Dhani Jones had some pretty harsh remarks today about Rich Rodriguez on Rome is Burning. To paraphrase, he said that to accomplish anything you need to win within two years. The comments struck me as representative of some of the more disgruntled parts of the fanbase as he admitted his patience had already run out. Obviously this is a product of going 8-16 and winning will cure all, but it is still frustrating to see. Dhani, unlike Amani Toomer, obviously still is proud to consider himself a Michigan Man, but this is yet another athlete to come out in criticism of Rich Rod. Hopefully, we can win 10 games this fall and shut everyone up.
Dhani Jones on Jim Rome
Was sagen Sie?
Er hat gesagt, „nein mehr, bitte“
He did have a rather nice bow tie on.
THE BOW TIE REVOLUTION!!!
go on Romey's show and be nice.
At least Rome didn't call him "Chris" Jones
I've always believed that was staged. How incredibly convenient was it for the brand-new ESPN2 network that its sports talk show host, then still a newcomer on the national stage, just happened to get into a headline-grabbing fight on the air?
I and many others have thought the same thing.
Everett doesn't actually look that upset. When he first gets called "Chris" his smile does not look angry or surprised, it just seems like he is trying not to giggle about what they're about to do. And the camera pulls away to perfectly to show the table in a full view before it gets thrown aside. And he doesn't really hit Rome on the ground, it's like he's waiting to be restrained.
I didn't see it as being that negative. He was just clearly as frustrated with the past 2 years as we are and he voiced it. Coming from a program like Michigan you are not used to losing... let alone for it to happen as much as it has in the past 2 years. I'm pretty sure none of us thought that we would ever see Michigan win only 3 games, but him as a former player I think it stings a bit more. Good to see that he was proudly proclaiming that he was a Michigan Man.... damn near screaming it.
I think the "Chris" charade set Rome's career back 10 years. That incident proved he was an upstart punk at that time. Has he grown up any? Hard to tell. He is more respectful to his studio guests though.
In all honesty, and I know they wouldn't get that deep into this on Rome is Burning, but who does Dhani think would have coached this team to big seasons the last 2 years?
I know there's the whole "RR needed his players" meme that goes around a lot, but I think it's about 80% BS. Yes, RR needed some guys that were his players, but more than anything else, RR needed PLAYERS.
When RR got here, we had nothing as far as LBers, little as far as DB's (especially safeties), and little as far as OL talent. And Threet may have done better in a pro-style offense, but he was still a very green RS freshman with shaky technique and little composure. Even if Lloyd had stayed, does anyone think we win more than 7 games that year, at most? Maybe the bowl record sticks around, but maybe not, and then instead of being bad, we have 2 years of mediocrity, playing in December 18th bowl games. For a Michigan fan, that's really not any better.
I do believe that Lloyd and/or other coaches could have churned out more than 7 victories in 2008. There was a significant amount of attrition immediately - Boren and Mallett especially, who were key components - and the team went through a vast scheme change from 2007-2008.
Furthermore, there is little history to suggest that Lloyd would have won 7 games or less. Only in 2005 did he win so few games.
The Shafer hire didn't work out at all, and the offensive personnel didn't fit the spread offense. I fully believe that Rodriguez did the right thing to implement his own offense right off the bat, but in my opinion, the coaching change certainly cost them several victories.
Mallett was gone the day Mustain said he was leaving Arkansas. Mallett always wanted to be a Razorback, he just didn't want to sit behind (at that time) a hugely hyped QB for 2, probably 3 years. And he was almost out of town before RR ever showed up. There's no saying that no matter who was hired that Mallett would have stayed. His coaches and teammates didn't get along with him while he was here anyway. As for Boren, who knows what really went down there.
All the other attrition was from guys who would not have helped us win (Alex Mitchell?). And that still doesn't address the lack of talent and depth on defense, and the fact that our best playmaker in the receiving corps was Greg Matthews. We absolutely did not have the receivers to run a pro-style offense in 2008.
Even if Mallett was already gone, Threet would have been a better fit - and known - Carr's offense and its fundamentals.
You don't know for certain that the departed wouldn't have contributed under Carr. Essentially, Boren's replacement was McAvoy/Ferrara. That's a big difference in talent right there.
