Norfleet has moved to corner
Hoke said Dennis Norfleet has moved to the cornerback position, but he will still return punts and kicks.
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I keed, I keed
hard to get on board with norflett moving to defense when he seem to have huge potential on offense.
5'7" cornerbacks going against the 6'2 to 6' 6' wrs that osu, nd, nebraska trot out on saturdays sounds like a recipe for failure.
Borges could not tell that gardner is awesome and bellomy is awful after 18 or so months of practice, games, etc. what do they see with norfleet?
Why? Bouboucar Cissoko was only five foot ei... oh.
Are you serious?????? Wow. Just wow.
Are we going to have depth issues at CB next year, or is this a case of having the best athletes on the field?
How does Norfleet see the field at corner? Ramon Taylor had a pretty solid year. Countess should be back and Avery seems like a solid nickel guy who's got plenty of experience. Behind them you've got Richardson and Howell - 2 guys that are about the same build as Norfleet.
Is Countess injury maybe more severe than we know?
You mean Hollowell.
No way -- Norfleet is way more stacked/jacked/whatever than those guys. He's a couple of inches shorter than Richardson and probably easily outweighs him. The numbers aren't as extreme with Hollowell.
Norfleet is like 5'6'' 165...that's my height plus 25 pounds
ferrreal?
Dennis Norfleet to DB... for how long?
Is this bowl-season move? Because if it is, I think it could be pretty reasonable.
It's nice to talk about Blake Countess, but he's hurt and can't play. We've gotten surprisingly solid play from Raymon Taylor, and he might now be healthier now than he was in the last three games of the season. That's nice. Avery; nice at nickel. Floyd; yep, glad to have him start against the Gamecocks. Delonte Hollowell; yes. And Terry Richardson has played; his redshirt is burned, so he's ready to go for the bowl game even as a freshman.
That's five guys, to play what is essentially three positions. You could add Jarrod Wilson as the backup nickel for Avery, but still a bit of backup isn't so strange.
One other thing is that Norfleet is making himself into a minor terror on special teams like kick coverages (epecially when he's getting away with facemasking). Maybe the thought is that if he is worked in daily with the d-backs as a unit, it will enhance his skills on special teams more than if he spends most of his time working out as a running back.
Because THIS is what I said from the beginning that I thought was happening. I think it's a bowl move.
Honestly, I think Norfleet will play both ways - just a hunch. I don't ever think he's going to be a starter, but I think he's going to find time and roles. I still think he'll be used on offense in a wildcat, jet wr, speed RB role. I think they're going to work him on defense because we need bodies! And I think he'll continue to be a beast on special teams (both sides).
Also, what many of you have to realize is that seniors don't practice much during bowl season - it's really time to get the young guys some reps with the "First Team." It's time to try things out. It's time to have 1v1, 2v2 and 3v3...so if Norfleet is just standing on the sidelines on offense, why not throw him out at CB at 2nd or 3rd team and see how he does? He's not going to regress as a player on offense.
FWIW, I think he's an offensive player...I wouldn't be shocked if I'm wrong, but I'm not totally giving up on the idea of him playing both. If he plays a similar role on offense, gets reserve time on defense, plays on all kick/punt/return units. He's earned his keep. With his skill, he could excel in all of those roles as well.
Sidenote, he plays like a defensive player. He loves to hit, he's in your face, doesn't shy from contact. He's truly a WLB in a slot WRs body.
Generally I'm not all up-in-arms about short cornerbacks, but this is a little...
Your avatar fits perfectly with your comment.
Well at least this makes more sense than safety.
WAT
And to think he didn't even go to Cass Tech.
I don't get this at all. I'm not super-high on Norfleet as a runner or anything, but CB was (I thought) a place where we had depth and ability. This is like Justin Fargas all over again.
Lets not talk crazy. Fargas was considered one of if not the top RB coming out of high school and then was mishandled here. Norfleet while I love home will never be an every down back like Fargas could have been.
Not sure that Fargas is a good example. He WAS being used as an everydown back until he suffered a very nasty injury. When he came back they moved him. That might have been based on a number of factors including chance of re-injury (unless I missed the story behind the story). Just because he transferred and (after substantial time to rehab and get back to his form) became a RB again doesn't mean he was mishandled at the time.
