Please come back, please come back, please come back...
Hardaway Jr to announce decision today
I think he's gone. I do believe that if he comes back, Mitch and GR III almost certainly will as well. Besides the fact that I've enjoyed watching him play, the potential Mitch/GR III domino effect is the biggest reason I hope he stays.
to connect the dots. Veteran upperclassman stays on for one more run at it so the talented underclassmen follow suit. Who said anything about these three bowling on the weekends?
I agree that he's probably gone. I just don't think it's a great decision for him to leave now, and I think the team would be better if he returned.
EPSN has him a second rounder and ndadraft.net has him at the end of of round 1. Do you leave early to be a second round draft pick?
Right, Darius Morris and Manny Harris?
What makes anyone think they'd have gone higher if they stayed?
It's simple....Returning another year is an opportunity to hone one's skill, making one a better player, thus a possible better draft position. THJ current draft statust is low first round at best. If the possibility of going into the second round with the no gurantee of a contract, then that should be one's incentive to stay in school just to get better. Of course he could be a "athlete-student", note not "student-athlete". If he was a athlete first,,,, and student second...then i cna understand why he would want to go pro.....simply stated...he simplydoesn't like to study. Regardless of his decision......we will wish him the best. Go Blue!
If my family needed the money, I might. Even if you don't latch on in the NBA, you can still go to Europe and get paid a decent sum.
player, I'm hoping his family doesn't need the money.
Ever seen Broke? THS is reportedly broke. (Note: He's not in Broke, but still.)
Where did you get that information? All I can find is that he has a net worth of $28M. Only 1 story I found mentions anything about money problems and even that is nebulous. I am not saying you're wrong but I'm not saying you're right, either.
This one talks about how pretty much all his business ventures have failed:
He does only own just that one hat.
Many NBA people view it as a negative to stay all four years because you're three years older than many of the prospects; thus, you're more likely to have a lower ceiling. So whether or not he's a late-first/second rounder isn't as important as whether coming back next year could mean that he's not drafted at all.
I assume his family doesn't need the money and his dad is an NBA scout. So they should have plenty of inside information.
If you don't feel your stock is going to get any higher.
People keep talking about his draft stock, but let's be honest, THJ isn't going to get THAT much better. He's pretty damn good now, if he comes back it's because he likes college and wants another run at a NC...not to improve draft stock.
IMO, it's the most overrate argument with THJ. Even if he does come back and has a better year, he's now a senior which bumps him down the boards even more.
In terms of draft stock, realistically the best case scenario if he returns is that he'll have a better year which will make up for the slots he'll naturally drop because he's a senior.
That said, I think it's fair to assume he'll have somewhat of a better year (although maybe not if people are keying on him instead of Burke). But with that assumption he's a late 1st/early 2nd either this year or next. So again, draft stock is meaningless in this case, assuming he stays healthy.
Whew, that's a lot of assumptions!
I don't understand the logic of him leaving. Money shouldn't be an issue as his dad was a multi-millionaire NBA star. And while I generally like THJ's game, he's not a first round lock anyway. He's one of those guys who might be able to help his stock by coming back one more year.
On top of that, I'm completely selfish about having another strong B-ball team next year, which will be much easier to do if he comes back.
Obviously, THJ going pro is not of family financial hardship...I personally think that he is a Athlete Student and not a Student Athlete. He does not like the fact of hitting the books. If one likes basketball over studying, then one has to quit school and follow your dream to the NBA. Good luck to the young man. Go Blue.
of the other 2 guys. They'll look at their own situations primarily. Also, whether or not THJ comes back, the team will be damned good next year with Mitch and GRIII back.
No matter what you decide to do, your time with us was greatly appreciated,
but please stay.
Please stay THJ.
Please stay. And tell Mitch and GR3 to stay in school too.
And to drink their milk and just say no to drugs.
I'd love for him to stay: like others have said, I think he could really flourish as a focal point of the offense next year. And his senior year leadership could be golden. And, of course, there would be at least a couple games where he could win it all by himself for us (a la OSU at Crisler this year).
But my gut feeling is that he'll be heading out. The fact that he didn't say anything during his speech at the banquet, combined with that picture from yesterday looking at the trophies, makes me think he's feeling nostalgic at the close of his time at Michigan.
The pessimist in me tends to think the announcing of a press conference probably means he's gone. Certainly hope I'm wrong, though.
Burke held a press conference last year too. I'm not optimistic about this, but I don't think the press conference part is important.
