Josh Furman won the Maryland 4A State Championship. I am hoping one of the incoming freshman can imitate Roh and and start from Day 1. Josh Furman is defintely on the short list at Saftey considering the depth Michigan has there.
Josh Furman Runs 100m in 11.27s
I thought he was an OLB. Or has that changed with the "switch" to the 3-3-5?
He's supposedly in line to play the Bandit position (aka strong safety).
That makes more sense to me. Last I heard he was being recruited as lb, but I haven't paid too much attention to him since signing day-ish. Can't wait to see some of these talented guys on D this year, even if they are just freshmen.
That actually makes little sense to me, because he did nothing but pass-rush and run support in high school. though he's obviously a tremendous athlete, as far as i'm concerned, his coverage skills are completely unproven.
Sorry but I get confused with which safety is which but is that Kovacs position or Gordons?
Kovacs plays "bandit" and T. Gordon plays "spur." The spur position has more deep responsibilities for obvious reasons given the personnel. Marvin Robinson will also compete for bandit, but Furman could probably do both with that speed.
Do you mean Cam Gordon instead of Terrence?
Oh boy, having two Gordon's on defense (and both are basically DB's) is going to be confusing; I can see it already.
Kovacs plays bandit and Gordon plays spur. I don't think the spur has more deep responsibilities. The both play a flat zone usually, but when the defense gets overloaded to one side, the spur stays in the flat, the bandit takes the deep zone, and the weak CB plays man on the lone receiver. At least that is what I saw at the spring game.
I remember them thusly:
Spur starts w/ S like a SAM LB, so it is analogous to Strong Safety (more run support, etc)
Bandit is the other one, so it is analogous to Free Safety (more deep responsibility, etc)
AFAIK, they are both more of a SS in most cases. Essentially we have 2 CB, 1 FS, 2 SS (5 DBs), 3 LB, and 3 DL. Most times the 2CB and FS will play deep thirds while the 2 SS act almost like OLB in zone coverage in the flats. In the rare case that there are 2+ more receivers on one side of the field than the other, the bandit moves to the other deep third (still more of a SS) and the CB will play man on the lone receiver.
I did not see any plays with 4 receivers on one side of the field with either a 5th receiver on the other side or a RB, but I would imagine that both CBs would move to the strong side to play quarters, the Spur stays where he is and the Sam moves closer to the receivers. The FS would then play the other Half and the bandit would play the Weak Flat. That is just a guess though.
In any case, I don't think the bandit is a FS in the manner you are referring to it as, but rather both are SSs.
There's been a lot of speculation that he will play one of the two box safety positions: spur or bandit.
He will need to play as a true freshman. That speed needs to be put to good use, and fast!
being banged up in his final h.s. football game.
Sounds like Josh Furman is healthy.
As much as I want to say this makes him awesome, I will remain skeptical until I see it on the field. Remember guys, he is a freshman and speed =/= production. See Trent, Morgan.
only = production when it comes to avatars, right?
but speed never hurts, so I'm going to go ahead and get excited anyway.
Attitude is important as well. In hearing him speak during an interview on WTKA, it sounds like his head is in the right place. I guess the proof will be on the field though. As others have mentioned, you have to like this kind of speed in a body that is close to LB size. Also, the reality of the depth chart states that he and MRob will be looked at for serious minutes if not starting. Hey, any positive sign is welcome!
The Bengals apparently disagree with your take on Trent, based upon the $1.65 million 4-year contract that they gave him.
Not saying that speed alone gets the job done, but speed + coaching does. In Trent's case, it is likely that the coaching element suffered, not from bad coaches but from the complete change-over in staff and system mid-career.
Speed doesn't mean much if you're doing this:
I know everyone loves to dump on Trent 'round these parts, but...
a) He was coached to bail out. I'm not saying he had great hips, but I think it's funny/sad that so many people on here hate on him for doing what he was coached to do.
b) You can take one photograph from anybody's "highlight" reel (Mike Hart fumbling on the goal line, Chad Henne throwing an INT, Jake Long getting beaten by Vernon Gholston) and pretend that he sucked. This series of pictures has been posted several times, so I guess if it gets posted enough, people just might start believing the bullshit...