I like Fargas, one of the few players I've actually had a chance to talk to (he visited Meijer when I worked there).
Obviously his injury was devastating, and even though he went on to have a productive college and pro career I don't know if he ever got all the way back from it.
The problem is that when he came back, he was behind Askew and Perry on the depth chart. He wasn't getting playing time. He switched to safety and spent the rest of the season literally waiting on the sidelines for Michigan to call timeout.
Then, with remarkable enthusiasm, he would charge on the field in full uniform, run up to the ref, call timeout, and run back.
It was, in my view, a demonstration of his desire to be on the field no matter how he got there.
A chance to play near home at then-talent-poor USC (this was before Pete Carroll was monopolizing the 5-star talent) was apparent, and he took it. I don't blame him a bit. And, frankly, besides 2001 (when Askew and Perry split carries and Michigan's offense couldn't move across the street) I don't think it was a bad blow for Michigan. There was, in fact, a lot of talent at that position, and Perry proved that in '03 when he won the Doak Walker.
I guess they were serious about maball in the future. Seems anyone under 6'2 might be destined for defense.
Heck, maybe he has great instincts and good tackling ability. I'd take a guy in the mold of Antoine Winfield.
When did we move away from the MANBALL meme? How did I miss that? And what exactly is Maball? Don't know about the rest of you, but my mom can't play football at all...
your mom is a BALLER for sure, otherwise your post wouldn't even exist!
true...
Hopefully this is just a better fit for Dennis and not a manball edict. If it's the latter, then Borges would have switched Barry Sanders to a safety if he coached at Oklahoma State. Must be the former.
Norfleet has embraced move to CB according to Hoke, and that "he loves to play the game."
A 5'7" corner? I don't know....
A 5"7 corner = skeptical
A 5"7 nickel...sure, why not. Quickness is the most necessary skill in that role IMO. Let's trust the coaches.
The whole Bellomy debacle...
I don't get it. Why not slot receiver or running back? It seems like a waste. We have pretty good depth at corner, and our starters are both really young (Blake and Raymon).
Mind bottling.
...mind bottling?
His mind has been bottled up
It bottles the mind. One could call it "jarring"
Yeah, mind-bottling. You know, when things are so crazy it gets your thoughts all trapped, like in a bottle?
/Blades of Glory
The last six years may have been the strangest six years in Michigan football history.
I dunno, those years where field goals counted as much as touchdowns were pretty wierd.
Devin Gardner to running back.
There, I made myself feel better on a Friday night.
There, now I feel even better than you.
Hate it. Couldn't we add him to the offense to make it more dynamic.
Too bad. Would've loved to see that speed out of the backfield. Still remember that end around we ran with him and he got 12 yards just like that. Seems to dynamic of a runner to put on defense
Honestly, he doesn't seem that fast to me. For all the talk of him being "just about to break one" he barely crossed the 50 all season on returns and just never showed the afterburners you expect in a huge game breaker.
Told ya
Sooo...Berkely Edwards then? Not sure I get this one. Seems his value you would be far greater in the Vincent Smith role than at CB.
As long as he's still returning kicks, I'm not gonna freak out too much.
honestly, I think everyone is overreacting a little bit, this is the internet so i understand. However, I think that it is at least reasonable to believe that norfleet can make an impact at corner...
I'm not saying we have to blindly trust the coaches or that we can't question here and there but lately I am getting repulsed by the combination of revisionist history and blatant denial of the coaches' abilities to make personnel decisions; we have to stop questioning every movement and labeling it blatant ignorance...
but hey, this is the internet so whatever floats your boats I guess...
Nickel/dime packages.
Well hopefully he doesnt tackle like he did when we punted the ball to Ohio and he came hauling ass down only to grab all facemask at 300mph. The refs missed it cuz it was like a fucking blur.
Does this mean we can finally move Furman to RB? Seems like a fair trade to me.
I would LOVE to see Furman in the backfield. He can't break the 2 deep at safety so why not give it a shot?
Hoke and Borges are really going to use him at RB but they are just telling everyone he'll play CB.
Don't tell anyone else though, because that would ruin this secret.
Well we do have such an abundance of explosive playmakers...
If there was a laughing & crying simultaneously moderation option, this is where I'd use it.
