Law School Looking Like Great Option for Seniors With No Other Options
http://www.everythreeweekly.com/law-school-looking-like-great-option-fo…
Really funny article for the Class of 2015. I was in a similar spot after graduation a few years ago, and luckily managed to break away from Law School after only a year(and minimal debt). Now have a successful career.
There is obviously a portion who it makes sense for. But still when you have a Supreme Court Justice saying the nation's brightest and best would be better off going to Medical or Business school, there's a problem.
March 25th, 2015 at 10:37 AM ^
I was in the class of '11. At our bar admissions ceremony, the chief justice of the Ohio Supreme Court spent half her speech listing all the things we could do with a law degree even if we never worked as an attorney. It was one of the most depressing moments of my legal career.
March 24th, 2015 at 10:10 PM ^
i bounced my way through all 3 years, along with clerking. who is 'prohibiting' that, and how on earth could they possibly enforce it?
secondly, the financials have changed dramatically since i went to school (our 'papers' were chiseled into stone tablets) but really nobody cares where you went to school after your first job. if you really want to be a lawyer then hustle for a job, get to know people, develop a personality and some enthusiasm and you'd be surprised what might come your way. but i do agree with the philosophy of not going b/c you don't have other options. go if you want to - then proceed with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind.
March 24th, 2015 at 10:33 PM ^
not just for lawyers, but for any field of endeavor. Hustle, contacts, networking, and low-level experience in a chosen field is a start, then work your way up with enthusiasm unknown to mankind. It's not the easy way, but it works.
DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT perform a Google image search of the words "POV" and "conflated". You will end up getting some very suspicious looks from those in the tech department and it could cost you your job.
Quote of the Day....
“It’s challenging, sounds nice at cocktail parties, and a great match for the hazy, loosely-defined credentials I’ve gained with my cultural studies degree.”
We can all turn off our computers and smart phones now.
I came here to downvote you and tell you how law school is a bad decision for the majority of students considering it. I'm glad I didn't have to do that.
March 24th, 2015 at 10:45 PM ^
March 24th, 2015 at 11:08 PM ^
live in CA, provided it is a full ride.
But the job prospects are still pretty mediocre. Only about 50% of grads get full time, long term jobs that require a JD. Only 13% get the high paying, prestigious gigs popularly associated with lawyering. 20% of the class is straight up unemployed 9 months after graduating.
March 24th, 2015 at 11:55 PM ^
March 25th, 2015 at 12:01 AM ^
State and local budgets are stretched extremely thin. And a lot of people want to be ADAs or public defenders. Don't expect those jobs to be available. I had my first kid five years after graduating, and I still worry about money for her. That's despite getting a law firm job that paid well right out of law school. Also, the older you get, the less marketable you become. So even if you get that firm job, they push you out after some number of years if you don't make partner. And very few do. So then what?
March 25th, 2015 at 12:06 AM ^
March 25th, 2015 at 10:28 AM ^
If you get out with no debt, I have no problem with someone going to law school even if they aren't sure they want to be a lawyer. Your only sacrifice is time, really. Frankly, I found law school to be quite enjoyable.
I steer people away from law school who would be taking out loans and don't know exactly what they want to do. There just aren't the jobs out there to support it, and a many people who graduate end up with no job in law, or a low-paying one, and have crushing non-dischargeable debt that they can't pay back. Even those who do get a BigLaw job that allows them to pay down those loans can feel trapped in that job longer than they'd want because they need that higher salary to pay the loans.
March 25th, 2015 at 10:45 AM ^
Accelerated law school programs are a horrible idea if you actually want to practice law. My understanding is that you take classes year round, meaning you can't really clerk or intern anywhere, so you graduate with no practical skills and no contacts.
As far as career stats, for recent classes, roughly 44% of law school grads actually get a permanent job that requires bar admission within nine months of graduating. That includes people doing document review, which is like the Wal-Mart of law jobs. If you have a degree in hard sciences or something and want to do patent law, go for it. Otherwise, I'd urge you to seriously consider it and read some of the law school scam blogs.
Thank god this isn't for real. My wife and I are the better part of a decade out and are still paying an extra monthly rent in law school debt payments. It affects every decision we make, and it wasn't worth it. And we were among those lucky few to get immediately employed in jobs that paid well enough. Stay far away from this scam, young Wolverines.
Michigan is worth it with scholarship money, but no law school is worth sticker price except maybe HYS.
