generational gap and RR

Submitted by sheepman on

So, I begin by saying I like RR. I like his attitude, I like his honesty. I even think the game plan will work given time. So here is the question...

My father-in-law is a classic Michigan man. Graduated here 30 years ago, successful, upper middle class engineer. Football season tickets every year. Also, name the UM sport and he supports it (maybe not women's stuff, but you know). He and his wife DO NOT like RR. They don't like his style, don't like the attitude he is trying to bring to UM. They hate the loud music in the stands, etc. They even think RR is a somewhat underhanded with the way he treated some players (no evidence - just hunches). I asked him if winning will do it, he said absolutely not.
I think he is representative of the older generation and many of them feel this way...

What will RR have to do? Or will all be pissed until he is canned. Even if we win BIG.
What do you think?

dahblue

January 24th, 2010 at 7:05 PM ^

Ok. Good point. We did copy one, excellent school with the helmets. That is much better than copying the worst of minor league anything with the piped in music.

That being said, I don't need to rationalize the worst 2-year stretch in almost 50 years. That is a valid reason to question Jesus...I mean RichRod.

scottcha

January 24th, 2010 at 2:47 PM ^

Say what you want about RR's coaching style (or, as you've chosen to single out, the pertinent issue that is the use of PA music), but if you think that as a football coach, Rich Rodriguez does not want to be a leader and the best, that is extremely shortsighted and flat-out moronic.

Talk tradition up all you want, the comment in question was that RR does not get that Michigan is the leader and the best and I'm absolutely sure that he does. He may have bungled the #1 jersey situation, he might not use statuesque pocket passers and the power run, he might not land on the moon regularly (which has no place in this argument, by the way), but he wants to fucking win.

Ass.

dahblue

January 24th, 2010 at 7:04 PM ^

Thanks for misquoting me and then getting upset about it.
I said, "RR does GET that we are the leaders..."

Of course he WANTS to be the best. Of course he WANTS to be the leader, but his actions (players tiny players in a large size conference, piping in music that was overdone ten years ago) suggest that he doesn't GET it.

What is "flat-out moronic" is an asshole ripping on other alums for questioning Little Baby Jesus Rodriguez, and then getting all shitty about something that was NEVER even said.

By the way, Michigan Men landed on the moon. That Mtv flag in the commercial is ours. Learn about your school, asshole.

harmon98

January 23rd, 2010 at 1:48 AM ^

I'm just shy of 40 and feel like most: winning cures all.

I was a student through Bo, Mo, & Carr and a fan of all. They had unreal winning records.

RR will win if given time. The real test will be how much time he's given.

Our ball program's amidst a sizable reboot.

If you're conducting an informal poll: I support RR.

Phil Donahue

January 23rd, 2010 at 1:50 AM ^

Tell your "upper middle class engineer" father that college football is supposed to be about collegiate athletes having fun. Rich Rod plays that music because its what his players enjoy listening to. Its sad that there are so many people, like your father, that can't seem to get their heads around this concept.

COLLEGE FOOTBALL IS ABOUT COLLEGE ATHLETES, not "upper middle class engineers." Rich Rod gets it. Do you?

dahblue

January 23rd, 2010 at 3:03 AM ^

You should have lots of points with the blind loyalty...What went wrong? Maybe it's thinking that RR's players enjoy Neil Diamond and garbage techno. I have a feeling you won't find a single player on the team who likes that garbage. I guess it matches the product on the field though.

What the hell happened to Michigan Men? Have the sack to question your coach when there are problems. Have the same sack to approve of a job well done. Until that job is well done, however, the slappy routine needs to go.

uminks

January 23rd, 2010 at 2:44 AM ^

I know both a younger and older UM fan who don't care much for RR as coach and would like the the new AD to can him ASAP. The younger friend likes the pro set offenses and the drop back NFL style QBs that the spread will no longer offer. The older friend doesn't like RR because he's not a "Michigan Man", but was Bo?

Winning will eventually lead to acceptance from the anti RR crowd. I'm 46 and went to UM in the early to mid 80s...so I have experienced Bo's worse season in '84 and one of his best seasons in '85. I'm a 100 percent RR backer and am willing to give him the time to rebuild this team. I blame the weakest defenses in my memory of UM football, from Bo's early years, as the main culprit to our current consecutive losing seasons. I never thought UM would ever finish last in the b10 in my life time...but we did! The weak defense was not RR's fault. Though it is making it more difficult for RR to transform this team into a perennial BCS bowl team. It may take a few more years but I think he is well on his way.