If you repeat it has to be true? Especially true if you are saying that it is true because you have repeated it. Truth is worth repeating because if you repeat it then it has to be true.
but what bothered me about Trent was that he played with no heart his senior season. See Illinois game 2008 on the long screen pass TD. Disgusting.
I agree. He only amasses 17.3 cardio his senior year. Well below par.
Guess he shouldn't have been drinking mushroom tea with those MMA wannabes during the offseason.
The post was not meant necessarily as a shot at Trent, but rather as a point that speed =/= production. There is no doubt that Trent was fast as shit, as could be seen when he tracked down Percy Harvin, but his college-level production simply did not meet up with his physical tools. Maybe this was because of the coaching, and maybe because he was lazy; I don't know. What I can say confidently, however, is that Furman's coaching coming right out of high school is probably not on par with anything Trent ever got, so assuming that he will immediately produce because of his speed is a bit problematic.
-debacle" was the reaction to paint him as a really sucky player.
Trent's comments were really, really stupid. He was not a really, really bad player.
He did not win the state championship. He won his school's regional, which is essentially the qualifier for state.
Also, 11.27 is not blazing. I'm not saying he's not fast for a big guy, but, as an example, it wouldn't even qualify you for state in Michigan, which is generally an ok- but-not-great track state. Side note: Delonte Hollowell ran a 10.7 and is seeded 5th going into the state meet next weekend
For his size and position it's great speed.
Not everybody can be made of Dilithium and Dreads.
Just imagine if he grows some dreads in the future? Would cut his 100m time down by at least .5 seconds. Dreads are all powerful.
He does have dreads.
Sadly he does not quite have the Dilithium reserves of certain other dreaded Michigan players.
I've got to agree with you here. I wish I could be more positive as well, but a couple years ago at my high school (only about 200 boys and not a good sports school) we had two people run faster than that. IIRC only one of those 2 is even running in college (a d3 school). I'm not totally familiar with typical safety speeds, but unfortunately anything in the 11s isnt making me excited.
I get what you're saying about your small school, etc. but he's 6'3", 200 lbs., and was recruited to play a LB/S hybrid position. His time isn't blazing, but it's certainly more than adequate for the position he'll be playing.
Look at it this way - he'll be fighting guys like Jordan Kovacs for playing time. I'm not dissing Kovacs here, but he's not exactly a speedster and he's smaller.
I totally understand that point, and its a valid one. I guess all I'm saying is, when I read a time of 11.27 for a 200 lb safety I'm thinking more along the lines of "someone with acceptable measurables for a serious division 1 football team" which is, albeit, an improvement to our current roster, it still does not make me think "wow i cannot wait to see this guy's speed on the field!"
The reality of the situation is that he will still be slower than a very large portion of the non-linemen amongst quality B10 teams (OSU, Wisc, PSU, Iowa, etc.).
The reality of the situation is that he will still be slower than a very large portion of the non-linemen amongst quality B10 teams (OSU, Wisc, PSU, Iowa, etc.).
Eh...I'll agree to disagree. I don't think you can determine this by one timing in the 100m. I also don't know that we have any idea how fast most non-linemen would run in the 100m. So while it's unclear if it's "reality," I'll agree that it's a possibility.
Agree to disagree sounds good. Just to clarify the way I'm making my assumption about how fast most non-linemen would run in the 100m is by roughly looking at general reported times on recruiting sites coming out of HS. While those times generally carry 3 or 4 FAKES out of 5, we also have to remember that other teams are starting juniors and seniors against Michigan (by which point in time many athletes have improved their speed to reduce the fakeness-level initially reported).
The reality is that knowing the time means next to nothing.
Was he running into/down wind?
Was it timed correctly?
Did he slip?
