They didn't release those to those were found on an unrelated investigation?
ESPN sues Ohio State
They obviously released them, or they wouldn't be in this mess. The point being, if you're going to cover it up, why do it so half assed.
Well the quote from above implies ESPN thinks the e-mails involve not just Tressel, but the chief of compliance, the athletic director, and the presided of the damn university. If they knew anything about it and did nothing, then they are seriously fucked. Especially after every turn, they are insisting that nobody knew anything.
I find it amusing how the Complaint says Pryor was all-academic Big Ten for 2009 (a joke and also equally pathetic for Big Ten), but more amusing is TSIO's response to the inquiry for all documents and emails regarding people barred from games and ncaa violations (including secondary ones) that the request is too broad for them to handle. Wonder what that implies.
The gift that keeps on giving. Couldn't happen to a better team.
Thought they only had to worry about the Court of Public Opinion.
This would be incredible. However, what's to stop them from deletiing any pertinent emails prior to handing them over?
that ESPN is to worried about that. There is no way they file suit without knowing they already have it in the bag. I'm not a computer guy but even if they do delete it wont that kinda stuff still be on the hard drive somewhere?
Not to mention who's to think this sarniak was smart enough to even delete them himself.
even if they do delete it, it can still be recovered. The only sure way to make it no recoverable is to destroy the hard drive, even then there is a slight possibility.
Which means multiple copies of the email.
I actually learned about some of this talking with a lady in our claims/safety department at work today. If a lawyer requests to have all of these emails and TSIO deleted them they are actually stored apparently in a server and can be recovered if needed.
For work when a claimant hires an attorney then by law if requested we as a company must turn over any requested emails/documents that may come about. That is a big reason why for any company you never post harrassment type stuff etc in emails, because even if you delete it, its still out on a server just waiting to be recovered and will stay there for years.
Which means multiple copies of the email.
Best double post ever.
All those hard drives probably went to the moon over six months ago.
The one thing I've learned from big computer systems is that nothing is ever truly deleted.
Various public record acts. Plus, now that its under pending litigation, tempting a contempt of court charge would be unwise.
I'm pretty sure that would be illegal at this point. Deleting those e-mails would further incriminate OSU.
This should be on the masthead.
We're glad to know that Scarlett is on your masthead sir.
about how the University web site promotes bio information. Including that TP was an academic all big ten. Doesn't that conflict with FERPA?
Also, the Attorney who filed the memo did his JD at Notre Dame. I'll say it this once, "Go Irish!"
OSU sure is paying a lot in legal fees lately, huh? I guess they're saving a lot of money in HC salary this year, though.
I don't know much about these specific laws but ESPN definitely has a solid case. Also I can't remember when ESPN sued someone for records, I don't think they do this frivolously.
They sued Texas last year.
The comments are pretty funny. I will admit, however, that there are several rational posters who just want to clean house at OSU.
ESPN is trying it's hardest to make this into Watergate. It's way past annoying at this point. I call for all OSU alumni that work at ESPN to resign immediately. You too, Herbie. It's time to remember your roots and circle the wagons. We don't need no stinking ESPN. We got ABC and BTN to play our games.
This is unbelievable. Why? What do they have to prove? Why is it any of their business? I wonder if they would do this to Texas.
Not sure what right espn has to sue OSU if the NCAA wants to do well so be it. Herbie I used to repsect you and felt all that went down wasnt right. But this stoops to the same level
I love how they think that their desire to keep this secret somehow makes ESPN's request unfair. Yes, guys, time to circle the wagons. God forbid that OSU alums at ESPN want to do their jobs.
oh wait ABC does...
and Damnit i ran outta popcorn again.
...not to mention the formal division of "ABC sports" nominally, if at all, exists. ABC got rid of their sports when they realized they could just use ESPN's non-union shop and make it "ESPN on ABC". It's all ESPN production and it's labeled as such, down to ABC using ESPN booths.
And ESPN did do this to Texas, as posted by elaydin above...so that's 0 for 2.
Now we get further evidence as to why Herbie moved out of Columbus.....Had Tressel or the AD or anyone at OSU done their jobs and reported what they found out this would not be going on right now. Will be interesting to see in the clear light of day in about 2 months or longer what the whole story will be......