Mathews was plenty talented to be a very productive receiver in a pro-style offense. And historical evidence suggests that, as Michigan's #1 receiver, he would have put up some pretty good numbers. Clemons, Hemingway, and/or Rogers might have combined to be pretty good #2 and #3 receivers. And the tight end position surely would have had more production than it did in 2008 under Rodriguez.
I'm not saying the team would have been great. But I'd guess we would have won a handful more games under Carr (or a similar coach) than Rodriguez.
I don't think the system could have saved Threet. Carr's system didn't prevent many of his QBs from struggling mightily as underclassmen. Heck, even Tom Brady was pretty ordinary in 1998 and he was a redshirt junior. I just don't think Threet was ready to be a starting QB in 2008. Putting him under center wouldn't have made him better at reading defenses. If anything, Carr's system put more pressure on the QB to make quick decisions, at least in the passing game. One additional OL (Boren) probably wouldn't have been enough to prevent the OL from being a weak unit, and while Mathews might have gotten more opportunities, he really wasn't a classic Michigan #1 WR. And with Carson Butler once more proving himself to be an idiot, who was going to step up at TE? A true freshman Koger?
Realistically, we weren't likely to have a good offense in 2008 under any scheme. We just didn't have the kind of talent we usually do. Where you could point to Carr possibly making a difference is on defense. The '08 D underachieved. It may not have under Carr.
It wouldn't have made Threet a great QB immediately. But he likely would have been slightly less horrible.
Our offensive line jelled toward the end of the season. One big hole was at that guard position until we got somewhat solid play. Boren alone wouldn't have made the difference between 3 and, say, 8 wins. But a handful of small differences might have (QB, system, defense, tight ends, etc.).
Perhaps Carson Butler wouldn't have been such an idiot under Carr. And as a true freshman or not, the tight ends in Carr's offense saw the ball more than in Rodriguez's; Koger (or Webb) most likely would have been better off in Carr's offense. And while he wasn't a great TE, Mike Massey was still around in 2008, too.
Most of your analysis seems to hinge on players who left immediately after Coach Carr retired. Obviously the team would have been better if Mallett and Boren had stayed. Both left pretty much immediately after Rodriguez was hired through (at least in my opinion) no fault on his part, though.
With them gone, I just don't see any coach making that team any more than a game or two better. You said higher up that you thought Carr could have gotten more than 7 wins out of that team (including Mallett and Boren) and yet he failed to do just that with the 2005 team that, though young like the 2008 team would have been even if those players had stayed, was absolutely loaded with current NFL talent, much of which had prior playing experience and only two of whom were true freshmen (Adams, Arrington, Avant, Branch, Breaston, Burgess, Butler, Crable, Hall, Harris, Hart, Henne, Long, Manningham, Mundy, Stenavich, Watson, Woodley, and Woods).
And just because you brought him up, in 2007 under Carr, Carson Butler put up 246 yards and 2 TD's as a junior. It is hard to imagine a giant leap in production coming his senior year just because someone else ended up coaching him. Maybe he wouldn't have gotten into as much trouble, but I don't see any reason to suspect he would have suddenly into a huge difference maker on the field with alternative coaching.
Do you think Boren would have left if Carr had stayed?
Koger had 6 catches for 93 yards and 1 TD in 2008. I'll take 246 yards and 2 TDs over that.
would carr have offered little boren a scholly because he would have been a legacy kid like his big brother??? that might be one of the main reasons why justin left at urging of his dad... its no secret that mike boren wasn't happy that RR never offered zach, and hence the whole "family values" issue that came out after boren left... section 1 made a post about this back during the season and as soon as i find i'll update my post with the link...
here is the link, its post #41: http://mgoblog.com/content/boren-loser
I've always assumed the lack of an offer to Zach Boren had more to do with the "family values" comment than cussing or anything else. I think the Borens were pissed, but Rodriguez doesn't offer scholarships to fullbacks. I subscribe to this theory and I've even mentioned it a couple times on here, too.
So yeah, I agree with section 1.
Perhaps Carson Butler wouldn't have been such an idiot under Carr.
Why would you assume this? He repeatedly got in trouble under Carr. In fact, Carr booted him off the team in the spring of 2007 after the St. Patrick's nerd roundup, only to later reinstate him.
