Michigan Tradition >>>>>>>>> Dave Brandon and Gary Danielson
"The Game" in October?
What does this mean? Brandon didn't want to move the Game.
i seem to recall brandon alluding to moving the game when they set the divisions. he just got a lot of fan backlash. then the issue was revisitied and the game stayed, iirc.
He spoke about this at a function over the summer. He said that he absolutely did not want to move the Game, but at the same time, as an AD, he couldn't just lash out at the league office. He has to be on good terms with them. There is protocol that he has to respect. But at the same time, he made sure word leaked out to the fans, who were free to voice their opinion.
I think this is the truth. If he been in favor of moving the Game, I don't think he would have said anything before the announcement. When you have an unpopular announcement to make (and everyone knew moving the Game would be unpopular), you don't let it slowly leak out - you make sure it drops as planned, buried in the middle of a bunch of other announcements.
Fuck that. Put us in the same division then.
Exactly. The other thing that does is give Nebraska and PSU true rivals that share the same type of historic success. Iowa would be a good cross-divisional rival for Nebraska, but they don't share the same tradition, IMO.
And I really wish they would've pushed for this harder at the beginning...part of me still wishes there is some chance of this happening.
Being in different divisions makes absolutely zero sense.
but many potential $. it's obvious to me that trumps tradition for brandon, which really surprises me considering he was a player.
The thing is, rarely would UM and OSU play in a rematch as it is. Someone went back and found that if there were a B10CG the past 15 years, then Michigan and OSU would have had exactly one re-match in it. There's no reason to worry about a back-to-back game because:
A: It will rarely happen, and
B: When it does, it will be novel enough that it will actually be a positive.
Putting us in two divisions was probably the most insane decision made with chosing the two divisons. NO! Part of what made the Red River Rivalry was that the winner might be going to the conference title game while the loser stays home. Absolutely not a fan of this, or anyone in the B10 considering such a move.
I could not agree more. To "go on," so to speak, you should have to win your block first, which means beating your biggest rival, your conference-mate, your neighbor state, etc. . If we don't beat OSU, we shouldn't get to play them again in the championship game; vice versa obviously, as it cheapens the regular season matchup, and also, most importantly, because it alters irreparably an iconic annual event fundamentally. I'm pro-change, usually, but not here. Same divisions. Last game of year. It would almost always have drama especially if division records were first tiebreaker. (Well, if the Big Ten used intelligent tiebreakers).
Random: I actually own the "Save the Game" shirt that was relevant for roughly 6 days last year. I feel like it may have to get broken out again some day, which worries me. I wonder how many Brian and UGP sold.
Not as impactful of a game, but it's also what makes the Iron Bowl great. 1 chance and that's it till next year
Do you think that principle is what diminished the OK/NE rivalry?
as NU-OU only played twice every 4 years.
..., IF that is the case (consider who is reporting it), to say the considerate thing to the nation and suggest the ruination of the tradition of two schools at once. I would vote "no" on this one.
The same things were being said when they came out with the divisional alignments, I really hope it doesn't happen, but it's no use even thinking about it right now. What will be, will be
This won't happen.
Ding, ding, ding. Why would anyone in the Big Ten be leaking information to the biggest SEC honk in the world? And why would it first leak out on a show that talks about college football for about 5 hours a year?
I believe this to be the wishes of many within the B1G. Heads will roll if it happens.
Can somebody please explain why it is so much worse for UM and Ohio to play in back-to-back weeks than any other combination? Isn't it just as likely that Wisconsin and Nebraska play at the end of some season two weeks in a row? I suppose the philosophy of the B1G schedules is now going to be to determine who the good and bad teams are (3 years in advance when the schedules are made) and match them up against each other in the final week.
I believe the way the schedules are put together no other alternate-division teams play the last week of the regular season, just us.
Was a cross divisional game the last week. As long as OSU-UM is the last weekend of the regular season, there will always be one other cross divisional match-up that weekend too.
watching the game after Thanksgiving as it was.
We don't know, because we haven't had a full on game since 2006, but I definitely thought the meaning of the game is diminished by us being in separate divisions.
Then again, watching the video of the players reactions, that game meant a hell of a lot to RVB and Will Heininger. So maybe my perception was just skewed. Heck, ask those guys - would they rather have played OSU in October, or for that last game on Senior Day.