South Carolina's receivers aren't very tall. Norfleet's height isn't a big deal in this game. He makes up for it with agility, change of direction, etc. I think its a good move for this game. Long term, not so much.
Hopefully that is what the coaches are thinking but I doubt it. I just don't understand why someone would take Darren Sproles 2.0 and say DONT WANT, PUT ON 3RD STRING D.
Except I doubt the coaches are going to play a true frosh who has been a CB for a month over the CBs we have who played there all year, and aren't freshmen. So I doubt this move is for this game.
Yea this is my thought, too. I'm thinkin that we'ere not going to see this anytime soon i.e. Bowl Game.
To be fair, I was really surprised he started as returner at season opener against Alabama.
I really thought he would be an asset catching passes out of the backfield and running sweeps or reverses. Very surprising move.
Corner makes more sense than safety but Norfleet is a guy that the coaching staff was designing plays for earlier this year. Now he's just a corner unlikely to ever start considering our current depth at the position?
I do not have high hopes for our offense going forward.
Moved to CB purely based on interception return potential.
Why, WHY? This guy was made for the jet sweep type plays. Maybe he can still get in on offense a few plays a game. (Probably not)
I just won the Heisman with Norfleet as a rb in my ncaa season. Does this mean I have to move him to corner now? Seriously though, I dont get this move. He must have really been shitty in practice.
Book it, my friends.
Also, Keith Stone to 3-tech.
Keith Stone's best rush move: "Hold my 'stones." *TFL!*
"Hold my 'stones." *SACK!*
He's so smooth!
Norfleet was too much of a playmaker for Borges. His replacment at RB is AJ Williams.
I hope that you were being sarcastic.
Norfleet didn't make a single significant rb play all season.
I'll admit I am a bit puzzled by this move but I think a bit of perspective is necessary...stats showed that he was an average kick returner and he couldn't garner meaningful playtime, even with our atrocious running game. The way people are acting seems like we just moved denard to safety...
do an adequate job revealing our generally craptastic kickoff blocking?
The Dino-punt formation doesn't help our punt returns either.
^This.
I thought the guy made quite a bit out of very little this year on Kick-offs. Because he didn't break one long I don't think means he lacks any speed/agility. He didn't break one long because it was impossible to do so, meaning he actually did do a nice job with what was "given to him".
was our punt returner - not norfleet. and your point is that norfleet would have had better stats if he had better players around him? uh, yah. so would everyone...
Still return kicks, not sure why everybody is so up in arms...on offense he could run one play, jet sweep, and we can probably run that play with Hayes if it even stays in the play book. Seems like he is destined for nickel back coverage and not anytime soon. He can still do what he was probably brought here to do, return kicks or punts.
Norlfeet looks like a career returner to me, not much more. They can switch him to Nose Guard for all I care, he's going to be behind many others at RB, Corner, Receiver, Safety... He was a flier as a recruit whose worked out well in a special teams role. He's a good little returner, but I never saw him playing meaningful minutes on O or D anyway. RB makes the most sense as his "position" given his skills and the team's depth there, but honestly, which group he practices with every day is of minimal concern to me.
Exactly, lets not forget this guy was a late offer by the staff. The coaches clearly didn't have huge expectations for him at RB from the get go.
panic level for M offense, 2013 version, sloooowly starting to rise.
Lewan and the twosie gone....breaking in up to 4 new starters on the O-line....our best WR is also our projected starting QB....we have very poor WR depth....Northfleet now a CB....
Borges' fault?
Oh come on (this is not directed only at you). Were you guys expecting Dennis Norfleet to carry the load at RB next fall? He got a small handful of carries on offense and did almost nothing with them. He would be behind Fitz (if healthy), Rawls, likely Hayes, and maybe even Deveon Smith and Derrick Green if he comes.
Point is, there has been no indication that Norfleet can be a quality option on offense, but now we're gonna give up on 2013 because he's not there? I think he could have been a nice weapon at one point too, but I wasn't planning on him having that big of a role next fall. And if the coaches are moving him, my guess is he hasn't stood out at RB when we're not watching either.
at best he was a V. Smith and at worst he was an even smaller V. Smith. Tiny RB's have never done well at Michigan and on the bright side, he is still returning kicks.
