First anti-RR sentiments

Submitted by ijohnb on

I don't even know the final score. All I know is that M wasn't ready to play and I'm pissed. RR has a lot or rope and he is still my guy for real, but it's time for some real analysis.. from the squib kick on, there was some major problems, and not the "young players" type of problems. This is one die hard who has had RR's back no matter what until now. I'm not calling for a firing, but that was not a well prepared football team. And don't bullshit me about freshman this and freshman that, that was bad. BAD. Not "we are bulding" bad, but fucking bad period.... Bullshit!!! Bring it on blind RR supporters, it's time we have it out. I remember WV v. Pitt....

los barcos

October 24th, 2009 at 8:16 PM ^

the competition has gotten better...but we looked awful today at home.

point is we lost a close one to an underrated msu team on our first away game with a freshmen qb. we lost a close game to the best team in the big ten at night on the road. both games we made steps forward.

today we dropped a huge egg when most of us thought we would win or at least beat the spread (see jaimemacs diary)

Mgobowl

October 24th, 2009 at 8:43 PM ^

Wait, you said the team is getting worse and worse, then cite MSU and Iowa as progress? I'll give you that MSU was the better prepared team, we shot ourselves in the foot against Iowa, and PSU was bad all around. Worse and worse implies a trend and your trend starts and stops with PSU.

The difference between now and the beginning of the season is the talent level of the competition and the game film that our opposition has been able to see. Teams are catching up to us in terms of talent (in this case exceeding us) and in terms of game planning. It's hard for a coach to install entirely new things each week when the team still doesn't know the whole offense. We are stagnating relative to our opposition, but not regressing.

Is the stagnation Rich Rod's fault, injuries, depth of talent on both sides of the ball? I think it's all of the above, but to solely blame Rich Rod for the team's progress or apparent lack of progress is a knee jerk reaction for a short term problem. If this were an established program and the players were clearly not progressing (Weis), then I would be calling for anti-Rich Rod sentiment.

los barcos

October 24th, 2009 at 11:22 PM ^

I didn't cite msu & iowa as progress but the consensus on this blog is, even though we played poorly, we were still in it at the end. in psu we played like shit for 38 minutes.

and the "trend" did not start and end with psu. it started with indiana and blew up in our faces agaisnt psu.

TIMMMAAY

October 25th, 2009 at 7:12 PM ^

I didn't cite msu & iowa as progress...

point is we lost a close one to an underrated msu team on our first away game with a freshmen qb. we lost a close game to the best team in the big ten at night on the road. both games we made steps forward.

richarjo

October 24th, 2009 at 8:47 PM ^

My only concern with the spread is that you have to line the qb and halfback so far off the line, and then if you are running, the halfback runs towards the sideline first. Getting the tough yards in the cold, seems to be even more difficult. It just looked like a passing game wasn't going to happen at any point, and I longed for the days when we would run 3 yards on first, then 3 yards on 2nd, and have an easy third down with a tall qb that had an accurate arm that could throw in the pocket.

I know that two of the last three years of Lloyd Carr were maddening, but I think we would have been fine if we recruited elite talent like the old times. We didn't and we needed a change, and I hope RR is going to be it. I have always said he is our answer, but today worried me. Our offense moves so fast that our D is on the field all the time. We should just run the ball and eat clock on offense. Rich Rod, can do that very well. It would keep our weak D fresher. It is what it is, but this is the first game where I started to have my doubts about RR, and longed for Les Miles to come here. Frustrating game.

RockinLoud

October 24th, 2009 at 9:05 PM ^

I don't know how it is on RR when there are several key injuries, numerous drive killing drops by receivers, and terrible fumbles that began to remind me of Nebraska earlier in the day (thank God we didn't approach that level of disaster, it was worse than any M game last year by a lot). You can only do so much as a coach and the rest has to be on your players to execute. The only exception that could made against RR today I think is the spike on 3rd down at the end of the half, if indeed that was his call.

Not to mention, is it just me, or does it appear that Tate is probably more injured than we have been lead to believe; he just hasn't been the same since that happened.

tomhagan

October 24th, 2009 at 7:42 PM ^

I see many other teams out there in the Big Ten not turning the ball over all over the place, not dropping easy passes, not blowing assignments and coverages and playing sound fundamental football.

Youth aside, can anyone say that Michigan is playing sound fundamental football?

Blue McMaize

October 24th, 2009 at 7:50 PM ^

Youth aside? You cant discount youth thats a pretty big factor dude. The fact is our Freshman qb who played out of his mind the first few games has came back to earth and is playing like a freshman. Same with Denard. Both in the right situation wouldnt even see the field this year but both are being asked to lead this thing. And as for Big Ten teams playing sound football? Tell OSU fans that after last week. Tell PSU fans that after their Iowa game. I understand your frustration with the turnovers. We have to be the hardest team to watch in the country. But this team does have alot of young players making dumb mistakes. I do agree however that RR shouldnt be completely above criticism. Part of this one is on the coaching staff.

