: Replied to a comment that doesn't appear to exist anymore. Maybe the user got banned for some reason? The comment itself was pretty measured and well-reasoned.]
borges owes a large chunk of his salary to mattison
We beat Sparty.
We beat Sparty?
WE BEAT SPARTY!
Greg Mattison. He's a hell of a coach.
No excuse on the fake punt, and that was all coverage call from the sideline. I wanted to punch my TV with the 3rd & 22 and we try to get the whole thing instead of playing for field goal position. And the clock management on that last drive was bad enough to lose the game.
The guys played well and won a heavy weight fight (let's call it that instead of 2012 B1G football), so all's well that ends well.
Gholston didn't do shit . . . again.
Zone read never works against good fronts.
No I Form running and no Rawls didn't make sense to me.
Denard needs to take off when he has 7-10 yards instead off throwwing deep.
Staee needed every break to acore 10 points.
More Funchess and Gardner in the red zone, please.
Pass rush could have been much better.
I love Mattison.
I want Rawls more and more every week. There was a run early in the game where Fitz had superb blocking set up for a long run and he did absolutely nothing with it. It's like he found the only defender in a position to make a play and ran to him.
Yeah, there was a screen early in the game where he had nothing but open grass in front of him, and he got shoestring-tackled by the one guy within ten yards of him.
There was only one guy about 10-15 yds past the line of scrimmage in front of him with acres of open space. If Denard runs, he at least gets in ~50yd FG range. More likely, he eludes the sole defender and who knows, maybe he scores?
But we ended up winning, and who knows, maybe we miss the ~50yd FG and end up in worse shape. Of course, I'll take it. But next time, please run.
But it bears repeating. Watch the replay on that 3rd & 22. Jackson is super-duper open between 3 MSU defenders. Like broken-coverage level open. Denard just missed on the throw. Wasn't a bad read, wasn't a bad decision to throw, just a bad pass.
Is Al Borges the only coordinator in football (at any level) that runs the ball five times in a two minute drill? I know Michigan Football (tm) is all about MANBALL and running the rock, but that's getting kinda rediculous.
It seems whenever a team plays with the mindset of "sell out to the run, Denard can't throw", we either have a close game or get trounced. I'm reeealllly drunk right now though, so if this is completely bogus I await the evidence.
Is there a riot in East Lansing?
Way too HARD on the "free play" crap. Sorry. The QB can easily identify when a D-lineman jumps offside in a flagrant fashion. This was not obvious. The kid is running around at 1000 mph in the closing moments and you expect him to recognize something on the field that was not obvious even from a TV angle ? Give the kid a break. I was in chat and people thought the flag was against UM at first.
Snowflakes? I don't have any. Just unbridled joy at getting this win. It's been a long time coming. With everything in life right now personally, I need that.
Sorry. First Double Post!
But I'm not that pissed at Borges. I think the best way to burn MSU's defense is by throwing against the DB's who are in man-to-man, but we don't have the receiving talent on the outside nor the passing talent at the QB position to do that. He could have open up it up a bit more, but that's a high risk strategy. Given how the defense was playing, I think some Tressle-ball was the right move.
I was reading over Colin's excellent piece on the Cover-4, and I was thinking, the system that will give that the most trouble is a West-Coast offense. Interestingly, once Borges installs his "old-school" offense, it might be the one that gives the "new-school" defenses fits.
All good defenses are going to key on Denard and reduce us to a passing team, which does not boad well for us. Why do Rawls?
Remenmber when kicking a point after (not to mention a field goal) was an adventure? Boy, they have really turned that around. Our defense is stout.
I can't wait until our personel is upgraded (probably in 2 years) and the offense has the right pieces (Morris and Green for starters).
was at the game, and I hope he recognized we're short a playmaker at RB.
Ladies and gentlemen.... We have a defense!!!!!
MSU fumbled inside their 10 yard line in the 2nd quarter and recovered, they fumbled inside their 10 at the end of the 4th quarter and recovered, we had their trick play for an easy 10 yard loss in the 3rd quarter but our guy falls down and they score 2 plays later, and of course that brilliant (although frustrating as hell) fake punt that led to a field goal.
Plus we lost 10 seconds off the clock when Denard reached for that first down on our last drive and nobody seemed to notice. I didn't even notice myself until Beckman and Brandstatter brought it up on the radio. The clock read 32 seconds when it should have been 42.
Plus we probably had triple the penalty yards that MSU had. When nothing is going your way and you can still pull out the win, that feels damn good.
Denard's pass to Dileo to set up the field goal was HUGE.
The fact that they didn't stop the clock while the chains were being set....grrrrr.
But penalty wise it was close too. They had 7 for 50, we had 6 for 55.
Stop the clock that is. Events transpired as such:
1. Denard reaches for the first down. Officials on the field signal first down. The clock stops, the chains move.
2. After the chains are set, the clock begins to run and Michigan prepares to run a play. This process takes 10 seconds.
3. Booth signals for review. Clock stops and play stops.
But no, they didn't. They had the ball spotted and started the clock. But the chains weren't set yet. The back end of the chains weren't placed, and the clock was still ticking. It cost us about ten seconds. Then they stopped it for a review, and didn't put the time back up.
I'll have to wait for the full game videos to come out, but I remember seeing the chain gang move, and looking at the clock an noticing it not ticking.
Clearly not too big of a deal at this point. We had 8 whole seconds to spare!
It did stop, but they started it when the font chain got to the first down spot, but the rest of the chain was still being set. Then they reviewed. All very weird.
Still think your (twice) posted "everyone complained about Denard passing now are complaining about running too much" is the post if the night.
I'm probably taking too much pride out of a complement from what amounts to a random internet stranger, but thanks, I appreciate it.