I wouldn't call using the word "perhaps" an assumption, but whatever.
Anyway, Butler was booted off the team and reinstated. He seemed to be doing okay after the reinstatement. Then when Rodriguez arrived, he suddenly found himself displaced from the starting TE position and playing a bit of defense.
It's POSSIBLE (thus the word "perhaps") that Carr had him under control but Rodriguez didn't.
I'm not sure whether it was negative. But, if that's what he said, then I say (partial) FAIL to Dhani. He's grouping himself with the "UNACCEPTABLE!!!" types that have failed to do any deep analysis.
Certainly, RichRod is partly responsible for what happened in '08 in '09. (Administratively, of course, he's wholly responsible, but that's another perspective that isn't important here.) But, he didn't choose to roll with Threet and Sheridan as his drivers. He also didn't choose to play with a depleted (yes, depleted) upperclass talent pool. I'm not sure he did the best with what was available, but just screaming UNACCEPTABLE!!! (which Dhani was apparently doing there) is disappointing. I'd expect better from him.
It would be really great if people actually listened to what Dhani said before going into the "UNACCEPTABLE!"/snap-to-RR-defense paragraph.
Dhani said nothing particularly wrong here. He was articulate, well-reasoned, and if you don't agree with him, fine, but at least listen before you put him on blast.
I love how we, as a society, set the bar so low for celebrities (especially black ones) that anyone who can put two sentences together is "articulate." I like Dhani and all. He's a good representative of the school. But he didn't say anything insightful here.
Why turn this into a racial thing? Dhani is a very, very smart person, a successful entrepreneur, television personality, and athlete. I don't think it's a stretch or a knock on anyone else to say he's an articulate, well-spoken, insightful guy, because he absolutely is.
I'm not saying he isn't a bright guy. But I didn't find anything remarkable about this interview. Tell me: what "articulate, well-reasoned" points did he make in this interview? Were you impressed by what he said, or just how he said it?
I was actually checking this thread in the hopes that it featured video of Dhani going Jim Everett-ish on Jim Rome; my hopes have been dashed - I'm going to another thread.
I think all of this stems from the (completely faulty) assumption I've heard tons of our fans continue to make that Michigan must have had enough talent to win simply because we are Michigan. By any objective measure (NFL draft picks, upperclassmen on the roster, actual scholarship players on the roster) the 2008 and 2009 teams had no business winning more games than they did. At the same time, anyone who follows the program closely can see the obvious upward trajectory the team is on as talent is added to the roster and existing players gain experience (I think most of us would bet a lot of money that the team will be much better in 2010 and even better in 2011).
Frustrating to see this attitude continue, especially from a guy who seems very bright and obviously has the best interests of the University and the football program at heart (since it does nothing but hurt recruiting and the national perception of the program).
RR is under an unofficial "win now or else" mandate from Brandon on down to the lowliest fan. So what that Jones uttered something similiar.
Two losing seasons, a NCAA investigation, the constant off the field issues...RichRod has burnt up all available goodwill. Now he has to win.
I do recognize that not all things were his fault and that it takes time build a program, but alot of his issues stem from his own faux paus'.
Wait, he said his patience has already ran out? So, he won't be watching this season, I take it? Or can one regain their patience, so long as one team scores more than another in an athletic match.
For a bunch of liberals this board hates to see people speak their mind. I think everyone is frustrated, and some of us spend time listing all the progress we see.
But that doesn't mean that the last two years haven't been frustrating, and certainly devoid of the FUN that hopefully the coaches are bringing back to the team this year.
I like Dhani Jones but if he can just chill a few months more I think he will be happy again. Going to be a lot more fun doing these interviews when things are back on the upswing. They will be soon.
Someone should remind him that in Carr's last season a bunch of really good players were in their last year and it was fairly thin behind them. The cupboard is filling again nicely.
Go back to making a fool of yourself on that stupid reality show you have, where you disrespect other countries customs. Douchebag.
was once asked about the state of Michigan football on ESPN's College Game Day, I *think* after the App St. loss, and he responded (I'm paraphrasing somewhat here), "You seem to think that I'm a fan. I'm not. I'm an alum." I've always thought that was a great response.