It's weird to say, but I'm happy he's gone. From his antics off the field, to on it. He was an excellent football player but just a head case.
Lewan's ex says he did in fact punch OSU fan
Whatever happened, I hope Taylor learned a lesson after a childish dispute and grows from it.
I don't think I remember a Michigan player whose impact was harder to judge than Lewan's. After he got his penalty problem in check, he was a terrific LT but on some horrific lines. Parts of his personality were endearing and awesome. Other parts were maddening and (probably) destructive.
I honestly have no idea how last season would have differed if Lewan had entered the 2013 draft. With almost every other player I can make an educated guess, but I think it's really hard to say with him.
Yeah... my opinion of him did a 180 after the MSU game. \
Me too. When I saw him give that guy the Gholston Special I couldn't wait for the guy to stop wearing the uniform.
He was a typically college kid IME, except he was a huge man who constantly had the focus on him. He seems like a bit of a jerk in some respects, but there have been far worse people on the football team in the past, and there will be more in the future. All of this retconning about his behavior drives me crazy.
He seemed like the quirky, funny kid we all thought he was.
The OSU fan thing doesn't bug me too much. The OSU fan was getting into a fight with Lewan's little brother, and Lewan did what big brothers do in that situation. (The OSU fan made a big miscalculation.) Frankly the whole legal part of it is a waste of time and taxpayer money. I am assuming the butt hurt OSU fan is pressing the case though just to keep on being a pain in the ass.
The MSU thing was over the line, but nothing like the head twisting of Denard two years before. It looked like he thought about it and decided not to do it, or he purposefully did it in a threatening but non-harmful way. Either way after all the outrage about what happened to Denard, Lewan should not have given MSU fans a counter claim like that.
Who knows on the Gibbons thing. I imagine he was again defending a friend, and in his youth said something that sounded threatening (or came across threatening because of his size), when he was really arguing his friend's side of the story. Sensitivities being what they were given the nature of the situation, that was heard and interpreted as a threat, which when re-communicated to the victim made it seem even more threatening. Of course all that is conjecture, and the police properly took it serious enough to talk to Lewan and straighten him out.
So yeah, his legacy is a bit of good and bad. We could all be black and white holier than thou and proclaim him a Richie Incognito type, but then, a lot of 18 - 22 year old young men say and do stupid things on the road to maturity. They just aren't scary big 6'-8" 308 lbs young men.
First off, the intervening in a fight was Lewan's story, and Lewan also said he may have pushed someone. At least part of that now seems like a complete lie, as it appears that he threw a punch and came away thinking he knocked the guy out. Resolving that is not a waste of time and money.
He also has repeatedly said that he didn't say those things to Gibbons' acuser, so if you think he was defending a friend, you also think he is lying about that too.
Lastly, IMO, you are looking at the way he behaved in the MSU game through some blue shaded glasses. It was completely unacceptable and has nothing to with Gholston's helmet tug. And to denounce it because it gives MSU fans ammo is kinda sad.
where you say something, and by the time it is two people down the line it is totally different. I think Lewan said something similar to what was reported int he Gibbons case in an argumentative tone. The aperature of Lewan was his friend thought he had consent in a druken hookup with the victim and was in very big trouble, and Lewan was arguing that point of view. The aperature of the recipient was her friend felt she did not give consent and was raped and so the recipient heard (and saw) Lewan in a threatening manner. This discussion took part at a party, so just like the initial event noise and alcohol induced haze further clouds the recollection of words and intent not to mention the choice of words to start with.
So no. I don't think he's lying.
I watched the video that some MSU fan put up and he never twisted anyones facemask. He may have grabbed some people's facemasks on the ground but they were never in danger of being injured unlike Denard's neck. I know the guy and he seems like a good guy.
Oh yeah, his antics on the field were just awful. Two time All-American LT? Ehhh... Michigan Men are better than that. hahaha
wanting to say something like this on the board for a while but I was afraid I would be sent to Bolivia. I mean, I love all players who represent the Maze and Blue but he always irked me... on and off the field. OSU fan probably deserved it but some of his on the field antics were ridiculous.