AKG_2007

January 23rd, 2010 at 5:59 AM ^

I was born and raised in Ann Arbor, but in the same regard my parents immigrated to this country and therefore never understood the spirit of Michigan sports until I went there for college. My first football game was in middle school with a friend whose father was dean of the math department. We had seats on the fifty yard line next to Marty Mornhinweg (at the time coach of the lions). Attending a game elevated my pride and made me understand the meaning of being a serious fan of the University of Michigan. Being a townie gives you a whole new perspective on things and I would never in a million years trade being raised in Ann Arbor for anywhere else in the world. I’ve had the opportunity to spend a lot of time with older alumni through the majority of my life I can never negate the opinion that rich rod is NOT a Michigan man. Currently he is early in his tenure, and change may very well be the best thing for the program at this time. But I can say that there are certain traits about RR which diminish what many consider a true Michigan man. RR is harsh, crude, and stubborn in his mentality. He has absolutely no relation to the UofM vs OSU rivalry in any way (compared to Bo who coached under Hayes prior to being a legend with us). In all honesty it does take an element away from the tradition and heritage of the program. Yes RR can adapt, but I personally never see him understanding things a true Michigan man would.

I currently live in Charleston, WV and the people are amazingly friendly and laid back. Tonight I hung out with some ex-WVU football players and they told me their thoughts on RR. They had many great things to say, but also emphasized how he lacks the ability to develop connections with players. He does not have the ability to motivate rather than deflate a player’s confidence when a mistake is made. Instead of teaching he resorts to shouting obscenities and strays away from helping the player correct their mistakes. Even though these were WVU players they were extremely friendly and seemed genuinely honest.

We’ve all watched on national TV RR’s reaction to blown plays this past year. We’ve seen times when the coaching staff themselves were arguing in front of the camera (how much common sense does it take to at least try and save it for the locker room?). RR takes away from this universities image. Yes his offensive scheme may be successful this year, but hiring him was a bad decision. I love the university and I think your father in-law would agree that winning will dampen the dislike. RR has never been the right answer for us, and does not fit here. I know many may disagree but Ann Arbor is where my parents and brother live. My brother is an alum season ticket holder. In our family we support the program through everything and anything. Maybe RR is learning and progressing with time but currently it is not the image I expect from our head coach. I'm optimistic about next season and without a doubt want RR to succeed because I always want Michigan to succeed.

I will always support whoever coaches the Wolverines. But to say RR is a Michigan man at this time is wrong. He hasn’t proven anything to me. He doesn’t have the substance both as a coach and as a person to deserve that title. I hope one day he does, but right now it is very frustrating for a lot of people like your father in-law for a man like this to be our coach. This is Michigan not WV and we will always have our strong beliefs. You as a coach need to respect that and change to adopt that culture. I don’t see RR doing that and for that reason I have never liked the decision to make him coach. Jim Harbaugh has said a few negative comments regarding emphasizing legitimate academics on the football team. BiG freaking deal....the man is a true Michigan man at heart. People like him understand the university and the community on a different level. If you were insulted by his comments then you underestimate the passion he has for UofM. I guarantee you growing up in Ann Arbor; you won’t EVER stop loving UofM. Harbaugh is who belongs here. He’s the one who can make an extremely positive impact both on and off the field.
Rich Rod is not the answer. Sorry for being pessimistic but im sharing the opinion of a great deal of fans who love the university. In the end we all want whats best for the school and unfortunately those who simply spend their 4-8 years in Ann Arbor and leave cant understand certain aspects of the community. Yes he may win at some point (hopefully) but he simply just doesn't have either A. the open mind to become a michigan man or B. the passion a man like Harbaugh whose roots are here has. To him its a job to make a mark in the sport and nothing else, and It's a shame for the school I love to not have that in their coach.

UM class of 84

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:16 AM ^

"RR is harsh, crude, and stubborn in his mentality."
-Nope, Bo was never, ever those things.

"He has absolutely no relation to the UofM vs OSU rivalry in any way (compared to Bo who coached under Hayes prior to being a legend with us). In all honesty it does take an element away from the tradition and heritage of the program. Yes RR can adapt, but I personally never see him understanding things a true Michigan man would."
-Just because Bo had experience with the UM-OSU rivalry, he certaingly didn't understand things as a true Michigan man would based upon his experience as an OSU coach! Duh.

