Good chance for the coaching staff to teach about better defense and better shot selection.
Michigan vs. ISU (Snowflakes) Thread
McGary and Stauskas played well.
Albrecht and Horford played "average"
GRIII, LeVert and the 2 freshman had bad games.
We probably played better than expected when you take this into account.
For a while he was Michigan's only offense. Putting him in the same category as GRIII is going too far
ISU managed to go from a team that I didn't really care about to a team that I strongly dislike.
Being loud and roudy is one thing. Repeating "Fuck McGary" over and over again at a player that has no bad history vs ISU and for seemingly no reason is an entirely different beast.
And god damn the officiating. It didn't directly cause the loss, but you'd have to be crazy to deny that it wasn't at least a factor.
That is probably it, but that is a terrible reason. The refs reviewed it and said he didn't. Then they chanted it again later in the game.
"The refs reviewed it and said he didn't" cannot have been meant seriously.
Did that not happen?
The refs went to the tape and determined that it wasn't a flagrant foul.
McGary and Stauskas looked great. Yeah, Nik missed some open threes, but he also hit some awfully difficult ones when we needed it. He's our #1 offensive option right now and I thought he played pretty well.
Spike looked fine. Walton really impressed me with his aggressiveness towards the basket. A couple times I thought it was LeVert because of how quick he hit the baseline and went up with the ball. Very good stuff.
GR3 played terribly. Not that surprising. I love the kid and I think he has an enormous amount of potential, but that was a repeat performance of exactly why everyone criticized him last year. The only difference is that his shooting looks worse this year. I dunno, man.
Also, Irvin looks lost 100% of the time.
Not really encouraging, but it's not a terrible loss.
It is weird, when you wait for somebody to explode and put all all their talent together, obviously there is the assumption that there is another level there that we have not seen. But when you are waiting, and then you are waiting, and then you are waitng, you start to question whether there is another gear there for him in the first place. Your right, he just looks tentative. Not the body language I was hoping for from him.
Exactly. I don't necessarily expect him to come out and be a world-beater, but he's shown no improvement thus far this season. Stauskas is stronger and is more assertive and dominant. LeVert took a big leap (although he didn't play that well tonight). Spike looks comfortable running everything.
GR3 doesn't look improved offensively or defensively. Every timeout, I just want McGary to start shaking him because he looked like he slept-walk through that game.
Anytime GR3 and Irvin are on the floor together, we're so stagnant.
Well, we're 1 game, 2 glorified scrimmages and 2 actual scrimmages into the season. And he's looked fine up to now.
He's not a creator with the ball. He's not going to be, so its best to get that expectation out of your head. He's an athletic freak who will rebound with anyone in the B10, can defend the perimeter, will get some steals, and can run the floor. That's what he is and he's very good to great at all those things.
He's not going to destroy guys off the dribble all game.
Of course, I'm not saying he's "bad." But for a lottery pick, pre-season All-American-type player, there's still question marks that leave a lot to be desired.
And I never expected him to be a big creator. That's pretty obvious - he can't really do it. His shooting numbers tonight (mind you, these were mostly uncontested) were pretty poor, and he doesn't have that first-step to blow by anyone one-on-one.
I just get excited about his athleticism and potential and he's still not making that sophomore jump (at least not yet). He's like the Frank Clark of this year's basketball team.
I haven't ever seen anything from him that justifies that kind of hype. He's a good kid who can be explosive offensively at times, but he's way too inconsistent to be considered a true All-American yet. Maybe by the end of the season he will.
the feeling you are just being antogonistic. Nobody is hating on Robinson, we are evaluating his play tonight. He looked really tentative all game. I think people are expecting a step forward and that was not it. That's all.
Except people were hating on Robinson, especially in the game thread.
Sorry, I might be extrapolating that extreme onto people who are concerned in a more mature manner.
I get upset when people bash on players who are putting forth 100% effort.