I remember last year, cant remembr the game, but our O-Line was obvoulsy struggling and he was just laying into the young guys....not sure thats the right approach for kids right out of high school. Anyway, happy that he got drafted early and all that he gave for Michigan but I am also glad that time has passed.
I remember reading he was dating Dileo's sister
And I really had little to no doubt that he punched that OSU fan. Did anyone?
for this but I really could not care less that some asshole osu fan got jacked. By anybody. That does not make me a model American or proud of myself but that's just the way I feel. And yes, I think Lewan was a pretty big douche nozzle.
"Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it."
Hey Taylor: oops.
Taylor should've made sure they didn't break up until AFTER the case was settled, because everyone knows that there is nothing worse than a bitter Ex...even if the Ex is Dileo's sister...and even if she is telling the truth.
Something something woman scorned something something.
The scorned woman is way worse than a large sized, immature man not controlling himself....that's the real story...the scorned ex.
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
Hartford? The whale? They beat Vancouver once, maybe twice a lifetime.
But why assume she is scorned, and why assume she's making it up? I don't think anyone would be shocked if it is true. I think at the time we all hoped he didn't do it because he was our twosie riding, charismatic senior leader. Now, we might tend to believe he did not show self control that is expected from one of the faces of the program.
I think it is interesting that someone thinks she was the one "scorns." Truth is this Jackass Lewan was questioned by the A2 police no less than four occasions, which including him helping his tootsie buddy Chris Brown trash the hockey player's ex-girlfriend's apartment and intimidating a sexual assault victim. If you want to talk about scorned, talk about Lewan. I will never consider him a "Michigan Man" and I hope we forget about him as fast as we have his kicker friend.
Second time you have mentioned this thing with Chris Brown and Lewan, but I see nothing anywhere on google.
What's the story? Any links?
I actually think she is telling the truth about what happened. My comment was made in jest, not meant to be taken seriously.
At the end of the day, Taylor was supposed to be a leader on the team, and he had a responsibility to be mature and act like a leader, even if it means walking away from some drunk OSU fans talking trash.
And he bragged to his mom about it over breakfast. I guess that's "toughness", right coach?
This is not a young man caught up in the moment. This is a college senior who still has a lot of growing up to do.
It says he told his mom he knocked a guy out. That doesn't mean he was bragging about it.
She didn't report hearing him say "I hit a guy," or "I got in a fight," or "I punched a guy," no, he told her he knocked a guy out, never mind not hearing him apologize or explain himself to his mom. Given his personality, I'd call that bragging.
Well the entire conversation wasn't reported. It doesn't say he said hi to his mom either. How rude, can you believe his lack of manners??
So you are basing this all on a single comment included in a report? I mean, unless a stenographer was in the room with Lewan and his mom during breakfast, I'm guessing that wasn't the only thing he said.
did you have a point? why not brag about it?
There are many times I want to deck an Ohio fan in the face. Well done Taylor.
...difference is your punch is less embarrassing and impactful to The Team. That's a freshman move..not a Senior team leader behavior that should be embraced
And there is a difference between wanting to and actually making contact.
"The Team" el oh el
That's the spirit! Sports are definitely worth throwing punches over!
No offense but he had a hard enough time keeping his head on straight on the field. I can only imagine what he was like drunk.
Now that I'm drinking....it's hard not to want to punch obnoxious OSU fans.
Do it! Do it! Do it!
Do I need to reassess my priorities if the fact that he punched an OSU fan (and an OSU fan on that day) - rather than any other person on earth - makes this a little less troubling to me?
I feel like sports rivalries give people who try not to be prejudiced a weird opportunity to make an exception.
I guess I was wrong when I thought I this incident was behind us.
This horse has been already taken to the glue factory. I know its the offseason, but I prefer ridiclous threads like "title says it all" to rehashing incidents that have previously been the topic of 10 or so threads.
Come on, I mean who hasn't punched a OSU at some point in their life
But I think about it a lot.
and every time I drive in rush hour traffic and see some jackass doing 85 in the far right lane, then almost cause an accident by cutting off a semi, I think about it. Luckily, I know if I do that with my son in the car, the police will haul me away and turn him over to child services, so I calm down pretty quickly. People just drive like morons around here.