If Harbaugh really understood things as a true Michigan man does, he wouldn't have ripped UM as he did SO AS TO BENEFIT HIS CURRENT JOB!!!! It's one thing to discuss and criticize UM for not encouraging him to pursue his chosen major, but he shouldn't have done so in the context of selling his current school. Question for the all-knowing AKG, why didn't Harbaugh come forward with his criticism prior to him being able to parlay that to his advantage as coach at Stanford? Why not while he was coach at SJSU (or wherever he was) or while in the NFL? Equally curious is the fact that he didn't criticize UM publicly until Bo was dead. Coincidence? To me, that suggests an less than stellar character.

GustaveFerbert

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:24 AM ^

Perhaps you never saw BO on the sidelines throughout his career - did not BO blow up at refs and go crazy...(in a similar way that Woody did). Did you happen not to see BO's last game in the Rose bowl after the crappy call? Did BO take away from Michigan's image?

And I suppose you never saw Carr give grumpy answers to the press at half-time and look like an ass? Did that creat a better Michigan image? Give me a break on this uppity attitude...

No one is going to like every coach, not at UM, osu, USC, Tenn, etc... And no player is going to like everything about a coach...And the main thing that sucks right now is the record...Obviously that must improve or it is over. But enough with this belief that a Michigan man must be born in the system and cannot learn it....

riverrat

January 23rd, 2010 at 11:01 AM ^

"Harsh, crude, and stubborn?" I worked at the Daily during my undergrad (the Bo years), and Bo was legendary for being at best impatient with the media. Some of the things he said to student reporters (and yeah, we were all cocky, arrogant little bastards, so I'm not saying he was wrong) were about as harsh, crude, and stubborn as it gets.

Bo's players also didn't necessarily think that he 'connected' with them. I always get nervous in college sports when I hear that someone is a player's coach. In the NFL, sure, but my guess is that college head coaches need a bit of distance from their players.

InterM

January 23rd, 2010 at 11:37 AM ^

If you invoke the "Michigan man" theme, you are incapable of making (or understanding) a fact-based argument. Nope, it's all about "passion," "fit," "understanding the traditions," etc. Huh, I coulda sworn that, up to now, we have identified our "Michigan men" by what they have actually accomplished. But no need to wait -- we can just watch Rodriguez on TV and see he doesn't "fit."

Ernis

January 25th, 2010 at 12:51 PM ^

Just going out on a limb here, but those WVU players sound like they've got a sense of entitlement. The coach is there to guide, but every good coach will say it's ultimately the players' responsibility to achieve ... and thus, the players get the credit for their success. An individual is responsible for their own attitude.

I admit, Rodriguez seems to have trouble motivating certain types. He certainly did not do well getting Threet's confidence where it needed to be. It appeared to me that starting Sheridan and subbing Sheridan in were used at times to provide motivation for Threet (I think this only because I could not think of another reason to put Sheridan in at times). Then again, Threet never postured himself like a terribly confident guy. So the question is, to what point is Rodriguez responsible for molding players' confidence? At what point does the player need to have the guts to take control of their attitude and state of mind?

Rodriguez seems to recruit certain types ... players who may not be the most touted athletes, but all seem to share (based on my reading of interviews and such) a good work-ethic and sense of responsibility. My guess is that RR does not have much ability to coach prima-donna types. Saban and Carroll have success coaching those guys -- perhaps because they are complete assholes, themselves? RR recruits "his players" -- not necessarily system guys, but guys with an attitude that he can work with.

The point of this post is just to highlight the responsibility of the players to take responsibility for their own success, attitude, and motivation instead of having it spoon-fed to them. If some of his players weren't motivated, then maybe it's their fault. There are some instances where management is so piss-poor that people can't help but lose their motivation -- but I don't see that from the majority of RR's players.

Don

January 23rd, 2010 at 6:05 AM ^

Eliot Mealer's scholarship when he was injured and unable to play, and also forbade his paralyzed brother Brock from having any access to the Michigan weight room or the UM S&C personnel.