Not trying to be antagonistic, but the micro-evaluation is maybe wearing on me. Let the season play out - guys should be allowed to have poor shooting nights without having a fan base call them "soft" or "a joke" or some of the other, worse things said in the game thread.
and normally I wouldn't feel bad losing to an 'upstart' team who probably just got their best win of the season but for the "Fuck McGary" chant, I hope they lose every game from here. What a bunch of corn husking clowns
And probably took to many damn shots. Gotta get to the cup and charity stripe. And refs were very frustrating to say the least.
1. Interior defense, 2. Too much reliance on contested threes, 3. GRIII still tentative. He is a beast. I wish he would just realize it.
home cooking from the refs. Not concerned about the loss. There are some new players that have to gel with the others. This isn't like football where one loss can screw your season up.
...and their coach seems like a class act.
Their fans can go to hell and I hope Borges is fired from Michigan and goes to ISU and they have to ensure 3 years of hell.
You're wishing Borges on them?
Also, is our defense just that terrible? LeVert was supposed to be our defensive specialist and he just got straight up schooled consistently. By multiple ISU guys. I thought we'd take a tiny step forward in that department but no.
And not that it decided the win or loss, but that was some very suspect officiating midway through the second half. A lot of fouls that were called that didn't affect the gameplay but obviously had a larger impact come the end of the game. I understand the hand checking and charges that are going to be called differently, but there was a span of two or three minutes that was pretty brutal to watch.
A few costly turnovers but overall a good game IMO. Lavert on the other hand had ball security issues and also became a defensive liability.
My concern is why Belien chose to play Lavert so much when he so clearly struggled. They missed a lot of open shots as a team. When Lavert offered nothing offensively and struggled defensively I thought Belien needed to switch things up some.
We could barely keep players in front of us as it was. Did you see how much penetration they were getting? If we put another slow-footed guy in there we would have been screwed (not to mention it would hurt the offense, too).
Rebounding was a question of effort and poor officiating, not size. Iowa State was allowed to get away with murder and also hustled to every loose ball. Michigan did not.
I need the Stauskas dunk and the ISU fan belly rub .gif'd SO bad.
Those jumpers off the passing rotation rather than hesitating than passing for this team to become great. He doesn't have to be Burke; he just has to take the shot if it's there.
Luckily it's November and there's plenty of time and experience to come. November doesn't matter. March does.
Also, I'm sure that The ISU athletic department would love a bunch of tweets @CycloneATH commending their fans directly attacking a player with profanity on national TV.
I approve of this use of social media.
How dare fans (that aren't at a university of Michigan hockey game) use profanity. OUTRAGE!
Glenn Robinson III is a joke. I've been saying it since last year. Overall no where near as good as he's supposed to be. I can't remember the last time he did good against a good team. He's only a projected lotery pick because of his daddy.
Please shut up. As good as he's supposed to be? Sorry he's not living up to yours or others ridiculous expectations. He was our leading rebounder this game and had 4 steals.
Do you expect him to be an off-the-dribble creator? Because he isn't. He never will be. That doesn't mean he's a joke.
I mean I disagreed with his "joke" comment too but to say that he is never going to be an off the dribble creator is just as problematic. I think those lottery pick prognostications are indeed based on the assumption that he can and will develop that part of his game. He had some nice rebounds but you have to admit, if that is anywhere close to his ceiling it is somewhat alarming.
Sure, he'll need to be able to create his own shot in some way. But I think expectations are that since he was a supposed lotto pick (according to...) that he should be able to create off the dribble with the best of them.
But that's not his strength. That's fine.
Look at THJr. He was even worse creating off the dribble. He's doing fine.
GR3 will develop enough of a skill set to create shots in certain situations. He hasn't really been asked to do that at the college level until now. It'll come. He won't be Rajon Rondo, though, and if anyone thinks he will be simply because some NBA people put the lotto tag on him, then their expectations are out of whack.
