Is it a foregone conclusion that Manny Harris is turning pro after this year?
Most people believe Manny will turn pro after his Junior year. It looks to me like he could benefit from another year of college (i.e. work on taking it to the basket with his left hand, shooting, getting stronger, etc.). What do people think? Is he ready for the NBA?
January 27th, 2010 at 3:14 PM ^
I don't think he's really ready...and it would be better for him to stay...but ESPN has him as a late first round, early second round pick.
There is this idea that drafting seniors is a bad idea because they have limited upside, but I can't believe he's really that high up as it is right now.
I think he should stay and I hope he stays....but I doubt it. We really need at least one star which I don't know if we'll have when Manny and Peedi both leave. It's unfortunate.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:38 PM ^
he needs to stay as second rounders don't get guaranteed contracts. I really don't know how ESPN can be doing projections like this as they don't know who's coming out early yet.
January 27th, 2010 at 4:09 PM ^
I think his projected position depends on how many freshmen like Wall and Henry go out this year. If he doesn't play a little better, he may end up not even being projected as a second-rounder. As it stands right now, for the NBA, I think he would project as a 2 who doesn't shoot well from outside.
One more year would be great. He could work on mechanics, become stronger and more mature, and, of course, he would have the undying gratitude of UM fans. Also, in case the NBA doesn't work out, he could get his degree.
I would love to see Harris as a grad who stayed for four years, got his degree, and was very successful off the court. For that matter, there is a definite pipeline from UM to ESPN at this point; a degree would help him take advantage of it.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:25 PM ^
I don't know if its calculated somewhere, but his shot is ugly right now.
I think he's around ~45% from the floor, but I would love to know what he is shooting from further than 10-12 feet from the basket...
Answering your question. I think he goes but its no way 100% right now.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:36 PM ^
The sooner Manny leaves, and in turn sends the basketball program back to obscurity, the sooner the universe will return to normalcy and thus elevate the football program back to its status as a perennial powerhouse. So here’s hoping he leaves…
Sorry, the game last night has turned me quite cynical...
January 27th, 2010 at 3:49 PM ^
I feel your pain, brother, but let us keepeth the hope.
To start the year, the chance of Manny returning was 0% (and that's the inside scoop). Now (no inside info), I'd guess...25%. Without a big man to give him some assistance though, it will be tough. Morgan won't be great and Horford (if he comes) will be too skinny his freshman year.
Anywho, don't give up on bball. If we get Zeigler, we're looking at a top 15 recruiting class next year. The year after that (with Amir Williams, fingers crossed) will also be strong. The product on the court next year...that's a different story.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:52 PM ^
It's one thing for rival fans to pretend that Michigan basketball doesn't have a proud history, but for our fanbase to do it pisses me off. We've been to six (count 'em) Final Fours since 1964. Michigan and UCLA were the only programs in America to go to the national title game in each of the last four decades of the twentieth century. True "normalcy" is when we're good in BOTH football and basketball.
January 27th, 2010 at 4:51 PM ^
Thank you. It seems that some only remember the last 10 years.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:37 PM ^
I think he will be another player in the recent trend of good college players who leave too early and do nothing in the pros. It really bothers me when talent like that goes to waste. Players like Dar Tucker and Josh McRoberts come to mind. Both left after their sophomore years when they should have stayed in college and developed more. Tucker went undrafted and McRoberts went in the second round and still hasn't seen much playing time.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:45 PM ^
had very little to gain, professionally, from staying at Duke another 2 years. He's hung around the league, gotten paid, and gotten to practice against the world's best. I don't think staying at Duke would have made him a better player than that experience.
The only reason to stay would have been to get a degree and enjoy college life. He can always get that degree later though.
