How I long for good Michigan MBB.... sigh... :(
Fab Five "30 for 30"*
no doubt about that, we havent been the same since those guys left. Cant wait to see that doc and relive the glory days.
We haven't been the same since Glenn Rice and Loy Vaught left. The "Fab Five," led by Chris Webber and his slimy friends can lick me where I pee. Fuck CW for turning a good basketball program into taint smelling suckitude. And fuck Steve Fisher for turning a blind eye.
Suck my balls for not respecting the University and its Athletics you dbags.
Go ahead...Apologize! South Park style.
Chill out bro...
Sorry...got no tickets for the hater train
The Fab 5 were....without a doubt the coolest...badass ballers this town has ever seen. They single-handedly changed the game from the inside out and dragged college ball into the era it is today. And the national semi-final game against Kentucky was the greatest game I've ever seen bar none. Sheer large brass balls.
You don't like em? Tough shit...I do.
Did you like it when a team of Michigan basketball players who were in elementary school when Chris Webber was getting a payday had to stay home from the NCAA tournament because of the sanctions?
Our program was tanked for a decade for this mess. No, not even that. We're STILL paying for it today. And we'll pay for it more when this documentary comes out and we go through another round of negative publicity for this scandal.
Just amazing. But, hey, they had cool socks and baggy shorts!
and one covering the Fab 5, that episode would be nothing short of excellent
You are acting very undude like. Nothing is fucked.
That will be bought by me so I can watch it repeatedly.
Thats going to be awesome. Wow can't wait.
6 to 12 after reading that...
How is the Bartman related to sports?
His impact on the game is debatable, but you make a great point on the public sensationalizing that play.
Cubs defitinely choked that night. All the anger was released on Bartman. I think the guy ended up changing his name.
That is the great thing about the documentary. I suspect they are doing some major research and trying to get the back story and where is Bartman now??? He won't do interviews, so I wonder if 30 for 30 will be able to get him. Anyway, it may not have impacted the game all that much, but the lore and legend (which is part of sports) from the incident is INCREDIBLE for sure. I can't wait!!!
Yeah poor bartman got all of the blame, where it was more Alex Gonzalez that lost the game for the cubbies
That will probably be the point of the show.
I was 14, watching the game at the home of my JV BB coach. A lil piece of me died that day. I effen hate Eric Montrose!!
in New Orleans. It worse than the worst. Fisher came to the Alumni hotel and met with us in the ballroom -- it was like attending a wake. "So sorry, coach..." "So sorry, for your loss..." "How are the kids holding up..." I gave Fisher a lot of credit of staying there and speaking to every person who came up to him. He was obviously broken hearted for his team, wouldn't pass the blame off to Webber and was an all around classy guy.
The whole tournament was an emotional roller coaster that year. I was almost in tears when we were down to UCLA by almost 20 points in the second round, may have been 20 actually. The overtime Kentucky game was awesome, and obviously the heartbraking championship game.
I was at Parris Island, SC for MC boot camp and had to hear about it the next morning from the Drill Instructors and then received the newspaper story in the mail a week later. I wasn't even there and it was a crushing event...
Wearing Nike kicks...the way it was meant to be
butttt, it was posted about a month ago when the news came out
Good to see they will continue showing quality documentaries on ESPN
30 for 30 was one of the best things ESPN has done in a long time. There were very few uninteresting documentaries and many of them were intriguing
Look forward to watching more of these documentaries in the near future
I actually saw rumors of this a couple months ago. I'm really pumped that it's actually happening. ESPN has done an awesome job on these so I can't wait to see how this one turns out.
I need this in my life, now more than ever.
Netflix carries a bunch of them for you to preview first. I liked them but you have to be very hard core sports nerd to like them all.
Should be amazing
I've only seen a couple but they were done very nicely. I look forward to seeing the new ones. Any word on a release date?
I really liked the 30 for 30 docs and reliving the past 30 years of sports, many events of which I was not all that aware. the Fab Five, 86 Masters and Bartman is a great combination of documentaries. Way to go ESPN and great job BS.
They're doing an ESPN documentary on Bart Simpson's alter-ego?... (to everyone who just freaked out, don't worry I know the documentary is on Steve Bartman. To everyone who gets the Bartman Simpsons reference +1 to you!)
It astounds me that out of four shows including F5, Renee Richards, and the '86 Masters, the one about Bartman is the one Simmons cited as "incredible." Superficially, with no further info other than the subject matter, I would go in this order: Fab Five, 86 Masters, Richards, and Bartman.
The Fab Five is obviously more importan to us, and would have to be #1 to any Michigan fan. It didn't end well for us, but we did get to watch them change the game forever.
The '86 Masters was the most impactful victory in a golf tournament since Arnold Palmer drove the 313-yard first hole at Cherry Hills on Sunday in 1960 on the way to winning the US Open. This was in the days of steel shafts, wooden clubheads, and golf balls that probably flew about thirty yards less than modern equipment. If Tom Watson had won the British Open a few years ago, it still wouldn't have had the same impact as Nicklaus' victory. Tiger Woods' broken leg US Open win pales in comparison.
Richards was both a pioneer and a travelling circus at the same time. What he/she did took a lot of courage at a time when that kind of courage was not appreciated by about 99 percent of the American public.
Bartman is just a drunk Cubs fan who is probably still crying in his beer. I wonder if they made a tear-jerker out of it? I guess we'll find out.
"They" did not get paid to play college basketball, "they" did not cheat. Chris Webber did, but the rest of them were the baby that got thrown out with the bath water.