Morris, Jamie.
Hart, Mike.
They were short, but not exactly tiny at 25 -35 lbs heavier than what Norfleet is listed at.
And they ran like it. Both had good moves, but they ran with a ferocity that we haven't seen from Norfleet yet. Hart impressed everyone in '04 not because of his sharply quick feet, but by the way he carried much larger tacklers into the end zone.
Well who were you envisioning to provide offense?
Here is our RB depth chart at the moment:
Rawls
Hayes
...(Northfleet was here)
We have two true-frosh RBs thus far
Smith
Shallman
With Green as a possible third.
I'm hopeful that Smith is underrated, seems to have good vision, doesn't have top-end speed, but you need to be able to get to the second level/outside first, and without interior line blocking, top-end speed can be a little moot. There has been even less indication that Rawls and Hayes were the answer.
Our WR depth is even worse:
Darboh/Chasson, Gallon, Dileo, Jackson. That's it...we have 3 true frosh (Dukes, York, Jones) coming in, but all are more under-the-radar types.
I'm all for optimism/spring practice hasn't even begun yet, etc. Howeva, the talent pool @ RB, WR is threadbare, and were NOT strong points in the 2012 offense. Losing two of the pieces (even if they weren't the centerpieces) does NOT inspire optimism.
Edit: I left Fitz off the depthchart for now; that was a nasty injury and will wait to see how his rehab goes before putting him at the top of the heap at the moment.
It's common enough for freshmen to play at running back, so whoever comes in is likely to get some time on the field next year, but you make a good point.
Don't forget Drake Johnson. Hoke said at his last presser he wished freshmen could play in the bowl game and keep their redshirts in reference to him. Not saying he's going to start, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was ahead of Norfleet.
I suppose it could be because he's an awesome corner, but man, this is kind of depressing. Hope for a diverse elite offense is slowly starting to sink.
I like him but he is not elite - he is a fast kid who may or may not be good at rb or corner.
an athlete. He started returning kicks as a true freshman and is obviously showing something to the coaches. Smallish athletes have been proving armchair pundits wrong for a long time.
I hope Dennis turns to be another "story" like a certain slow walk-on who played safety and became a team captain.
Or perhaps we're going to be seeing a new RB come in very soon. :) Ok not for the bowl game ...*grumble grumble bryant gumbel*
Hayes and Drake must be looking good. Or maybe they feel good about Green.
Or our OC doesn't know what to do with certain types of players.
You know we have a head coach too, right? Maybe let's not blame everything on Al Borges.
It's pretty well known that our head coach doesn't actually do anything other than recruiting, instructing the D-line and decide when to go for it during games.
At least he does all of those things well.
Ohio. 4th and 2, opening drive of the second half ring any bells.
It was the right decision, just the wrong playcall... And Borges calls the plays.
And Hoke is also the leader. Never ever ever ever forget how he handled the Hagerup OH-NO punt mistake. I cannot overstate how much his handling of that situation means to the integrity of our program.
Just because it didn't work doesn't make it a bad call. And one bad decision does not a bad decision maker make.
Out OC wants to play players that fit his desired style of play and Fleet is not SO dynamic that Borges should change the offense around him. Of our coaching changes over the past few years have taught u's anything is that it is important to have players suited for your desired system.
Norfleet was signed last year by Hoke. At the time, I seem to recall it was primarily to be a kick returner.
Borges staking his claim for most obstinate offensive coach in last five years.
To be fair, RR did try to convert Steven Threet into a run-first spread QB.
Not really. That was a pretty balanced offense and, besides, it's not like Threet could throw the ball anyway. People act like we had 2001 Miami or 2004 USC when RR showed up. That team had just about nothing to work with. What difference would it have made it RR tried to install the Wishbone, the Air Raid, the spread option, or just stayed with a pro-style offense? Maybe we go from 3-9 to 5-7, max, and that's if that clown Mallett stayed and we ran pro-style. Seriously, who cares? This horse is dead, beaten, rotting, and rancid at this point. And what's worse, the point is moronic and counterfactual.
Take out DeBord, and you've got the last 20 years covered.
Hey look - another inexplicable, idiotic move by our coaching staff.
