Also glad to see Devin get some reps.
Hoke: Denard "should be fine"
I just LOL'd at work reading that one...
Yeah because he should be embarrassed that he plays football for the University of Michigan and is getting a free, first class education.
I'm sure that you were doing much better at 19.
take it easy.. bellomy looked terrible. There are true freshman QB's who have done 10x better than him and they were in high school 6 months ago. Shit look at Manziel..freshman and all, he is dominating and he was a 3 star. Bellomy was unprepared and looked poor even on basic throws
I do not mean this to be critical of Bellomy here, but I'm wondering how much a kid can learn from playing in that game on Saturday. If anything, his confidence has to be shattered, doesn't it? For the record, it looked like he took it in stride after each series and didn't appear to be shaken, at least from where I was sitting in my living room. I know if it were me I would probably be laying on the ground crying. These kids are pretty damn impressive competitors.
We've coined a new term for a less than stellar performance: Bellomy'd
No offense to you profit, but that's the difference between you and a Big Ten football player.
This is not the first time Russell Bellomy has screwed up on a football field, he knows how to handle it. No, he didn't look great, but I'm sure he learned plenty from his experience. My guess is the next time we see Bellomy on the field he looks a solid step better.
And that's why I said I'd be laying on the sideline crying. I said nothing about him not playing well, I said that it would seemingly be very, very difficult for him to not be shaken. Some people learn from those experiences, some people never recover. I think its a little too early to determine if he learned in a positive way.
I worry. His mudda worries, too.
in the last sentence of your post:
"These kids are pretty damn impressive competitors." He'll be fine. And I strongly believe he'll play much better the next time he's thrust into a non-mop up time of a game.
You could say the same thing about Brendan Gibbons' freshman season. Look how far he's come.
Not necesarily confidence-shattering; true, it illustrated the degree to which nerves can really interfere with his playing ability, and that's gotta be a little angst-inducing.
But isn't it just as likely for him to think, "I choked in my first clutch game in front of a hostile crowd; now I know what that feels like and I won't do it again." He's been through the worst of it. Onward and upward.
That what I HOPE he feels like, anyway.
Chad Henne had about the best freshman season ever for a Michigan quarterback. That's not a very fair comparison.
John Navarre, Tom Btady, Brian Griese . . . their debuts didn't go quite as well.
you could be talking about John Navarre's performance as a redshirt freshman against UCLA and Illinois. This was AFTER two impressive statistical performances in pitch-and-catch games against a couple of MAC tomato cans.
Navarre was scared shitless against Illinois. Anthony Thomas look up in disgust after Navarre didn't come anywhere close on a simple open swing pass. 9,000+ of passing yards later, it seems as if Lloyd was wise not to write him off because of his deer-in-the-headlights games.
To be fair, he said that at halftime too.
I don't think I'd have phrased it as, "To be fair, [Hoke] said the same thing at halftime [of the game in Lincoln]." Yes; that is exactly what Hoke said. Before a disastrous half of football in which Denard Robinson was unable to play.
It is an obvious thing to say about Hoke; that we've heard it from Hoke before and it wasn't true. And when Hoke commented on Denard at halftime, he was, it turns out, misleading. Hoke could have said that they were still evaluating Denard. He could have said he wasn't sure, but that he planned to talk to the trainers at halftime. Hoke didn't do that. He said Denard would be "fine." So we know what that means now. It means anything. Or nothing.
I don't know exactly who we are being "fair" to, in the case of Hoke's completely uninformative comments on injuries. Maybe we need to be "fair" to the Vegas bookies who really want to know if Denard will be playing next week, or in any more weeks.
Didn't Hoke say at halftime that he expected Denard to play again in that game? Hopefully this is more than just gamesmanship (which seems possible, since you wouldn't want Minnesota to prepare for Bellomy all week when they could be trying to figure out a Denard plan).
Please be right this time
...I should be fine driving home in hurricane Sandy in my 98' dodge neon but I may get a boo-boo.
I think the game plan for Minnesota should be to hand the ball off if D-rob is in there or not.