Eyebrowse

October 24th, 2009 at 8:41 PM ^

I appreciate someone saying it. We've talked about how this team is going to have a rollercoaster year from the beginning. Somehow people have latched on to our early success and convinced themselves we still have a shot at a conference championship. Now that reality is setting in, it sucks, which is hard. But my god, the world hasn't ended, we're still one game away from being bowl eligible (which we'll get next week with the win against Illinois), and it's a young team. This is the growing pains, it is going to happen. I won't be surprised when it happens again this year. I'm not saying that wasn't painful to watch, I am saying we'll see this team bounce back.

Hang in there, Go Blue!

mongoose0614

October 24th, 2009 at 7:43 PM ^

We have no swagger or attitude. No nasty in this team on either side. I saw a team that looked soft. THey have failed to show up in 3 bad weather games. THis is a reflection of attitude. This is football for crying out loud.

Where is the fire. Where is the passion. Where are the fundamentals.

I am an unabashed RR supporter and doubt has crept in today.

BlueinLansing

October 24th, 2009 at 7:44 PM ^

until Molk went out again, that took A LOT of air out of this team. Molk is their best football player, period. When he was in there before the knee injury, they were getting 7-8 yards a carry and Forcier was getting pass protection.

Without him the line can't pass protect, can only block marginally on certain running plays and snaps from center become yakety sax.

I'll say it again, Molk was the single biggest injury to this team in the last couple years. This team had a real chance to be 7-0 coming into this game with him in there, I truely believe that. Without him the oline is really awefull and all of your timing routes in RR's offense are thrown off because the QB has to run for his life.

bronxblue

October 24th, 2009 at 7:54 PM ^

Totally agree. It is no coincidence that without Molk, the offense has been stagnant against FBS teams. It also doesn't help that 3 of the last 4 opponents have had pretty good defenses (MSU not statistically, but they clearly were up for that game). Remember that UM now plays Illinois and Purdue, they off the 105th and 71st-ranked defenses in the land. I'm cautiously optimistic that the offense will look better. Now the defense, we'll see. There clearly is a lack of talent, but the poor tackling and compounded mistakes is troubling.

mrjblock24

October 24th, 2009 at 7:56 PM ^

Molk is a huge loss, but he's one guy out of 11. If stuff is breaking down, change your game plan. Throw more quick slants, use misdirection, and compensate for the loss. The team lost because the 11 who were on the field didn't play well, and one more guy wouldn't have changed much about that.

tomhagan

October 24th, 2009 at 7:46 PM ^

Anyone who has a problem with healthy and valid criticism is an idiot.

So go ahead, keep neg banging me just because you have your blinders on.

However....I have supported RR from day one and still do...but that does not mean that I dont call it like I see it: Bad Football today. Very bad.

Im sure that is what this thread is about: How they play on the field.

b-diddy

October 24th, 2009 at 8:07 PM ^

were also a couple plays from 3-5.

losing to psu doesnt bother me (theyre good) getting completely outclassed bothers me, and so does the regression (happened last year too).

the start of the year was great, but we didnt prove as much as it felt like at the time.

RR's honeymoon isnt over, but its not going to go on forever, either.

M-Wolverine

October 24th, 2009 at 9:56 PM ^

I'd say the honeymoon ends IF he loses to OSU. It's going to get nasty then. But honeymoon ending doesn't mean the end of the marriage. And definitely doesn't mean bringing out the pitchforks (yes, for all of you who think ANY criticism whatsoever means someone is saying FIRE THE COACH! FIRE THE COACH!). But yeah, eventually we're going to have to start winning some games that matter.

Brother Mouzone

October 25th, 2009 at 1:14 AM ^

The good news to me is that there was only one game where we were out of it late in the 4th.

The bad news is that it was our most recent game.

Iowa and PSU were superior teams, maybe the best two on our schedule.

People let expectations get out of hand after the early win totals. As a young team we have - and will see bad losses and "ugly" wins.

Freshmen will make mistakes costing us points and possibly costing us games. This season is about progress. Progress isn't linear. We won;t be able to cash those progress chips until the next few years, but cash them we will.

Rescue_Dawn

October 24th, 2009 at 7:50 PM ^

This program is still going through some growing pains but to sit here and say the program is worse now then it was....is simply ridiculous. I'll admit some of the miscues/penaltys were very frusterating but they HAVE continued to get better...not as consistanly as I would like, but the progress is there.

MileHighWolverine

October 24th, 2009 at 7:52 PM ^

when we couldn't protect the QB? Seemed like we were doing the equivalent of 7 step drops on a lot of our plays when we had no time to get the ball in play. Where was the I formation stuff that worked well against MSU? Why doesn't anyone tell Denard to forget any pass further than 5 yards from scrimmage (for now)? He cannot make an accurate throw beyond 5-7 yards (and even then it is shaky)

bronxblue

October 24th, 2009 at 7:55 PM ^

I was at a bar with one of my friends, and we both commented that it was insane to see them looking downfield so much when it was clear that the receivers were not getting open. A couple of nice screen passes or short comebackers would have been great for the offense, and would have opened up lanes for the running backs.

markusr2007

October 24th, 2009 at 7:54 PM ^

had it's moments and did alright under the circumstances. Yes, they gave up big plays and another 30 points but that's just Michigan 2.009 version. Not at all surprised.