Yeah right, the coaching staff that has taken the least talented Michigan teams in recent memory (at least 20+ years) and went 19-6. Im not saying to blindley listen to whatever they say but you act like they are incompentent. This is the best coaching staff Michigan has had since the Moeller days.
Seriously - you'd think after such a dynamic season at running back, the coaches wouldn't dream of moving him around. However will we find someone to make up those 14 rushing yards against UMass?
Exactly this. Hoke moved a player from a position where he was not going to contribute Rockne where he may.
You're absolutely right. Given our terrible depth at CB and all of our graduating players at that position, what we really need is a 5'6 RB to fill that gaps. Amazing how people here people on here reject even the most obvious criticisms of this coaching staff.
"Another idiotic move by our coaching staff" is not an obvious criticism.
So the staff that actually watches this kid everyday - the staff that is going for its 20th win in two years - is less-qualified to determine his proper position than you, random dude on the internet?
This staff isn't perfect, but they've gotten a hell of a lot more things right than wrong.
He was a true freshmen. Regardless, I think most of the discontent is that he represents one of the only really quick, fast, shifty guys on offense. I doubt anyone here would argue that he should be a feature back, but it's frustrating that a guy who has shown flashes of strong athletic ability will never get worked into the offense in some capacity.
How is it idiotic to move him from RB? Even this past year when our RBs were averaging like half a yard per carry (obviously not exactly, it was more like a full yard or something) he couldn't crack the top 3 RB spots. He rarely saw the field so perhaps he has limitations. Speculating, but maybe he fumbles, misses cuts, poor vision, drops on first contact - who knows.
Also, maybe his running style just doesn't fit what hoke wants to do.
I could see all of the angst if hoke were converting a stud RB to corner. But he is not. He is coverting a 4th string RB to corner.
Dennis Norfleet will never see the field at corner. That's why it's idiotic.
But Devin Norfleet might!
Do you know that he would at RB? As a sophomore, he'd be behind Fitz, Hayes and Rawls, and maybe behind a couple others too. It's not like he had a clear shot at RB either, especially since Hayes is his class and Rawls is only one above him.
Ok, so don't put him at RB then.
Speculating, but maybe he fumbles, misses cuts, poor vision, drops on first contact
Obviously you're speculating (see how I picked up on that), but wouldn't any of these traits also be worrisome for a kick returner? I suppose it is possible not to be able to pick out holes in a more compacted run from scrimmage but have the abilty to find the right route when tacklers are more spread out like in kick return.
Norfleet seems like a kid who wants to contribute in any way shape or form. His attitude seems pretty emphatic when returning kick offs and hell the kid just excites me when he catches the ball and runs it out the endzone on kick offs. Maybe he wasn't happy with only returning kicks a few times a game and was looking for other ways to contribute so he had a sit down with the coaches about the depth chart and decided to give him a shot at corner as possibly the thinnest position. Does it necessarily mean he can't return to running back if the need arises? I mean look at Gardner.. QB to WR back to QB in less than half of a season roughly...
My theory is this is a trial run to see if he can be a good corner which I assume the coaches think there is a decent shot. If it doesn't work, they move him back to RB in the Spring or before Fall practice. It's not like learning RB is that hard that he couldn't go back before Fall practice and be able to play (ok, blocking is kind of hard but that's unlikely to be his specialty anyway).
I think the odds are near zero that he's moving to CB if they didn't expect him to be at least 2nd string at one of the CB positions (nickel?).
Remember, Borges RBs at SD State were small.
His RB's were small because he was recruiting at...SDSU. Look at Auburn.
I choose to see the upside in this by assuming we now have Derrick Green AND Ty Isaac in the bag... And Dorial Green-Beckham. That's why we didn't move Norfleet to slot.
For some reason I feel this is temporary for the Outback. I still see him as Michigan's next Percy Harvin/Quizz Rodgers.
Hey dol, merry dol! Ring a ding dillo! Ring a don, hop along, fal all the willow! Tom Jom, jolly Tom, Tom Bombadillo!!!
But i honestly cant remember a good 5'6" CB. I could be wrong but i really dont think there has been one here.
I don't think there has been one anywhere.
I guess it's a good thing that he's 5'7"!
So so so stupid. Now that he's at corner, he'll never be able to produce on the offensive side of the ball. A school like Michigan isn't going to ever let a kid playing cornerback and line up on offense, right?