I said it in the other thread, but I'll say it here too. I've had denard's injury before. First there is searing pain, then you can hardly squeeze your hand. The weakness/numbness lasts 3-5 days and then you are normal again. If it was as bad as what happened to me, there is no way he could even hold a football. I coudln't even open a door. 5 days later i was 100%. Denard should be fine.
accurately in a lacrosse arm pad ...
For the kids in our crowd:
You should compare Bellomy's performance to the first-year performance of sophomore Brian Griese. He STUNK. Couldn't throw more than 5 yards past the LOS. Lost to NW in a low-scoring game where one stinking TD would have won it, but with Griese at QB, we couldn't get first downs.
Obv, Griese got better. Now, I'm not predicting Bellomy wins the NC in two years. But, my point is, these are kids. They get older and grow and develop.
I would expect to see him wear some protection on that elbow. I know that it's his throwing arm but I have to think that landing on it, again, on a Field Turf surface is going to result in a similar injury. Some type of protection may minimize the effects, of landing on the elbow, thus keeping his time on the sideline to a minimum.
Wouldn't a simple elbow pad help?
Hoke also said Denard should be fine and ready to go for the second half at halftime. I'll take this with a grain of salt.
this incident illustrates how thin we are at QB, which begs the question:
Who will be the starting QB next year when Denard departs for the NFL?
True freshman Morris? Bellomy? Gardner? Which QB would you like to see groomed to take over? Assuming that Morris is not ready to start, I think I would prefer Gardner. At least he can run better than Bellomy and is a larger body and, hence, more difficult to take down. From what I've seen of him in the spring game and limited appearances in a few games, he can throw the ball, albeit erratically at times. Which QB would the Mgobloggers prefer behind the helm?
It might be a good idea to start looking around at possible transfers. I'm not sure if I can ever feel truly confident about a true freshman starting at QB.
Give him a super intense turnover prevention course and things should be fine. Next year's defense is going to be a beast yet again and the schedule gets a lot easier. If Denard doesn't give the ball away against ND or get hurt against Nebraska this year's team is sitting at 7-1 with a win over a top-10 ND team (that won't be as good next year) even without a super charged offense.
Having another guy defenses really have to worry about in the ground game just makes everything easier on offense. Even if Gardner isn't the best passer (and he's probably ahead of Bellomy and at least even with a true freshman Morris), his margin for error is much better because of his athletic ability. I'll take boring, methodical offense with the occasional first down scramble for 10 wins, Alex!
Of course, Gardner, Morris, and Bellomy should all be given consideration (i.e. reps) in camp, and let the coaches evaluate and choose the starter. But if they choose based on maximizing 2013, I think Gardner would be the winner.
I'm still not sure why they didn't at least try Devin on Saturday, once Bellomy had gone 0-10. I know he probably doesn't take as many snaps at QB in practice, but Hoke has said he still practices at QB. He certainly couldn't have done any worse, and definitely wasn't helping at WR at that point.
I don't understand why Gardner adorned the bench. It's not like he was contributing majorly at the WR position. He is faster than Bellomy and a bigger body. I am sure he could not have done worse than Bellomy.
even with Devin's limited impact at WR, he's still a big body to throw at. Put that in at QB with little to no (im going with literally zero) reps, and who's he going to throw to? any of about 5 tiny slot targets and a freshman tight end that every team has now identified as a guy M will look to throw to. Meanwhile, Nebraska tee's off on this quasi-spread zone read stuff and beats the crap out of Gardner, potentially further limiting his role on the team via injury. I would much rather have at least the hope of a downfield jump-ball drop to Gardner from the actual back-up who may have at least gotten 10 reps at QB last week.
Not a win for M. maybe he does slightly better, with fewer turnovers, but M still does not win that game with Gardner playing QB. Not happening. Brian said it this morning. M offense minus Denard = 2008.
Going forward, sure, I could get behind Gardner actually preparing as a QB in case of emergency, but you have to have a plan and preparation. The situation against Nebraska was going to be a tire fire any way you cut it.
I always thought that switching Gardner to WR would be irrevocable; at least on a couple of weeks' notice. I wasn't surpriesed the Gardner was not the second-string QB.
What surprised me, was how totally lost Bellomy looked.
I'm still not sure why they didn't at least try Devin on Saturday, once Bellomy had gone 0-10.