What I don't get is the across-the-board regression on offense.
It's going to be another hellish week of practice and some suicide runs for the turnover festival.

michman79

October 24th, 2009 at 7:55 PM ^

BAd football game today. Outside of Delaware State, this team has been regressing each week. But I think the defense has actually been improving. It's that teams are starting to scout and figure out our offense that is the bigger concern.

But, too call out RR when we expected this team to be 6-6 or 7-5 I think is too far. I am pretty sure he has not been coaching the LB's to miss tackles, the TE's to drop balls, the OL to miss blocks, etc.

Our guys did not execute today and sorry for the fair weather fans that don't want to acknowledge our youth, but that is exactly what it is. They are going to make huge plays due to talent that give you tons of hope. Then they are going to make huge mistakes that send you sinking into the abyss which is this post. Ride the coaster and deal with it. It will be a little bit more of the same next year. Won't be until 2011 when we become experienced and thus consistently dominant.

bronxblue

October 24th, 2009 at 8:08 PM ^

I agree the offense has regressed a bit, but remember that they've played some good defenses in less-than-ideal conditions the past few weeks. Not an excuse, but Iowa and PSU have really good defenses (and the one loss between them is against each other), and I still hold out hope that this offense will have more success against teams like Purdue and Illinois. If they only put up 10 points and look lost next week, then I'm worried.

mgoblahhh

October 24th, 2009 at 8:04 PM ^

This entire program for the last 5 years has been on the down-swing. LLoyd did not have the energy to keep up and Rich is trying to play catch up.. I understand, but what the hell was that out there today. I wish the staff would just get it over with and start Denard. You can tell they want him to start because of his speed but they are affraid to have another sub 500 season until he learns to read defenses. I have been a RR supporter but I am starting to have my doubts. I think they should stop recruiting every 5 ft nothing slot receiver and begin going after some size and speed on defense. I cringe at the thought of next years defense without Brandon Gram but I'm sure big Will can replace him ....not.

goody

October 24th, 2009 at 8:05 PM ^

Has Michigan lost to an inferior team this year? NO, Iowa and Penn State or both better top to bottom than Michigan. And MSU and Michigan are about even.

Has Michigan beat a superior team this year? Yes ... Notre Dame.

So Michigan has lost to two better teams, lost a toss up game and won a game they should have. This team is just where they should be this year and will only get better.

bronxblue

October 24th, 2009 at 8:56 PM ^

I'd buy that if this was 2002 or 2003. The last few years of the Carr era were marked by losses to teams that they should have beaten. At this point, win the games you should, lose the games you should, and be competitive in the middle. We all want to be greedy and think this team should win 9-10 games, but it is going to take at least a year more before that will be reality. Still, 5-3 with two weaker teams coming up. 7-3 going to Wiscy and then home to OSU is fine.

M-Wolverine

October 24th, 2009 at 9:59 PM ^

But considering we won 9, 7, 11 and 9 games in those years, that must mean we beat some teams we shouldn't have too, right? Or were we just much more competitive in the middle? Because it seems that's where we're struggling right now....

jmblue

October 25th, 2009 at 12:44 AM ^

Other than PSU '05 and maybe Florida in the '07 bowl, I'm hard-pressed to think of a team we beat those years that was superior to us. Toward the end, Carr had us in a little rut where we basically always beat the bad/mediocre teams (often in uncomfortably close fashion), but almost always lost to the good ones.

ahs22

October 24th, 2009 at 10:56 PM ^

I dont disagree with your comparison of us to other teams...but the overwhelming sentiment on this board that this team "can only get better" without any facts to support it is just wrong. The bottom line is the defensive personnel is far below average this year and losing Graham next year.

Offensively, there is clear evidence to show (from this year and at WVU) that RR's offense struggles in the rain and cold. In the poor weather games where a team needs a shutdown defense to bail them out - I find it hard to believe (analyzing recruiting, scheme, etc.) that are heading towards that here.

With ND, OSU and PSU on the road next year I believe there is legitimate reason to be questioning the state the of the program now and in the immediate future.

imablue

October 24th, 2009 at 8:05 PM ^

We shouldn't be ready to hang RR because of this game. I
think the freshman are starting to get a good taste of
Big 10 football.
Swagger. I agree with mongoose. Tate doesn't look like the
same kid that played ND. I know he was assualted all day,
but this by far the worst offensive output of the season,
some credit to PSU, but we looked terrible other than
the opening drive.
Maybe we shouldn't play a Delaware St. in the middle
of the season.
As well as we played Iowa on the road, I thought we'd
play much better than we did.

MileHighWolverine

October 24th, 2009 at 8:14 PM ^

They guy can't take a hit because it aggravates the injury and he is supposed to play option football? Insanity! And frankly, very concerning that RR would leave him in and exposed like that. Denard makes stupid throws but he can RUN. Devise a few counter plays for him and watch the running game take off....