Course, there's very little danger of that one ever being a rematch in the B1GCG.
Danielson = Drew Sharp.
No one would listen to/read their crap unless they said something controversial. I sort of hate myself right now because our participation in this discussion essentially gives that prick what he wants. He wants people to talk about his show.
I understand the tactics of it, if it is true. Implement change incrementally so that no one change is big enough to get the whole population against it. That said, it is an awful idea- but the only thing against it is tradition. Nowadays how powerful is tradition really? It is to us, but we won't stop going to games or buying jerseys (especially in Ohio where the sales of said jerseys are turning the tide on the rivalry). If they think it will make more money then they will push for it. It is going to be up to whether Dave Brandon gets enough pressure to fight on behalf of Michigan fans and traditions instead of against them.
If this is put forward it will be tough to stop, and it will rely on OSU and Michigan fans getting as up in arms (probably moreso) than they did last time. They are just trying to sneak changes by piece by piece until MIchigan Stadium looks and feels like every other team and Michigan tradition as as unique and valued as Wonder bread. Great brand, but no substance.
I don't know guys... Danielson was right about that gimmicy spread stuff.
IIRC when, after the dustup about moving The Game last year, the powers that be said Michigan-ohio would be the last game of the schedule at least until they move to a nine game conference schedule (~2015?). They left the door wide open to move it mid season. My guess is they make the attempt again. Let's hope it doesn't happen.
I'm not a big Danielson fan, but why would he just make this up? To piss off the two biggest fanbases in the Big 10? Not likely. This makes me a little worried.
so he can go on NY radio and sound like he knows a lot...not saying it isn't true but he is prone to that type of behavior
Danielson also suggested that the SEC championship game will be moved to October so it won't be played back to back with the national championship game between the same schools.
I was wondering when this particular piece of shit would hit the fan. It's not just fanbases in the Big Ten that are motivated by petty jealousy of Michigan and, to a lesser extent, Ohio State. It's the leadership of several Big Ten athletic departments (I'm looking at you, Barry Alvarez).
To say it won't happen, I'm afraid, is not fully grasping just how the Big Ten athletic directors think. If this schedule change ever came up for a vote in a Big Ten meeting, I wouldn't be surprised if it passed 9-3 or 10-2. I think Michigan and Ohio State need to be prepared to abandon the Big Ten rather then let themselves get walked over by the minor programs that make up too much of this conference.
Brandon and his counterpart at OSU were totally in favor of putting us in separate divisions and playing midseason until the fan uproar forced him and the league to cave on the less important of those two things.
This is not true. I don't know how Gene Smith felt, but Brandon was not in favor of the plan and made sure it leaked.
Brandon repeatedly talked about how awesome it would be to play OSU in the title game and how that could only happen if they were in separate divisions. He was totally in favor of splitting up the two teams. That or he got pushed around by everyone else in the league which isn't any better IMO.
I'm not sure how he really felt about the divisional split, but he was not in favor of moving the Game.
Gary Danielson is a professional SEC troll and cheerleader one step less powerful than PAWWWLLL Finebaum.
On the credibility scale, BKFinest > Gary Danielson.
This is what has been coming all along. It really doesn't make sense to play OSU at the end of the year if we are in separate divisions (the games against MSU and Nebraska are frankly more important now and a rematch a week later would take a lot of luster off both M/OSU games, especially for a national audience). The plan all along was to put us in separate divisions and move The Game to midseason. When the decisions were being made/leaked everybody bitched about the timing (which is really the secondary issue to being in separate divisions) and were placated when the date of The Game wasn't changed.
like a shell game. We were distracted enough by moving the game, that they were able to land the separate divisions softly by keeping the game on the last weekend. The separate division decision is the harder one to change, so get that one landed first, lay low for a while, and then do the other. Especially after the fan base wakes up and realizes the Michigan - Nebraska, and the Ohio State - Wisconsin games now mean more Big Ten Championship wise.
That said, I think the ramp in schedule to the game this year was perfectly done. Our entire team had really come along by the time we finished off Nebraska. (Then again it allowed Ohio State to get Posey back as well.)
Anyway, it is going to happen, and we will be looking forward to that Michigan - Nebraska game and all the Big Ten Title implications on the last Saturday at some point in the future.
and thus the conference was eligible for a championship game, the nature of Michigan-Ohio State game was changed. It would no longer the last game of the season, and would never determine the conference champion, the championship game would be both of these (unless the championship game is done away with - not happening).