"Schools" don't make decisions. Coaches do.
Luckily Hoke was on that staff, so we're good.
Ok, so because Hoke was on the staff 15 years ago when probably the best athelete in Michigan football history played both sides of the ball, Norfleet will be a successful on offense while playing corner?
It certainly doesn't preclude that he will be successful on offense. I think what I've gleaned from this is, given I think for the most part the staff isn't completely retarded, is that by their judgment Norfleet probably can't cut it at RB so they decided to try him somewhere else. The sky is not, in fact, falling.
Manti Teo would have been the first primarily defensive player to win the Heisman?
Sincerely,
ESPN
Unless he is Tyrann Mathieu 2.0, I'd rather see him in the slot receiver position...
I've wondered about this, too. Given his open-field elusiveness, wouldn't that make sense?
Honestly, has he really shown open-field elusiveness? He accelerates quickly, but hasn't shown that much as far as eluding tacklers.
IIRC, Shane had Norfleet on his 7 on 7 team, and Shane went to him often. I thought that was one of the small reasons we could have recruited Norfleet.
I dont get this at all. Can we at least get him a few more looks on offense before we banish him to the CB depth chart? Enough with the mgokissup line of..."well I trust the coaches." They're human, they make mistakes, and not above criticism...see Al Borges.
The shortest cornerbacks to make the Pro Bowl were the quartet of Aaron Glenn, Antoine Winfield, Cortland Finnegan, and Dre Bly, all of whom measured in at 5'9". Who knows, maybe Norfleet's got major hops. But even if so, I think he would be more dynamic at the RB position, heck, even the slot -- why not.
I don't think the NFL Pro Bowl is a good measuring stick to use. It's not like there have been many pro bowl running backs his height either.
I totally agree, but that was not meant to "measure" his potential at cornerback, just pointing out the odds of success in the NFL around that height.
I don't know about pro-bowls, but there have been plenty of excellent running backs right around 5'6 or 5'7.
Ok, name them. The cut off size for most quality short running backs in nfl history is 5'8". They all were/are roughly 25-30 lbs heavier then Norfleet.
The shortest cornerbacks to make the Pro Bowl were the quartet of Aaron Glenn, Antoine Winfield, Cortland Finnegan, and Dre Bly, all of whom measured in at 5'9".
Do they all actually stand 5'9" or is that just their listed height?
Darrell Green is listed as 5'9" officially, but on his own website is listed as 5'8". And by 5'8", I believe he means around 5'6".
The seven Pro-Bowls are beyond dispute, however.
It's all good. They're trying to Woodson-ify him, just in reverse!
Man I don't get this. With Gallon and Dileo gone after next year we got nothing as far as slot recievers go. That along with being pretty loaded at cb assuming countess comes back strong and this looks like a head scratcher. I was really expecting big things from Norfleet as a kind of slot/change of pace rb/gadget player like you see a lot of nowdays.
Gallon doesn't play slot receiver, anyway.
Michigan doesn't run the same offense that they did when Rodriguez was here. True fact.
Not like he was going to start at RB. People are acting like he rushed for 500 yards last year...and all this elusive talk I just didn't see either. The guy has good speed, it's not like he still can't do what he did this year, return kicks.
No, he wasn't going to start, but he could have been a useful piece of the offense. He's almost certain to ride the pine at corner.
I think Hayes can fulfill the role people envisioned norfleet doing. Evidently the coaches don't plan on running many plays for a 5'6 slot type receiver. I think they want a back who doesn't leave the field much and a speedster or two at WR...
What makes you say that? Avery is going to be a senior in 2013, and nobody is established at slot corner behind him. Hollowell hasn't lit the world on fire, and Michigan's best slot corner in my memory was Brandon Harrison, another guy who was about 5'8" and pretty darn fast. Maybe Norfleet can play field corner, maybe he can play slot corner. But I don't think he's guaranteed to be buried on the bench any more than the other corners who aren't currently starting.
I'm mostly kidding. But not entirely.
I like Norfleet as a change of pace back. Why do all of our backs have to be big bruisers. Can't we have a few burners?