UMMAN83

January 23rd, 2010 at 8:20 AM ^

change you get left in the dust. What is wrong with some music in the stands? If some of these types got up and yelled throughout the game and actually supported the team vs. looking for the team to support their ego maybe things would be different. I think the worse thing occuring is so called "UM" fans not supporting RR and making the situation worse.

jb5O4

January 23rd, 2010 at 8:35 AM ^

I don't think he has done anything wrong. My dad met him when he was at Tulane. He said that he is a nice guy and everyone there loved him. He has done nothing wrong and I think it shows how much the players like him seeing as how they are sticking around to try to win under him. If he was a huge douche we probably would have a bunch of kids giving up on the program. No one wants to lose playing for a bad guy.

I gaurantee the next time we beat Ohio State no one will be complaining. He will win and he'll win it the Michigan way.

BigWeb17

January 23rd, 2010 at 8:45 AM ^

Michigan man...not a Michigan man...who really cares? I don't. I could care less who the coach is I will support the Team. Our family will continue to go to the games and support the TEAM. The coach is not bigger than the program. I agree with the poster earlier who mentioned if we pick from the pool of candidates that AKG outlined where would we be? Anyway. Have a great weekend and GO BLUE!!

Bosch

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:17 AM ^

My ex-step-grandfather (yeah...) has had season tickets since forever. He's probably around 70 now. I still occasionally visit him. Anyway, most of our conversations are about Michigan athletics. I have made a point to ask him about how he feels about RR and the direction of the program. This man is someone who will most certainly share his honest opinion of someone. He supports the guy, so it certainly gives me hope.

Magnus

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:29 AM ^

Winning cures all, but there will always be people who dislike every coach we have. It's just a fact of life. Hell, Lloyd Carr won us our first national championship in decades, but people got pissed off at his halftime answers to Armen Keteyian (or whoever that was, I forget) or were sick of him running the ball or wanted him to retire or wanted him fired.

ontarioblue

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:35 AM ^

Sorry to sat, but attending a football game is not like watching a baseball game. The action occurs fast and reactions are quick. The game today is a lot faster than it was ten years ago and with the upbeat tempo of play, fans have been drawn more into the flow of the game. During the OSU game, we never sat down the entire game, unfortunately there were a lot of the older fanbase that were becoming really frustrated. To them, I understand standing all day at your age is tough, but that doesn't give you the right to dictate to the rest of us, what our behaviour should be. To them, I recommend staying at home, pull out the lazy boy and enjoy the game, cause it is only going to get worse.

These are also the same people who view all the changes in the stadium the last few years as something that Rich Rod single handedly brought with him. Truth is the atmosphere at the games was becoming stale, the crowds quieter, and the excitement level dwindling. After all it is the Big House and it should never sound like a baseball stadium on game day.

.

Section 1

January 23rd, 2010 at 11:44 AM ^

When you stand, YOU are the person forcing your will, on every fan in every row behind you.

If you are such a great fan, and so spirited and so supportive, I have an idea for you. Call the Athletic Department, propose a major giving program in which people like yourself who want to stand, can get season tickets reassigned to them where they can stand and not bother anybody. Otherwise, you're just a an ignorant, unserious prick. I suspect that there might be corners of the club seating area where you might be able to stand and not bother anybody. You'll have to pay for that.

I can assure you that there's no connection between supporting Rich Rodriguez and wanting to stand the whole game. Nobody has been more vocal than me in supporting RR and in challenging the Free Press.

By the way, if you want a meaningful statistical cohort, you might consider "the age of Michigan fans" in a regression with "Detroit Free Press Readership," to figure out the level of disloyalty to Rich Rodriguez.

Music -- send your music complaints to Joe Parker. I agree that the music has been awful, partly because of the horrid old sound system (which will be vastly improved next year) but also because I just fucking hate it. It is like going to a Tigers or a Red Wings game. Stupid-shit Neil Diamond and Diamond Reo or whatever. If I never again hear, "...born and raised in south Detroit..." it will be too soon. Does anybody know where South Detroit is on a map? NOBODY can tell me that our football players care about hearing Journey during games.

Michigan has a world-class marching band. That is our music. The recorded music is an insult to our band.

The. Recorded. Music. Is. Idiotic.

cjffemt

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:42 AM ^

Would we even be having this talk about RR, if in fact he beat Pitt in the Big East Championship game and went on to the NC game?? I think not!! I believe RR is not the right fit for Michigan, he has brought controversy to the University since the day he took the job. I feel as though he will contiue to create controversy till the day Brandon finally pulls the plug on his reign at the GREATEST FOOTBALL PROGRAM in the country.