I usually just tip them for the pizza and close the door.
Not everybody's the perfect person in the world. I mean everyone kills people, murders people, steals from you, steals from me, whatever.
I recall his freshman year when I remarked to my son, "We have a OT playing with a DT's mentality." Remembering how far too often we'd watch a 20 yd run and be cheering loudly, only to be interruped with the announcement of "Unnecessary roughness, Michigan." Through the years these moments seemed to become far less frequent and he was playing with the necessary mindset of an OLman, "maintain compusure at all times." Whether you like it or not, when you are granted the opportunity to be the leader of any Big Time college OL, which is what the majority of LTs are, you are saddled, regardless of your cultivated nastiness, to not lose your teammates trust, and you sure as hell won't maintain any degree of trust if you are being hit with 15 yarders on a routine basis. ^As stated, I do believe that had sunk in but when you mix alcohol with a loss to a bitter rival, you are being tested to the extreme, a test he failed. Good luck young man, but you will never be the player you should be unless you grow the fuck up.
this should end well.
Lewan - clearly talented, but clearly a really, really bad leader. Hoping for a major bump in intensity/production from this team with new senior leadership. We heard an awful lot about the high character and passion of the players recruited under the Hoke regime....well, some of them are now upperclassmen - time for that to pay off.
Give me passion and leadership over talent any day of the week. Of course, passion, leadership, AND talent are most preferrable. 22 Zack Novaks. That's what I want out of this football team.
Oh yeah, because you can totally judge his leadership ability from the outside looking in...
True leaders lead with their actions. Lewans actions, in the MSU game and in this instance, were pitiful.
you have no idea if he was a good leader or not. all you can do is speculate.
Leading by action is cliché? Do you prefer your leaders to tell you what you should do and see them doing the opposite? Nothing kills morale more than a leader that doesn't play by the same rules he establishes for those that are supposed to look up to him.
I'm not saying that. I'm saying that you're just throwing out cliches, claiming that Lewan didn't do a good job of meeting the standards of these cliches, and then you fail to back your claims up. How do you know Lewan didn't lead by example? Were you in the locker room? You're judging the man based off your own opinion of a few of his "worst" moments. You are also making assumptions that you probably have no business making.
And you know what? Personally, if I were on a football team, and we were playing one of our biggest rivals, and we were getting our asses kicked, and one of our leaders decided that he has had enough and he assulted an opposing player after a play.... I wouldn't really question it. I would be glad to know that my leader isn't gonna lie down and take an ass beating without a fight (literally). Now maybe that says something about the type of person I am, but that's just the way I feel about it.
Leading by action is cliché? Do you prefer your leaders to tell you what you should do and see them doing the opposite? Nothing kills morale more than a leader that doesn't play by the same rules he establishes for those that are supposed to look up to him.
What did he do in the MSU game? All I remember was us getting throttled.
Did a 2012 Tom Gholston impression.
He never punched anyone or grabbed anyone's neck. I'm not sure what you're talking about.
Classless play. Was it the exact same as Gholston, no, but equally as unsportsmanlike.
If your talking about the facemask against #9 on MSU then you would hate 90% of O-Linemen.
If thats the stuff you're taking issue with then you don't know how football works. That is par for the course. It just happened to be caught on camera and got attention. That happens on every play. Thats football.
No it does not. If you are a Michigan lineman, you have enough body control to not grab someone's facemask. If you grab it unintentionally, you are not good. If you grab it intentionally, you are an idiot/lack control.
Oh so Michigan™ linemen are just that special? What are you talking about? Watch any NFL game...O-Linemen are grabbing, twisting, pulling faskmasks all game. And it is certainly intentional. Wake up. It is a physical game and the pnly lineman that we had that was actually physical gets ostracized after the season because we need an excuse for how crappy our team was. This is comical. This off-season has shown me why the rest world hates Michigan fans. Some of you people on this board are so ridiculous.
Forgive me, I didn't fully consider the physical nature of collegiate line play.
"So apparently Lewan dated Drew Dileo's sister"
Even if we missed she would look damn good.
Creepiest comment ever?