Excellent rebounder. Plus defender. Plus athlete. Plus on the break. He's a very good player and his strengths are all the un-flashy things which is why - I feel - people are bashing him without looking at the whole picture.
He needs to finish at a higher rate. His history says he will. Lets not extrapolate from too little data for this year.
Well, to be fair, THJ is a much better shooter than GRIII and that's why he's having success. I think GRIII should have a red light from the arc for the time being.
I wasn't too fond of Hardaway JR. either. The problem is, Robinson can't make a shot if he's two feet away from the basket. And obviously it's not my expecations, it's someone else's if he's being a projected lotery pick. I expected him to improve, but I never expected him to be "great". So far he's shown that he's the same level as last year.
Strengths are the unflashy things?? I have to completely disagree
Gets a lot of boards, gets his hands in the pass in lanes a lot, uses athleticism to get to loose balls, can lead a break off a rebound and can run the floor really quick. I think those are the things he is talking about.
I am as critical as the next guy but to say he is a joke is really premature.
Yeah, that's an overreaction after a tough road loss. I'm pretty damn critical of GR3 but to say he's a joke is kinda out there.
At the same time, I just don't understand how someone with that much athleticism and talent can't put it together. He doesn't have to create his own shot. But for coaches and players and the media who rave about his basketball IQ? I dunno, I haven't seen a lot of it this season.
Not to double down on my first point, but the officiating wasn't terrible and here's a reason why:
Michigan did not get the ball into the paint. We really struggled taking advantage of the switch on the ball screens (something Burke excelled at) and it resulted in a lot of jumpshots. I think had we gotten the ball into the lane more, we probably would be seeing ISU fans bitching about the officiating.
If you look back at the calls, I don't think there were many that were blatantly wrong (e.g. the McGary to the floor on the rebound before GR3 fouled a rebounder was the correct no-call then correct call if you watched the replay). However, ISU put themselves in a better position to take advantage of the whistles by playing inside out. We needed to get the ball to McGary in the post more, but couldn't.
They were calling touch fouls on Michigan when ISU had the ball, but allowing the Cyclones to get away with murder.
I'm pretty sure ISU fans thought the refs were turrible too, wich is a sign that they were actually pretty even handed
We'll agree to disagree.
I'll admit I view this as being a former official and now coach so I think I am able to put away the fan bias better than I was 10 years ago. I watched all the questionable calls twice and I don't think it was very uneven.
There were 1 or 2 calls I was surprised about but even after second viewing I couldn't say they were egregiously wrong. That's not terrible.
I didn't think many of the calls on Michigan were bad, the issue is the level of no-calls on the other end of the court. The level of roughness called needs to be the same on both ends.
That's the main issue with NCAA officiating - since it exists in a grey area where any one call cannot be discussed in isolation, it therefore needs to be consistent with the rest of the officiating which makes it difficult to analyze.
ISU is a quality team with a very good coach who just played the biggest home game in history. They will make the tourney and probably get a 5-6 seed.
This team is young and missing Burke- no one is filling that hole right now, espeically the freshmen. Levert is being leaned on a ton offensively right now. I think he's still a pleasent surprise, but we have stauskas as the #1 offensive guy and levert as #2- that's not good.
Let's hope Irvin and Walton can develope and GRIII can start playing like an NBA 1st round pick. until then, we'll have trouble scoring, especially late in the game.
I think Walton is doing a fantastic job replacing the unreplaceable Burke.
I think the problem is we're missing Timmy. Without another big shooter (other than Stauskas) on the wing, we're fairly easy to defend. Not to mention GR3 isn't an offensive threat and we don't have post-offense.
But I don't think Cris LeVert is awesome like everyone else on this blog seems to think. He's still too small for his position, which is kinda the norm for Coach B I guess. He still get completely abused on defense. He's good passer for his size, but he's not a great shooter or scorer. I'm just confused by the praise hept upon him around here. He's not a bad player, but I'll go on record here saying that he'll never be a star-player.