According to the article, ESPN filed suit in the Ohio Supreme Court. That doesn't make sense. The Ohio Supreme Court is an appellate court; usually a case would be filed in a court of common pleas and reach the supreme court only after an appeal.
Was the article in error, or does the Ohio Supreme Court have original jurisdiction in open records cases in Ohio?
I can't imagine that the Ohio SC would have original jurisdicton for something like this, but that is what the article said.
The Court has original jurisdiction for certain special remedies that permit a person to file an action in the Supreme Court. These extraordinary remedies include writs of habeas corpus (involving the release of persons allegedly unlawfully imprisoned or committed), writs of mandamus and procedendo (ordering a public official to do a required act), writs of prohibition (ordering a lower court to cease an unlawful act), and writs of quo warranto (against a person or corporation for usurpation, misuse or abuse of public office or corporate office or franchise).
For most useful first post EVER.
Well done, sir.
How i wish you around for the infamous pos-bang, search it and you will know what I mean. Thanks!
And I thank you both.
I have been lurking around here for the better part of 3 years now and find myself thoroughly informed and entertained on a near daily basis. Figured it was time to get in on the action (I dated my wife for 8 years before proposing so this was pretty fast actually).
I'd like to buy you a beer....in 2016...when you're ready of course, no rush.
is the justification for the filing. this will likely move quickly and not so much to the liking of buckeyes.
You have passed the mgobarexam
Thank you kind sir!
In reading mgoblog I find tons of useful information by educated posters such as yourself. Then I go to bucknut and find this 50 yr old guy named italianbuck running off at the mouth about Kalis, ESPN, Hoke negative recruitng, bla bla bla and his friends replying with "duuuuurr". Bucknuts will literally lower your IQ by 30 points.
Nice username, but in the alma mater "The Yellow and Blue" composed by Charles M. Gayley in 1878, the term is a rollicking crew. As in "Yellow the stars as they ride thro' the night, and reel in a rollicking crew." I wouldn't quibble but adding a capitalized "The" in front of names is a tradition more appreciated by that shitty school down south.
But thanks for the info. Would this case be a writ of procedendo?
Note the following in the papers allegations served to OSU:
May 27, 2011, Ohio State responded to the records request by stating that it
From my experience as an attorney in Ohio, OSU looks to be in a bad position with this suit. I'm familiar with Ohio's public records laws and it seems to me that unless FERPA applies, they will have to release all the records requested in accordance with state law.
This could be the straw that breaks the camel's back. I've heard from multiple people i trust, that more than just Tressel knew about the violations before this all came down.
What defense are the bucknuts claiming under FERPA, that students were involved so this is all confidential information?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but OSU's argument is that the contents of the e-mails are educational records for purposes of FERPA. But if so, they couldn't have shared the information in them with Ted Sarniak, because he is not an authorized party under FERPA.
So, if they shared it with Sarniak, either (a) it isn't "educational records," and is therefore not covered by FERPA, or (b) they violated FERPA by sending the e-mail to Sarniak.
Am I reading this right?
Maybe.. The OSU argument is that the emails are, for FERPA purposes, what are considered "student records.". There's varying jurisprudence and precedent on this, some saying that any paper with a student's name on it originating at or received by a school, with almost no exceptions (minus statutory carve outs) are "records" while other cases have ruled that the term "educational record" is much more narrowly construed, ie not every napkin or scrap/email.
The way I see it, Tressel could email with Sarniak and not have it violate FERPA because it's just a third party talking to Tressel about a player. The discussion in the email makes it a protected record, because it's about TP. As he was TP's contact person for recruiting, there might be a level of privilege so long as Tressel isn't sitting there blabbing TP's grades or protected info. I could be reading this too broadly, and maybe any talking about a student at all is a FERPA violation, but I somehow doubt it.
Also, I just don't know if Sarniak was a privileged person on TP's FERPA rights, but I'd also doubt that. What could make the conversations bad is a continued back and forth-by talking at length about TP, maybe Tressel is going beyond regular convo and divulging protected info. I don't know.