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I fucking love Jalen Rose.
How cool would it be to see Webber their cheering his heart out while Michigan wins a championship and erase the nightmare that happened 20 years ago? That would be an all-tiime greatest sports moment IMO.
After listening to Jalen discuss how it's his belief that Webber wants to disassociate himself with his college career, I don't really think it would be that cool. And I don't think it would be a great sports moment, it would remind me of the reception Tressel got last season. I'm not saying to hate Webber because I don't, but I don't like how he's handled any of this.
He ought to have more of a part in reconciliation than showing up at a moment arguably long delayed in a large part because of him.
While that's true, now is as good a time as ever to change how he is handling it.
Tomorrow is as good as any.
And also, the anti-Chris Webber revisionist history has always bugged me. Michigan was down two in the final seconds when the Time Out heppened. Their win probability had to be pretty low in that situation, before the mistake. It's not like he cost Michigan that championship. We were probably going to lose anyway.
It's also not like Webber was the only one who took things. Nearly a decade of wins were wiped out -- C-Webb only was at Michigan for two years. It's frankly lucky that the '89 championship wasn't taken away as well.
The kid was in high school, maybe middle school, when Martin started giving him money. And he's been vilified for 15 years for it. It's time for us to let it go, and for him to let it go. I would hope he's there tomorrow, since it's not the Fab Five without him.
Steve Fisher can stay far away tho. Adults should know better.
I'd love to see Webber: after a mea culpa and an apology.
This comment was for my original post. I wasn't correcting the person who responded to my comment; this isn't "trolling".
Rice, Robinson, Higgins, Vaught, And Mills have a get-together instead.
Would love to see it, but I'm not sure Robinson can have that many visitors in a week, yet alone a day.
Robinson would have to space his visitors out a bit.. and get them on a preauthorization list
I think there's a misconception out there that Webber doesn't care. I think he cares. I also think there are some hard feelings with the University that make him want to just stay back and root privately for this team. I also think he's incredibly embarrassed. He's a smart guy. he made a decision when he was younger that I will gaurentee he thinks about every single day because he had part in essentially taking three successful years from the program not to mention the TO. If he shows up, great I guess but I don't expect it and I don't really blame him. I don't think it's something where he is trying to stick it to anyone.
Anything behind your theory that he roots for Michigan in private? I can see a plausible situation where he is bitter and jaded enough where the contrary is true.
He tweeted his support for the team before the Syracuse game, so I don't think it's theoretical that he roots for Michigan.
He also said we were going to beat Kansas during a TNT broadcast before the game.
I was leary about it at first, but now that the team has played their hearts out and made it to the finals, it is time indeed.
Based only on me watching the fab five doc, it seems like Chris had a rough time off and on at the university. Then, the infamous timeout. I cannot even fathom how embarassed he must have felt and then the added embarassment of being in the Ed Martin scandal. I think Jalen is probably right in that he wants to be totaly separated from it. I hope he can overcome that though and show up with the rest of the fab five tomorrow night
Yeah Jalen. Get it done
Come on CW lets do this!!!
Not to be downer, but why the hell are you so eager to to see a player who helped bring corruption and shame to the university in a major and lasting way? A great player, sure. And everyone deserves a shot at redemption. But he's still playing the petulant victim. I don't think the university needs a reminder of that tomorrow night.
You're like the Nyquil of downers.
I don't get this either. We are going to hear over and over about how many years it's been since Michigan was in the finals...and some want to celebrate the main actor in causing the long, dark era that followed the Fab Five?
While it may be a stretch to call Webber a victim, he was far from being the main actor. It was, after all, the Ed Martin scandal.
Also, this isn't about celebrating him -- it's about celebrating this year's team. People comparing this to Tressel's triumphal return at the horseshoe last fall (as someone did the other day) are way off base. He won't be getting carried off the court on anybody's shoulders, but it would be cool if he was there cheering when Trey Burke is.
If nobody on Michigan's team takes Martin's money then there is no problem for Michigan.
I so hope this happens. I would love to see the Fab 5 there when THIS team does what they could not.
but what would the fab 5 do if they won? I imagine if it were just the other four they might go down to the court or maybe even the locker room, but I doubt C-Webb would be allowed to do that? Would they just stay in their seats? Because that seems too boring for them (kind of /s but not really).
Webber CAN do whatever he wants. The University just can't purchase tickets for him
It's just that I would think allowing him to celebrate with your players might count as association. Just being really cautious on this one.
