According to John Walters' twitter...
According to John Walters' twitter...
when in Ireland, drink like the Irish do...
I'm sure all those times Tate and the rest of the younger guys were spotted at Ricks, Scorekeepers, and the Fifth Quarter the past two years they were only drinking Apple Juice.
A) There's no evidence to prove that any underage players on Michigan were drinking. A lot of bars in Ann Arbor let 18 year olds in quite often.
B) They weren't arrested
Read through any of the stories on the board of the encounters people have had with Tate and the other underage players. There are stories on the board of playing beer pong with them, hanging with them at frat parties, house parties and at bars.
A house party got busted at Notre Dame or in South Bend. Big fucking deal. We're just lucky that the AAPD rarely break up fraternity parties and if they break up a house party, they're more likely just to send people home then start asking everyone for their ID. Also, if you do get busted for underage drinking in AA, 9 times out of 10 they write you a ticket and send you on your way, it doesn't end up in the newspaper or defined as an arrest.
You're making a big deal out of nothing.
Hopefully it is a big deal to the ND coaching staff and these players are suspended for the first 2 games of the season.
I could be mistaken, but there's not a starter amongst those guys. It wouldn't make a big difference. Then again, why look a gift horse in the mouth?
Filer and Montana are the closest thing to starter, Jones maybe later in the year
A) They are in college, which is evidence enough. Besides, i have seen some of those kids drink at the bars. Everyone saw Ryan Mallett there. Come on and join reality
B) So all the other schools that were spending extra time 'stretching' are guilty of going over the NCAA time limits like we were
Welcome to reality. This is a non-story
So, what you are saying is that the drinking isn't the problem, it's the getting caught that is?
When it comes to 18 or 19 year old students away from home for the first time, yes, it is a right of passage and very common to drink underage. But if you are a football player at a high profile program like ND, it is unacceptable to get arrested doing it.
ND football players, whether they like it or not, represent the program and the university wherever they go and whatever they do. They have to be more careful than the average college student. Ask Tiger Woods or Ben Roethlisberger how that works. Or the Georgia AD who just got fired for picking up a DUI.
Star football players at a program like ND's receive tons of benefits, not the least of which is a shot at playing on Sundays. As a trade-off, their conduct is under a microscope and being arrested for any reason is a big deal. Virtually any college student would accept that trade-off in a millisecond. If these players did not understand this before, they do now.
You are playing proofreading police and telling me to lighten up?
Hypocrisy is the act of persistently professing beliefs, opinions, virtues, feelings, qualities, or standards that are inconsistent with one's actions. Hypocrisy is thus a kind of lie.
The hypocrite thinks that what he or she usually professes does not somehow apply to him or her.
This time I will let you off with a warning. Just don't let it happen again.
Let's assume, arguendo, that Tate was drinking at Skeeps. Hell, assume every underaged player on the roster drinks occasionally (which for a bunch of college kids isn't outside the realm of possibility). Your point is still moo.
During the Jihad, a lot of us kept saying was "but EVERYONE does this shit." And the response was, "yeah, but they didn't get caught, and Michigan did. So you've gotta deal with the consequences"
My, how the turntables...
It's a bigger deal for Brian Kelly than for anybody else, esp. since the death of the recruit whose name I can't recall. He can't appear to be condoning any illegal stuff involving booze, so it will be interesting to see what the extent of his punishment will be.
It's hardly out of the realm of possibility that the same thing could happen here in AA, so I'm not going to gloat. Karma and all that.
And I agree; gloating is a bad idea. And not just because it could happen to us at any time, but also because these are just kids who did something we all did at some point. No need to drag them through the mud more than is necessary.*
*As long as they're suspended for at least two games...
Don: "It's hardly out of the realm of possibility that the same thing could happen here in AA, so I'm not going to gloat. Karma and all that."
I just don't think it is appropriate to gloat over something like this. It is an issue that has occurred at Michigan in the past, and likely will again in the future. That whole "People who llive in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" nonsense.
We're lucky, it sounds like the South Bend police are real cocksuckers when it comes to house parties. In Ann Arbor, they tend to be a little more lenient as long as you're drinking inside a house or at least on the grass. Once you leave the safety of the grass, it is an entirely different story.
Dmitri Martin disagrees:
The South Bend Police will be arriving shortly to take me in.
I dunno, there was so much pot being smoked in Markley during my fresh and soph years I doubt it was really that safe.
As someone who is underage, I was at a house party that got broken up by the cops and they just came to the door and said that everyone under 21 just leave through the backdoor. So yes, the cops in AA don't really care as long as your not a danger to yourself or anyone else, or so it seems like. South Bend sounds a little different...
The Jihad is a bad comparison. Not everyone does that stuff, and we ourselves wouldn't have if Brad Labadie/Scott Draper had done their jobs.
Bad example. Labadie, without a doubt was the sole reason why you didn't read multiple headlines similar to this ND underage drinking story to have come out of a2 over the last couple years. He is REALLY taking a lot of heat right now, and some rightfully so, but this guy saved the asses of countless players during his time in the AD.
is 'who cares?! the drinking age is stupid. no one over 18 should ever get punished for drinking alcohol. drinking and driving on the other hand ..."
