well that's just, like, your opinion, man
Good read QB LB WR and Nuss
Hopefully Morris gets a lot of snaps early on in the season against App St. and Miami...not sure who would enters as the primary backup, but I hope it's Morris.
Let's hope Gardner stays healthy and Morris doesn't see the field so he can redshirt.
I think it's safe to put all Morris redshirt questions to rest by now. Not gonna happen.
You need to prepare 2 QBs to play. Period. What if the team is 5-2 and Devin goes out for the year and Shane has not had a single snap. The yelling at Hoke for "not being prepared" would be intense.
Shane needs to play and the 2 games that on paper that should be the 2 blowouts this year are Miami OH and App State. I hope he is in by the beginning of the 4th in each.
You have a plethora of QBs coming down the pike now with Speight, Malzone, 2016 recruit, etc. They are spaced out fine - let Morris put in these 3 years and hopefully go off to the NFL. We need a functional QB battle now and 2 players who can lead the team - we've been stuck with 1 most every year since pre Henne.
and it never panned out except for CMU. Last season's ooc schedule, except for ND, a team we handled better than many lesser ones, seemed tailor made for what you are referring to, getting some seasoning behind the youngsters. You are totally correct and was one of the main reasons, Bama, despite sending an entire OL to the NFL didn't skip a beat. They had developed players who were listed no. 2 but through experience they were combpletely ready to take over when it became their turn. That used to be the case at UM. RR and BH both went through the exact same things. Unlike Carr, who inherited the kingdom, they were both assigned the task of building one. One player had no players on defense and the other woefully thin on offense. No coach can build a program until he builds depth. Mattison will have a much improved defense simply because he rotated continuously last season and everyone he plays this year, unless they are deserving incoming freshmen - I see two - will have a measure of experience and some of the backups, even from last year's young team will have a lot of experience.
It's entirely due to the fact we haven't been able to field experienced players that it is taking us so long to return to our usual level of play. After LC, they should have hired a coach, possibly even Brady who preferred a similar style. The blame for those "missed" seasons were certainly not the fault of the new coach. He had built his reputation as being among the innovators of a completely new style. Of course he was not going to recruit the same type of player. But back on point. Last season was a disaster as to developing experience because so many were going through what amounted to on the job training, thereby allowing lesser programs to stay with us, not because of talent but simply because it's difficult for a 19 year old with one year of college weight training to push around a 22 or 23 year old who had 4 more years, not only of weight training but playing high level football. It was easy to see our skill players were superior to theirs, but the old axiom "games are won in the trenches" only became a cliche in football due to its truth. I do think, in some odd way, that year of getting pushed around just might turn out to be good for our players. It's something none of them had ever experienced so they were faced with two options, either admit defeat or work your ass off to ensure it doesn't happen again. These kids didn't get recruited here because they were easily scared or lacked a strong work ethic; quite the opposite actually. They will still struggle against a couple of the conference's top teams but their performance will bear no semblance to that of last season. We will find out early simply by measuring last year's ooc schedule against this one. We don't have to dig into stats, expert projections or any damn thing except what is occuring in front of our very eyes. Always the easiest way to measure improvement.
Next year this time people will be saying "Man, I hope Malzone progresses a lot in camp so Shane can redshirt this year"
Is writing off Bellomy. I'd love to see Morris get his redshirt and Bellomy make major strides with Morris/speight as the 3rd string who never see any action
I was at the Nebraska game in 2012. There is a reason everyone has written him off.
I was there too. I'm not saying I think Bellomy has the chops to start and lead Michigan to 10 or 12 wins, but I think he just might have the capability to be a serviceable backup for a series every once in awhile. I think it is premature to completely write him off. There were so many things working against a young player brought into that situation and it just snowballed. They announced the crowd as the second largest in stadium history. It was a cold, windy night game, and the only thing keeping Michigan in the game offensively up to that point was the athleticism of Denard Robinson. There was no run game without him. It was almost a perfect setup for failure of a young and inexperienced QB.
im a better quarterback than bellomy and my only time playing quarterback was my freshman year during a practice. took one snap, threw a pick six against our varsity and that was the end of my quaterback days, but at least my pass would have reached my reeicer abd not rolled to him...
really??? one bad game and an acl tear and you feel that he is a complete waste of a scholarship? you sir are everything that is wrong with the Michigan fanbase. turn in your Wolverine Fan Card immediately
That's like.. your opinion..
the fact that you are railing against a player is absolutely disgusting. I can understand some criticism (I have done the same with regards to jack miller, and a few others on the o-line), but the fact that you are so quickly to judge after only one game is unconscionable. you're not a true fan.