Being the first all-freshman starting lineup in DI college basketball history was an accomplishment. Getting to the Final Four two consecutive years and to the Finals in one of those years was an accomplishment, despite them being removed from the record books. People didn't catch on to the trend of baggy shorts because wearing baggy shorts was cool. It was cool because the Fab Five wore them. People talked about the five of them before they ever set a foot on campus. They had swagger, no doubt, which the fan base loved and, I have to say, was pretty justified based on how they played on the court.
Rose, Howard, Jackson and King are good guys who do a lot for underprivileged kids and charities. Don't rope them in with Webber's crimes.
Bo and Woody would be good to
But I always thought a broadstreet bullies 30 for 30 would be cool.
So... Let me guess how this is going to go:
Lots of discussion about socks and haircuts, Webber making excuses for taking cash (if he even makes an appearance), the rest of them lobbying for the banners hanging again, and the University staying silent on the whole thing, made out by the filmmakers to look like a backwards monolithic evil empire hellbent on erasing their legacy. Sentimental shots of a library employee unfolding the banners on a table in the Grad. Shots of an empty Crisler with dramatic voiceovers about glory and winning and NCAA sanctions.
I'd rather this not get dredged up again. Those banners are gone, they're not coming back, and if the University has a shred of integrity (which they do), Chris Webber will never be let anywhere near this program again.
The Fab Five was a hell of a ride, I enjoyed being in Crisler back then as much as the next guy, but this period ended up being nothing but an embarrassment to our program, and started off a string of guys taking cash. And Webber has been publicly completely and totally unrepentant in its wake. He doesn't care, he got paid, in high school AND college. And I doubt the 10-year disassociation means much to him anyway.
At the end of the day, I'd rather this documentary not happen. There's got to be something else about Michigan worth making a documentary about that will actually paint our University in a positive light.
I know that's an unpopular opinion, but I loathe what the Ed Martin scandal did to this program, to this community, to this University, and it drives me crazy seeing it get spun and rehashed. It was wrong. Let's move on.
The Fab Five were incredible and so much fun to watch, but Chris Webber left an indelible stain on them as a group. The Michigan legacy of Jalen, Juwan, Jimmy and Ray is forever tarred by and tied to Webber's acceptance of ill-gotten money from Ed Martin's illicit gambling and money laundering operations. The banners taken down from Crisler Arena and the record books that reflect that Michigan basketball won 0 games in 1991-1993 that Webber played in was an appropriate self-punishment for Michigan, but the wide scope of sanctions unfairly cast the other four as complicit in Webber's crimes. They, along with the other players on the teams of Robert Traylor, Maurice Taylor and Louis Bullock, are victims, not villains.
Let's not forget that Chris Webber lied to a federal grand jury about his relationship with Martin, not exactly "Michigan Man" stuff. The feds allowed him a plea bargain to cop to a misdemeanor obstructing a federal investigation with fines and probation, instead of trying him on felony perjury charges that could have landed him even briefly in the federal pen. Lord, people vilified Rich Rodriguez for mistakes (not deliberate flouting of NCAA rules) that occurred on his watch, and that wasn't even in the same universe as the Ed Martin scandal. How would headlines of "Ex-Wolverine Webber gets 18 months imprisonment" have played in Peoria?
I don't care how much Webber claims to "love" Michigan. He singlehandedly brought disrepute to the University and athletic department, and his conduct (along with the other 3 recipients of Ed Martin's largesse) almost killed the basketball program. He is, as you noted Bando, unrepentant, even expressing that he deserved the money because Michigan made so much money* from ticket sales, increased interest in U enrollment because of his success and his no. 4 jersey. That may be true, but breaking the rules and being indifferent to the turmoil caused to others because of it earns you contempt, not applause. Instead, become the example of the unfairness of the NCAA's obsolete rules regarding student-athletes and try to change them. That's what "the leaders and best" do.
The trouble Webber caused to my school was both humiliating and infuriating. Let him remain a pariah, but give the other Fab Four their due. That's long overdue. But if ESPN does the story, that won't be the focus.
*Michigan had to give back nearly 1/2 million dollars it earned from NCAA tournament play as part of the sanctions.
My frustration is the same as yours, just add a six pack and I voice my frustration with emotional rabble. Thanks for a good post.
I was the same class as the Fab 5. The win over Kentucky in 1993 was one of the most fun nights I ever had on campus. Everyone was pouring out of the dorms and storming the Union and then down to South U. It was incredible. The North Carolina game...not so much...and all the stuff that came out in the following years ruined it. I have enjoyed the 30 for 30 documentaries I have seen so far, I will be interested to see this when it comes out.
Let your nuts hang
my annual reading of the fab five book...
I really don't care what anyone says about them. Yeah, it was wrong for whoever to take money. We all know this. But for someone like me growing up and watching these guys, it was the greatest thing. The really did change the way of NCAA basketball. Who was the first to ever wear black socks on national television, despite what the coach says. Who were the first to come out with baggy shorts like that on national televison? Not to mention they were absolutely awesome to watch play. Highlight after highlight. This was a part of our school. I don't care what the haters think, these guys were Michigan kids, regardless of what CWebb was paid. He loved it here and still does. All these guys love our school. I will always love to relive the memories, even the painful ones. Remember the impossible 20 something point deficit to UCLA in the tourney. That was awesome!!
I wouldn't trade the Fab Five for a better program now a days. They were legends and I'm proud that they were at Michigan. They didn't win a title, oh no, what a tragedy. All they did was go to 2 straight National title games, on the back of 2 of the most incredible tournament runs ever, with not one upperclassman starter either year. 5 freshman starters went to the natioal championship final game! That's incredible. They also made an elite 8 the following year without Webber. I wish they had won a big10 title, but the big10 was tough those days(as it is now) and they lost out to some veteran teams. To compete with them was something in itself.