Seems Mr. Hayes has dropped us and has probably burned his bridge. Maybe he is just afaird of competition with Dee Hart (Sam Webb has a strong gut feeling).
Justice Hayes calls us a "sinking ship"
Blah blah blerg not a MICHIGAN MAN grumble grumble rumble.
I don't care Dee Hart owns him
The jerk store just called....
JUSTICE HAYES BACK!!!!!!!
His jerk level is too high for them to legally carry, so they are discontinuing him.
...and my first thought was, "Okay, which opponents' coach is feeding him those negative recruiting lines?" There is simply no way he could've gotten "sinking ship" and "unstable" from visiting here and talking to players.
- We're 8-16 in two seasons
- Large portions of the fanbase are calling for Rodriguez's head
- We're about to have our sanctions for NCAA rules violations announced
You think he couldn't have come up with "unstable" on his own?
- Justice Hayes likes Michigan.
- JH names Michigan in his top six.
- JH has nothing but positive things to say about "hotseat" coach and no words about violations.
- JH visits other schools.
- JH says M is "unstable" and a "sinking ship."
Sure, he could have come up with those words on his own. I just don't think he did. And I especially don't think he came to the conclusion without influence from negative recruiting.
What do you think happened? Or are you once again just waiting to respond to others' opinions and not offer any of your own ideas?
EDIT: I guess maybe he didn't come up with it on his own: http://mgoblog.com/mgoboard/justice-hayes-not-trashing-um
How did you miss what my opinion is? I think the kid looked at our situation and thought it to be unstable. It's pretty elegantly simple.
Is now when you threaten to beat me up again?
Negged for breaking 10k points.
What movie is this from?
EDIT: Hahaha, really? This is neg-worthy?
Hopefully the board can forgive me for not having seen every movie ever made...
It's one of the most quotable movies in the world.
"I'm your Huckleberry. Why, Johnny Ringo, it looks like somebody just walked over your grave."
I won't neg you for not watching "every movie ever made" but this is a classic. May I suggest you quickly check out Tombstone and get caught up on the gazzillion quotes that the movie has produced over the years.
Thank you. That's why I asked... I wanted to check it out and now that I know what movie it is, I will.
does that make RR the leader of the Cowboys?
I guess that could be interpreted as a modern-day sash.
Yet, I think he will have a better end than Curly Bill.
Doc Holliday: "Oh
Johnny Justice, I apologize; I forgot you were there. You may go now."
Justice Hayes should educate himself before making unfounded remarks
visits. There, you will find the negative recruiter. Seriously, it sounds like he parroted word-for-word what some shady coach told him re: Michigan's future.
I don't think that 17-year old kids use the phrase "sinking ship" very often.
RR: "Hello, Justice?"
RR: "I've learned not to believe everything you read in the papers, so let me ask you. Did you say that UM is a sinking ship?"
JH: "Yes, sir. But I'd still like to ......
RR: "Good luck on your football future."
I'd guess that things went the other way around:
JH: Hey Coach! It's me, Justice! I hadn't heard from you in a little while, and I was getting a little worried.
RR: Oh yeah. It's uh . . . good to hear from you.
JH: So Coach, do I still have that scholarship waiting for me?
RR: Well, right now I can't make you any promises. We're waiting on another player's decision right now. If things don't work out, we'll call you.
[End of conversation]
JH:(talking to a reporter) SINKING SHIP! SINKING SHIP!
He's entitled to that opinion, however will think back on that in about three years when Rich Rod is running roughshod over whatever Big Ten school he chooses.
Sinking ship? Doesn't he know we burn our boats?
getting talked into burning couches instead......
I was once pissed in high school when a girl stopped talking to me. I even said things that weren't true.
At least we aren't an airliner that's just ingested some volcanic ash into its engines!
I think that phrase is about to take off.
Cool your jets.
such a drag.
someone will come along and lift everyones' spirit.
I feel as if I am falling into an emotional tailspin.
Come for the football, stay for the puns.
You could try a good, ol'fashioned corkscrew
I could wing it for hours.
This thread has quickly taken a nosedive
No worries, it'll take care of itself.
It must take a lot for a kid that grew up loving Michigan and publicy said he would have committed had the season gone better.. oh wait, there's that guy in EL. Peace Justice.
He did some scout interviews on May 12 and April 21 and had some pretty good things to say about Michigan. I wonder if he said that because the coaches have moved on and he's a little salty about it, or if someone *cough* MSU, has been in his ear about UofM
If it were negative recruiting as you seem to believe, why would it just start now, asopposed to months ago? Wins takes away the "sinking ship".
someone knows when he doesn't have the goods to win a job with Michigan....
He can come to Michigan and risk having a dismal 5-7 season or go to Northwestern and have an expected 5-7 season. I guess it's all up to him.