With that said, I will continue to support the job (good bad indifferent,) RR continues to do while he is here...........Why because I am a true blue Michigan man. I refuse to allow my feelings about a coach, interfere the meaning of college sports. It is not about the coach, ultimately it is about the student atheletes and the education they aquire while in school.

Section 1

January 23rd, 2010 at 12:02 PM ^

If your idea of "controversy" is Ryan Mallett, Justin Boren, Mike Boren, family values, Cleeg Whatshisname, J. Feagin, disproven "stolen files" allegations, contract buyouts, Michael Rosenberg, CARA forms and Hurricane Katrina, then I've got news for you, Chad -- Rich Rodriguez has done NOTHING wrong.

If you are unclear on the facts and all the details, I urge you; get out more often. Check out the facts. Only the laziest of Michigan fans could, at this point in the dismantling of the Free Press, think that Rich Rodriguez is prone to self-made controversy. He isn't. He's the victim of a writer, a newspaper, and a tiny (and I mean TINY) faction of people who have attacked him.

cjffemt

January 23rd, 2010 at 2:59 PM ^

I never laid blame at all for the controversies surrounding him. I just simply stated since he has taken the HC job he has brought controversy to the University.....has he not?? How can you say he hasn't?? The $4 million buyout, to the supposed stolen files, to the new allegations of practicing too many hours a week. Those are controveries he has brought, not me not you, noone but RR. I am not saying that a few of the controversies are BS, but undoubtedly the Buyout scandel and the practicing scandel are real (as we will find out very soon from the NCAA.) I don't dismiss the fact that there are nay sayers out there wishing him not to succeed, but the fact remains when was the last time Michigan was under NCAA investigation in the football program, I believe that report just came out earlier this week, and it was never in the 100 years of Michigan Football, and now we may see sanctions. I don't feel as though the practice scandel is a huge deal as every BCS team rather they want to admit it or not, do it as well...

I will leave this as I did the first time around, I will support him till he is no longer here.

Section 1

January 23rd, 2010 at 3:25 PM ^

What was the "Buyout scandal" (to correct your spelling)? There was a dispute; it was litigated. Rich Rodriguez did not negotiate his buyout clause; a lawyer did. Rich Rodriguez was, assuredly, represented by an agent and a team of lawyers through the entire process, as he negotiated with Michigan and negotiated his way out of West Virginia. So too, both Universities were represented by counsel. What was the scandal? Do you equate "contract dispute" with "scandal"?

Chad, you mention "the supposed stolen files." Describe for us, in detail, what Rich Rodrgiuez did wrong with respect to any athletic or academic files from WVU. Be specific. Do it now.

Lastly, you bring up the NCAA investigation. It is based on a newspaper report, that was based on a handful of unknown, unnamed, "current and former players." And nothing else. (Ever ask yourself why "former" players should be anonymous?) If you haven't seen how Michael Rosenberg's reporting (called "journalistic malpractice" by Jonathan Chait of The New Republic) has been ripped apart on this blog and elsewhwere, you haven't been paying attention.

I shudder when I think of how many fans there are out there like you. People who have given all of the Rich Rodriguez reporting only casual attention, it seems, and whose general view is that there must be something wrong, something going on there. I am certain that that was the effect that Rodriguez's opponents, like Mike Rosenberg, intended. (That, and general controversy, to boost falling Free Press circulation.)

cjffemt

January 24th, 2010 at 7:20 AM ^

Well thank you for the spelling correction, I am not as educated as you, I do appologize for my ignorance SIR. As for my opinion it is just that my opinion, which I am entitled to, if you don't believe what I do then you don't have to read or respond to it, that is your choice. But to condem me for my beliefs you are out of line. I have not been on this blog that long so I have not seen how this site has broken down the Asswipe Rosenbergs commentary so I do appologize. And to make a statement about fans there are like me? WHat that have an opinion and are not afraid to voice it?? If anyone here is ignorant Sir it is not me, so I now take back my appology and I will leave it as is.

wildbackdunesman

January 23rd, 2010 at 4:35 PM ^

Would we even be having this talk about RR, if in fact he beat Pitt in the Big East Championship game and went on to the NC game?? I think not!!

What difference does that make? So what? Rodriguez wasn't happy with his AD and wanted out. Sooner or later push was going to come to shove and the timing was right for us.

Would we even have had Bo if he did a little better early on at Miami of Ohio and got scooped up by another school first?

Would we even have had Carr if he didn't listen to Bo who told him that he couldn't take the Notre Dame DC job?