Thus, with the addition of Nebraska, at best the Michigan-OSU game was going to determine the division champion. Putting the two teams in opposite divisions doesn't even accomplish that.
And yes, now with the divisions the way they are, the other 5 divisional games (Nebraska and MSU games included) are of more importance than the OSU game. I suspect that disappoints only 2, but satisfies many more.
The interests of the 10 other conference members is not in maintaining the importance or integrity of the game, as a matter of fact it detracts from their own programs. By putting Michigan and Ohio State in separate divisions (which IIRC, all of the other programs were in favor of), these other programs accomplished exactly what they wanted, a boost to them at the expense of UM-OSU.
Usually the colder weather suspends the smell of shit that Ohio usually puts on the field
That will never happen. I will be making a social visit to Indianapolis and Mr. Delaney's office if he thinks that the little 8 is bigger than Michigan Ohio.
Are you going to call him from Indianapolis?
Otherwise you might want to go to Chicago.
Get off I-90 at Cumberland Ave. (IL-171). It's about 1/2 west on Higgins, if I remember correctly. Look for Bo Pelini shouting, "DAMNIT, JIM! WHY DIDN'T YOU TELL ME ABOUT MICHIGAN!"
We left the Big10 once before
I think it would be a lot of fun to play on back-to-back weeks for the players, the fans and anyone associated with either school, especially the loser of the first game!
The sane Buckeye fan I sat next to this year (section 7, row 96. Yup, top row.) and I actually talked about this and we were in agreement. So if there is anything Michigan and Ohio State fans can agree upon it's that game, it's importance, and it's place on the schedule.
Good luck to the suits trying to mess with it because it will not play well in Ann Arbor or Columbus.
for what to do with an iconic rivalry game in the conference championship era. One is to follow the model of the Iron Bowl, and the other is to follow the pattern of the Oklahoma-Nebraska game in the Big Twelve era. If this crap is true, then the clueless and soul-less bean counters driving B1G policy are hell-bent on following the latter, and emasculating and eviscerating the best-recognized, the most iconic and the most valuable property the B1G has at precisely the time that money is threatening to gut revenue college sports of what remaining fan loyalty hasn't already been squandered away.
CFB will just be a system of unrecognizable faceless overly-marketed revenue-driven farm teams for the NFL where none of the players are payed. I hope there is some way to pull back from the dystopia that Delaney has in store for us.
If "The Game" gets moved to mid-October, it will always be referred to as "The Other Game."
the BCS will implode and conference championships pitting 12-0 teams against 6-6 teams in a re-match of a regular season game in a sterile corporate environment will go away before any of this blasphemy comes to pass.
If Dave Brandon becomes an agency of this travesty, he will lose the good will he is getting so far from the Hoke hire. And if further attempts to soak the fanbase result in copious empty seats at Michigan Stadium like before 1975, then all this unhinged corporate grasping will blow up in B1G's face.
I'll believe it when I see it. If it does happen, though, I would bet it would be 2017 with the 9-game schedule so that they can try to use that as the excuse for why it needs to be that way.
In the new B1G, there are three circumstances under which The game is played:
Neither can get in - this was the circumstance this year and The Game still means The Game.
Either can get in - this could make the game even better.
Both are in - this is no good. Could there ever be a circumstance where The Game doesn't matter? This is it. They are both already certain to play for the mythical B1G chamionship in a week, why bother playing the first version and risking injury?
Also, I don't really care when we play Ohio, just as long as we BEAT OHIO.
In your third scenario, if one or both are have a shot at the national chapmionship The Game means something. Still, this is why we should be in the same division,
I'll know your a fine young man, but I have ZERO TOLERANCE for people who say they don't care when the game is played. Weren't you paying attention to the hold your breathe atmosphere created by the timing of the game two weeks ago. If that game is played in early October, it basically does become another game because you can't focus everything you have on that game because we have 6 more weeks of games to get ready for.
Jim Delany is a real ass so anything's possible. I hate the Leaders and Legends and Michigan and Ohio should be in the same division. We need to add ND and Pitt or Kansas(basketball) and redo the divisions with better names, like directions.
