Did Rodriguez throw Zoltan under the bus?
There was a lot of discussion after the game over the fake punt, with many blaming RR, until he said in the presser that Zoltan made the call. Less discussed was A- whether RR should have put the blame on Zoltan in a public forum, and B- whether or not that was the true story.
Regarding the first, I frankly am still thinking about it and don't have a strong opinion, but am leaning toward "no." Concerning the second, I never would have thought it an issue, except for the news in this column from Dave Birk that RR said "it was supposed to be a kick" and that Zoltan provided conflicting quotes after the game, first saying it was his call and later saying it was "called." Here is the column:
http://www.annarbor.com/sports/birks-eye-view-is-michigan-a-fraud-or-co…
I'll be interested in Brian and your reactions.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:27 AM ^
Next question
October 5th, 2009 at 9:41 AM ^
I don't think we should be so quick to dismiss this issue. It was an absolutely disastrous call.
I won't say he threw Mesko under the bus, but he didn't exactly jump out and say "it was all my fault" either. The buck stops at the Head Coach, and he should have been quicker to shoulder the blame.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:47 AM ^
There is a very fine line between throwing a kid under a bus and coddling him. I'll quote remember the Titans here:
~ Now I may be a mean cuss. But I'm the same mean cuss with everybody out there on that football field. The world don't give a damn about how sensitive these kids are, especially the black kids. You ain't doin' these kids a favor by patronizing them. You're crippling them; You're crippling them for life.~
send an e card Coach Boone
October 5th, 2009 at 10:57 AM ^
He has the option to run in the "read punt" only. That is not our only punt formation.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:55 AM ^
Gotta love empty quotes like this. This issue, much like our offense, is more complicated than that. Our offense trusts many players to make on the fly reads every single play. When Tate gets crushed in the backfield on a zone read keeper, do you say "WTF RR? The buck stops here!!" No, the QB simply made a bad read on a well-designed play. When you have a 5th year senior all American punter like Mesko, RR better fucking be trusting him to make reads like our freshmen quarterback. And no, I don't think we need to baby him by saying "no reads from the 30 back" or something like that. One mistake in 3 years of brilliance doesn't negate all the good reads he has made.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:05 AM ^
Isn't that a bit of an exaggeration? Yes, they got a field goal as a result of the play. But had Mesko punted--into the wind, from deep in our own territory--the Aggies were likely to get excellent field position and been in great position for a field goal anyway. Maybe if he had punted, they would have gotten a touchdown. Who knows how the entire rest of the game would have gone?
October 5th, 2009 at 10:08 AM ^
I agree. You can't blame the fake punt for losing us the game. It's not like we were playing that great up until that point.
I just hope that the Michigan State game (and the Indiana game for that matter) will be an eye opener for our defense. I think they really need to work on it. There are a lot bigger games coming up.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:11 AM ^
needs to wake up after this game. This was our best defensive performance (besides the disastrous first drive).
October 5th, 2009 at 12:22 PM ^
The defense is keeping teams out of the end zone, which given the personnel we're working with, says a lot about our coaching. I was as frustrated as everyone else seeing Cousins scramble for big yards with impunity and the defense's inability to get off the field is maddening. Nevertheless, this is probably as good as we can expect this season
October 5th, 2009 at 10:15 AM ^
I have been saying the exact same thing.
Yeah, we gave up a FG as a result of that disastrous "fake." But I think it was almost worth it to see Brandon Graham show his stuff when he leveled Winston in the backfield.
Also, our redzone defense has been much better this year at holding opponents to FGs than our mid-range secondary. We may well have given up a TD if MSU starts from our 40.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:15 AM ^
and if zoltan runs for a first down, he's a genius. hind sight is always 20-20.
and yes, i believe it was zoltan's decision.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:17 AM ^
I'd love to agree with you, but there was nothing genius about that play. He had no chance of making that 1st from the moment of the snap. And if he somehow did, I'd have said "whew, Zoltan the Magnificent dodged a bullet there. Boy did he get lucky on that one."