All of us are true fans and we all have our own opinions.
No ones railing against Bellomy. The coaches see both qbs in practice every day and they're the ones to make the decision anyway. Shane and Bellomy have only really had one game both with extensive experience and Shane did a lot better.
Do you want some cheese with your whine?
Joe Kerridge is still waiting for his pass to get there. If you enjoyed Nick Sheridan, Russell Rein or Chris Zurbrugg as The Michigan QB than Bellomy is your guy.
so under that premise, let's completely write off kalis, glasgow, clark, pipkins, clark, morris, green, and smith. they didn't perform as they were expected to last year, so according to you, they are all garbage and shouldn't play another game in a winged helmet
Kalis was a slight disappointment (only due to the hype train), but the rest of your list is laughable.
Morris wasn't expected (by any sane person) to blow up Alderaan.
Glasgow was a WALK-ON and thus had zero expectations.
Clark was playing very well at the end of the year.
Pipkins was playing at a high level until the injury.
Green and Smith did fairly well considering the offensive line.
Meanwhile, nothing against the kid personally, but Bellomy's performance could only be described as a nuclear meltdown. There's not even a hint of similarity.
It's like you don't know anything about anything. Your misery is draining your brain.
Hey, none of those guys threw 7 picks against MSU, soooo.....
Rose Bowl victory.
In Columbus. 2-0 in bowl games beating Alabama and USC.
Demetrius only looked good because (a) michigan was loaded with future NFL players, including yours truly, and (b) his competition was Michael Taylor, who was really a wishbone QB. Demetrius was...mediocre.
51% completion percentage and basically as many INTs as TDs.
Two very different players (besides the left/right thing), but both brought something to those fine late-80s teams.
Brown had a big arm. Low completion %, but if you look back, his yards/catch was crazy high.
Taylor didn't have much of an arm but was a high-percentage guy. Good runner too. Just had trouble staying healthy.
His decision making improved dramatically from the '87 to '88 seasons. In 1987 he was a turnover machine with 16 interceptions with a completion percentage of 47.6%. In 1988, he didn't throw one interception and his completion percentage went up to 57.1%.
To be fair, he was the backup in 1988 so he only threw half as many passes, However, he was the starter after Taylor was hurt against Ohio State and USC.
I would have liked to have seen how he would have done in 1989 as a starter had he not been kicked off the team. Even if Taylor had done the job Brown would have played extensively after Taylor's injury against Notre Dame that year.
In the rain against Minnesota? Then beat Jeff George led Illinois team coached by Mackovic to win big ten.
He threw zero picks. Beat OSU in Columbus and a Rodney Peete led USC team. Only other QB with a Rose Bowl win under Bo was Wangs. If that's mediocre I'm good with that.
What happens if Gardner gets hurt? Do you think Bellomy is going to be the better option taking over the starting job? Do you want Morris to start next season after taking a year off, or are you projecting Bellomy to come back for one more season as the starter?
I don't want to write off Bellomy either, but I'd be happy if he was competent enough to allow Speight to redshirt. I have a really hard time believing he's ever going to be a better option than Morris.
that he's a better option, but I would bet that it's close enough that it doesn't really matter who the back up is. Are we gonna win a certain game because we put Morris in over Bellomy? I don't think so. So what's the harm in letting Morris redshirt and using Bellomy?
The difference between Morris versus KSU and Bellomy versus Nebraska is enough to win ten million games.
Let's not let real world facts interfere with religious comparisons.
Yeh Bellomy performed poorly, but I can't think of a worse situation to be thrust into.
I like Morse. I like him a lot. I think that he has all the talents to, with a lot of hard work, win the QB slot in 2015.
That said, I think that Bellomy is a probably a better QB than many of the QBs playing college ball today. Trashing him only demeans those who trash him.
I'm wondering what games you're actually watching. The difference between Morris and Bellomy is night and day. Plus, there's a lot more incentive to get Morris ready to take the starting job for his junior and senior year. Bellomy is already a junior, and if he's starting as a senior some crazy, crazy things have happened.
Morris is a better QB than Bellomy. Simple as that.
I'm not saying whether or not it's fair to write him off, but in most videos they have released Bellomy is the 4th QB in. Now that could be because he's still working back from injury, but Speight has been taking snaps before Bellomy.
What happened to him at Nebraska was rough and likely not close to what his true ability is. Remember he beat out DG for #2 QB which may have been partly about needing a WR. I don't think the coaches had him prepared well. He certainly was not prepared for what happened. But I remember Brian Griese not looking much better in a similar situation his Sophomore year and he developed pretty nicely. All that said he is not passing a healthy Morris in our lifetime. And you need two QBs ready to play.
