What is it that ND has that Michigan doesn't have? They seem to offer pretty much the same thing, yet over the past decade it seems that ND is killing it in head to head recruiting, just as OSU has. I know lots of crap surrounding the program the last few years, but it wasn't only those few years where Michigan has been losing more recruiting battles than it wins. Doesn't make me feel too comfortable about Ty Isaac too.
Joshua Garnett update (Not Good)
You sound like you've never visited the beautiful city of South Bend, Indiana.
He's from Columbus. Everything is beautiful compared to that.
Then he hasn't been to South Bend. The biggest news here is that the city will pay over $1 million dollars for property to give to a private Catholic school (What kind of school is ND?) that was contested. Seperation of Church and state kind of stuff. Appraised value of land..$300k. Oh, and the City is broke financially.
South Bend makes Columbus look like Rome. Fine dining in South Bend is Buffalo Wild Wings.
it may be time to bring back the /s tag
I caught a game there a couple years ago. Campus is pretty average for a college in my opinion. Surrounding area is awful. Stadium was a poor man's version of the big house BEFORE the renovations. I honestly don't get why they would have the edge...proximity to Chicago is the best I can come up with.
Seriously, as someone who's been affiliated with both schools, I've been very perplexed by this too. I wonder if maybe there's something behind the scenes that ND is hitting it out of the park with, like academic support.
well, let's start with what it is not...Good Lord, just look at that abomination:
I am affiliated with both schools and have asked this same question, particularly since Jordan Payton seemingly flipped after watching UM beat ND UTL and following it by watching a horrible performance under the lights by ND against Stanford. South Bend is a dump; dilapited homes and violent crime riddle the surrounding area. The sun shines maybe 10 days a year. ND seems to be <20% female and those girls are, on average, less attractive than UM girls (although UM isn't necessarily a hot bed for pie). The only conclusions I can derive are as follows:
1. ND is the only thing within 90 miles. When you are on campus, it feels like the entire world revolves around you and the ND brand. Additionally, there are absolutely no distractions from football. Hockey and bball have performed well recently for them, but no one really cares. These sports actually take a back seat to intramurals and interhall football in the mind of the average student.
2. ND's campus is unique in its layout in that the buildings all follow the same architecture. The new hockey rink is in the same style as the main building built in the 1800s. I have no idea why this appeals to a high school junior other than it creates a sense of seclusion...you are somewhere far, far away and that place is pristine. Contrast to the character of UM's campus, which is a hodgepodge of different architectures across a couple sprawling campuses. It's less initimate, less cohesive. I don't think you love Michigan by walking around campus once, you do it over the years through your experiences.
3. NBC contract has to be a big part of it. Think of a kid from California. His parents can see 7-8 games without even having cable. How many Michigan games are shown in California on cable? Maybe 2?
4. ND sells hope. They have been selling the "return to glory" story for 20 years now. They paint a ficticious picture of "what could be"...high schoolers have great imaginations which aligns well with ND's brand.
Anyway, I don't think any of these things would entice me as football recruit - I'm just trying to make sense out of some of these kids' decisions.
Didn't feel that long when writing it...
Whatevs, I read it and it made good sense. Still puzzling though, given our recent dominance over them, more imminent "Return to Glory," and plush new facilities. Michigan has to have more street cred with guys like Denard, Woodson, and Brady going legend every weekend, too. What player is the face of ND football?
The new Compton Ice Arena is nice. Way better than the former ACC. I miss the old days when you could walk up on game day and buy UM-ND hockey tickets at the gate 10 minutes before faceoff.
you forgot to add Lou Holz to your list.
But seriously, I think your point #3 might be the biggest factor. ND is the only school in the nation that gets national coverage on basically every game. The number of nationally televised games has to be a huge recruiting advantage (and one that Michigan enjoys over the Spartans, btw).
In response to #3 - I have seen EVERY Michigan on TV on California this year and I live in the same city as Payton. That is with the exception of the Purdue game which I saw at the Big House.
Michigan is on TV ALL the time here.
Most recruits' families aren't going to have the Big Ten Network
Nice post- I agree with you, except for #3. I now live in San Diego, and I was able to watch every single Michigan game this year. Between the Disney networks (ABC and ESPN) and the Big Ten Network, which I get through my local cable provider, I was able to watch EVERY game from the comfort of my living room. Though I will say, that before the Big Ten Network, living outside the state of Michigan was VERY frustrating, as I would only be able to catch the few games that aired on ABC and the ESPN channels.
Ah yes, I forgot the NBC contract. I'm sure that's the big one. Best exposure for the pros.
"a hot bed for pie".
I will say U-M has done a good job with their new construction in making things more cohesive, from that mismash of 60's and 70's architecture to the more classic look.