January 27th, 2010 at 4:16 PM ^
Good point. I'm not sure if he would have gotten much better, but I just kind of felt like he might as well have stayed in school if he was in a good financial situation. Duke could have been a much better team if he would have stayed those last two years and he hasn't done much as a pro. He could have gone down as a great college player. I guess I place a lot of value in staying at school and trying to get the most out of that experience, but I shouldn't expect others to feel that way.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:39 PM ^
I thought it was a 50/50 chance he came back this year. I think he really needs another year to develop, but with potential millions ($) within his reach, it would be a stretch to see him back. I don't think he and the coach are always on the same page either.
January 27th, 2010 at 8:10 PM ^
Depending on who comes out he's not even a lock to go in the first round which is the only round with guaranteed contracts.
Reality is Manny has a limited left hand, isn't a great shooter, takes to many bad shots, and makes to many ill advised passes. That being said, his game is more suited to the NBA then it is to JB's system. I hope he stays, but can't blame him if he goes.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:41 PM ^
he should stay, I just don't think he will. Can't really say I blame him I just don't think his personality meshes with Coach B. His game definitely does not go with Coach's system
January 27th, 2010 at 3:42 PM ^
Generally, the "he should stay to improve" arguments for NBA prospects are overstated. You're drafted on potential.
Manny will probably want to consider what his potential draft position in 2011 would be relative to 2010. Probably not much higher because whatever elements he improves upon in college he'd have a higher likelihood of improving them in the NBA. In 2011 he'd lose a year of youth/potential in the eyes of evaluators, not to mention risk a major injury along the way.
That said, the big thing in the NBA is if you can get into the first round and get a guaranteed contract. Given that he's considered borderline, its a tough decision. This all ignores how he's getting along with Beilein and how he's "enjoying" his courses.
Ultimately I think he goes pro knowing that he'll face even more defensive attention next year without Sims. He really doesn't have that much to prove (for NBA purposes) in college. His deficiencies are evident and will need to be improved upon; it doesn't really matter where that happens.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:51 PM ^
...a skinny 6-4 guy who can't play the point, can't even shoot a respectable percentage from the college three point line, and would have big problems defending most two guards in the NBA. As important as Manny is for UM Basketball, I do not see him as a contributor in the NBA.
Manny reminds me a bit of Lavell Blanchard in that his skills are more suited to providing periodic stretchs of dominant play at the NCAA level, but do not translate into the pro game. And Blanchard was bigger, a better rebounder, and had a better three point shooting percentage than Manny -- all of which are attributes that actually make Blanchard a better candidate for the NBA than Manny. So if Blanchard -- who could not make the NBA -- is a better NBA prospect than Manny, where does that leave Manny?
That being said, I think he probable leaves because some NBA team will probably (stupidly) draft him, but he ends up with Lavell over in Europe doing just fine one day soon.
January 27th, 2010 at 6:42 PM ^
I agree that Manny is not yet ready to be a productive 2 at the NBA level, and his ceiling as a defender is probably not all that high. But he has a position to play, and he could potentially be an effective scorer in the League.
Lavell had no position in the League -- he was a slightly undersized 3 with no lateral quickness, nothing off the dribble, and an outside shot that was good but not nearly good enough to be the only thing keeping him in the league.
Disclaimer: I love(d) both in college.
January 27th, 2010 at 4:03 PM ^
"chengelis RT @umhoops NBADraft.net took Manny Harris off of their 2010 mock. http://bit.ly/AeY0 They have him as a second round pick in 2011."
So there is some hope that he stays.
January 27th, 2010 at 4:33 PM ^
15 lbs. on his frame. The NBA is going to smoke him the way he's built and plays right now.
I'd really like to see him stay and help fully transition this program.
