ChiBlueBoy

January 17th, 2014 at 10:12 AM ^

Given the history with Woodson, there might be a tendency to use Peppers similarly. Primarily a CB with a package or 2 where he's at WR. At least, that's my guess.

Magnus

January 17th, 2014 at 12:49 PM ^

I wouldn't be entirely opposed to him getting snaps as a Wildcat quarterback, but that wouldn't really make sense if the current QB (Gardner) is already a big threat as a runner. Maybe in another year or two. But yeah, I definitely think the coaches should get him the ball some on offense, on end arounds, screens, posts, hitches, slants, etc.

LSAClassOf2000

January 17th, 2014 at 8:15 AM ^

Thanks for sharing this, Magnus. 

The most intriguing thing about this history is as you mentioned - fortunes seem to be all over the map, and indeed, a few of them ended up playing positions other than what they were recruited to play and never saw a snap as a cornerback.

I actually was surprised about Ginn - I didn't realize he was recruited to play CB initially. I wonder if that was one of those situations where staffs try someone out at another position for the heck of it and are floored in a good way. 

jmblue

January 17th, 2014 at 8:28 AM ^

It could be that they weren't even necessarily recruited to play CB, or not exclusively.  They probably all played on both sides of the ball in high school, but the recruiting gurus like to place every player in a single position, so they arbitrarily became "cornerback recruits." 

Magnus

January 17th, 2014 at 10:01 AM ^

Right. The recruiting services generally try to place a guy in a particular category. There is the "athlete" designation, but it would get boring if every guy was just ranked as an "athlete." As I was reading about all those guys, the majority of them had discussion of their success on offense when they were in high school - receiving totals, rushing totals, etc. Unless you go to a real powerhouse of a school (and even then in some cases), most coaches are going to play you both ways to give the team the best chance of winning.

JayMo4

January 17th, 2014 at 8:19 AM ^

In my amateur opinion, I think Peppers might have more upside at safety or on offense than at corner.  I'm not trying to be negative, either.  I say that because I think he might have Berry-like potential at S and he seems like a big threat with the ball in his hands (I also like him as a KR.)  So I mean it in a complimentary way.  I think he's going to be a big time player for Michigan.  But for the moment, I'm not so sure it'll be at corner.

MGoLogan

January 17th, 2014 at 8:27 AM ^

I might be completely wrong but I feel at safety there is only so much that can be done to impact a game.  A CB is able to completely shut down one side of the field or take away a teams #1 option while a safety is more of a last line of defense.  But yeah, either way I expect Peppers to have a huge impact.

mgobaran

January 17th, 2014 at 1:31 PM ^

Yeah, but it is a give an a take. Safeties can have bigger impacts on deep balls, as well as being more involved in stopping the run. Just look at 2011 & 2012. Kovacs definitely had more of an impact than Countess/Taylor/Floyd. And he had more of an impact at safety than he would have at CB. 

jmblue

January 17th, 2014 at 8:36 AM ^

Now that teams routinely send 3-5 WRs downfield, it's harder to speak of a CB shutting down half the field.  In Woodson's day it was true because teams generally only ran 2-man routes then, so he'd take one away.  Now, a single corner can only do so much if the offense wants to flood the field.  Teams avoid the top cover guy and throw at his weaker teammates.  That's where having good safeties is critical, because not too many teams have multiple good cover corners.

 

Magnus

January 18th, 2014 at 7:40 AM ^

It depends on how you play your safeties. If you leave them in Cover 2 all day long, then yes, the impact is limited. He's either coming up to stop the run, or he's dropping to his deep half. But if you blitz him, play robber, have him cover the deep middle, etc., then he can impact the game in a variety of ways.

Space Coyote

January 17th, 2014 at 9:25 AM ^

But I really don't agree about on offense. I think he can be a good offensive player (and will contribute there at some point), but as a RB he doesn't have the same upside as some of the top RBs in football; he'd be good, but not the potential standout IMO. Same with at WR, where he has physical tools that match some of the better players, but doesn't exceed them.

On defense he brings a very unique set of skills that gives him top potential that isn't really matched in this class or by many players overall, similar to the big name safeties/CBs that are out there right now. It's the Berry/Peterson upside on defense that he has, and I don't see the AP, Gurley, etc upside as a RB. Still a player that you want to get the ball to eventually, because of his skill and athletic ability, but much more upside on defense, at either CB or Safety (we'll have to see performance at the college level to really determine where he stands out between the two), IMO. 

Magnus

January 17th, 2014 at 9:40 AM ^

I agree. His physicality is one of his outstanding traits as a defensive back, but he's not particularly physical for a running back. I do think that he could be a standout running back because of his speed, agility, etc., but as a defender, I think he could be the best in the country after a year or two in college.

Space Coyote

January 17th, 2014 at 8:59 AM ^

Pretty sure Peterson was immediately their NB (or third CB) and also contributed on special teams. I'm also pretty sure he had a lot of cloud leverage responsibilities from his Boundary CB position, meaning he was more involved in the run.

He was also probably picked on a bit too, as freshman technique can tend to be good enough to make plays immediately after the catch, but is rarely good enough to actually shutdown WRs.

BlueCube

January 17th, 2014 at 8:24 AM ^

I was wondering if the recruiting services may have improved their evaluation methods over time as it seemed like the early years were not very productive.   Then I looked at the running back history, which I had somehow missed when you initially posted, and Reggie Bush's name popped was the second year.

It would be interesting to see film from all of them to see how their talent appears to measure to others.

Thanks for the post. Very informative.

mgobaran

January 17th, 2014 at 8:37 AM ^

I definitely see the trend when it comes to Rivals and CB recruiting. First 5 years, they had no clue what was going on. Since 2007, it's hard to envision a complete failure on their part. Even Malcolm Mitchell, who looked like he was going to have a breakout season at WR isn't a complete swing and miss. 

You can't really fault Rivals for college programs changing the kids position for that teams needs.

Space Coyote

January 17th, 2014 at 9:11 AM ^

Come on The Jeff, get your facts straight.

Actually a weird thing that I was thinking about as soon as Seth posted that, is the real Seth and the real Magnus now having to battle for who gets to keep the rights to the posts. Seth we have real pictures of, and therefore can envision him. Magnus we do not, and therefore must go by the information he has shared with us to surmise what he actually looks like.

Magnus is Latin, but is popular with Scandinavians. On TTB, his name is Thunder, again, a big thing with Scandinavians. He also coaches football, and I presume played football. But he also has a softer side. Putting all that together, I'm thinking taller (6'2"-ish) white guy, light brown, medium length hair, with a groomed beard. Bigger build, but he does still play basketball and works out his balance, so decently fit.

So now that I can envision both parties, I'm going to assume that they are going to partake in the foam weapon battles that the kids have every Saturday in the park near my home, dressed fully in proper medieval attire.

jaggs

January 17th, 2014 at 8:50 AM ^

your assessment in the final paragraph based on how they turned out as NFL players? If it is based on college, I think Ginn should probably be considered in the class with Peterson as a great player.

Bobby Boucher

January 17th, 2014 at 11:10 AM ^

Seems legit.  Stars next to the kids name doesn't always determine success.  Attittude, discipline and coaching had more to do with their successes rather than how athletic they looked coming out of HS.  

That's also very sad to hear about Oliver committing suicide in front of his family.  Hope his kids turn out alright inspite of seeing the worst thing imaginable.