It never shocks me when they get some Catholic kid to commit, but man, I don't know how they get African-American kids from across the country to commit, and be completely surrounded by white faces in class.
If they are, it's negligible. But in most employers' opinions, they are not.
Not during my time on the west coast. Whether it's fair or not, have a degree from UM definitely helped create seperation from other job applicants early in my career. Hell yeah. (I'm referring to ND here, not Stanford, which is a truly outstanding school. Actually, all three are solid.)
to keep recruits from visiting ND after they visit Michigan. This is like the 2000th time this has happened the last few years. Glad Michigan has been going after some other OL (including Alex Kozan) pretty hard lately.
...a comparative analysis of cheerleaders:
Not sure if this is the best route, I'm pretty sure any school south of the Mason-Dixon Line would kill it in recruiting...
That is just because they can offer two over our one.
Dads must be so proud of their daughters, I am not sure if that is sarcastic or not.
Sounds like Garnett just gets "blown away" by whatever his latest visit was as I'm pretty sure I read that he was "blown away" by Michigan as well. The consistent team in there is Stanford, which is where he will probably wind up.
Garnett gives a glowing review of everywhere he visits. Also, FWIW, I asked Justin Hopkins (who Steve Wiltfong got this info from) about two or three months ago whether Michigan had a shot at Banner or Garnett and he told me he would be very surprised if they both didn't stay on the West Coast. Hopkins and Wiltfong don't know any better than we do where these kids are going. They just put out "updates" like this to get more web hits.
You have a head coach whose head turns more colors than Skittles and, my god, you have a somewhat well-known fan and blogger whose obsession with center justification and ellipses is a sad amalgum of the collective emo-whine of their fanbase. How do they spin this positively?
That this kid plays things pretty close to the vest, so it's hard to tell what he is truly thinking.
You're like mgoblog's very own news ticker.
System analyzing has its benefits.
You have been exceptional lately.
Thank you sir.
I thought he loves mags and had a great visit. What is it going to take, we beat them the last 3 years
MSU's recruiting class wouldn't be the wonderful mess it currently is.
True, but I added in there, if you think that we are similar to MSU and the only difference is head to head matchup. Fair enough
Another difference between us and ND: we can still make it to BCS Bowls.
Not by earning it.
Not worth a response.
In your opinion, phork, how does a team "earn" an at-large BCS bowl bid? The way the BCS defines it, you need to finish in the top 14 of the BCS poll and then be chosen by a bowl. By losing only 2 games, we earned out spot in the top 14 (all BCS conference teams with 2 or fewer losses were in the top 14, so there's no bias there) and we were then chosen by the Sugar Bowl because, through our years of success, we have a large national following and devoted fanbase, something certainly earned.
I find it odd that those his top 2. He's always tweeting magnusun and how close those 2 are I almost felt like we had an inside edge. Without reading anything I find it really hard to believe we got jumped by nd.
I take that as a bad sign that he didn't just call it "ohio"
This is the longest announcement ever.
This isn't even his final announcement though. This is his top five. Two hours and we've only found out two of the teams.
he is going to sit in front of the cameras and crochet ski hats in the colors of five schools before putting one on.
That text just says he's favoring two schools after his ND visit. It doesn't say there is any variance from the two b schools he was favoring going into the visit. The art of online recruiting gurus is to try to create smoke with or without fire, and the fact that most recruits speak well of the schools they visit feeds into that.
Why ND honestly? They don't win, ever, their coach is a complete dick, their city blows...I just don't get it. Unless Garnett is dying to underachieve, why ND?
He wants to be a doctor and ND has an excellent pre-med program.
That can't be a reason to choose ND over Michigan or Stanford.
Thats the joke. ND does not have a med program.
Garnett also tweeted this today:
— Joshua Garnett (@IamJoshG) December 15, 2011
I wouldn't count him out based on a visit reaction, especially since he had a similarly glowing review of Michigan. That said, he'll be a tough pull from the West Coast, but we already knew that.
[Edit: No idea why the embedded tweet is so far below the text, and there's no obvious solution in the HTML, so I guess it's just gonna stay that way.]
He's also been tweeting about his bro Ronnie Stanley, who committed to Notre Dame today. And he retweeted the announcement of Stanford guard David DeCastro's All-America status made by Stanford football's official Twitter page, so it's not impossible.
But I agree. Probably staying on the West Coast.
That is unforseen...Would be great to get another Ohio roadgrater for our line, especially one who apparently verbaled to Ohio last week. /S
Isn't Yuri Wright visiting ND this coming weekend?
Yes, with his teammate Elijah Shumate.
Don't worry, he's visiting ND before he comes to UM. Curse avoided. Hopefully.
I think Jordan Diamond stopped his top 5 with Ohio. Which is wrong on two levels. He listed Ohio first, and he apparently can't count to 5.