I see people are having their usual freakout. Keep in mind that 1) position changes aren't necessarily permanent (see our current starting QB) and 2) that the 2013 season is a long way away.
Let's remember people like to talk about how the sec puts it's best athletes on defense. Maybe mattison seen something he liked and told Brady he thinks his 3rd string running back could be a playmaker on defense. I would be more concerned if they were moving him out of necessity, but right now they seem to have decent depth at both positions. That being said I think this is being done more because they see potential than to fill a hole.
There goes my dream of him being our De'Anthony Thomas/Percy Harvin type player.
Oh come on - those guys were mega 5-star recruits who were explosive from day 1 on very good teams. He was not going to be those guys.
Thinking the coaches are smart enough to know if Dennis is going to be the next deanthony Thomas or harvin, obviously he isn't that type of player, so lets just watch this unfold.
According to my grandma's son's son, my gut feeling is that he's no Vincent Smith when it comes to pass pro and he's all Vincent Smith in terms of bulk.
where we are very shallow :(
5'7, not exactly wide receiver size, we won't be recruiting little receivers anymore.
OK, I just scanned the thread and saw Dennis Norfleet's name mentioned in the same breath as Charles Woodson, Percy Harvin, and De'Anthony Thomas.
Really? We are talking about a kid who couldn't crack the paper-thin depth chart at tailback this season and ranked 49th in the country in kickoff return average. I'm not even convinced he's the long-term answer at kickoff returner, let alone anywhere else. Some people here need to stop channeling their inner Fred Jackson and breathe into a paper bag for a couple minutes.
I was just thinking to myself that he didn't really impress me all that much with his kick returns. I'm sure he will get better at finding lanes, but he may not be a lock to keep the KR job. Also, wasn't Hayes the top all-purpose back coming out of high school? My guess is that Hayes is out shining him in practice.
Norfleet did, however, have a better kick return average than Steve Breaston did as a redshirt freshman. And Breaston was pretty good. Also, Norfleet had to deal with the fact that kickers are kicking off from 5 yards closer than they did to Breaston.
I'm not saying people should be freaking out, just taking issue a little bit with you not being impressed by his kick returns.
I guess my expectations were just a little too high. I also didn't even think about the kickoffs being 5 yards closer. I just expected him to take a couple to the house, but I'm sure that will come.
This move isn't that surprising. He wasn't going to be a very good running back in my opinion. He's way to small for manball. Short corners can be very good in college. He has the speed and athletic ability to hawk a receiver. The question is does he have the intangibles and instincts? Most college QB's aren't accurate enough to exploit height like they do in the NFL. I wouldn't be surprised if he turns out to be a reliable DB.
Per the ESPN article, Norfleet played corner soph and junior years in HS
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegesMichigan/post/_/id/8993/norfleet-makes-m...
What the fuck? If anything, move the kid to receiver. He's too talented with the ball in his hands to move to the other side of the ball.
I dunno. Seems like it must be depth issue. We got some depth issues at Center, why not move Norfleet there? LOL.
The blow-up here from a bunch of people with no in-depth knowledge of the situation over a guy who has contributed almost nothing on offense is a little bit ridiculous.
Whaddaya know, a guy who we were told on National Signing Day probably wouldn't play much running back in college...
...isn't going to play much running back in college.
This is totally out of left field, guys.
get this move
Am I taking crazy pills here!? This is a horrible move. It doesn't utilize his skill set at all. There has to be another motive for this.
"It doesn't utilize his skill set at all."
His skill set involves being really fast and agile. I didn't realize that cornerbacks aren't supposed to be fast and agile. I have just learned something brand new about this game you people call football.
Skill set is returning kicks and possibly punts, and honestly, while he had a nice return average, it's not like he lit the world on fire on kick offs either. It's funny how so many on here thought Dennis was going to be the next Darren sproles or harvin when he was primarily brought here to play special teams, this was discussed many times. People are so panicked because we possibly moved our 4th or 5th string running back. As far as those wanting him to play slot receiver, we aren't running rich Rodriguez type offense anymore.