Bellomy beating out DG and more about DG is a fantastic athlete lets figure out a way to get him on the field and get production out of him AND Denard at the ssame time
Gardner's move to wide receiver was so we could simply get him on the field. As was stated at that time, "the minute Gardner steps on the field at wr he immediately becomes Michigan's best." While I think they off there, especially considering the careers of Roundtree and more particularly Gallon. IMO, that was one of the biggest mistakes during the current era. Of course we wanted our best 11 on the field and Devin offered just too much to be riding the pine. However, he should definitely have been taking snaps, possibly even with the threes, just so we would have been ready in case the inconceivable happened, and we all know that it did. With just a decent qb out there that day, we might have won, but instead it is added to "games that got away," a subject-matter that has become too large for my comfort in recent years. But as I said, coaches continue learning as well as players and BH has never been known as an "immediate impact" coach. But through the years, at both schools, he continued to improve until he took both teams to the top. He is better than anyone we've had since Moeller as to getting talent here and unless you are the incarnate of Bear Bryant you had better be surrounded with 4 and 5 * personnel.
It's my hope that he has learned enough in the past two seasons - Season one was virtually a gift extended by one Denard Robinson - to become a BIG level coach when it matters, on Saturdays. As to the qbs, I think we're set for quite awhile. We'll RS Speight this season and although he wasn't awarded a fourth star, he was targeted by this staff as the man they felt was fully qualified to run this team some day. You must remember we can offer virtually any kid in America w/o offers from among the nation's best and be relatively assured he'll give the nod in our direction. When they target someone who isn't on everyone else's radar it is the equivalent of getting a 4 star inasmuch as getting the player you actually want, after watching virtually 100s go through the interview process via their h.s. careers, camps, etc., having the man you want is a very comfortable situation.
I thought Speight was really just as good as Morris in the spring game. IMO he jumps Morrjs next year.
Harris is more than likely gunna RS
This one will be interesting to watch. It depends on his hamstring. He needs to and will add weight and strength but he is not weak by any means. If he gets past the line check very few if any CBs will keep up with him on the fly and he is gone. This the type of threat you need against MSUs press coverage.
Collegiate DBs will, for the most part, be able to keep up with him. He is not 'that' fast. He had a real knack for catching the deep ball in HS but unless you have world class speed a lot of that ability gets negated to a certain extent at the college level by technique and talent. Because of the injury that has seemingly persisted in some capacity for around a year, he would probably benefit from a redshirt.
Is he fast, sure he is. But I don't see him being a vertical threat his freshman year with that nagging injury and that frame. If the spring game showed me something it was that he is skinny and needs to put on some muscle.
Harris has a knack for grabbing those jump balls as well. So yeah, it could be interesting. He probably can do a couple things a lot of our other guys can't. But is he going to be strong enough and polished enough as a true freshman to beat out Chesson and Darboh (not to mention the three guys that were freshmen last year?) I don't think you burn his RS just to play him in garbage time.
I do think that if he plays that first week that it's probably a sign we can expect some big things out of him.
I agree if he plays there it should be a good sign. Although I was surprised at how little time Darboh played and when they burned his shirt. His overall game on the outside is very exciting. I am hoping for sooner rather than later.
To beat press coverage you need a guy strong enough not to be disrupted at the line. Harris looks very thin right now and with that added height he won't have a strong core esp with all those hamstrings. He is skinny to start with - he could use 20 lbs easy. Guy is rusty as heck, hasnt played a competitive football game in 1.5 years? I'd rather he RS unless he just lights camp on fire in the summer/fall.
People are forgetting about Darboh (not the OP) and Mr Bowling Ball from last year - that is 4 WRs along with Funch and Canteen... and you hope 1 of the guys (Da'mario?) from the 2013 class contributes as well this year, we have 3 options from that class. There are also multiple options at slot, although who knows how realistic they are but we dont need to burn a redshirt on a 6th WR.
Who's Mr. Bowling Ball?
Chesson! Referring to him taking out 3 guys last year with 1 block aka bowling bowl. Don't know how he will develop as a pass catcher but he seems like by the time he is a senior he might be the best blocking WR in a long time.