Didn't Lewan have a press conference, too?
This team will miss the leadership he brings. You can't replace that.
He is a way more developed player than Levert. Not even close. Plus, like the "tape a cheetah to her back" commercial, having both is better.
He disappeared only if you measure productivity by a box score. He was a team leader, a calming influence, the second scorer focus of defenses that helped open up opportunities for Robinson and Stauskas, etc. He will be missed.
It's better to be fast, than slow, according to the cheetah commercial. It's better to shoot 2 lasers than 1, according to another dumb kid. Both would apply, but I wanted to make sure you are doing it right.
Come on Tim, one more year!
Hope stays in school not only because I would like to see him in the maize and blue for another year, but I think he could improve his stock if stayed in college another year to work on his game. With Burke gone, Tim has the chance to lead this team and really shine.
I think another year would benefit McGary and GRIII as well. Regardless, I respect the heck out these kids and wish them the best.
He doesn't need the money, but I also don't see how much good another year of school will do him.
Miami Heat had to buy his dad's house due to tax problems, which usually means you've run out of money.
Of school would do? Hmmm .. I would think that Michigan degree would do wonders! That is something that can never be taken away from THJ .. His bball playing career could end anytime .. That degree will be with him for a lifetime if he chooses to stay.
I was talking specifically about basketball.
He can come back and finish his degree if he wants to.
He can come back and finish his degree .. The odds if him declaring .. Playing a few years of pro ball and then returning to Michigan to finish his degree is about 0%
end up getting his degree?
He graduated from Maryland in 2005. Howard graduated on time despite being in the NBA for his forth year, and I'm pretty sure Jackson and King both graduated with him in 1995.
Juwan attended graduation at the Big House with his class. His promise to his gradmother to get his degree was a point of emphasis in the book "Fab Five."
I think staying would enable him to improve his stock. Work more on his handle, be the primary scorer next year, get stronger. I think he gets better and has better stats if he stays. I don't see how his stock goes down if he stays next year but could see it going up.
I have not see enough our of GRIII to think he will be a great NBA player, too many holes in his game right now. McGary is the most NBA ready from an athletic standpoint but I think he really needs at least another year to work on skills.
In addition to earlier leaked rumors/reports...there's this @nickbaumgardner: As of last night, Beilein said no decisions were imminent. He had was about to start meeting w/ players -- possibly as early as today.
Then a presser gets scheduled.
Another thought I had was that if he was coming back wouldn't he announce with mcgary or GRIII if either of them were to come back?
Isn't it a little odd that Beilein wasn't expecting this quick of an announcement? I'm thinking if he was headed to the NBA, wouldn't he at least discuss his options with Beilein first out of respect? I'm an eternal pessimist, but this just seems a little odd. I'm also usually wrong, so maybe this just falls into that category...
the first round. He will have the time to work on his ball handling and given his size, he could be a good NBA SG.
Thanks for the memories.
by many UM fans. He is going to have a ten year NBA career.
negged for Hawk Harrelson
How quickly we forget. C'mon now.
but we would not have made the tournament that year had Hardaway not gone red-hot during the back half of the Big Ten slate. He averaged like 20 pts a game during that stretch and shot 50% from three.
Remember how nervous we were up until the Big Ten tourney victory over Illinois? Another loss or two and we would have been in the NIT. A certain Iowa game in which THJ scored 30 and we won in OT might very well have saved our season.
How does that have anything to do with the two of them not being seniors under Beilein?
Yeah actually you have the years mixed up. You're thinking of Stu and Zack's Jr yr with D-Mo. Their Sr. year we, you know, won the Big Ten title for the first time in a long, long time.
Trey Burke shot 36.6% during the NCAA tournament.
I guess we'll be better without him, too.
It's the same argument you're using.
You said Hardaway only shot 38% from the floor, so it will be addition by subtraction.
I said Trey Burke only shot 36.6% from the floor.
I agree that your argument is weak, which is why I came up with an equally absurd one.
Burke took more shots than Hardaway during the tournament, but Burke shot a worse percentage.
Statistics don't back your argument...son.
I would agree that in the past THJ took a lot of bad shots, but this year that was not the case. A lot of the shots he missed in the tourney were on drives and foul line area jumpers, those are not bad shots. Sure he missed some in the offense 3's, but they were in the offense and not bad shots.
Label him a streaky shooter if you like, but he (at least this year) was not a poor shot taker.
why don't you two go hug it out in a PM?