The more I think about this the more I realize that Norfleet probably had a 6 inch growth spurt. Everybody calm down!
after seeing all these people talk about Darren Sproles 2.0 because Brian had a boner for the kid. He did nothing to make me or any other reasonable person think he was like Darren Sproles, aside from being small and fast. He didn't take over the starting RB spot, hell,he didn't take over the second string RB spot. So who gives a shit if he moves to corner? It's not like we are moving a 1000 yard RB to CB. We are putting our kick returner in a position to see the field more frequently.
after seeing all these people talk about Darren Sproles 2.0 because Brian had a boner for the kid. He did nothing to make me or any other reasonable person think he was like Darren Sproles, aside from being small and fast. He didn't take over the starting RB spot, hell,he didn't take over the second string RB spot. So who gives a shit if he moves to corner? It's not like we are moving a 1000 yard RB to CB. We are putting our kick returner in a position to see the field more frequently.
Jesus, even Sproles didn't do crap his true freshman year. He only played in six games and didn't even start until his junior year.
I think that's kind of the point. There's no need to "get a boner" for him so early. He might be just as good - or better - on defense as he was on offense.
I said this the other day in the original "Norfleet to safety?" front page post, but of the two third down backs on the roster (Hayes, Norfleet), Norfleet has more potential on defense and those two guys are in the same class. This could be a way of getting both guys on the field without one always blocking the other's playing time.
Can't believe most of you are questioning this move. Mattison's defense, which has been our saving grace now has yet another instrument. I believe he knows what he is doing. Sure Norf could be used on offense but do you really expect Borges to use Norfleet properly if at all? We can barely get people like Funchess on the field enough.
When he is back for kickoffs, I enjoy how he rocks his head and flexes his arms like the Fox robot. I just saw some of the Northwestern game for the first time and noticed Taylor Lewan doing it too. Good moves for an offensive lineman. Come to think of it, seems like Taylor may really love college football? I hope?
Everybody needs to take a chill pill. It is ENTIRELY POSSIBLE Norfleet doesn't pan out at corner and switches back to offense. The kid has three more freaking years at Michigan. This isn't necessarily permanent (he may even switch back this spring) and he is still doing what he did best last year, so stop losing your marbles!
He contributed essentially zero on offense and buried on the depth chart. He is exciting with the ball and appears to have big-play potential - which is rare on thr roster for next year.
Without Denard, I suspect all of us are concerned about the O. Norfleet, though, is not the answer.
I like the speed and quickness. Something that has been missing.
Speed overcomes a lot of weaknesses.
I like it -- get the dynamic kids on the field. He played CB in HS, he'll still return kicks, and they'll probably work him into packages on offense in time. Nothing to fret about -- oh wait, this is a Michigan board...so in that case, PANIC!!!!
I trust these coachs 100%, unless it's 4th and 2 at Ohio State on our side of the field.
1. Norfleet has shown nothing at RB. We won't miss any production, we'll just have one less guy to pin all of our unrealistic hope on.
2. He has shown no ability to catch the ball. He may have it, but we don't know. So, why should he be a slot? Our best passing offenses featured guys like 6'1" Steve Breaston in the slot. Just because a man is small does not make him a good slot.
3. He has shown no ability, nor is he likely to possess said ability, to block. This would be a knock on him at RB and WR.
4. If his physical profile is OK to fit in as a slot, his profile is OK to cover the slot. why worried that he's small? More to the point, how can the same people complain that he's not moving to slot AND insist he's too small to be a nickel? For the record, I think he will probably never be a factor at either position. See #6.
5. Our RB depth is not a problem numbers-wise, the problem is quality. He couldn't crack the depth chart this year; he was almost certain to move further down behind the freshman coming in, particularly if we land Green, who could be a four year starter.
6. This move does not in any way affect Norfleet's true position, which is return man. Even when he signed, we were told he would primarily be a returner. Why are we so up in arms?
7. A lot of guys wanted to see him as a "part of the offense". That's fine, but these people are probably the same ones who would complain every time a play broke down that "hey, Borges, way to be creative. Norfleet was in the game, of course it's gonna be the jet sweep or a fake off of that. Any defensive coordinator could plan for that." You can't have it both ways. You either want a real offense with cohesion, or you want a bundle of tricks that lack any real flow.
i'm gonna take this to meant that the staff knows green is coming and with him and deveon rb depth is okay.
i'm also gonna take tihs as treadwell is coming too, and they need more people to cover him in practice.
certainly that's what this is about.