January 27th, 2010 at 5:16 PM ^
I think if he hears back that he will be a 1st-rounder, he is gone. But when you get into the second-round/FA area, the value of coming back and maybe bumping your stock up a bit becomes appealing. Right now, he doesn't look like a NBA player, and I'm not sure he is loaded with potential or is a diamond in the rough. As Victory Collins notes, his current skills simply don't translate well to the NBA, and I'm not sure they improve in the pros. People act like pro ball teaches players how to play, but in fact you are expected to know how to play. Remedial instruction on rebounding and shooting 20-footers isn't going to happen in the NBA unless you really want it (by staying late with an assistant), which I kind of doubt will happen with Manny. He may very well leave this year, but I'm fairly certain it won't be because NBA scouts knocking down his door.
January 27th, 2010 at 6:46 PM ^
Compare Jamal Crawford's jumper in 1999 to his jumper today. I'd love to see Manny back, but it's not like his arsenal wouldn't likely be refined in the NBA, if he can stick (probably a big if).
January 27th, 2010 at 7:11 PM ^
Crawford's always been a good ballhandler, though, and I think he's just a shade more athletic. Manny's athleticism is good for this level but is pretty much average for the pros. That coupled with a shaky handle, questionable defensive focus and 28% shooting from the short college 3-point arc, makes his stock iffy.
January 27th, 2010 at 7:27 PM ^
I'm not trying to say that Manny is gonna turn into Jamal once he hits the League; just saying that young Crawford's jumper was once just about as unaesthetic as Manny's, and now it's evolved to be nothing short of wet.
As to their athleticism, I think Crawford has the better frame, but Manny's definitely a more explosive athlete, even compared to a young, pre-knee-injury Crawford.
Also, not to feed into the ridiculous "there's no defense in the NBA" meme, but Manny's definitely less disinterested on that end of the floor.
January 27th, 2010 at 7:50 PM ^
I think they're pretty comparable defensively. Both will gamble and get a fair number of steals (and the occasional block), but neither is very disciplined in man-to-man.
January 27th, 2010 at 5:49 PM ^
"We've been to six (count 'em) Final Fours since 1964. Michigan and UCLA were the only programs in America to go to the national title game in each of the last four decades of the twentieth century."
Michigan did not go to a Final Four in the 1990's.
\NCAA'd
I hope he stays, but would not be surprised if he left.
January 27th, 2010 at 5:58 PM ^
If the NCAA had any stones (and subpoena power), there wouldn't be many Final Four teams in the record books over the past 50 years. (John Wooden's whole UCLA coaching career probably would have been vacated.)
January 27th, 2010 at 6:00 PM ^
I follow the NBA draft and scouting websites quite a bit and he will surely declare. He gets one year where he can declare and pull his name out if he doesn't like what he hears so it would be dumb for him not to. But I really see him staying in. Some agent will convince him that he will be a first round pick or or tell him that there will be a lockout in 2011 (there probably will be) so he should try to get established in the league while he can.
On the other hand, if one assumes that there will be a lockout in 2011 you have to imagine most of the underclassmen next year won't declare out of fear which would in turn make the draft very weak and a grate year for graduating seniors.
As far as coming back for his senior year to improve, I think that would be a big risk for him. With Sims gone teams will game plan around him more and his fg% might actually go down. See what happened to Willie Warren after Blake Griffin left.
January 27th, 2010 at 6:25 PM ^
No. It is not a foregone conclusion, in fact I'd be mildly surprised if he leaves.
January 27th, 2010 at 7:34 PM ^
Apparently, you didn't hear what he said at the end of last year.
January 27th, 2010 at 7:50 PM ^
I did. It's possible that we looked to much into it and inferred that he was talking about this season and beyond, but he could have meant that in the context of that one draft. Besides I'm sure a lot has changed since then.
January 27th, 2010 at 8:12 PM ^
Manny is gone, and with the struggles of this year's team he may already be gone mentally, which may be the reason for the whole kurfluffle before the Purdue game. The fact that there is some rift between he and Beilein will only assure that he leaves at the end of the year. He ain't coming back.
January 27th, 2010 at 8:26 PM ^
With Warren? All this he's not ready to go, he's staying, then when he leaves we all turn into the club owner turning a blind eye in Casablanca...