Developing: Penn St story keeps getting worse
http://www.whptv.com/news/local/story/Federal-investigation-underway-in…
Child pornography ring is being investigated on a federal level, with Sandusky and other people "affiliated with Penn State" (no specifics yet) at the center of it.
EDIT: Update from the article- Both the FBI and a criminal investigative division of the United States Postal Service are looking into the possible existence of a pedophile ring that involved Sandusky sharing boys with other men connected to Penn State. Sandusky was recently convicted on 45 counts of child sexual abuse. "Investigators have interviewed at least one man who claims to have knowledge of Sandusky and a very prominent man, with strong ties to Penn State, both sexually abusing a boy," a source familiar with the situation told RadarOnline.com.
Edited for formatting.
August 10th, 2012 at 6:45 PM ^
These rumors have been around a while. I'm left wondering if the reason Sandusky was allowed to hang around is because he had the 'goods' on some people so to speak.
I also remember a quote by Bobby Bowden that has been stuck in my head since this story first broke. Something along the lines of , 'we all knew something wasn't right up there,' etc. I will try to find the video but Bobby's demeanor has been peculiar on this issue.
August 10th, 2012 at 6:52 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 7:11 PM ^
Sorry, but there's nothing in the OP that changes the fact that this is none of the NCAA's business and they're still overstepping their bounds and punishing innocent people.
Imagine if one of the people running this fine blog were found to be guilty of the crimes that Sandusky was convicted of, and other people running it were covering it up. Now, imagine Red Berenson deciding that, as punishment, all members of this blog lose access to the internet forever. That's essentially what happened here. Not only is the Sandusky scandal not in the viscinity of the NCAA's jurisdiction(for many reasons), but the punishment doesn't come close to fitting the crime...because they're not punishing ANYBODY who actually committed a crime! If it was found that the people in charge of the blog were actually running a pedophile ring, would that make it acceptable for Red to ban all members of the blog forever? Of course not. Obviously, legally and morally, the latest developments at Penn State make things far worse and far more difficult to stomach. But as far as the NCAA's involvement, this changes nothing, because it still has nothing to do with them.
If it turns out the pedophile ring included recruits who were drawn to Penn State because of the access they'd have to little boys, or if it included coaches or players on other teams who were throwing games because they were given access to little boys...then we can talk. Because at that point, unlike right now, NCAA rules would have been broken. Unlike right now, they'd have grounds to punish Penn State, and hopefully they would permanently shut down the football program.
I know this will be an unpopular statement, but that's often the case for cold, hard facts.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:18 PM ^
The accusation is that rich old pervs were donating to the football program in exchange for a romp at the neverland ranch, aka second mile. (With the possibility of the ath dept knowing)
That's sure as shit NCAA turf and warrants PSU getting negged into obilivion.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:33 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 7:42 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 8:02 PM ^
If Sandusky went around raping boys outside the university, with NOBODY at the university knowing, then you may have a point. Your logic skills are so, so poor though. I'd want them to punish a school that allowed a football coach to go around dorms raping and murdering people, yes. You miss the whole problem we have with PSU in this instance. I bet standardized logic tests in high school were not your forte.
How does the whole 'giant conspiracy to cover up a terrible thing' just pass through your head without sinking in at all? Please stop. Your ignorance is actually travelling through the internet and pissing me off.
August 10th, 2012 at 9:33 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 10:23 PM ^
double angar - grrrr
August 11th, 2012 at 12:21 AM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 12:37 AM ^
Covering up a horrible scandal that would severely tarnish the reputation of your school and football program and keeping up the fiction that your program is on the up and up = gain.
I get that you're READY FOR SOME FOOTBAWL, but your life will go on without PSU being a football power for awhile.
August 10th, 2012 at 10:17 PM ^
"PSU didn't gain anything as a football program by raping boys in the showers. "
They sure as shit did, ignorant motherfucker. They avoided the embrassment of having one of their own dragged through the mud publicly as a rapist, a child molester (well, they successfully delayed that by 14-15 years).
This point is the whole gist of the outrage over this scandal. The original Sandusky offenses, as horrible as they are, are absolutley trumped by the DELIBERATE inaction of Paterno and company.
I cannot see why this point is so fucking lost on some people. It was a conspiracy, you incredibly dimwitted idiot.
August 11th, 2012 at 12:00 AM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 12:11 AM ^
AGAIN you miss the point. By engaging in this conspiracy, they successfully dodged all of the football-related downsides associated with the embarrasment to the program. Avoiding the public knowledge that they harbored a childboybuttrapist = gain.