October 5th, 2009 at 10:56 AM ^
at that point in the game. We were doing nothing on offense and we needed some sort of spark, ice breaker, SOMETHING. I felt the right call was actually going for it on 4th and 1, but, I wasn't exactly throwing stuff at my TV in disgust after Zoltan got tackled. Zoltan is a senior leader on this team and one of the smarter guys too. He'll do far more good than harm this year. Valiant attempt but unfortunately it didn't work out.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:26 AM ^
I was actually hoping RR would send Tate and company out there for good shot at converting a 4th and 1. Either give Tate the punt read from shotgun or hand the ball to Grady or Minor and pound it for 1 (or maybe more). Or even something trickier like PA from power-I, shooting Stonum or Hemingway on a fly.
I'm just saying that Zoltan's read was totally messed up, and he had no chance of converting on THAT PLAY. I don't even think he looked at the defense before deciding to run it. Zoltan's a great player, and I'd rather have him at punter than anyone else in the universe. I'm just saying he made a mistake.
As I said earlier, our redzone D has been performing well all year. Statistically, I'd rather see our D backed up into our 20 than see them being passed on from our 30.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:29 AM ^
No.
It was however, "called." But in the sense that it's always called for Zoltan to check and see if he can run for the first down.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:32 AM ^
I'd like to see how Coach Rod said it. In other words, I'd like to see if he said it like "Zoltan made a gutsy call that didn't work. These things happen." Or whether he said it like "Zoltan made a gutsy call that cost us three points." Any link to the presser or confirmation as to the tone Coach Rod used?
Either way, that call confused me greatly. It would have been so much easier just to try and sneak it or draw it the inches needed rather than a fake punt. Whether or not it cost us three points is immaterial, in my opinion, because of how terrible we looked in the first 50 or so minutes of that game (save for the red-zone defense)
October 5th, 2009 at 10:52 AM ^
RR said something like, "no it wasn't called...but Zoltan has that read any time. He must have seen a crease...I'm not sure."
I think personally think it's fine for RR to be up front and honest that this wan on Mesko...we are all men here and men need to be accountable. So no...he didn't "throw him under the bus." Especially since in the next breath he was quick to say that "this didn't cost us the game."
October 5th, 2009 at 9:35 AM ^
Second guessing split second decisions is not worth it. Even if he punts they have great field position and probably get the FG. We would then have had less time to come back.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:36 AM ^
he is referring to the Rugby punt that has an automatic read possibility. There is no way that RR called a fake punt and Zoltan read it. I think he was trying to make a play but tried "too hard."
October 5th, 2009 at 9:36 AM ^
the only reason this issue is coming up is because we are trying to compare it with how Lloyd Carr would of handled the situation. Let RR be.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:57 AM ^
Carr is irrelevant, the question posed was did RR throw Zoltan under the bus, to which almost everyone answers "no" (including me, I've been convinced by the replies) and whether what we heard was the real story given that the linked article raised it as an issue. Second guessing the call and response is besides the point and not why I linked the article.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:39 AM ^
The third down call before that fake punt was far more puzzling to me.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:44 AM ^
I am actually a fan of RR's "gutsy" play calls. It's fun to see Michigan go for it on 4th down occasionally even if it does backfire on occasion.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:52 AM ^
I also think it's fun to see Michigan go for it on the 4th down, and I could see if they were on the 50 yard line to try the fake punt; but being back on the 16 yard line and trying this was crazy.
I think they should have gone with a draw play or something where there was more of a chance to pick up a yard or two.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:56 AM ^
I agree. But in this game I actually thought he wasn't gutsy when he could have been. He could have tried to go for it on that 4th and inches and he could have gone for 2 at the end of the game.
I don't necessarily disgree with either of those calls...but I remember at the time being a little surprised in both situations that RR didn't do something a little more "gutsy."
October 5th, 2009 at 11:33 AM ^
I think RR has been as gutsy as has been necessary. Going for 2 at the end would not have been gusty, it would have been downright stupid. Always giving Zoltan the option is somewhat gutsy, but it is also smart, showing that he as confidence in his players, which gives them confidence. If they had gone for 2 and not made it, he would be getting trashed all over the media and on every campus in the US - including this one here in Ann Arbor.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:48 AM ^
nope
October 5th, 2009 at 9:54 AM ^
from the link at least, is that the rugby style punt formation includes a read option of punting it or executing the fake. What RR means when he says that Zoltan was supposed to kick it is that he read the play wrong and executed the fake. IMO.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:11 AM ^
After watching the replay, I think that you're right about the rugby punt option. If it was a called fake, then you'd think that some of the guys on the line of scrimmage should have tried to block. It look like only one guy on that line even thought about blocking (maybe the snapper). The rest of the guys were all out in coverage many yards down field.