Would we even have had Yost if he won a national title at the previous 4 schools that he head coached at before he came to UofM?

Your point is pointless.

Elno Lewis

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:46 AM ^

to their opinions. It is impossible to please all of the people all of the time. Bo was despised by many when he first arrived, and had his fair share of haters throughout his career. There is no such thing as a Michigan Man...it was a trite remark spontaneously made by Bo when he got rid of that basketball corch.

Controversy sells and the media makes good use of this all the time. We feed into it constantly so it perpetuates itself.

Yes, winning the right way is important. Every team in the world would probably agree to this even if they aren't doing it--whatever IT is.

People seem to think the football team somehow reflects on THEM. These people really need to get a life. Its a GAME. It is meant to be entertainment not a statement of character. And football is really not that hard to just enjoy.

Potato Salad.

TorontoBlue

January 23rd, 2010 at 9:56 AM ^

My old man played for Crisler 44-47. He loved Oosterbaan and Bump Elliott. He hated Bo when he was hired and refused to set foot in the Big House during his tenure. Very similar sentiments to the original poster here. So I've lived through this before. My two brothers and I brought him to Moeller's first game against UCLA. (He got yelled at for fireing up a cigar in the stands which was hilarious).

So there was an old guard that Bo had to deal with as well, and he wasn't universally loved at the beginning of his tenure either. You can't please everyone. But if you love Michigan, then that's all that really counts. RR knows what he's gotten himself into, Don Nehlen was the guy who pushed him to go after the job, he's got a clear perspective on things. We're gonna be just fine.

GO BLUE!

Braylon1

January 23rd, 2010 at 10:42 AM ^

All Rodriguez needs to prove is that he can run this program w/ absolute integrity, understand our rivalry games and beat our rivals. With those things accomplished the wins will pile up.

I hope RR gets this ship righted asap.

miller

January 23rd, 2010 at 12:14 PM ^

I just had a conversation with my boss' husband yesterday about Rich Rod and the state of the football program. I'm in my 20s and he's in his early 70s so there's a huge generational gap there. Also, we're both alums.

I pretty much agree with Brian that the 2010 season for better or worse should determine Rich Rod's fate. I've supported Rodriguez from the very beginning and preached patience to everyone I've talked to over the past couple years. However, if we go below .500 and miss a bowl I think big changes need to be made.

Surprisingly, my boss' husband thought that no matter what happens this coming season Rodriguez should get a fourth year. So, for what it's worth, not every old blue hair alum hates Rich Rod and wants a Bo style program back in Ann Arbor.

jabberwock

January 23rd, 2010 at 5:42 PM ^

I'm part of the over 40 crowd as well, and while I may not be a football genius, I can certainly recognize coaching/personality styles. Rodriguez is much less "gruff" than Bo, and a bit less polished in other areas but I'd say the two ARE very similar.

As far as the piped in music goes, I mostly blame the Martin/RR honeymoon.
let me 'splain:
RR is a young coach, that actually DOES seem to connect with his players pretty well. He wants them comfortable, and motivated. I'm also sure that RR knows about the "quiet atmosphere" at the Big House.
I'm sure he inquired about livening it up a bit, and Martin unfortunately opted for the "Joe Louis/Comerica Park/Palace Special"
There's always time to change it, amp the band, etc.

Also, what the hell is up with all the Midwest/Michigan Man bigotry?
"RR isn't from around here, so he doesn't get the OSU rivalry?"

What The Fuck kind of inane statement is that?
I'm sure Pete Caroll, Mack brown & Urban Meyer, etc. would be chased away with hot pokers if they ever showed up at Michigan. (well ok, maybe Caroll would be now)

I still haven't seen any valid evidence of RR's shortcomings from any of the haters on this board?
If you want to say you don't agree with a certain way he recruits, or coaches a game etc. that's fine, give us an example, but all this vague whining about not being a good fit is ridiculous. Most of your Michigan idols were COMPLETE outsiders when they arrived, and that was without the media shit-storm that was waiting for RR.

Results on the field will be the ultimate decider, but if people are this vehement after just 2 years, then IMO they had a hell of a bias to begin with.

dahblue

January 24th, 2010 at 12:51 AM ^

I didn't expect miracles in 2008, but the record was worse than could have been imagined. Last years team...eh...it's been argued a million times.

My concern is that folks are setting up another excuse for the 2010 season - "How could we expect a good season after losing our top players on defense?"