Ah. Chesson is an enigma to me. Blocked like a champ. Caught most every ball thrown his way, including some tough ones, but didn't get targeted much. I got the sense that Devin locked onto Gallon and Funchess and didn't give many other WRs a chance. (I think going through progressions is a big weakness of Devin's, contributing to some INTs.) I think Chesson deserves another shot at starting based on what he showed.
is why Chesson didn't get any balls thrown his way. If Gallon is the #1 guy then Funchess and then probably Butt, Chesson would be pretty far down there as far as options go. #4 targets don't get alot balls thrown their way
since when is his 4.4 speed legit?
I've never timed him but have seen him play 5 or 6 games and I know one of his coaches. He has unique speed. Watch his film and tell me what you think. I'm not seeing or hearing a big fake here. He is not 6'4" though.
That doesn't rely on 50 million plays and formations that are too confusing for inexperienced linemen sounds good to me. May Nuss make that happen.
This team has got an abundance of talent. If Hoke can find a way to put it all together, we could be in pretty good shape.
Really looking forward to seeing JMFR back at 100%, Funchess being a mismatch all over the field, and Peppers....well....I'm just looking forward to watching the legend unfold before our eyes.
I expect good things from Funchess of course but the dropsies he showed the last 3 games or so last year and in spring has me scratching my head. Hope this ends in the fall.
Unfortunately, there's not much any of the skill position players or the QB can do if the offensive line can't open enough running lanes to make the defense respect the run and keep the offensive out of the 2nd and 3rd and long distances. The season really all boils down to the effectiveness of the offensive line, plain and simple.
This entire thread is kind of a moot point. If the OL can't get it together enough to be mediocre (and considering the massive amounts of youth and inexperience, I'd be thrilled with mediocre), then it doesn't really matter who is starting and excelling at various skill positions or on the defense.
Chances are we'd have some other highly touted qb lined up to play for us when Morris would be a 5th year senior. I wish he had a redshirt but it doesn't make a lot of sense now. Chances are Gardner gets hurt at some point.
we will not have some other highly touted QB lined up when Morris would be a 5th year - Speight was a 3-star on the 24/7 Composite rankings, Malzone is a 3-star in those same rankings, and deWeaver wasn't in the initial Scout 300. Maybe one of them will be good but none are highly-touted, especially in comparison to borderline 5-star Morris.
That malzone has a good shot at being a composite 4 star by the time signing day comes around. With Deweaver, who knows but with 2 years to play there is always a decent shot he moves up as well.
its possible one or both moves up; but my point is the poster acts as if not having Morris in 2017 won't be a big deal b/c we'll have similarly-touted guys behind him. I disagree: Speight isn't, Malzone isnt with 6 months to go, and deWeaver (who would be in only his 2nd season) isn't highly ranked initially (but he's got 18 months, and 2 HS season, to go up....or down).
Regardless, the present evidence implies we will not have some blue-chip waiting in the wings.
You sound stuck in the world of recruiting rankings. I, nor you, nor Nuss, nor anyone knows who will turn out to be the best - Speight, Malzone, Messiah or Shane at the end of their careers. To say we have an issue because Shane is the only blue chip and we need to keep him around because he had the most stars at some point of his HS career is the definition of falling in love with rankings.
3 of those 4 havent even stepped on a college football field in a real game and the other has the equivalent of 1.5 games. Yet we are already talking about how 3 of them cannot match Shane due to a group of HS game/camp evaluators? Yes we've seen how that has worked out.
2 of these guys could be busts, 1 could be a Heisman candidate, 1 could be a first round draft choice, all 4 could be average, all 4 could be great - but who knows which. There is no guarantee of any of it and projecting any of these guys as a 21-22 year old when some of them are 16-17-18 is the definition of using recruiting rankings as a bible of sorts.
please re-read what was written above. ThadMatta said we would have another *highly-touted* qb lined up to play when Morris would be a 5th year Sr. I said we won't, since Speight wasn't highly-touted, Malzone probably won't be, and deWeaver isn't considered a blue chipper now, though it is still quite early for him.
Neither Thad Matta nor I ever offered an opinion on how good Morris, Speight, Malzone or deWeaver will be (I certainly dont have a clue); no one is saying the star rankings are right or wrong; the debate is about if there will be another highly-touted guy there to play when Morris would have been a 5th year, and I argue there won't, which is not to say we're gonna be terrible b/c there's not 5-star.
Good rant about recruiting rankings though, i guess.
"my point is the poster acts as if not having Morris in 2017 won't be a big deal b/c we'll have similarly-touted guys behind him. I disagree"
So you disagree with the poster that having a highly touted recruit won't be a big deal. Which infers you are stuck on recruiting rankings. Maybe I am reading your words wrong - generally when someone says not having a blue chip recruit behind Shane is a big deal, it would mark someone who is focused on the HS rankings.