Let this team have their spotlight. If the fab five want to come to the game, great. No need for the publicity and media attention
How exactly do you want Jalen to make it known that a bunch of people including himself want to see him at the game?
It would not be difficult for him to contact Webber personally, I'm sure. Bringing it into a public forum makes it seem to be about publicity, attention, and ultimately self-promotion.
The game is played on the court by the current players; the fab five had their time in the limelight and it was glorious but also had a dark side. It's over- has been over for two decades. Should Michael Jordan issue a press release before attending a UNC game?
I'm sure he's contacted Webber himself many times abou the idea. He had to do something to get a bunch of people behind it.
That would be awesome, I'm 100% for it.
I don't know about extremely public. If this wasn't posted on here I never would have seen it.
It's on the the front page of ESPN.com. I'd say that is pretty public.
He doesn't need to show up. All he needs to do is say (tweet?) something like "Hey this game doesn't feel like the right time for me, but we'll get back together soon, Go blue".
It is time. It would be an unforgettable moment.
But I'm only ok with it if Webber takes responsibility and mans up. Not sure how he could or would do that. Maybe just being there would be enough. If he cheered his heart out. Just don't know.
I've been wearing a hat to every game this season from the 93 Final Four my dad got when he was there. Do I wear this hat tomorrow or is it bad luck?
Wear the hat.
Agreed. Wear the hat! I'll be wearing the same t-shirt I've been wearing for every game this year. Also didn't wash it after the Cuse game.
I wore that exact same T-shirt the last two games.
I am on 4 games with same shirt, including sweating my ass bc its a thick long sleeve, at a shirt and tie brunch on easter. Dedication is definatly a understatement.
I'll wear it. Maybe if I get close enough to the Fab Five reunion in the dome I'll get them all to sign it, one can dream right?
Ironically I ran into someone with the SAME EXACT HAT, authentic from '93, but the Kentucky version. Who would've though that two 20 year old hats would be spotted in the same place?
You've been wearing it all year. Why ask or even think of changing now??
Stick with what works, dance with the one you came with, don't mess with the juju. There's a reason I post "Fuck *current opponent*" in every game thread, it's 5-0 so far and i'm not changing now
You better wear that FUCKING HAT!
You wear that damn hat!!! I've got a Michigan flag flying on my front porch that's about one seam from falling apart because I've never taken it down... That suckers not getting replaced or repaired... Go Blue!
I'm wearing my exact same clothing I've been wearing for every game of this tournament - in fact I will be representing Japan in a debate tomorrow in my Michigan hockey jersey. Not even changing my boxers from Saturday.
for a championship game to be the same as the banner issue. I'm betting the players would love to see them there - all of them, supporting the current team.
If all else fails, the Muppets have already shown us a way forward...
So we're all for bringing in a potential distraction to the team while also drawing attention away from what the current players have accomplished? Sounds perfect.
They're in the national championship game. There really isn't much danger any more of being "overshadowed" or "distracted" by anything about the Fab Five.
At this point we are all just celebrating Michigan basketball and it would be great for them to join in supporting the team.
I doubt the team is paying attention (or being allowed to pay attention) to outside info.
Feelings on Webber aside, I think that if they were all there together, before the game -- and wished the team well -- it would serve as a huge spark for the players.
I'd like this.
That's all we should care about right now. The fab five had their time. Why does Jalen need to keep making this about him? I don't see the 89 team trying to steal the spotlight.
FWIW I'd support having the 89 team in attendance as well. It's good to see all former UM athletes supporting this team. It's been 20+ years. Look at MSU when they won in 2000, it had been 20 years for them as well. The Fab Five and 89 Teams might not get this opportunity again.
They should go, support the team, decline any interviews and celebrate with the team afterwards.
He's not trying to make it about himself. Considering in the video he said do it for Trey Burke, Tim Hardaway, and GR3.
for having a different opinion and questioning Jalen's motives, but he has been pushing for this nonstop all year. He may say it is not about him, but this clearly is very personal to him.
If Webber wants to show, fine. If not, fine. I was a student at U of M when the fab 5 was there. I loved them then and would be happy to see them support this team any way they choose (and I am not saying they do not support them).
The Fab 5 are an important part of M basketball's history, but M basketball is not defined solely by the fab 5.
I am not questioning Jalen's love for Michigan. He clearly loves the school.