Did he not get his best jump?
Was he sick?
Was it not his day?
Was it his best day ever?
Is he injured?
Was he able to train properly leading up to the event?
The only thing we know is he advanced so at least he was faster than the guys in his region.
Is he in the fastest region in the state?
In certain sports sometimes it is harder getting out of your region than winning states.
You forgot one.
Can we make more excuses to make us feel better?
This might be a really really stupid question, but when you add pads, would that cut into the speed of someone with less strength? In other words, would Furman be able to stay closer to his true speed than someone with a smaller frame? Maybe it's 9am.
I've never played football in pads so I have no clue.
I dont think anybody has ever been able to definitively say one way or the other, mostly because I dont think many athletes run the 100m in pads. You have to remember that a bigger frame = bigger pads so thats not necessarily an easy assumption to make.
To use the only example I've heard on the subject, Jerry Rice (while not considered a speedster) is considered the "best" NFL player to maintain speed while running in pads and he is by no means a large guy by NFL standards. This fact, quarterback play, and his excellent route running are the three most cited reasons for his success despite unimpessive measurables.
Interesting, thanks for the input!
He clocked a 4.37 electronic timed 40 at a combine event and for a LB that is blazing. We don't know know any of the factors concerning the race so it would be hard to judge as he could have been running straight into the wind.
Let's just say Furman is faster then our other options at his position. Though he has said in previous interviews that he would need to work on coverage skills as it is not something he has had to do in HS.
and it might not rank him as a dilithium-emitting ninja... but at his size it's certainly enought to classify him as a "G*ddamn human missile."
For a OLB/Bandit/Spur/whatever the hell he is, I'm just fine with that.
That guy that is seeded #1 is blazing fast. He broke the state record for the 100(I think) at the conference meet. I ran in the sam race as him this year and all I'm going to say is that it was a humbling expereince.
I agree with everyone else on his speed for his size. If he put some bulk and converted to OLB he'd be a beast. Either Safety of OLB he'll help the defense.
on defense. 240 pounds and a 10.3 100m dash (according to Keith Jackson)? Does anyone get more physically talented than that?
Not to nitpick, but I'd have to believe Bo Jackson put up similar numbers, if not better...then again, Bo was, and will always be, one of a kind.
Yeah, I guess that was nitpicking.
I never timed Bo's 100m time. I was too busy running in diagonal slants with him to avoid defenders to get a true read of his straight line speed.
to some of Ty Wheatley's state final track times (1990, 1991)...
I think 11.27 is pretty impressive considering his size and the fact he injured his knee at the end of his football season, but I don't see him as a threat to Usain Bolt, not yet anyway.
I hope to never witness Furman's 100 meter prowess on the football field unless he switches to offense
cuz he deserved it.
i negbanged Elno Lewis
cuz he needs a new group-level food substance.
One poster can't posbang (or negbang). It's a group thing.
... but even as a slightly above average athlete in HS, I was clocked at 10.4 for my anchor leg of the 440 relay back in the day, so I'm not too impressed. (Of course, that was from a running start...)
That said, if he can hit someone at that velocity, it will be fairly devastating for the ball carrier (or receiver).
shouldn't be enough to make one question josh furman's speed. the sub 4.4 times he's run at combines and camps have all been consistent. he might've had an off day, he might just not be good at running the 100, who knows?
Maybe he pulled an Usain Bolt and eased up the last 15 meters pumping his fists.
BTW, Bolt's projected 40 time is somewhere around 4.23.
To those being critical of the 100m time, we have no idea what the weather conditions were. If he ran that into a howling headwind in driving rain, would that change you opinion? Do you know what his best time is this year?
He ran 11.09 a couple of weeks ago:
...to that one. His times from his junior and senior years range from 10.94 - 11.75 (see link). At 6'3", 200+, I'll take it. As was said before, his combine times were consistently around 4.40. Commence to being excited...