I think it's possible that it looked more confusing at the game than it did on TV. It looked to me like the ref spotted the ball and made the signal to start the clock before the clock started. Maybe the chains weren't completely set at that point, but that may be a common practice, I'm not sure.
I really think those 10 seconds were just the Michigan offense not snapping the ball when they had the chance. They've been doing that in their hurry-up all year (and last year if I recall). They hurry to get to the line, and then take a full, normal snap count before they snap the ball. I would be more upset about that, but it all worked out today, so I'm happy.
I watched the tv replay, and it clearly shows at the top of the screen that the front marker is barely placed when the clock starts, and the back one isn't even close.
HOWEVER, I've read posts on here that in the last few years that (no one can pinpoint when) that the rule has changed and they don't have to be completely set, just moved, and the ref can start the clock whenever the ball is set. I haven't been able to find that rule, but I've asked a few more knowledgable than me and they think that might be the case.
So while I was right about the chains not being set before the clock started, it probably didn't matter, and you're right, the refs probably got it right. That all really doesn't matter because we won, the game is over, and it didn't really end up changing the game after all.
very frustrated with Hoke. Overall, I think we'll be consistently good under Hoke, but god dammit I want the man to yell at the refs for once. It's beyond comprehension that those TWO refs didn't throw a flag when Denard got his head nearly ripped off. After last year with Gholston? Unreal. Hoke should have blow his top. I like his class, he represents M well, but stand up for your frick'n QB too!
On top of that, the clock management, and more than anything else, the fake punt is just inexcusable.
It's not like it was on a part of the field where you would expect. Dantonio exhibited much balls by running that play so close to his endzone, at that distance, and in the fourth quarter. That was a great call.
I also don't buy the "scream at the refs" complaint. Screaming at the refs does nothing except raise your blood pressure and make you look like Brian Kelly.
The clock management is a legitimate complaint. That needs to improve.
On the fake punt - Dantonio lives for it. We should have been ready for it on any and every punt, from the first minute to the last. As another poster said, it's extremely likely we'd either fair catch or let a punt hit and roll, so why focus on the return instead of the fake, against Dantonio? I'll admit, I was stunned he called it there, but I'm more stunned we weren't ready for it.
I didn't say I wanted Hoke to "scream." There is a difference between yell and scream. I don't want Brian Kelly, he's an idiot. I like Hoke's class. But it was unbelievable those two refs didn't throw a flag, after what happened last year. I want our coach to get on the refs when they totally f it up, and especially when it comes to protecting the health of our players, and especially the QB.
I'm fine if you feel different. The OP asked what I was thinking, and I answered.
Even the greatest coaches are at times fooled. Football is a game of guess. On that play Dantonio guessed right. Give him his props and move on. If Hoke's teams had a history of special teams fails(ala the Lions) then I would be more concerned. But they don't. Dantonio made a great call.
You can feel however you want, that's fine. But dude, chill, I get to feel how I want to feel too. I'm not trying to tell you how to feel.
Why was the lack of preparation for the fake punt inexcusable? Against Dantonio, when you do you think you should expect the fake punt/field goal/point after/kickoff? I would say you should probably expect it when you would otherwise least expect it.
Like I said, I was still stunned he called it then. But Hoke shouldn't have been, he's getting paid a lot of money to not be stunned by that. As long as Dantonio is MSU's coach, we should expect the fake punt/field goal/point after/kickoff on every punt/field goal/point after/kickoff.
Why wouldn't you?
replied to the wrong entry ... below
I didn't feel like I was searching, but if I was I'd like to know why.
Did Gholston play?
and gave us 5 precious yards.
Defense looked great today. Only gave up 10 points. Got an INT and forced two fumbles (Unfortunately we couldn't recover one). J.T. floyd had a few good pass breakups, and we tackled well in space for the most part. And we actually played well in the clutch. This defense has been fun to watch in these last few games. We've given up less than 10 points a game in the last four games. Starting to look like a Michigan D to me! Go Blue!
We kicked a game winning field goal and left only 5 secs on the clock. Yes, I would say that the click management worked out just find. Amazes me when some fans can't just be happy with the win - no game is played, officiated, or coached perfectly - just enjoy the win everyone.
Mad props to Matt Wile for coming in and making that longer field goal. I don't think he's had any FG attempts during his time here and to hit that was absolutely clutch.
Would have liked to see Rawls. I felt that both times in the red zone instead of the read option, which drives me nuts, but instead going I formation and letting the big man try to pound it in could have been more successful. Win is a win and the team never gave up.
The playcalling was frustrating, but Sparty's D is good enough that whatever counterpunches we think of from our living room probably wouldn't have worked out much better than whatever we did try. There were a few times we had the right play dialed up but our receivers not named Dileo flat out didn't make the play or the throw wasn't where it needed to be.
Bottom line is that re: Borges, he gets a free pass from me all season long because of his masterpiece vs. Ohio last year. If all he does for the rest of his tenure is engineer works of art against those cretins, I'm honestly OK with that.
Gardner caught that pass that was called incomplete inside the 10. That was a huge swing call
Have to give the refs some credit, not perfectly officiated, but I was expecting this game to get really nasty - may change my mind after some replays, but thought that they did a good job breaking things up before it was able to get out of hand.
Although they did get some calls right, they were constantly missing holding calls on MSU on our guy coming from the edge. And then, after a whole game of not calling it on MSU, they call it on Michigan at a point in the game where it could have altered the game's outcome.
But you're right, it could have been worse and they did keep it under control.
About the clock management: even when the team needs to go into a 2 minute drill, it takes forever to get plays in. Why is there not a set of plays to go to in that situation that doesn't require using up 20 seconds or more?
Anyone else think the block in the back call on Kovacs interceptioin was bogus? T Gordon did not block that guy in the back.
Real men don't yell.