Adidas will soon be selling the Detroit vs everybody, Wolverine hat, baseball bat combo-package Jalen outfit
Jalen could get a cut and it would be legit. . . .
To everyone who is opposed to Weber coming back, why hold grudge for this long? It's been 20 years, are you not over it? It's done, it happened, we paid our dues, he paid his, let bygones be bygones and lets move on.
Hell, look at the story of Brian Banks. He's already forgived the lady that falsely accused him of rape. That's something significantly worse than what Webber ever did, and what the woman did to Banks directly effected him, what Webber did, no matter how much we love Michigan, really didn't effect the fan's lives at all. If he can forgive why the hell can't you guys?
Do we really think guys who play in front of 17,000 people a night (especially considering half the time the people are screaming, cussing, and talking about them) are going to be distracted by 5 additional famous people at their game? I honestly believe that our team has more resolve than that. If the question is about the Fab 5 taking the spotlight from them, maybe. I think that it would make the night that much bigger. Also, 100% agree with the poster above: Ed Martin burned the program, not Chris Webber. He did go to school at Michigan, he did have a stellar career, and he did help take the team to two championship games. I would just like to see them back together tomorrow night.
I can't tell you how badly I want a sweatshirt or t-shirt with "Detroit vs Everybody" on it.
would love to see LaVell Blanchard, Dion Harris, Daniel Horton, Graham Brown, Courtney Sims, DeShawn Sims, Josh Asselin, Lester Abrams and dudes like that det some love.
Note: It is exactly one month until Webber's ban is over.
Also, I watched the Fab Five documentary today on ESPN Classic because I was killing some time and the end before it goes to the credits it says "The sanctions have been lifted but the banners remained locked away".
Interesting. Sanctions aren't lifted until May 7th though. I think they should put the banners in the PDC.
Tweet by Chris-
it would be for the players. Tim Hardaway idolized the fab five. What sort of impact would there presence (or dare I say the opportunity to meet them all together) have on them? I would imagine the impression would be just as strong as when Muhammad Ali met with them 20 years ago. . .
I voiced my approval of their all being there tomorrow in another thread, but front-page appeals on ESPN.com? If they all just showed and cheered the current squad on, great. But as much as I love Jalen, he's also an egomaniac. I almost appreciate Webber's reticence more, at this stage. It's possible that he doesn't want to show tomorrow for the RIGHT reasons.
For the many thoughtful MGoBloggers out there concerned about the impact of the Fab5 coming to the game, I would like to offer this...
I think it is important to remember that sports are not just an isolated event, stuck in a crystallized prism through which we view from a distance, separated from the rest of our lives. Sports are a very real part of our lives and the lives of billions of people all over the world. These cherished moments and celebrations of contest have the ability to accomplish so much more than just a championship for a team. In perspective, winning a trophy is the least that sports can accomplish.
In 1980, a group of kids breathed a mighty gust of pride and patriotism into the bowels of a nation that was suffering a crisis of confidence. When a hockey team won a shiny medal in Lake Placid, New York, that was enough to restore a national pride that had been severely wounded by a crippled economy, gas shortages, the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and the Iranian hostage crisis. Our nation transcended it all.
As a nation, we mourned together and stood united as the President of the United States threw out the first pitch in the 2001 World Series. A showcase of athletes became a showcase of resolve. The same was true when U2 gave the greatest halftime performance in Super Bowl history three months later, in part due to the context of what had transpired on September 11th. The peoples of the world celebrated global freedom of ideas and mourned the loss of the innocent. It was not ever meant to just be about "the greatest show on turf" and the first year starter from Michigan. It was always so much more than Tom Brady. In fact, that is what made it so special, and so memorable.
Sports have been used as a weapon, such as when Hitler attempted to promote his aryan ideologies at the 1936 Olympics in Berlin. Despite the Germans winning a plethora of medals, the "Buckeye Bullet" Jesse Owens slapped aryanism in its face by becoming the runaway star of the games. Where sports had been pushed to justify racial prejudices, men like Jackie Robinson, Joe Louis and even Doug Williams in the 1980's stood as symbols of so much more than just winners of championships. Sports helps the world achieve progress through breaking down ideological barriers.