Hoke said that he HAS NOT been taking many snaps at QB. There is no confirmation of why, but there is a lot of speculation that Gardner's injury versus ND -- to his throwing arm -- might be effecting his ability to play QB more than his ability to play WR. If that 's the case, then it makes sense that DG wouldn't even be considered as a viable option at QB once Denard went down.
Why are you so obsessed with this issue? Do you REALLY think that if DG was, in fact, a better option that the coaching staff would NOT have played him? Since he wasn't put in, one of two things MUST be true: 1) he's been beaten out by Bellomy as the backup QB; and/or 2) he's incapable of playing QB due to injury. I suspect it's #2 considering if it was only #1, after the 0-10 and INT fest start, as you said, DG couldn't have done much worse.
You can't just go out there and draw plays up on the ground. "You do a button hook in front of the red car."
Hope Denard get's a nice padded elbow sleeve and get play very limited the next 2 weeks. Get a two score lead and head to the bench and let the defense win it. Let's just hope the two score lead isn't two field goals. Lol.
So cutting through the coachspeak here, I would say it's 50/50, at best, that Denard plays against the Gophers.
Even if we're stuck with Bellomy again, it will be after a week's worth of preparation, against a weaker opponent. (Remember how Sheridan looked against the Gophers in '08? Awwww yeah.)
Remember how Sheridan looked against the Gophers in '08? Awwww yeah.
Wow, that game really brings back some crazy emotions. Sheridan looked like freakin Johnny Unitas in that game. Definitely, his "One Shining Moment" in his UM career.
Yeah, I will always remember that game, not just because I remember every single game unless I am blackout drunk, but because I was in Vancouver, BC, and called every bar in the telephone book until I found one that would put the game on for me. I had this whole room, with full bar, to myself. I was expecting a brutal hand-off of the LBJ to those varmits, but the Gophers star receiver was hurt and couldn't play, and Sheridan got REVERSEBODYSNATCHED.
If he bruised his ulnar nerve, which is what was said, then Denard will be fine in a couple days
So all of this over a funny bone?
I don't think Coach Hoke would have said "Denard is out for this weekend" even if he knew it for a fact. I'll believe Denard is healthy when he lines up under center against the Gophers.
him be in the gun
in one package, but plays football instead.
Besides the clear lack of armstrength, I think we still know nothing about what Russ can do as a starter. Do I hope Devin or a freshman Morris rise up to take the reigns next year? yes, of course. In a situation like this, whoever comes off the bench when denard goes down is totally screwed --- maybe a few snaps with the first team during the last week?. Nebraska was going to tee off on that person. We were so lucky to have a former starter and generally experienced Forcier on the team in 2010. That is an anomaly. You generally aren't going to have a STAR qb1 and a rock solid backup.
So, 2 things:
(1) I disagree with those saying that Gardner should have been the guy. Nebraska's still going to tee off on the run, without even the faint hope of throwing to a guy like himself on the outside. Gardner's not really seemed all that comfortable or competent in his past mop-up duties. Add to that that he clearly HAS NOT PRACTICED AT A QB--- my guess is he has taken literally zero snaps in weeks, despite the coachspeak indicating that he takes reps here and there. I take my chances with the proclaimed back-up, and maintain the off-chance that a 6'4 athlete like Gardner can make a play from the receiver standpoint.
(2) I don't think we can crucify Russ until we have to see him play after a week of preparation to be the starter. Yes, he doesn't appear to have much of an arm, but on many of those throws against nebraska, he looked like he just had no idea what the play was supposed to look like or where he was supposed to throw.
Much more often than not, at ANY level, a backup QB in the game = death. On the positive side, Bellomy's tackle was fucking impressive.
You generally aren't going to have a STAR qb1 and a rock solid backup.
Premier FBS teams should have a solid #2 option and if you have a running QB with a propensity for getting dinged up, you MUST MUST MUST have this #2 option. It's inexcusable for a coaching staff to somehow deny the reality of Denard getting hurt and allow a tire fire like that to happen.
It appears Ohio has figured out that Miller is the majority of their offense, and if he goes down they are screwed unless their backup QB is prepared to step in for clutch performance and OT win ...