Though I'd remove the "maybe" tag for HYS. They really do set you up for success regardless of if you want to be a lawyer (and of course almost guaranteed success, monetarily, if you choose to take the legal path).
I think the expected return on investment is still pretty good for all of the top 14 schools, even if you're paying sticker. The problem is that many people don't enjoy the jobs that pay the big salaries, but that's not exactly a new problem.
The problem is so-called "law schools" don't teach students how to practice law. Call them "Writing and Analysis Schools," and I wouldn't call them a scam. With a more accurate name, I probably wouldn't have been suckered by the word "law" and my top 20 school's inflated job and grad income stats into paying well more than $100K to become a better writer.
Sometimes I think this is a bit of an inflated criticism. What, specifically, is the "how to practice law" that you wanted your law school to teach you?
March 24th, 2015 at 11:55 PM ^
How to write and file a complaint. How to perform discovery. How to depose a witness. Motions to make before, during, and after trial. How to draft a contract. How to facilitate a business transaction, such as a merger or acquisition. I learned none of these things in law school. I learned all of them in my years of working for law firms. I just don't know how people who start solo practices do it.
Most law schools offer courses in the things that you talk about. I don't think there are too many law schools that don't offer a course on contract drafting or discovery. Mine certainly did. As far as drafting a complaint -- the major part of drafting a complaint is composed of the very thing you learn first in law school -- identifying possible legal issues from a set of facts. You want the law school to teach you how to put it into numbered paragraphs and file it with a court? I think most attorneys can figure that out. And your civ pro class probably taught you when you need to move for a directed verdict at trial.
Of course you'll learn more about these things and get better at them as you practice. But the required courses in law school are absolutely necessary things that you need to learn. If you want to learn very practical, hands-on things during 2L and 3L, most law schools allow you to do that.
March 25th, 2015 at 12:10 AM ^
A sincere tip of the hat to the OP for breaking away from law school when the OP realized it wasn't for him/her. When you've got yourself in a law school hole and you realize you don't like it, set down the shovel.
Most of those not suited (for whatever reason) to being lawyers still soldier on, amassing debt, a J.D., and a frustrating career path before finding another calling. Of those poor souls, almost all would be envious of the OP's decision.
It reminds me of Marge Simpson's advice to Homer when he wanted to join the circus as a human cannonball - "Just because you can do something doesn't mean you have to do it!"
(Homer's response was for the ages - "You know, Marge, in a lot of ways you and I are very different people".)
Law school is something that requires a lot of research before going into it. It amazes me that some of my classmates are going to regional schools at sticker price thinking they're going to make 150k+ at graduation and the massive loans will be worth it. The number of people that make that amount out of law school is minimal (especially from a regional school) and the jobs that do pay that amount can be brutal. I plan on going to law school, but not without substantial scholarship money. If I can't get the money, I'll choose another profession.
The chances of being a lawyer who can pay his/her bills while still having a fulfilling professional life are very low.
...I agree for the most part. I went to Ross for MBA and it was the best decision of my professional life. Many JDs came over to Ross because they figured out the shit of having a career in law.
The only negative is that Ross (like most top MBA programs) don't really accept students right out of undergrad. Gotta get about 5 years of good experience.
I received my law degree from Michigan and have been practicing litigation for 7+ years. I was able to make great money right out of law school, but the money could never make up for the lifestyle and the frustrations of the practice of law.
I will shortly be giving up my license and pursuing non-law interests, and I don't think that I am going to miss it one bit. There is a reason why lawyers have very high rates of alcoholism, substance abuse and suicide. It is not a career that is for everybody. Even those that may have great "legal minds" are often driven out by the realities of the practice. I wish new lawyers lots of luck, but many of them will be out of the practice within 5 years and their debt loads will follow them for much longer.
Anyone get an mba after practicing law for a few years?
you practicing in columbus and all. litigation can be tough but you went to outpost-hell hole. maybe if you got away from mouth breathers it would be better?
March 25th, 2015 at 12:19 AM ^
Law school has been a default for college graduates since I graduated in 1994, and probably before then. Knowing what I know now, the majority of those that chose law school by default regret their decision.
Any feedback from those, in that position, that attended one of H/Y/S?
but what does H / Y / S refer to?
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
Harvard/Yale/Stanford.
Change the Y to a W and it's the business school top 3 (Wharton)