You must live a pretty sheltered life there in Wichita. You should get out a little more often.
Damn, she looks a lot like her brother. I mean, you know, better, but enough like him that for the first time I'm wondering whether I have a "looks too much like Drew Dileo for me" criterion. Thinking that I don't.
Threat. Right there.
I would put him on my NFL team any day. I'd rather have that, than a guy that has drug problems or is known to own a gun. He plays football, its a violent sport, and lets be honest, he did what we all want to do. Maybe should have controlled it better, well he definitely should have. But I think he'll be just fine, he's not the worst person in the world, let's not all act like we are better than him.
is a problem even if he has permit and doesn't use it for dumb reason?!? wow
Because obviously the OP was taking a stand against the 2nd amendment...
I meant own a gun without proper permits and such (i.e. Plaxico). I'm all for owning a gun, I more or less meant getting in trouble with one.
I think last year's team had major team chemistry problems and I have no doubt he had a lot to do with it.
Those are quite the assumptions youre making there....
Yeah? Care to provide any evidence to back that claim? Other than your own specualtion? haha
He's an Ohio fan and deserved it.
Exactly. Most everyone, justice system included, seems to be ignoring that very important detail.
Taylor's size and had the same opportunity to tune up a fuckeye.........
How can anyone here say that Lewan punching an Ohio fan is a good thing? Taylor Lewan is an unusually large person who has been in a D1 S&C program for the past 4 years, he could easily kill someone by punching him in the head, especially on a concrete sidewalk with alcohol involved. There is nothing at all good about this, assuming it's true. Taylor and his accuser are both pretty lucky this didn't turn out a lot worse than it did.
I think you're missing a healthy heap of sarcasm.
you have a stick so far up your ass....
if Taylor was provoked or not, if he lied or not, if Dileo's sister lied or not, if Taylor is a good guy or a jerk, or whether the team would have been better if he had gone pro a year ago because of "chemistry" issues. What I do know from years of representing the media is that stories get sensationalized with distressing frequency, that news reports in even the best media publications are sometimes sloppy and are almost always written based on the POV of the reporter, that police have major biases too, and that you never really know for sure what happened in most cases, but that you have a much higher level of confidence in the truth after a trial where people are subjected to cross examination. So I am inclined to wait before reaching any judgment about Taylor's actions in this matter.
That young man has some serious issues.
I met him in person, and granted in a public context where he'd be on good behavior, but I can't square the Talor-is-nothing-but-a-no-good-thug-with-serious-issues judgement with the person I met, have seen in the press, and who Brady Hoke talks about like a proud father.
We expect these guys to be trained up to do battle and put them on a pedastal, and then shit on them when the job slips out in stressful public circumstances. The fact that he shoved the guy (which is effectively what linemen do to protect the quarterback), and the guy felt hurt enough to go to the hospital - should not surpise anyone.
Then there is this: you were shoved to the ground by a future 1st round draft pick. Is this an opportunity?
I am not blinded. I don't see Lewan as the perfect shining knight in armour everyone expects a Michigan Man to be (which is mostly unrealistic). I am not even on the fence, I think Taylor Lewan is generally the good guy we thought he was, who has made some youthful mistakes.
This was a minor bar fight - not a Philip Nelson situation. End of story.
Ignoring that we have NO IDEA, if your assertion about what actually occurred, is in fact what actually occurred...His conduct in the aftermath of the Gibbons fiasco should have just about sealed the deal for most reasonable parties, imo.
Maybe I am naive, but I met the guy, and my impression of him doesn't square with Mr. Hyde, so I give him the benefit of the doubt.
I understand your opinion, have considered it since the Gibbons thing is disturbing. Your opinion is equally as reasonable though.
Pull yourself together, boy! Easy boy. If they were really shooting at us, we'd be dead by now.
Taylor's regrettable actions aside, I'm amused by how many people are engaging in wishful thinking about the offensive line last year, as in "Well, Taylor was probably a lousy leader and that's why they couldn't block anyone."
I haven't seen anything that obvious, but the feeling seems to be common.