IIRC, we haven't really rolled the punter out much this year, and IMO Zoltan got confused by the rugby punt and forgot to kick it until it was too late.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:54 AM ^
believe that RichRod should not have created the impression that it was Zoltan's error. One of two things is true: either it was called, or RichRod vested his punter with discretion to run even on his own 16. Either result is a fundamental coaching failure. Laying it off on Zoltan in the presser is unacceptable. For the record, there is no way that wasn't called ex ante.
October 5th, 2009 at 9:55 AM ^
Zoltan seems to have the option on most punts to take off if he sees an opening. RR takes responsibility for the loss, and I'd like to see the actual context of that quote before determining whether or not he blamed Zoltan for it. A coach is allowed to say that a player made a mistake, and if that bothers the fans or the players, then tough. Zoltan gets a great deal of praise for being one of the best punters in America, but at the same time he has to take responsibility for a bad play. RR never pinned the blame on him, and that is what a coach is supposed to do; he is not supposed to protect his players from all criticism.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:19 AM ^
and think that maybe some of the mountains of praise have gone to his head, and you need to be able to take the good with the bad.
However, I believe this information (whether it was an option, a direct RR call) should be kept in the family and behind closed doors. It's not professional.
Publicly nothing negative about a player should be said by a coach. Privately, hell could/ should be unleashed.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:04 PM ^
I agree - that's why I had a big issue with Pete Carroll telling the media that he didn't think Mark Sanchez was ready for the NFL last year. That is a perfectly valid opinion to have as a coach, but I thought it was in poor taste to say so in public and potentially hurt your former player's draft stock. It just seemed tacky.
Here, RR never blamed Zoltan for the loss or even giving up 3 crucial points on the subsequent FG. He said that the wrong read was made, and that clearly he needs to convey when Zoltan can make that call and when that option is off the table. I do not think that a coach should call out a player for his on-field mistake, but he can say that a mistake was made and that it needs to be corrected. If that imputes that the player made a mistake, then so be it. Zoltan is a big boy, and I'm sure he understands that he made a mistake there. I'm fine with how RR handled the incident.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:09 AM ^
He simply said "He was supposed to kick it it was a bad read". What do you want him to do that if it was Zoltan's fault on the read take the blame unnecessarily?
October 5th, 2009 at 10:50 AM ^
"No comment". He is honest to a fault and talks too much.
At most he should have said: "The punt read was called from the sideline."
There is a reason it was "Fort Schembechler" ya know . . .
He didn't intend to throw Zolt under the bus. He didn't have any ill intention. He just opened his mouth and out came honest words that should have been saved from coaches and players. Fortunately, he's already throttled back a bit from last year, and that will likely continue. There's nothing good that can happen from comments like that.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:02 AM ^
Seriously? You want him when asked about the fake punt to say "No comment"??
Um.... I will respectfully disagree with your analysis of the situation.
October 5th, 2009 at 12:50 PM ^
You can't say "no comment" to a substantive, play-analysis type of question. It would get rehashed on ESPN for the next week.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:21 AM ^
Are you talking about his comments immediately after the game? I didn't get the impression that he was sticking Zoltan with it. You can go back and look at a quote or watch a clip, and in fact maybe an exact quote would alter my impression. However, context may be important to interpretation--that entire presser was impressive to me, because the tone of it was appropriate: regretful, but accountable. Complimentary of the right people, with admission of some errors. I felt better about the game after it, and glad to have RR at the helm instead of some finger-pointing whiny little bitch.
October 5th, 2009 at 10:42 AM ^
By even asking this question you are inadvertently showing us that you believe that Zoltan was thrown under the bus and you are just looking for some agreement with other posters before you come out and say it. This way you can test the water before getting slammed. If you didn't think it was an issue you wouldn't have brought it up in the first place. Just admit it, you think he threw Zoltan under the bus, you wouldn't be the only one. I don't think he did at all, he answered the question if he called a fake punt.