Oh wait Kenny Guiton is a Junior. So other teams save their Junior bench QBs to employ as back up QBs ....
make me wonder WHY the trainers don't have Denard wearing some sort of pad on his elbow or forearm ? The was not any serious "hit" involved on the play.
A pad there might affect his throwing motion.
Basically debunks all the speculations that DG's shoulder injury was what kept him from the QB job last Sat. We all know separated shoulder or simiar injuries don't heal overnight. DG should be our 2nd string QB on the depth chart and should start taking more snaps no matter how Denard feels. We learned this hard way.
How does this "debunk" such speculation? You're right, a separated shoulder doesn't heal overnight, which is why he might not have been taking reps at QB, but now that 3 weeks have passed, he's able to. Remember, preparation for Nebraska started right after the MSU game, and DG might still have been ailing.
Denard gets injured, and DG's shoulder is ready to take snaps?
I am not naive enough to believe such a coincidence. Besides, recent (post-Neb game) interviews indicate that DG took some snaps during the past week but didn't take "enough" snaps to sub Bellomy.
Above all, do you really believe that DG was healthy enough to play WR but not so much to throw a ball? Separated shoulder injury usually occurs/aggravates due to sudden impact on your shoulder, and WR's take sh** loads of hits and impacts. Do you think they would clear DG to play WR if he has a seprated shoulder, severe enough to keep him from throwing?
Do you think that it would be that bad for Belomy to get a week to know he is starting? If he is the presumed starter next year wouldn't you like some real playing time first? Hopefully Denard is good next week, but if not the sun will still come up and we will still beat Minnesota. Remember Nick Sheridan beat Minnesota.
never put up a stat line as bad as Bellomy's for that amount of time played.
I have zero confidence that Bellomy is the presumed starter next year. Not with that arm and the ineffectiveness of the run game. I have a very bad feeling we're going to need big plays from the QB positiion again next year.
One thing I can applaud Bellomy on was his effort on one of his interceptions. He sprinted to make a TD-saving tackle and the defense ended up giving up only a field goal after that. If we would have had some kind of an offense, that could have been a play that changed the game.
He looked extremely quick. I wouldn't have minded him running a few more times. He had Michigan's longest run of the night with 15 yards, and after watching some highlights there were certainly a few plays he could have kept the ball.
Perhaps we should expand our QB recruiting to more than Shane.
I give him credit for that too. He could've quit on the play but he prevented the td after Smith catapulted the ball to the db.
Jesus you guys are really reaching. So you are happy he didn't both tank and give up? He also could have batted down the snap and balled up into a fetal position on every play or played with his helmet on backwards or thrown every pass to the other team instead of every fifth pass. Better be happy about those things too. We should expect more out of a 2nd string QB for Michigan. And I 'm not blaming him, I'm blaming his preparation.
As were other Michigan fans in attendance and fans throughout the country, I was baffled as to how Devin Gardner was never put in. Sure Bellomy is the back-up and Gardner hasn't practiced, but Bellomy was horrible. He has a poor delivery, had no confidence, and looked ready for the game to end. Even if Devin hasn't been practicing at quarterback, he should have been put in. He is quicker, stronger, and more confident. He has played on the road before and would not feel as much pressure. Furthermore, Nebraska would not put as much pressure on Gardner as they know he could not have been intimidated by the "blackshirts." It is baffling that Gardner needed to put in. Bellomy stunk. This reminds me of 2008 when both Nick Sheridan and Steven Threet stunk, yet Rich Rod never gave David Cone a chance to play. Absolutely baffling. And then don't get me started on Rawls not playing.
Glad to hear denard is doing a lot better, hope he's at full strength by the end of November. Does any know what type of injury he had during the game? He wasn't able to grip a ball from what the announcers were saying. I'm assuming its an ulnar nerve injury.
While that sounds good and he may be ready to start against the gophers, this injury has me worried. I'm no doctor but I get the feeling this is the type of injury that isn't going to completely heal until the off-season and could easily be re-occuring (sounds like this is what made him leave the Illinois game).
My big concern now is will he be able to finish games? Since UM has no rushing attack unless Denard is carrying the ball, he's going to be taking hits. I'll be surprised if in any of the next 4 games he doesn't have to come out because of the elbow.