Follow up: Michigan-ND Rekindling Series? Harbaugh weighs in.

Submitted by tlo2485 on

http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/index.ssf/2015/09/jim_harbaugh_would_be…

 

 

MLIVE is reporting that both Harbaugh and Kelly are open to the idea of opening the series back up. Things are 'trending up' according to Kelly. Are we fans of this possibility?

 

Harbaugh:

On Tuesday, speaking on the Big Ten teleconference, Harbaugh was asked if he'd be in favor of having a Michigan-Notre Dame series re-started at some point down the road.

"I'd probably have a conversation with coach Kelly about that before (I had one with) anyone else, that'd be the best course of action," Harbaugh said. "But I would be open to it, yes."

 

 

 

Edit: sorry, missed the original comments from earlier this week, changed title 

JClay

September 15th, 2015 at 4:55 PM ^

I'm a fan of the idea but would prefer not every year. If I was Hackett, I'd push for two years on, two years off, repeat with a 2+ decade agreement, ideally. Best of all worlds: every 4 year player at both schools gets to play the other home and away once, but both schools can bring in truly elite OOC foes in the off seasons for variety.

alum96

September 15th, 2015 at 6:15 PM ^

I am with you 80%.  I'd like to see Notre Dame as part of a regular rotation but not every damn year.  4 years out of 10 is fine.  I am still yearning for Georgia on the schedule but a 10 year cycle that goes something like Oklahoma home and home, Notre Dame home and home, Georgia home and home, UCLA home and home, and Auburn (or LSU, or Bama) home and home would be fine by me.  If you want to take that last SEC game out and put Notre Dame back in there, it's cool too.  But no more only doing Notre Dame every year.

A Fan In Fargo

September 15th, 2015 at 6:33 PM ^

They dropped Michigan like a bad habit and took the last home game. Then they added a home and home with the suckeyes. Playing them once every few years would be enough. I'd rather see Michigan smack them around in a playoff game. I've always wanted to see USC and Georgia in Ann Arbor. Do that instead. Comeon Man!!

UMForLife

September 15th, 2015 at 9:36 PM ^

May be ND wanted to extend and Brandon didn't. So, they came up with a different story. Who knows what happened? Now they see us a viable option...

May be Brandon thought we should be playing more teams and heck with the rivalries. It was not a good business model.

Or ND just likes the idea of Harbaugh. Regardless, I like a few games a decade with ND.

leu2500

September 15th, 2015 at 5:18 PM ^

We learned not so much in BLL. The ND AD was a pain to deal with that Martin put up with for the sake of the series. Brandon didn't appreciate the series (he thought MSU was a bigger game, despite the evidence presented to him), and the other ADs didn't like him. Also, Brandon trusted the last deal with ND & didn't negotiate like he should have, again despite advice otherwise. So ND might have walked anyways, but Brandon made it easier.




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tlo2485

September 15th, 2015 at 5:09 PM ^

I'd be perfectly fine with scheduling them as any other series for a home and home.... except the first one should be a 2 and 1 to make up for their cancellation

alum96

September 15th, 2015 at 6:34 PM ^

A 1 off game could happen soon.  A home and home would probably have to be split i.e. not consecutive. And by split it could be a decade apart.  Unless UM wants a very atypical schedule you are not looking for a regular series witH ND until late 2020s.  In the playoff era it is dumb to do - OSU got in last year by playing 1 really good team (MSU), a few above ave teams (Vatech, Minn) and then a conf championship game (Wisc).  They didnt even need UM or PSU to be any good to get in  If you are serious about making the playoffs you dont play Oklahoma and Notre dame in the same year or even Arkansas and Notre dame.  Too much risk.  You do something like Oklahona, Syracuse, and tomato can i.e. Eastern.

  • 2017 - already a 1 off with Florida
  • 2018 - Arkansas and SMU
  • 2019 - Arkansas and Army
  • 2020 and 2021 are no gos as you already have both VA Tech and Washington
  • 2022. 2023 - UCLA
  • 2024, 2027 - Texas
  • 2025, 2026 - Oklahoma

So any of the 2022-2027 time frame you are talking another P5 blue blood + Notre Dame + 1 tomato can.  2020 and 2021 already have 2 mid tier p5 teams so not those years.

You could do 2018 and 2019 and you'd have Arkansas and Notre Dame + softer team in SMU/Army.  But after that you are talking 2028 unless you really want to stuff the schedule.

Notre Dame is not dropping USC ever and has Ball State, Northwestern, Stanford as the other "non conf" along with Navy in 2018. 

In 2019 they already have Georgia along with USC, then New Mexico and Stanford so no way there.

Only way I see that for Notre Dame is to walk away from Ball State in 2018 but that gives them no real tomato can early which I doubt they want to do.

With scheduling so far out nowadays it is difficult to restart a series anytime soon.

 

 

 

cutter

September 15th, 2015 at 5:31 PM ^

Unless Michigan is thinking about scheduling Notre Dame as a second non-conference home-and-home series along with Arkansas (2018/9), UCLA (2022/3), Texas (2024/7) or Oklahoma (2025/6), then the ND discussion is a moot point because the next open scheduling slot would be in 2028.