Sports have also been used to heal, and to promote dialogue between warring factions. In Israel and Palestine, football is being used as a tool to demonstrate the similarities that peoples share, rather than a competition that tears people apart. The modern Olympics and the World Cup were created to create an international dialogue and to promote understanding. At the Olympic Games this past summer in London, a Rwandan cyclist competed for the first time, proudly waving his country's flag to let the world know that Rwanda, still scarred from genocide, was a nation that stood together, Tutsi and Hutu. That young man's national team, riders of both tribes, trained by an American who was convicted of sexual crimes against a minor, is an organization built upon redemption and the restoration of personal, community, and national pride found through sport.
This national title game is so much bigger than just the boys taking the court. If it was just them, they would play locked in a gym and nobody would care. Extraordinary achievements have the ability to transcend life and to heal wounds and create dialogue, whether some folks want it or not. There is no greater time to begin the process of healing than on the very stage our University last connected and felt that bond of love with Chris Webber. He is a man. A man who sinned. Who hasn't among us? But, if Rwandans can come together to support a national cycling program in the wake of a genocide that is more recent than some silly infamous timeout call, and if Israelis and Palestinians can work together to use football to create dialogue between their peoples in an effort to curb the violence that has already claimed so many, then surely as a community we can take the step to reach out to Chris, should he appear Monday night, to say that we are glad that he came to the game and that we hope that the past will be behind us all soon. Let's take the next step forward.
Sorry I couldn't resist. Been waiting awhile to use that one.
+1. Awesome read.
...that this is not a big deal either way.
I can understand Webber not wanting to be a distraction. I'd feel the same way. No reason they can't reunite in private. Cameras don't have to be rolling.
I always thought Webber's issues were more about being a pawn in the huge revenue generating machine. Issues with both the university and the NCAA. Walking around town and not having the money to buy the merchandise with his name on it while being so responsible for the huge cash cow.
I never thought it had much to do with the Billy Buckner like timeout moment although that's what Jalen references and he would know better than me.
Webber always came off as not being comfortable in his own skin as a celebrity. It almost seemed like if he could have be would quit basketball long before injuries derailed his career. He seems more comfortable talking about the game.
Sorry but that argument makes no sense. If he was getting paid thousands of dollars, how did he have no money? It's also not like his family was dirt poor. He went to Detroit Country Day. Someone's story about him having no money and him getting paid all through school doesn't add up.
I love Jalen but as I watched this I couldnt help but think that they say they love Chris publicly but I wonder if they feel Chris cost them a championship and essentially their place in michigan history officially. For him to say that Chris wanted to disassociate himself from his college career because of the timeout and to live as if his basketball career started his rookie year in the league is kinda odd. Chris has taken the most heat for what happened at michigan. And the only time u heard Jalen or the rest of them back him for what happened really was in the documentary when Jalen admitted to taking money as well. I get the feeling Chris feels betrayed on some level and whether its real or preceived betrayel their needs to be a clear the air session between all of them.
Ummm no. If you asked any member or coach of that team they would NEVER tell you or think that Webber cost them that game. They wouldn't have even been in that position without Webber in the first place. Secondly, there are hundreds of other plays throughought the game that impact the score and any player would say that if they were asked.
I have a question for those of you that were in Ann Arbor during the Fab Five years? Did the University actually make shirts that had the Fab Five on it with the name? Or promote the Fab Five name?
Now, the interesting thing is that Jalen Rose holds the Trademark on Fab Five.
Now what blows my mind is that the "THE FAB 5" itself was trademarked by no other than Chris Webber Filing Date August 9, 1993
When the Red Sox finally won a World Series they brought back Bill Buckner, and it was an emotional moment of closure for all involved. Maybe this game isn't the game to do that. Maybe if Michigan wins it all and they raise the banner next year at Crisler, that would be the game to bring back the Fab Five. Or maybe Webber never feels the time is right and we get no closure, or moment of reconciliation.If that is the case, that is fine by me too.
I will remember the Fab Five for what they wear, a team of freshmen that turned into basketball rock stars and electrified Michigan and captured the imagination of the whole country. But if Webber doesn't come back this season or next, I think the window closes and Michigan has to move on. I am tired of the ESPN documentary, the questions on every sports site, the mentioning of it during every tournament game.
This moment is for the kids who are playing now, they earned it. Let us appreciate them for what they have done.
Amen to everything you just said.
Can you imagine the locker room if pre-game Bacari says we have a guest pre-game speech and the fucking fab five walk in?
Michigan would get in trouble by the NCAA. Webber can't have any contact with the university until May 7th when the ban is lifted. But 4/5 ain't that bad.