That is the gain. They did not want to set their precious little milquetoast blue and white football program back with the public acknowledgement that they employed a fucking child rapist. Hence, the GAIN. Hence, the direct relation to the football program.
Perhaps I could best put this in song:
August 11th, 2012 at 12:16 AM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 12:44 AM ^
Want a "decent" opinion? One question, and one question only, purely asked from not a criminal standpoint, but the NCAA's:
Would Matt Millen/Levar Arrington/John Cappelletti/Curtis Enis/Todd Blackledge/Ki-Jana Carter/Kerry Collins/DJ Dozier/Roosevelt Grier (or who the fuckever) have chosen Penn State as the place to matriculate and play college football, knowing their head coach had harbored a child rapist for years and years, with the tacit blessing of the university?
Don't see a gain/advantage there troll?
I'm out.
August 11th, 2012 at 1:11 AM ^
1. I hope you treat others as you wish to be treated. Anger and negativity breed anger and negativity.
2. I guess I don't quite understand this can of worms the NCAA has opened. We aren't talking about laws or the legal process of the everyday citizen. We are talking about a game. A game that is making billions of dollars in tax exempt money for the universities, but a game none the less. College football is entertainment to us. Nothing more, nothing less. The comings and goings of PSU, or OSU, or UM, or any other school has no real impact on my life (or most others) other than a diversion to the everyday grind. The NCAA has no authority over me anymore other than the team I root for. That being said, I will play your game.
The NCAA Board of Directors is voted on by the member institution. If the majority of the member institutions don't like how the NCAA BoT handles these situations, they can vote them out. Remember, the NCAA looks out for it's member institutions so when one, like PSU, allows and even helps (allowing Sandusky to bring the boys on campus) about as bad of a crime as one could, they need to take action, at least in their eyes. How bad would it look to the nation if PSU was constantly in bowl games, playing for national championships, ect. It would look like the schools can get away with pretty much anything. That's not the image that the university presidents want to project, and I can see why.
You say it's only a legal matter, but it's so much more. Does the actions of PSU affect the other member institutions? You bet it does. One of the shining beacons of college athletics, "The Grand Experiment" was nothing more than lip service. With more and more schools cheating, paying players, allowing extra benefits, the image of the NCAA is taking a nose dive. That nose dive leads to lower revenue. They had to act. In the case of PSU, they had to act early. If these allegations are true, and Sandusky was using TSM as a way to "pimp" kids, he was using PSU to help in that endeavor. By agreeing to the sanctions now, they won't be forced to shut down the program entirely. That would be a mess. I'm sure PSU and the NCAA knew what was coming down the pipe in regards to this "new" investigation. They are trying to keep PSU out of the spotlight as much as possible.
BTW - If I were Miami (YTM) or UNC, I would be shaking in my boots. I think Emmert and the NCAA are trying to "clean up." As both UNC and Miami (YTM) are repeat offenders, I think they will get hammered.
August 11th, 2012 at 6:29 AM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 12:57 PM ^
that the NCAA did have to act to punish PSU over and above whatever the legal system ends up doing, I understand where you're coming from with your arguments. You immediately lose my support, though, by disintegrating into low-brow tossing of insults, especially in the above post, when you go off on "wigeon" 's family members. "Bowl of dick"? Sorry, but I'm really tiring of seeing that phrase being used, and I bet I'm not the only one. But suggesting that his family members partake of said bowl? Grow up, regardless of how much personal success you claim to have had in life!
August 11th, 2012 at 1:45 PM ^
rant and rave like a lunatic. If you think everyone who disagrees with you is a stupid fucking asshole then you are going to lead a very frustrating and angry life.
August 10th, 2012 at 10:29 PM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 1:13 AM ^
Beavis
August 10th, 2012 at 11:16 PM ^
The NCAA can do what ever it's members give it authority to do. The NCAA is an organization that is run by the universities that it represents. The NCAA is like the NFL or the MBL that act in the best interest of the all the schools it represents. The Board of Directors, which gave Emmert his power to sanction PSU, is made up of College Presidents (PSU peers). If the NCAA goes too far and sets precedents if sanctioning schools too strongly before the facts come out, the universities themselves are to blame. Again, who gives the power to the NCAA? PSU could have fought the NCAA on the issues, but they didn't. They choose to take the plea bargain. It was their choice to have these sanctions and fines. They didn't make up the rules as the went. They have a bylaw that covers this (see below).
If you look at who the NCAA has sanctioned, it is teams that have been investigated by someone else. UM basketball was brought up by the FBI, OSU was brought up by the FBI, USC was investigated because of a civil case. Even stretchgate was "Investigated" by a "newspaper." They can interview, but they can't supeona (which I think is a good thing). The NCAA took the Grand Jury testimony and the Freeh Report as their investigation.