Shane started as a 5 and fell to a 4. Malzone started as a 3 and is trending to a 4. They could both end up at almost the exact same spot when all is said and done. If player A is 120 in the country and player B is 190 I don't see any difference in that. It's to sell subscriptions.
What is a blue chip to you? What is the magical cut off? You said we won't have any once Shane goes. Malzone is the 11th ranked pro style QB by Rivals. So 10 dudes in the country are better in his style at his position per ABC recruiting service. What would be a blue chipper then? only 5 guys in the country? Shane was 4.
Marcus Mariota was the 12th ranked QB and a 3 star. We should be ok if we have development and good coaching. Any QB is going to be surrounded by almost all 4 star players on this offense.
He said highly touted. A common way to measure highly toutedness would be to use recruiting rankings. That being said, highly touted does not ensure success. The converse is also a shoe. Star ranking are a consensus prediction of a player.
Thank you. I'm glad you avoid the mgoblog circle jerk over star rankings and 17 year olds who are "really feeling Michigan." Develop the talent we have Nd win on the damn field.
Malzone already is a composite 4 star.
One bad game? Even in the limited time leading up to it he did absolutely zero to give anyone any confidence. Prior to that game he had completed as many passes to the other team as he did to teammates. That game just followed the pattern. I personally hope to never see him on the field again, even if we are beating OSU by 80.
Who are you referring to?
he's referring to Bellomy. And I strongly disagree with what he said---even if Bellomy is buried in the depth chart the rest of his Michigan career, I'd still love for him to again see the field and feel some success, rather than forever be labeled as the QB that blew against Nebraska, as he seems to be thought of by many at this point.
I went on record as saying that was one example of Brady's mistakes last season, not having a viable BIG qb ready to step in as no. 2 should something happen to DR, which it did. I think anyone on this site has the ability to understand the only thing we learned from that game regarding Bellamy was that he was not ready. That is understandable, and it's on the coaches, not him. I realize I'm probably "pissing into the wind" here but I hope no M fan would seriously think that about a player who was cast into a situation way before he was ready. I am sure that much more than the majority of fans would want success from all our players.
Wouldn't necessarily count out Chesson as a starter yet.
If you had to guess, what percent of your posts contain a mention of Rich Rodriguez?
The OLIne doesnt make it easy to go to second and third options in DGs defense..Its a team problem not any one player
So let's rant about SPROTS.
I HATE BRUSSEL SPROTS!!!
They look like baby cabbages, they taste awful, and my mommy used to make me eat them--- yucky!
Certainly he had his issues at times last year, but pretending he was dreadful in many games is just not accurate. No running game and a horrible o-line certainly didn't help his cause either.
I think you're reading too much into the not naming a starter aspect. That is simply Hoke making sure the upperclassmen stay motivated to earn their starting spots. Nothing more, nothing less.
I understand your argument, but what about Shane's lone serious PT suggested to you that he was ready to take the reigns. Yes we have had nearly an entire offseason since the BWW bowl for Shane to improve but his play during that game was pedestrian at best. Accuracy was an issue as well as consistency. Now I thought gorgeous Al Borges called a bad game offensively but Shane did absolutely nothing to impress me.
The passes Shane completed were safe and easy. The passes he missed were generally not very difficult either, but IMO he struggles to get through his reads before the rush was in his face. Yes, I know, the line was sub-par yet that's something both QBs have to deal with. When protection did break down it showed me what I already knew from watching Shane in HS; he is limited physically. I know someone who wants to challenge this point will talk about how he supposedly runs a 4.7 or post a clip of him hurdling a defender. The point is that was HS. Morris is a pocket passer. Pocket passers can move in the pocket but are often very limited outside. When you have an O-line that is questionable at best it makes it difficult for a new guy who can't run to be successful.
Once again, I get that Shane has probably improved over the spring season. I believe that he could be a viable backup this season. However, unless DG pulled his best Tate Forcier and did next to nothing over the offseason there is no evidence that suggests Shane has passed DG as a QB. DG had several malign games but it is difficult to do everything knowing darn well that you have no running game to bail you out.
Feel free to argue my point. However, unless you have seen something that I haven't seen in the now four years I've watched Shane play football it seems as though the argument for Shane to play is based on loose evidence and speculation at best.
If DG is the guy which I'm sure he will be let's not forget that last year was his first year at the helm as a full time starting QB. I think you will finally see schemes that will make our OL,QB, and RB's successful. If this years offense doesn't bring it then BH is in trouble.
The players will fight for BH this year to give him some cushion. 11-2 record coming up!
According to who? What source?