Aside, here's Drew's sister on the WWW: http://gamedaygrits.wordpress.com/
I may be in the minority but I'm glad he's moved on.
it doesn't much matter, given that it's straight-up hearsay and not admissable evidence in court (that is, Lewan's purported statement on the phone to his mother).
On the public opinion side, admissable and not good. Ex or no ex, she's probably recalling it accurately. It's not hard to imagine a drunk OSU fan wanting to prove his toughness by starting an altercation with a Michigan player, and it's not hard to imagine Lewan (a) not being able to control himself, especially after the high emotion of the bitter loss (b) knocking a dude out and (c) bragging about (b) to his mom over the phone in the presence of his girlfriend.
If so, it's an Admission by a Party Opponent, and her (Dileo's) testimony of what she heard is therefore admissible.
Statement against interest.
Absolutely agree, though one should acknowledge that the court must also determine the veracity of the speaker and weigh the merits of that statement. Also, if her statement is that Lewan said he told his mom he knocked a guy out and that is not in dispute by Lewan (I've not read the report, so I'm not sure if that is the case), I'm not sure what is in dispute here. But again, I'd like to see this report at some point.
I could care less if he punched the dude , especially if he was provoked. DB buckeye fans that talk crap and act a fool need punched. People get punched everyday, deal with it sissy.
The Politically Correct crowd on here is unreal. Even one post saying "he could have killed him", give me a break. There are probably 1,000,000 drunk fights a year on college campuses.
Oh btw it was probably an obnoxious douchey OSU fan. If anything I like Lewan better after this. He could play for me any day.
Have said better myself
Phillip Nelson says hello.
so punching a guy during an altercation = kicking an already unconscience guy in the head?
When the puncher is drunk, angry and a dude like Lewan the risk of serious problems or escalation isn't exactly remote.
Well my advice would be to not start shit with a giant drunk guy. Problem solved.
I think you've been watching too much TV.
In the 4.5 years I spent at Michigan, I saw exactly 1 guy get punched in the head. It happened at a rec center during a basketball game and it let to a police report being filed and the puncher being banned from the rec facility.
Do drunk guys get into scuffles at parties probably pretty much every weekend? Sure. Are there guys getting cold-cocked knocked out all the time from uppercuts to the face? I don't think so. A punch to the head that knocks someout out like that could be considered assault, and laughing it away as "boys will be boys" is IMO rather severly understating the severity of the situation.
I realize that AA isn't exactly a large city, but i doubt you could be everywhere at once in your 4.5 years at Michigan.
that I was everywhere. I said the idea that guys knocking other guys out in massive drunken fights in college wasn't some kind of weekly occurrance. Writing this off as "boys will be boys" is kind of lame, especially for a guy who was a co-captain of the Michigan football team.
I can remember watching, and taking part in, a series of fights outside of a house on S. State (it was awesome)...
I don't remember too many random fights but they did happen.
Now, if you want to talk about trips to Ypsilanti, then you can talk about a lot of freaking fights...
I saw more than 1 fight. I said I only saw 1 fight where a guy just cold-cocked someone else in the head. And that one ended up with the police involved and the guy kicked out of the rec centers probably permanently. The rest were really more scrums than fights. i'm sure scrums are pretty common. I don't think guys getting knocked out are.
I also doubt that the Ohio fan was just an innocent bystander. My guess is that he was taunting Lewan and doing what Ohio fans do. You're telling me that there was only 1 Ohio fan at the bar out of all the Ohio fans that were at that game. If that was the case then he was asking for it.
What did he do on the field that was bad?
He was a two time All-American....I guess people are just upset that The Team sucks and they feel the need to make excuses. The guy was an awesome player, went in the 1st round of the draft, was by all accounts a great team leader, and a likeable guy (unless you are an OSU fan or a MSU Spartan D-Lineman).
And where did you hear he was a great team leader? Prettt sure you're just making that up.
his head coach?
“There’s no question,” Hoke said. “With Taylor, he was a great leader for us, came back for a fifth year where he really didn’t need to do that. Would have been, maybe, the first pick a year ago in the draft. But wanted to come back, help a young offensive line develop and wanted to win a championship at Michigan. Guys make mistakes sometime during their career, but the one thing about Taylor off the field: He was great, as far as we were concerned, in how he handled himself.”