That assumes that UM doesn't drop any of those series for Notre Dame.  It also assumes that Michigan will keep the two home-and-home series with Virginia Tech and Washington for the 2020 and 2021 seasons.     

Here's the more interesting scheduling questions that should be asked of Jim Hackett and Jim Harbaugh:

1.  Will Michigan look to play two Power Five Conference teams on future non-conference schedules?   As I wrote above, U-M has VaTech and UW in the 2020/1 seasons for a couple of home-and-home series.  That means losing one potential  home game over that two year period, so how much does that effect the budget?

2.  If the answer is yes to (1), then what sort of teams will U-M pair up with Arkansas, UCLA, Texas and Oklahoma on the schedule?  Will they look at having that second home-and-home with a team that is traditionally not very good within the Power 5 conferences, such as Vanderbilt or Wake Forest (I assume that game against WF would be played in Charlotte, NC)?  Will that second team be a middle of the road program like California or Boston College or Virginia or Texas Tech?  Will teams in major recruting areas be on the list, such as Baylor or TCU in Texas or maybe Miami-FL?

3.  If Michigan does opt to have two home-and-home series with Power 5 teams, will the Big Ten cooperate and make the Big Ten Conference opening game against an "easier" opponent.  From 2016 to 2019, Michigan's B1G opening games are with Wisconsin (2), Nebraska and Purdue.  If U-M were to have two P5 teams on the schedule, then opneing the B1G season with the Purdues of the world would help.

4.  When making up these non-conference schedules, how much is schedule strength a consideration when it comes to the playoffs?  Is U-M assuming there will be a four-team playoff during the next decade or will we be at 8 teams by the 2020s?

As far as Notre Dame is concerned, I wouldn't mind having them back as a part of a rotation of major programs within Michigan's non-conference schedule.  This blog and other boards have discussed the candidates--programs like Georgia and LSU from the SEC or Clemson and Florida State from the ACC would be four possibilities from the top of my head that aren't on the schedule between now and 2027 (and aren't from the Pac 12).

tlo2485

September 15th, 2015 at 5:48 PM ^

I think you raise all of the major points. if we opt for 2 power 5 teams in a given year, they will absolutely have to coincide with a year when we have 5 big ten home games and not 4.... and probably years we know we get weaker teams from the west..... thankfully brandon is not here to absolutely screw this up... but there will definitely be years we can have 2 big non conference games each decade if it's done carefully 

cutter

September 15th, 2015 at 6:07 PM ^

Michigan already has seven home games in 2018:  Arkansas, SMU, Nebraska, Maryland, Wisconsin, Penn State and Indiana.  If U-M were to have a second home-and-home series in that season and in 2019, then it makes sense for that game to be on the road (seven home/five road).  Unfortunately, the season opener is with Nebraska, so Michigan might want its third non-conference opponent to be in the "below middle of the road category".

In 2019, Michigan only has five home games on the schedule to date:  Army, Iowa, Rutgers, Michgan State and Ohio State.  That last unscheduled non-conference game will have to be played in Ann Arbor to get a six home/six away split.  Since Michigan opens the Big Ten season at Wisconsin, it would again suggest U-M would want that third non-conference opponent to be in the "below middle of the row category".

The Big Ten hasn't published conference schedules beyond 2019, but assuming they keep up the current rotation of home/away conference games, then 2020 will have five Big Ten games, 2021 will have four, etc.

2020 Home Games (7):  Ball State, Virginia Tech, Maryland, Penn State, Indiana, 2 Western Division Teams TBD

2021 Home Games (6):  One Non Conference TBD, Washington, Rutgers, Michigan State, Ohio State, 1 Western Division Team TBD

2022 Home Games (7 or 8):  One or Two Non Conference TBD, UCLA, Maryland, Penn State, Indiana, 2 Western Divison Teams TBD

2023 Home Games (6):  Two Non Conference TBD, Rutgers, Michigan State, Ohio State, 1 Western Division Team TBD

In 2024 (Five Big Ten home games?), Michigan opens the season with Texas (Aug 31).  U-M plays in Austin on 4 September 2027 (Four Big Ten home games?).

In 2025 (Four Big Ten home games?), Michgan plays at Oklahoma on September 6, then hosts the Sooner on 12 September 2026 (Five Big Ten home games).

cutter

September 15th, 2015 at 6:11 PM ^

Notre Dame's contract with NBC is pretty much set, so they're not going to get any extra cash from the network because Michigan is on the schedule.

Perhaps they could make more on tickets by selling them at a premium, but they could probably do the same with the programs they have on the early season schedule in the coming years.  The next two seasons include games in September with Michigan State and Georgia.  I have a feeling ND would be able to sell out those games with little problem.

A Fan In Fargo

September 16th, 2015 at 1:42 AM ^

We'll call you full of shit. It all comes down to money. (Notra) Lame being the little candy asses they are all of a sudden want back into the rivalry. Why you ask? Probably because it is going to be very appealing for them to beat a Michigan team of the future. What does that ultimately come down to after all is said and done? It's money. Time to go pro sometime rookie. All of a sudden after kicking us in the ribs they want to shake hands. To hell with that and to hell with your disfuctional logic.