Lastly, here is the NCAA bylaw 2.4: The Principle of Sportsmanship and Ethical Conduct
For intercollege athletics to promote the charecter development of participants, to enhance the integrity of higher education and to promote civility in society, student-athletes, coaches, and all others associated with these athetics programs and events should adhere to such fundamental values as respect, civility, honesty and responsibility. These values should be manifest not only in athletics participation, but also in the broad spectrum affecting the athletics program.
Now, we can debate all day and all night whether what happened at PSU falls under Bylaw 2.4. It's vague for a reason. The NCAA gives itself leeway to rule on issues that don't fall under the specific bylaws, with good reason. The PSU scandal is a black eye not only for PSU and the NCAA, but to the university presidents, especially those that work closely with PSU. Again, PSU chose to accept the sanctions to keep the univeristy out of the spotlight in this regard. They waived the right to their "due process."
August 10th, 2012 at 7:36 PM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 7:46 AM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 7:36 PM ^
The head coach of PSU allowed his DC to rape young boys three doors down from his office for years. He allowed that DC access to the facilities in order to run yearly football camps. He allowed that DC to travel to bowl games, hang out in the press box with young boys all while he knew what the guy had done and/or what was doing.
The NCAA has the right to rule on the integrity of its members. This was done.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:45 PM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 10:07 AM ^
I don't really see why this is even being debated anymore.
University athletics departments used to facilitate child rape. University officials decided it was better (for the football team) to keep this hush hush than stop it. Child rape continues. Everyone caught. Football team and university punished.
I really can't see a credible counter argument, unless it's to say PSU got off too lightly.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:46 PM ^
The fake non-profit status of the NCAA is the only thing stopping your argument from being completely absurd. A private company can do whatever the hell it wants, within the bounds of the law. Even with the quasi-public status that comes with dealing with state universities, you are just plain wrong.
Every recruit or player to jump ship is a CLEAR testament that keeping this quiet was a competitive advantage... unless you would send your son to play for a culture that harbored and fucking empowered a serial pedophile. The myopic nature of your stance is just hard for me to fathom.
To address the 'please don't punish those poor kids' angle, tough shit. Michigan basketball suffered for less, a handful of other programs are suffering for less. Apply your logic to OSU. THE NCAA HAS NO BUSINESS HANDING OUT PUNISHMENT TO OSU! TRESSEL AND PRYOR ARE GONE! THEY SHOULD MIND THEIR OWN BUSINESS! BOWL GAME OR BUST!
The PSU sounds like it is much more systemic and an infinite number of times more egregious than the OSU deal. Please defend OSU, USC, Miami, etc if you choose to work this angle.
Is it overstepping my bounds to tell you that your take on this is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard? Go back to BWI.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:51 PM ^
bylaws on Ethics and the way they expect Universities to conduct themselves in the matter of criminal activities. The NCAA determined PSU violated these guidelines.
It was very much in the NCAA's purview to punish Penn State. End of Story.
August 10th, 2012 at 10:02 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 7:54 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 8:11 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 8:27 PM ^
Let me understand your point...
Penn State is an NCAA institution that makes countless millions off its football program. That same *NCAA institution* enabled a child molester to continue molesting kids for god knows how long after information about his behavior while on the premises of an *NCAA institution* was first uncovered.
How is that not an NCAA matter?
As for your blog analogy, I can't even comprehend the logic behind that one. Let's say there was an organization that policed the internet. Call it the Department of Justice for that Golden Age of Comics feeling. And the DOJ gets wind an MGoBlog user, Blue in South Bend, is streaming Michigan games for free on its site. Regular users aren't aware of this activity, but Brian and Ace and Seth and even TomVH actively covered this fact up for the past five years. Finally, Blue's activity is uncovered and he's arrested. Brian, and the other higher-ups are also disgraced and forced to leave their positions. Meanwhile, MGoBlog isn't shut down but is restricted from posting certain content (post-game discussion) for four years and any user can sign up for any other Michigan blog without penalty or can stay with their full point totals, but simply will not be able to partake in post-game discussion. New administrators and moderators are hired and any money made from the blog goes into paying back those who were wronged.
How is that not completely fair?
(Sorry oh MGoBlog lords for taking thy name in vain, but somebody had to shoot down this argument)
August 10th, 2012 at 9:01 PM ^
I really don't know what to say. The cold, hard facts are that the University, athletic department, and football staff covered up a pedophile and allowed said pedophile to keep using the university as breeding ground for his victims.