I'll take Lewan's leadership over your dumb *** any time.
And again, any evidence to back this claim? You have no actual evidence other than your opinion. You probably say he was "the worst captain ever" because our team wasn't good and you are looking for an excuse.
I said he was an awesome player (backed by the All-American performances he displayed), he was a first round pick (he was), and that by all accounts he has great character and was a leader (backed by his head coach multiple times http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/index.ssf/2014/05/brady_hoke_defends_tay... // http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/index.ssf/2014/05/brady_hoke_defends_taylor_lewa_1.html )
You could say he was a big baby, but personally, I'd rather have a captain who gets pissed and assults someone during a loss than a captain who doesn't seem to care.
And I'm not sure what you mean by smoke.
Honest question - has anyone read this police report here? I've not been able to find a copy, and based on what I could gather from the AP report it's basically Taylor Lewan telling his mother at brunch that he knocked a guy out (which he's seemingly never argued against) and his ex girlfriend apparently saying he's lying because she either saw (or was told that) Lewan knocked the guy down and punched him instead of breaking up a fight? To me, and again I don't have the report in front of me, but this reads like a difference of interpretation. Taylor Lewan is a huge guy, and him breaking up a fight/altercation with a drunk OSU fan is going to look quite a bit different than if little 170lb me tries to break up a fight. He may very well have broke up a fight; that might have just looked like a beating if he pushed down a guy significantly smaller than him.
Again, I'm not defending Lewan - he seems like a hothead, and there's enough smoke around him that he's earned the well-deserved reputation for being a bit of a jerk. That said, people are acting like a 22-year-old kid getting into a fight is some atypical event, and that football players should be held to a higher standard despite ample evidence that stuff like this happens all the time and the only reason we don't hear about it is that most times the police don't get involved. I want to see this report for myself and see how the court determines its authenticity; let's all remember that there are official court documents alleging Manziel tried to have a threesome with a woman and Dr. Drew after sending her pictures of his junk in a hot dog bun. Just because someone said it doesn't mean it is the truth.
Oh well. I'm glad he's gone, but at the same time I can't say I care too much about this incident. Considering the way Ohio State fans treat visitors, I hope it hurt like hell.
well that's that.. someone said that he did it. he punched someone. we better get started on removing anything to do with taylor lewan from the university's history, and ban him from assosiating with UM Athletics. quick before the protests start, and the NCAA puts a 5 year bowl ban on the program.
Treated in Ohio and considering they come up here and act like inbreds and think its ok .... Good for Lewan. Retribution for all the Ohio acts that get swept under the rug by their "police" and local government.
I've punched my clown lots of timess.
Oh not what we're talkiing about.
There are two points to consider. Until now Lewan was not worth suing, at this point one must consider the OSU fan may have a strong financial motive to pursue this as far as possible.
The op presents this as "she now says". Has his former girlfriend changed her statements to the police? I find it odd that she expressed concern that people would "feel she was lying" and her characterization that "she knows what happened and Taylor is lying".
If this goes to trial evidence will be presented and tested and we'll have a better understanding of what happened and will be in a better position to make an informed judgement. Until then this is all just emotion driven speculation and I for one will grant Lewan the presumption of innocence until guilt is proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
I'll wait until the real facts come out, not what some jaded ex-girlfriend has to say. Sick some of you are trashing one of our own.
I've found that pissed off ex girlfriends are the most reliable people in the world!
Good luck and grow up Taylor.
Only on mgoblog is one guilty before being proven innocent.
Have you not visited any other site on the internet ever? Or watched Nancy Grace?
It's really really hard NOT to punch an Ohio fan, few people have that kind of restraint.
None of us know what happened. Its possible the fan deserved it and I'd be happy that it occurred, it's possible it was completely inappropriate and i'd be disgusted with his action. Just like none of us know exactly what he said with respect to the rape case, could have been completely benign, could have been in poor taste, could have been terribly threatening. It seems kinda silly to be debating and forming strong opinions on things we'll never have enough details about.
dude protected by "The Fort" that lets you down in the end.