Boom PSYCHOANALYZE'd
October 5th, 2009 at 12:02 PM ^
(I like a good psychoanalysis) except that you may want to read my OP, where I clearly say, "while I don't have strong opinion on it but am leaning toward no." I gave an answer up front, then asked for comment.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:07 AM ^
No, Rodriguez didn't throw Zoltan under the bus. A reporter asked what the deal was on the fake punt. He said it was a read by Zoltan. Right after that he said that it didn't decide the outcome of the game. That is perfectly fair. Zoltan had his worst game in a long time and not just because of that play. I thought Rodriguez made a few bad calls. The third down right before that play I thought should have been a power run for a yard. I really wanted him to go for two at the end, but that scramble was all Zoltan and Rodriguez handled the press conference just fine.
October 5th, 2009 at 11:22 AM ^
i agree completely, but on the thrid down i think it should have been a true qb sneak. have tate take the snap from under center not in shotgun and frankly, i would have done it again on 4th down if we didn't make it on 3rd. if we expect to win this kind of game we should expect to get 1 yard on 2 rushing plays.
all that said, i am f'ing out of my mind with giddiness over having tate here for 4 years. i wasn't sure i believed his quote "i don't get nervous", but now i really think he has ice in his veins. of course, i also am f'ing nervous he's going to get split in two half the time.
October 5th, 2009 at 12:06 PM ^
IMO think that the two contradictory answers from Zoltan in the link was a simple mistake on his part (which BTW is possible) and the slightly different reply from RR was a simple mistake as well (also possible).
October 5th, 2009 at 11:11 AM ^
If RR says nothing, he is being "disengenuous."
If he says "I called the fake," he is a "bad coach."
If he says "Zoltan did it on his own," he is "throwing the player under the bus."
So, WHAT THE FUCK IS HE SUPPOSED TO SAY TO SATISFY ALL OF THE NAYSAYERS OUT THERE?
I think RR handled the situation correctly and the press should, like RR, invoke the "24-hour rule" and move on to the Iowa game. Fat chance.....
October 5th, 2009 at 11:22 AM ^
There is nothing that he can do that is ever right. People are always looking for the next thing to nit-pick
October 5th, 2009 at 12:44 PM ^
Everything RR does is in comparison to LC. When RR goes for it on 4th and makes it, folks say YEAH! we would of never seen that under LC, go RR! If RR criticizes a player for missing an assignment or a read, folks say WTF RR! LC would of never done that to his players. RR wont get away from this for a long time, perhaps until he has some winning seasons under his belt and at least a Big Ten championship. Perhaps, only then, will the ghost of LC fade away and fans will judge RR based on how RR runs a football program. I know folks say it has nothing to do with LC, but i really think they are not being honest with themselves.
October 5th, 2009 at 1:41 PM ^
No coach except Urban Meyer is immune from criticism every single day from press and fans. It comes with the territory and deserves no extra sympathy. Every coach after a loss is second guessed, and it doesn't mean that those asking the question are anti RR or any coach. The fact of the matter is, small issue or not (it is small) you have two different quotes from Mesko and two different ones from RR. You can choose to ignore it, which is perfectly legitimate, or you can look at the different statements and question that. Both are fine IMO. And I'll go further on a limb--if he called the fake, that WAS a bad call. That's NOT the same as "bad coach"
October 5th, 2009 at 1:56 PM ^
If Coach Rod or anyone else threw Zoltan under a bus, the kid would just pick up the bus and throw it at his opponent like General Zod in Superman II (I wonder if he and Zoltan are related?).
Let's all stop whining and get ready to kick the shit out of Iowa on Saturday.
October 5th, 2009 at 3:19 PM ^
Zoltan...Space Emperor, or whatever had a bad game... he made a bad decision there... RRs comments did not blast the kid, he gave his explanation. I used to hear Bo go off on people in press conferences...what RR said was pretty tame and Zoltan as a senior should take responsibility for a stupid decision. You dont run the ball from the 16 yd line on a fake punt. RR should have ran Minor on 3rd down instead of Tate as well.