I'd say the players named "Gordon" are doing their best to keep up with the Joneses.
with the Robinsons.
blueblueblue because he is obviously insecure and needs support.
potato salad you devil egg eating homo
Homo's don't eat deviled eggs. They are too fattening. And what kind of potato salad? Mustard, Mayonnaise, or Hot German?
salad a la Heidi Klum. I'll take it.
i nonbandged Elno Lewis for his nonsensical reply.
I really dont understand where you get insecure and homo (not that there's anything wrong with that) from my reply above. At least try to make sense.
Yes, speed does not always equal on field success, but it certainly does not hurt. The overwhelming majority of the players that we have coming in this year are fast for their respective positions. While these guys are young, and will experience some frustrating moments as they learn to be fundamentally sound D1 college football players, a year or two down the road, all of this team speed is going to give the teams we play fits of frustration.
I was a sprinter in high school (in Michigan) and I ran in a number of other meets around the midwest. So here's my take, take it FWIW:
I know that Furman is a fast guy, he's proved it many times and places before, so seeing this is basically non-news. But for the guys saying "11.27 is not that fast" are very right, and the ones saying "yeah but it's fast for his size" are very wrong, IMO.
Furman is not that big. He's about 200lbs, which is not bigger than a lot of the elite sprinters he's going up against. Let me use one example: Joe Staley is currently an OT for the 49ers. He ran track for the neighboring HS of mine, so we ran against each other a lot. He was actually recruited (by no one big, he ended up at CMU) to play TE, and was 6'6" and about 230lbs as a senior. He ran a 10.6 100m and a 21.9 200m.
There are probably 80+ kids in Michigan alone who can run a 11.27 100m. That said, I'm not giving it any weight, because a number of things can affect your times on the track, and this could just be one bad time for him. Throw in the fact that he'll never have to run 100 meters, and this bothers me 0%.
No offense, but I do not believe that Joe Staley ran a legit 10.6. I'm not saying that he's slow or that you're a liar. All I'm saying is that if he were timed with more precise timing mechanisms, I bet his time would be slower than a 10.6.
Also, assuming Furman is 6'3", 200 lbs., that still makes him significantly larger than many a high school sprinter. When I was in high school, our top sprinters were about 6' and 165 lbs. At the current school where I work, our best sprinter is about 5'9" and 150 lbs. Those track stars at Cass Tech? They're all 5'9" and 160 or thereabouts.
6'3" and 200 lbs. isn't huge, but I'd venture to say that he's 30-40 lbs. heavier (and a few inches taller) than the vast, vast majority of high school sprinters.
Furman is on the bigger side for sprinters, but he's not that big. A lot of sprinters are RB prospects, many of whom are in the 185-195+ range as seniors in high school. But Furman is fast, but he's not an elite sprinter, so if he had run a 10.7 or 10.8, then he would be fast for his size.
So he's fast for a LB, and probably average for a safety. Nothing that we should get worked up over.
A lot of sprinters are RB prospects, many of whom are in the 185-195+ range as seniors in high school.
I think this would be more accurate if you reversed the two - a lot of RB prospects are sprinters. I would venture a guess that, in the grand scheme of things, very few sprinters are running back prospects. They're mostly safeties or cornerbacks or wide receivers or basketball players or simply kids who just run track.
Fine, man. I agree with you that most HS sprinters aren't 200lbs, but most HS sprinters aren't playing D1 football either. Of the ones that are, it's not uncommon for him to be 200lbs and run around an 11 second 100m.
probably matters more for an LB/S, especially when Kovacs is the incumbent (no offense to Gritty McGrit), so I'll get as worked up over it as I want
I never said that his 40 times aren't fast - you didn't read my above post. I said that I know Furman is fast, but not because of a 11.27 100m time. I was speaking on behalf of that particular time, not the player himself. You can't just ignore that caveat.
Yes 11.27 is not very fast. But the 100 is the shortest race and if the timing is not perfect there can be a significant change in actual times.
im really liking the improved team speed. hopefully in time it means no more HUGE plays given up.