Hug it out bitch
- Michael Scott
You're losing this one, Champ. Badly. Maybe step away from the keyboard for a while.
That is quite an honor. You should be happy he even cares what you think.
The Ewing Theory applies to superstars, the kind of players who when they leave you say "well now they are going to suck." Like Ewing himself at Georgetown and with the Knicks. Hardaway isn't at that level, I don't think. Good, but not great player this year.
It does not really apply as well in college because everyone loses players every year.
Please stay, pretty please with sugar on top!
I hope he stays for the same reason I hoped Trey Burke left: what is best for his future. Financially, Burke had nothing to gain by coming back, and could have lost millions of dollars.
THJ has nothing to lose by coming back, and could gain a lot with a good year. I don't see him possibly getting to the first round. He has shown flashes of brilliance, but more often than not falls into the "one of the guys" category.
Trey is going to make what it would take the average engineering graduate 30-80 years to make. THJ is in danger of being another guy who plays in Europe . A degree would be a lot more valuable to him than it would to Trey at this point. It could be his entry into coaching, TV, or an NBA team's front office.
Except next year's draft class is insanely stacked. Could lose a lot by coming back.
If he stays, press conference usually means they're gone. This isn't always the case, but most of the time it appears to work out that way. Usually when a player stays it's just a press release. Hopefully Timmy is back, but I'm not holding my breath.
National runner-up run, I mean, what else is there? His senior leadership would be nice, and he could be a focal point of the offense, but whatever his decision best of luck to him. I would love to have him for his senior year, but given the overall weakness of this year's draft and the projected strength of next year's, the time may be right for him to go. Best wishes in whatever uniform I see you in next season TIMMAYY!
Uh...not being the runner up?
Obviously, but given everything that has to go right to make it to the national championship game (difficult to do two times in a row) and the fact that that's the only thing that wasn't accomplished, I don't think there's much reason for him to come back.
I know. I was just giving you a hard time.
I figured but then people reading this might not be so sure, so I decided to make clear my thoughts. Plus, I'm never super peppy/happy when I'm at work haha.
the way i see it is that you have one year left to get your degree. just come back and finish your 4th year and graduate. would hate to look back and think what if. if you stay then there is no what if's
Make enough money to come back and make it after his bball career.
I thought they had to declare by the 16th...well my dad told me that said he read it on insidethehall.com which is a IU website...he's an IU fan obviously
The 16th is the deadline to withdraw your name from consideration if you previously declared. Any decisions to leave made between now and draft day are final now that the withdrawal deadline has passed.
Oh ok thanks I got it now
Let's stay blue! Let's stay blue! Let's stay blue!
but my gut feeling is that he's not. We should be ok without him, but we'd sure be better with him
I look at thiings a little different I guess. I want Tim to go pro, because this is the best time for him to go IMO. He's not going to help himself by playing a 4th year. Good luck to him and I hope he succeeds.
GR3? If he's top 15, he has to go too IMO.
Mitch? He needs to come back, period. A few great games in the toruney propelled him from undrafted to top 15 pick? I don't buy it and neither should Mitch. Come back, work on your game and consistency and then see where you're at. The only thing that might make him go is his age, he's already almost 21 years old.
Take 26 seconds and visit this stay in school website. Also, please share with MM & GRIII.
More pluses in staying including being the undisputed leader of the team. One more year as a college kid isn't bad either.
If THJ stays we have great senior leadership. It is not clear to me if we would see much talent improvement over what he did this year. However, leadership is a quantity that is impossible to measure on the stat line that would be missed.
If THJ goes it means more playing time for Irvin who probably has more upside. There will be struggles early in the season and loses against some tough teams.
If Hardaway stays the two people who could see minutes drop or not see a role increase are Stauskus and LeVert. If Irving shows almost as good a 3pt shot but better defense I could see Irving taking some of Stauskus minutes. Also have to wonder how LeVert gets on the floor. If we presume Irving is used to spell Robinson(not a given) your looking at 5 people having to share 120 minutes. If we exclude the 4 position that would be 80 minutes for 4 people.
I think we are a better team if Hardaway stays. But if he is the only other player to declare early the team should be okay.
I dont see him staying with Trey gone. All that has surrounded "them" as the fire and ice. I think he wants to leave on the same note. He doesnt want to be the other guy that didnt make it the same year. But who knows.... I think he may have hit his ceiling as well in college ball. I wish him the best of luck
Say you are a junior in college and get offered a $500 K/Year job.
The company tells you you're welcome to leave school before your senior year and start working.