There is a small difference between a college football player drinking underage and a college football player being busted for drinking underage. The difference is making sure you are not doing it in the wrong place at the wrong time. I am sure that most college players drink occasionally, but the vast majority don't get busted in a group with several other high profile football players. Go Irish!
Except that getting arrested isn't under their control. HAve you been at a Michigan party when the cops came? I'm sure 100% of the students or former students on this board have. Your'e deriding these kids because the cops happened to be assholes. In Ann Arbor, less so.
I really don't understand why you're getting negged for this. During my 4 years at Michigan I could easily name at least three dozen players who I either saw drinking while underage or drank with personally while they were underage, whether at frat houses or the bar. I can also name a few who like to regularly smoke marijuana with people I know.
Do some posters here really think that Michigan football players don't do these things? Trust me, this happens everywhere. I'm not saying every player (not even close), but it happens in every program in the country.
There are plenty of people here who reflexively neg anybody who makes a comment that can be construed—no matter what contortions in interpretation are necessary—as anything other than slavishly laudatory of Michigan, or RR. If you dare to express an opinion that a highly-rated recruit will go elsewhere, or that Michigan won't go 13-0, or that there are other college football programs worthy of respect, somebody here will neg you automatically.
And then there are those who seem to neg the most innocent comments by individual commenters for what appear to be entirely personal reasons. It's weird.
I'll check with some "sources close to the program" as things unfold.
For now, sufficed to say...
EDIT: Pete Fiutak is reporting that Ron Powlus and Touchdown Jesus were also arrested for underaged drinking, but that coach Rockne has no comment at this time.
Someone's dipping into the holy wine before sunday ehh?
While I understand that college students drink and I don't ever think that's a big deal, but the school has to be careful how they deal with this since they just had a recruit fall to his death during spring break because he was drunk. It's going to be a tough line to toe.
I gotta believe BKelly laid down the law at the beginning of camp with a "zero tolerance" attitude in light of Matt James' tragic death. The school and SBPD may be taking a no-nonsense stance against drinking among underage students. I mean a real stance with real consequences.
The "Zero tolerance. After the first strike. Or after the second strike if it really isn't a big deal and the cop was just being a dick. And possibly after the third strike if you feel really REALLY bad about it. Though some exceptions will be made for fourth strikes if we're really thin at corner. But that's IT. After that, no tolerance. Probably" policy.
That's great...I was going to post something but I read that take and, really, there is no way to exceed that analysis. I'd give you more than the plus one if I could...
Or Best Comment Evar?
of the students. In Oregon Chip Kelly perhaps could have been harsher with Masoli (and maybe saved him from the path he's taken (I doubt that much could have saved Masoli however given his poor choices.)) James makes this a big deal for ND.
Discipline and locker room culture are particular to the schools. I'm surprised this sort of difference doesn't play out more in recruiting. I'd think parents would be tuned into this...but I don't see that so much.
I think Chip Kelly has handled Oregon's issues pretty well. They hammered their star RB last year (Blount) for the punching incident after the Boise game.
We will see what kind of disciplinarian Brian Kelly is. Lo Wood and Nate Montana are too high profile for ND to think they can quietly slap them on the wrist without raising eyebrows.
right back on the team after taking the credit for said hammer. That works for curbing media and public reaction but it doesn't set a clear standard for the players.
Masoli had a strike against him and screws were not applied (that could have potentially saved his season.)
I don't blame Chip Kelly for the behavior of his players entirely but I certainly don't think he has handled discipline well.
OT to the discussion at this point:
Survey reveals that 650,000 underage drinkers in the past month were given alcohol by their parents or guardians
More than 40 percent of the nation’s estimated 10.8 million underage current drinkers (persons aged 12 to 20 who drank in the past 30 days) were provided free alcohol by adults 21 or older, according to a nationwide report by the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration. The study also indicates that one in 16 underage drinkers (6.4 percent or 650,000) was given alcoholic beverages by their parents in the past month.
Source - samhsa.gov
Just sayin'. Seems fair to me.
That's pretty harsh for underage drinking.
At the parties I saw get busted up by cops, it was just citations for everyone and you go home.
Yeah it's real great having a police department which only focusses on alcohol violations, gets them real excited when they get to arrest someone. 43 people arrested, man
Tip for dealing with the SBPD: when (not if, when) someone breaks in and steals your shit, tell them that the thieves were underaged, and that one of the items missing is a 30-rack of Keystone. That's the only way they'll bother to look for the rest of your shit.
The fact they were arrested could mean they gave the police a hard time or that there are circumstances besides the drinking. It does seem harsh if this happened at a private party and nothing else occurred.
Edit: Here is the ESPN version of events (apparently they were called because there was a fight):
All 43 people were giving the police a hard time. Sounds like the cops there are just douches.
While drinking isn't uncommon in colleges, underage drinking is still illegal.
Just as Michigan violated rules that most colleges violate, Michigan got caught by the NCAA police and is being penalized. Because of this, people still like to say we are "cheaters". So, I guess we can say since these ND players were caught and arrested, we can call them "criminals"? I'll go for that....
A friend of mine is banned for life from Notre Dame's campus for drinking underage. I'm assuming this is a hard and fast rule and that these players will also be banned. If not, I will be incensed. Incensed!