Maybe Mr Hayes was fucking around on youtube and happened to see this...
If I'm a high school teen-ger, would I rather go to the school coming off consecutive bowl games, including one on Jan 1 or go to a school that's 8-16 during that time.
Frankly, we look like a sinking ship to the outside world. We'll see more of this until we start winning.
The kid is being somehwat practical. And, he wont be the only recruit to feel this way.
and it's reasonable to think so. But why 1) be a douche and say this and 2) proclaim like (not love) of Michigan and the staff a week earlier?
I'm sure we have over 10 (that's a guess and it's likely more) players who would have given M a more serious look if we had been better last year and were projected to be even this year. It's nothing new.
Because he is a teenager and taking what any recruit says in those boiler plate Q/A's with recruiting reporters at face value is like buying into the accuracy of the assorted political chain mails that get circulated.
Just gotta prove him wrong. Plain and simple.
Ya know, had he said he was interested in going to Ohio State, Penn State, Alabama, Virginia Tech, hell, anywhere that is a consistent performer, but Northwestern?
I'll take my sinking ship of a program over your tiny purple sloop any day.
A tiny purple sloop that played in consecutive New Years Day Bowls. While we went 8-16. He thinks Michigan is down. Is that so unreasonable?
Down does not equal sinking ship. A sinking ship was Syracuse under Robinson. Washington under Ty. A sunk ship is Wazzou. He didn't say down, he said sinking ship.
If Justice wants to make his decision off of two years of football, hey, by all means, go for it. He wouldn't be the first and he won't be the last.
He used a cliched phrase. You're parsing it way too much.
Maybe. If he said, "Hey, the program is down, it'll probably come back, but for now it's not for me," you probably wouldn't have this thread. A thousand players have already said that. But it sounds as if he is taking an intentional shot at the program.
It probably doesn't matter. I agree with Magnus that there are other guys that we should want more than Justice.
He just shotened it to a sinking ship. Sinking ships can also be restored.
We do look like a sinking ship to the outside world, on many fronts.
W's are the 'tussin that will cure those ills.
The more the outside world downgrades Michigan's players and coaches, the more likely it is that they'll all have a gigantic chip on their shoulders by the time UConn rolls into town.
I wouldn't assume Hart is a lock, either, Sam's gut notwithstanding.
What we have here is a failure to communicate. what looks like a sinking ship is actually a nuclear submarine armed with nuclear warheads in the process of submerging and setting it sights on Pasadena.
Almost spit out the beer I was in the middle of drinking!
Now, now , Justice don't be angry because the coaches know Demetrius Hart is better than you. Hopefully we face him sometime in his college career so he can see how supposedly "bad" we are.
what does that make his current top choice, Northwestern? See yo on the field , Justice.
1) Can you blame him for calling us a sinking ship? We went from 11-2 to 9-4 to 3-9 to 5-7.
2) Regardless of what he says about Michigan, be better than calling him a "douche." Seriously. He hasn't even finished his junior year in high school. Just because he doesn't like your favorite school doesn't mean you should call him names.
3) I've been saying this all along, but there are several running backs I'd take over Hayes. He's really not that great. He's probably about the 5th or 6th best player in the state, and we have other, better running backs on our radar. Guys who are better, IMO: Demetrius Hart, Savon Huggins, Andrew Buie, Malcolm Crockett, Mike Bellamy, Mike Blakely.
and Hayes is definitely still an amateur. Thank you for saying this, Magnus
We certainly DO look like a sinking ship and we'll have to prove we can bail ourselves out and weigh anchor.
I like that Mike Bellamy character you mentioned...don't know how interested Michigan is in him, though.
a genious or anything but isn't the point of a sinking ship that it goes deeper or "sinks" as time progresses? Going from 3 wins to 5 seems to be more of an upswing than a down.
He could be a Northwestern Wildcat or a Wisconsin Badger, and I will still confer upon him honorary Little Brother status.
Since we went from 3-9 two years ago to 5-7 last year, doesn't that mean we sunk at one point and are on our way back up to parascope depth so we can start torpedoing the shit out of the Big 10?
All things being equal, you wouldn't ordinarily make a comment such as this unless there's some bitterness brewing or an ulterior motive at play.
Plus, if he heads to a Big 10 school, you can bet the "sinking ship" comment will come back to haunt him BIG TIME.
Trashing teenagers is cool. How would you feel if it were your kid?
it is probably teenagers that are trashing him.
I'd be shocked to know I had a 17 year old son.
but I don't believe in making it a better place for our children's children. Because I don't think children should be having sex."
~ Jack Handey
He is 17. He doesn't want to come here. Some grown up who wants him to go to another school probably said, "don't go to M, they are a sinking ship." He believed it. He immaturely (because, as mentioned, he is 17) repeated it in a text.