I heard a guy today on the radio say there will be four super conferences and the winner of each conference will be in a plus-1 playoff scenario and all the bowls can still exist.
I think the BCS is goung to die soon becuasuse they f-ed this year up so badly.
By the way Gary D also said the spread is dead several years ago and the PAC-12 has at least five teams that will run it. Danielson took too many head shots while playing for the Lions.
If we're lucky. Everybody knows that MSU has been pushing to move the Michigan-Sparty game to the last week of the season for 30 years now. Perles talked about it every year, insisting that they were our biggest rival.
First off, No. Secondly, No. and Finally, Fuck that noise. Can we sit Dave Brandon down and force him to watch "The Rivalry". Any normal person would not consider moving the game after watching it.
He doesn't need to watch anything. He played in the rivalry.
This is heresy.
How's this for balance?
Leaders: Michigan, Ohio, Indiana, Minnesota, Purdue, Illinois.
Legends: Michigan State, Iowa, Penn State, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Northwestern.
For Balance? Pretty terrible. If you wanna keep it balanced, just swap out ohio and nebraska.
The Big Ten is blessed with a natural competitive East - West split. Why fuck around? Just take yes for an answer.
East: Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, MSU, Purdue, Indiana
West: Nebraska, Wisconsin, Iowa, Illinois, NW, Minn
No, I agree that it's terrible. I think the real issue that the B1G is having with putting us in the same division is that, historically speaking, we have been the two most dominant programs in the conference. If they were to rearrange the split in a way that puts us in the same division, my bet would be that they lump us with four teams with far less impressive histories and put the rest of the "annual powers" into the other division.
The part about not wanting to hit UM and OSU fans with changes all at once? Were they opposed to adding Nebraska and a championship game? There's no way waiting is going to make that change less objectionable.
When UM does (beat) OSU two straight weeks, that change might get proposed. But honestly, who really cared whether there were a few weeks between this year's rematch?
I believe this will happen. UM-OSU was the only crossover game during the last week of the season. The B1G is going to want all intra division games the last week of the season to enhance the chances and therefore suspense of who may play in the Championship game the next week. It sucks, but I think it is just inevitbale.
Then put us in the same division as Ohio. You'll have all the suspense and intensity you want.
Illinois played Minnesota on Nov. 26. Wasn't going to be deciding anything after Zook's epic failure and Minnesota being Minnesota, but there's that. Penultimate weekend had Iowa vs. Purdue and MSU vs. Indiana.
In 2012, the final weekend includes two that are both rivarly games, albeit of different degrees:
- Michigan at osu
- Illinois at Northwestern
And the weekend before has everyone staying in division. For the course of the conference season in 2012, the number of inter-division games each week is: 3, 4, 1, 2, 2, 1, 3, 0, 2 (18 total games, 36 total opponents, 12 teams times 3 inter-division games).
Not sure the tea leaves prove anything.
Ah, thats right. I guess if one team played a crossover, that would entail needing a 2nd crossover game as well, my bad. I ws doing the thinking in my head and remembered UNL vs Iowa, MSU vs NW, and totally forgot about Minnesota.
Gary Danielson can suck it.. He's full of shit. MAN, I can't stand that guy. What a traiterous tool.
Need to move penn state and give us a snacky-cake like minnesota.
The Game should be the last game of the regular season. Period.
If the Big Ten++ wants an intradivision game, then tOSU should be in our division.
Over my dead body.
Gary Danielson is a self-serving blow hard. That is all.
If you really think about it, if that happened, it would pretty much signify the conference wants Michigan and Ohio would to play annually in the Big Ten Championship game.
It's not such a bad deal, we play them in the middle of October and can have Sparty as our last conference play game.
Gotta remember that this "news" is coming from the guy who said the spread is dead. He's a fool.
and 10 other programs each with an vote of equal value to UM and OSU, but with their own interests. These other programs don't want Michigan and Ohio State in the championship game, they want their own team there.
And from their perspective, the game totally diminishes the importance of all of their games. I can't believe there isn't just a little resentment there.
Finally, if you go back to the Big Ten standings the last 20 or so years, I doubt that you would find more than 5 years in which Michigan and OSU had the 2 best records (thus loosely representing a Michigan-OSU championship game matchup).
Particularly with the addition of Nebraska and the rise of both Wisconsin and MSU as powers, a Michigan-Ohio State championship game is not going to happen often.