I know, as a college kid, I'm taking the money.
In Timmy's case...he gets to play a sport he loves and gets paid to do it!
64 posts and no "Those who stay..."?
"this is Michigan, or course I am staying, I mean what did you think? And the GR III and McGary are gonna run out of the tunnel and be like "we stayin too." And I am going to celebrate with pizza.
It would be crazy...
I'm pretty sure he'll come back. His dad is a scout for Miami and knows exactly what Tim needs to work on and I forsee him finally getting back into coaching his son. He knows that his son playing (and being the face/leader of) a top 10 college team will get him more exposure than sitting on a pro-bench or even playing untelevised games in a place like Idaho for the NBADL. Unless Hardaway Sr. has some sweet deal worked out with an NBA team, my guess is he comes back.
He's probably gone. Declaring (the day) after the deadline to withdraw gives him no room to second-guess himself or reason for random people to sway his decision back. He is the one guy from this team that I will understand why he makes whatever decision he does. That being said, GR3 and MM need to come back for one more year, show they can be leaders and develop the obvious flaws in their game, and then make some money. We'll be in good shape if they stay.
Those who stay will be champions. Happy BrownJuggernaut?
Just bought the sweatshirt a couple days ago, too.
On both McGary and Robinson, look at how much Darius Morris and Trey Burke improved from their freshman to sophomore seasons. If those get coached up by Beilen and can show similar improvement, it would definitely be worth their while to come back.
I totally agreed with you. I will go as far to predict that he will eventually have a nothing career in the NBA. At best....possibly a couple of years on the bench, and then possibly the Euorpean League. As a player in college, he was very good. There are flashes of brillience, but not a consistent performer. Should he go pro, he won't have the chance to get better. After another year on the bench, he has to compete with new rookies for a spot on the bench. That bench gets real short real fast. Still best of luck to him pursuing his dream playing for the NBA. Go Blue.
please stay, please stay, please stay
I'm sure I'll get zinged for this, but I'll still make the argument ...
I haven't seen Z Irvin's name mentioned much on this thread, but it's quite possible that, assuming everyone else returns, Hardaway could see less minutes next year. He did disappear at critical points in the season and his defense was suspect at best. I am certainly not claiming to be prophetic, but two years ago I said Burke will make everyone forget about Morris; I am saying today, having seen this kid play a couple of times, Irvin will make the transition away from Hardaway less painful
Upgrade to HDTV homeboy.
FWIW, the NBA comparrison that was used for THJ was OJ Mayo. THJ has better athletic numbers than Mayo at this stage in the game...THJ scoring 13 PPG, 4 APG and 4 RPG in the NCAA tournament on a loaded team is definately not a bad stat line.
I'm pretty sure we all know how this is going to end. If not then you may need to consider the fact that you're in denial.
I guess the good news is whatever he decides he's deciding today so it's not dragging on until the last minute.
I'm betting he's gone. And as much as I'd love to see him stay, I just don't see where another year would do anything to move his draft stock up or down. So given the time value of money he's better off to come out now and start cashing checks. Cause they'll be about the same amount this year as they'll be next year - he'll just have one more year of them.
I personally think that if all four were going to leave (Burke, THJ, Mitch, and GRIII) we would have seen more offers go out by now. We have Walton and Irvin to replace Burke and Hardaway, and to me those are nice replacement pieces to have.
If all four leave, we will have nine players on scholarship next year. I am assuming the coaching staff has a good idea of the status of GRIII and McGary. I hope so because nine scholarship players is pretty lean.
Stronger draft class next year (theoretically, any of those guys could have a rough season) aside everything else pretty much demands that THJ comes back. He had great regular season, and an okay tournament, but nothing that screams NBA starter; and he's already a third-year starter. He'd probably be best to come back, give this young team leadership, show that he's still improving, and get his degree. That way, when he goes to the NBA next year he can transition into something else around the sport (coaching, management, journalism) OR make the journey to Europe and keep playing. One year that opens up a lot of options...
But it's his choice either way. And I think it's 60/40 a good decision to return, if even that much...
Burke didn't really have a choice to make. His stock is at an all-time high and even if he could repeat it all next year the media wouldn't the blown away enough to heap the awards on him again... As great as another year of Trey Burke would've been for Michigan Basketball, I'm afraid it would've been really bad for him. He made the right choice.