I know some very experienced business people and attorneys who put a lot worse things into email. They are not 17. Annoying that he said it, but who cares.
...Hayes, if he would agree to publicly name any rival coaches who told him, "Michigan is a sinking ship."
...but I wouldn't put it past other schools to plant the "sinking ship" seed in his head. I definitely wouldn't be surprised if some school in EL (cough, cough) said something like that to him. I hope he goes to NW; it would be better than seeing MSU benefit from negative recruiting.
"The ship is rising..."
You say this largely because you're a Michigan fan. It's certainly understandable if outsiders consider Michigan's ship to be sinking or, at least, floating aimlessly.
I think he says it from the 3-9 to 5-7 idea, or the whole, having two sophomore QBs instead of two freshmen QBs. Or the OL.
Obvious counterpoint, losing the two best defensive players. Obvious cat is obvious. Point being, you could say we're rising and base it off of some solid non-fan like stuff.
Right. And we're also announcing self-imposed sanctions in a few days while our coach is on the hot seat.
The point? It can be seen both ways.
No reason to get all upset Mr Hayes you will be getting a fine education from North Western. If you think Michigan is a sinking ship get ready for a ride in the HMS Titanic of football your North Western Wilcats. Don't get me wrong NW is a fine program with many national championships and all americans + Big 10 titles and Mike Wilbon right?
Two things stand out here. 1) Deeeeeeee 2) Just win Michigan so we can strike these Mother F'ers out I mean up .... Damn Major League quote popped into my head there.
"North Western"? Really?
Agreed, we just need to win and there are other RB recruits out there. No big deal.
Is it really unreasonable to think, from the outside, that our program is down?
It doesn't excuse a stupid and unneccesary public statement, but if program stability is high on his list among recruiters, he's not insane for favoring NU. Say what you will about the team's history, but Fitzgerald will be there until he's retired or dead.
If I had to lay down money right now, I'd guess Rodriguez will have his team winning this season, competing for championships in 2011, and secured for as long as he wants it by the start of the 2012 season. But then I'm a fan, not a junior trying to make a huge life decision with imperfect and biased information coming at him from a dozen directions. RR is, sadly, on a hotseat this season.
When you add in the depth chart dimension, I can see a good case that NU is a better fit for him: would you rather compete with Shaw, Smith, Cox, Toussaint, Hopkins and (fingers crossed) Hart, or Arby Fields and Scott Concannon? NU's current system has a history of producing big numbers backs (Damien Anderson, Noah Herron, Mike Kafka oh wait) but lacks an obvious star at the moment.
Dumb thing to say out loud, still.
I don't follow recruiting as closely as a lot of you, but I don't recall ever hearing a recruit talk disparagingly about a program publicly. That seems like a strange move - he may regret it, it may have just slipped out - but it would be good for him to learn that stuff like that inevitably comes back and bites you in the ass.
BEST POST OF THREAD. THANKS. GOOD THREAD TOO. SORRY FOR THE CAPS. AND, REMEMBER TO KICK IT OVER... ALOT OF PEOPLE WON'T GET NO JUSTICE TONIGHT.
of this is whether this is the beginning of a trend. You can view Hayes's opinion of UM as an outlier or as a hint of things to come. I would not be surprised if, as time goes by, we start to see the effects of having a losing record on recruiting in a more pronounced way. And losing will continue to have this amplifying, positive feedback effect on recruiting. Which is why RR has to change perceptions this season, why he has to make a statement (not some 7-6 or 6-7 season). If not....well, someone will have a tough decision to make.
Hayes has always been a respectful kid in all of his interviews, and I think he's a really good talent that would fit nicely into our offense.. He's a good runner and an excellent pass catcher... I'd really, really like to have him on our team still, and I still don't think that it's out of the picture... I don't know how much MSU is pushing for him, and if he doesn't choose us, best of luck to him... I'd still really like to have him.... We may think our program is really stable because of the knowledge of our players or our expectations, but he is making a decision that affects the next 5 years of his life.... Hopefully we have a good season, he sees our progress, and he commits.....? Am I that weird to want that?
another man's dilithium powered submarine. Justice will be served.
Can't believe how many good RBs have come out of Grand Blanc. Ingram, Benton and now Hayes. Best of luck to the young man wherever he goes. I don't see him quite at the level of the other two but he will be a fine back.
I guarantee our coaching staff will now stop recruiting him after his comments.
You also guaranteed that Denard would be the starting quarterback last year. It may not be the best idea to throw out more guarantees.
I guarantee diclemag2 will get banned just like the first iteration.
I don't mind this all that much .. kid is ok but that's about it .. i'd rather have D'Hart and save this kids spot for another kid ... we don't need to bring another 4 running backs in again this year we need to stock up in other areas ..
Maybe Justice likes sinking ships after all.
we are patching the holes and repairing our guns.