Boo your reality! Webber comes in wearing a ski mask. They can't prove anything!
I really like the commercial with the ski mask guy Yeah. It's great.
I also like the one with the kid who says his name is Nikki flash because "Nikki rhymes with flash.......close....."
The Fab Five changed the face of college basketball. It provided, at the same time, among the best and worst moments in UM bball history.
Can you imagine it? 20 years (almost to the day!), we have a chance to do what we couldn't do 20 years ago and finish the job.
At the SAME time, we reunite the a big part of our history and take some of the sting from the Time Out and the Scandal.
Come to think of it, the Time Out was probably the best thing to happen to us. It's one thing vacating championship gm appearances, it's another vacating a title and to be the first ever to do so.
The 20 year cycle is almost complete....the Fab Five started it...Trey and company finishes it tomorrow. Hail!
Not sure if this was mentioned......Just read that CWebb is working on an autobiography and documentary to be out this year. It would be crazy for him not to attend to complete the story.
I, for one, can't wait to find out.
Brandon correctly said that once Chris apologizes for his off court actions he will be welcomed back. Time does cure the wounds but not if Chris is still in denial. This has nothing to do with the other members of the Fab 5 (who by the way were great kids and were guilty of nothing besides associating with Chris). I think Chris loves UM but his ego is so damned big he doesn't want to be associated with the time out or anything bad that happened off the court. I LOVED Chris as a UM player and trend setter, and hated what he did to FIsher and the program which suffered for what seemed like forever (and we deserved it!). That said if he mans up and apologizes sincerely, I'll be the first to cheer him back. If Chris doesn't apologize, screw him and lets cheer the other four hoops heroes when the ban is lifted.
and the Fab 5 is there next to each other cheering their hearts out...that would exorcise pretty much all the demons from the past 20 years of Michigan Basketball.
I think this Jalen's way of letting the public know that 4 out of the Fab 5 will be there, and this is the reason why, and that even though Webber won't be there, they all still love Webber.
I'm cool with it. Can't wait until Monday night.
Love me some Jalen!
I don't get some of you. In one word you say nothing about Jalen Rose, who admitted to taking money from Ed Martin as well. Jalen had as much to do with this as the rest, but he was honest about it and didn't try to cover it up. Webber is not allowed to be associated with the University at all, and as far we all know he may have been told that he can not come to any games and/or do anything that may publicly show support of the University. Did anyone see the letter sent to him? Who knows what Weber was told, he's not talking and good for him, it has nothing to do with us as fans. He made a mistake and is living with the consequences of that mistake. Look at how big of news it was when Webber hummed part of the victors during a telecast. Now, imagine the news if he showed up, it would inadvertley show him as supporting the University and assisting in promoting the University. Something he is not allowed to do.
Why does Jalen carry a bat? And what does it have to do with Patrick Ewing's revenge?
Love me some Jalen.
I've always thought Jalen shared a little of the blame for the TO. The reason Webber traveled on his way down the court before the timeout is that he went to pass the ball to Jalen and then realized that a NC defender was shadowing Rose waiting to pick off the pass. So Webber decided he had to rush it down the court instead.
Rose needed to run right to Webber in that situation and get the ball. I know he probably thought he was open enough to get the pass and maybe he was. But why risk it? Just go right to Webber and take the ball from him. With the NC guy standing close, why risk a steal or a deflection?
Obviously it was still Webber who panicked, but as the point guard, Rose needed to do a better job of getting the ball in his own hands.
It would be great if he did join the rest of the Fab 5 and every other maize and blue faithful in Atlanta. I understand some of the frustration people have with him buthe was just a kid. People need to put themselves in his shoes and take a moment to really think about what they would have done in that situation. Growing up he didnt have a whole and there was a gown man offering him anything he wanted. Yeah he knew the rules when he signed his letter of intent but when your that young and you can have anything you want its really really hard to turn it down. I wish alot of our fans would really think about this and realize this happened 20 years ago and he made a huge mistake that I'm sure he regrets every day. To all the people that bash him you have no right to be upset with him. He didn't effect your livelihood one bit. the only ones that have any kind of right to be angry are his teammates and they all forgave him and are welcoming him back with open arms.
CWebb, you don't have to do ANY interviews, you don't have to even wear something that says "MICHIGAN"
Just come to the game with your brothers in a Navy Blue polo and call it a day.
Today is the day we shock the world!