GRIII and McGary need at least another year each. GRIII has the potential and all the right physical tools, but his mind and attitude hasn't caught up yet. Throwing him in with a bunch of NBA guys is just as likely to shake him up as it is to improve him at this stage. McGary just needs to show what he can do without Burke over more than a 5 game run. He had a phenomenal tournament; but a lot of analysts are crediting a sizable amount of that to Burke's management of the plays. If McGary can impove on defense and show that he can be a leader/creater on offense he'll be ready to go; but that's at least (probably exactly) a year away.
Three tournament appearances.
4-2 against MSU
2013 NCAA Runner Up
Whatever he decides, he doesn't owe us anything. But if he stays, and Michigan makes another run...
They're going to have to hang his jersey up next to Trey's.
That's a legacy.
...for Bacari Alexander to give THJ a handwritten, "you're a baller" note?
I've heard that strategy is pretty effective.
Any truth to the rumor that 3 of our basketball players haven't returned to class after the finals? I've read it a few places.
I saw pics of empty rooms filled with garbage bags on twitter so along with this knowledge, they are all gone. Don't even watch the pressers because obviously.
Just to clarify, since I haven't seen any rumors or pics, you are just being funny, right? Referring to the pics of garbage bags that supposedly indicated Burke was gone last year?
Edit: This is an honest question. Not sure why it's been marked flamebait. I recall that last year one of the reasons people said Burke was gone was due to garbage bags in "his" dorm. Is this what is being referred to here, or are there actual new pics/rumors for this year's crop of possible exits?
I think he is gone. Like someone else said, next year's draft is really stacked with talent and would have a better shot going higher this year especially coming off from a national championship game.
To me, next years draft doesn't really impact him because he is not likely to be in that upper echelon anyways. He is going to be on the fringe most likely anyways so any impact of the top 2 or 3 players being better will be diluted in my opinion.
It's always rather interesting to watch the dichotomy of fanbases waiting for draft decisions. On one hand you have people saying that he should come back because he's not good enough to go to the NBA/NFL, but on the other hand they recognize that he's good enough to help their team which is why they really want him to stay.
I'm honetly not sure if Hardaway is good enough to stick in the NBA because I think he does a few things at a "good" level (get to the basket, shoot, defend), but not one thing at an elite level (for Burke I think that'd be quickness, GRIII finishing at the rim, McGary motor). That being said it's probably in his best interest to declare this year because of the aforementioned stigmas attached to 4-year guys. If he does, I'll be appreciatve of all he did for the team (the 2011 20 pt second half against MSU, NBA fire jam perforamce against OSU this year, etc.) and be rooting for him to do awesome at the next level.
Hope THJ stays... but anybody who says they can't see the logic behind him leaving is fooling themselves. Forget his father's money (or purported lack thereof) - do people with money not want more money? This is a chance for another year in the league to make great money and play ball professionally - what's not to understand?
....and perhaps missed this morning by some was Josh Bartelstein on WTKA talking about how he, among others, has had a chat with Tim Hardaway Jr. as he has gathered input for this decision, whatever it turns out to be. Bartelstein doesn't go into much detail about those conversations specifically (for good reason, of course, although he does say he's had chats with Mitch McGary and Glenn Robinson III as well), but he does talk about how his father's job and being the son of an agent give him an some insight into this. It starts roughly around the 10-minute mark of this podcast - HERE.
It is an interesting interview throughout, but for this thread, those last six minutes or so are particularly interesting.
but having a year like they had has to be a plus for staying. He knows that Mitch is going to be a beast next year and that GRIII will also improve greatly. This would also become Tim's team ... much like it was Trey's team this year. Plus - its college life nothing like it. Having graduated 35 years ago .... let me tell ya - ain't nothin better than those 4 or ____ (fill in the blank) of college life.
I also think that Tm has an excellent opportunity to actually increase his potential for an NBA pick based upon a more consistent shooting game and fewer turnovers next year. Add to that the fun all of us will have watching Timmy thrash IU twicw next year and watching Crean break down on camera ... hahahahha
Good luck Tim. I hope you stick somewhere
@WojYahooNBA: Michigan junior Tim Hardaway Jr., will enter the NBA draft, sources tell Y! Sports.
Check the time-stamp first, please. Sheesh.
but my brain knows that another year probably won't do anything for his stock. He'll be a year older.
I only see him staying to enjoy his senior year at UM. It's totally his call. I don't see him returning. Let's hope I'm wrong.
as of 12 52 hardaway is going pro. i am and will be sad and will miss him. wish he was back and took over as this was his team.. edit someone already posted
Not sure he's ready yet though.