The rest of your statement is opinion. It is your opinion that the NCAA overstepped it's bounds. It is your opiniuon that the football team didn't keep an advantage by covering up the pedophile. It is also your opinion that it s none of the NCAA's business. There are no "cold, hard, facts" there.
Let's first look at your "example." It is my opinion that it really isn't a representation of the situation. How is a Michigan coach banning every member of the blog from the internet like the NCAA punishing a University and allowing the players to transfer? My guess is that banning people from the internet is like punishing the players. The players aren't banned from playing football for life. In fact, they can still play for PSU if they choose to. They can even continue their education for free and not play football. They can play this year, say this sucks, and transfer. The fans can still pay for a ticket to go into Beaver Stadium to watch PSU play football. They can still watch football on TV. They can still go to a high school game. They aren't banned from football.
BTW - the punishment of innocent people happens all the time. My family lost, at one point, over $60,000 of equity in my house because of the actions of a few greedy individuals. We have a family of five stuck in a 1270 square foot house. We can't sell it because we are now over $20,000 underwater. Yet, I have a roof over my head and my family is much closer than we would be if we had a larger house. I guarentee that the workers of Enron didn't receive such choices for them when their employer was convicted of what they did. They were forced to look for a new job and their families may have been uprooted. Life is not fair. The NCAA has given the PSU players multiple ways out if they choose to.
Here is a better example of what went down. Let's say you are a CEO of a major company (the NCAA). One of your contract companies (PSU), one that was very good at what they did and made you a lot of money, was covering up one of their high level directors (Sandusky) pedophilia. That director wasn't even in the same division as the the one that worked for you. Would you keep the company working for you? I wouldn't.
Lastly, what is the purpose of a university? To educate and train individuals to make a better society. To give the population the skills to succeed as adults. It's not to provide football for the masses. It's not to provide football players a means to get to the NFL. These athletes are given a free education to PLAY A GAME! They can still play the game and get a free education out of it.
August 11th, 2012 at 12:15 AM ^
August 11th, 2012 at 1:41 AM ^
He's trying to be the George Lucas of Mgoblog. He lost me when he brought Red Berenson into an Mgoblog conspiracy. I didn't even read anything after that.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:17 PM ^
So when do they get kicked out of our conference? They will likely bring nothing to the table for the foreseeable future. Or beyond that.
August 10th, 2012 at 8:02 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 8:09 PM ^
Before this whole scandal, they were arguably the third strongest member of the conference, and brought up the average in nearly every category. After all of this, they're probably an average member at best, and they're only there because of the sheer quantity of fans. If that starts to drop off, they would bring no more to the table than Indiana or Purdue, but with a bad stigma. I don't like it.
August 10th, 2012 at 7:59 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 10:12 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 10:53 PM ^
but is it?
August 10th, 2012 at 8:30 PM ^
Is it just me, or does anyone else wonder if this unamed powerful individual played a role in helping Spanier get what seems like a plum Fed job dealing with security when he was under such a cloud of suspicion?
August 10th, 2012 at 11:28 PM ^
August 10th, 2012 at 8:38 PM ^
If that's even remotely true, Penn State won't have to worry about NCAA sanctions because the school is going to be absolutely obliterated by the federal government. Heck, they still might now even if nothing else does get found out
August 10th, 2012 at 8:48 PM ^
"The new investigation is also looking at if boys from the Second Mile charity were shared by Sandusky with other men."
After reading this sentence, among others, I realized that it in fact can and will get worse.
Even though this aspect of the nightmare in State College will be a criminal investigation, it somehow underscores exactly why it was totally appropriate for the NCAA to act within its own locus of control.
Going back to several posts above where someone decried the NCAA's action in this matter, it isn't just that a child rapist was allowed to do vile things with impunity on university property for over a decade, but that this person represented a university and its football program with his emeritus status in the department and at the school and had access to the facilities.
The NCAA had every right to effectively castrate this program through sanctions as it failed - perhaps most - importantly to uphold a bylaw which entrusts these representatives of the school to be teachers of young people in the midst of a total lack of institutional control. The school and the program failed to mirror the ethos expected in the bylaws.
Similarly, if Jerry Sandusky - on top of what he has already been convicted of doing - used this organization of his, designed to give troubled youths a "second chance" to further the abuse he was inflicting, then it is in a way like using university facilities, hiding behind the supposed integrity of a program or organization and using / abusing your own stature in the community to do terrible things. The NCAA can rightly deal with what happened on school property and among representatives of that program. The law will take care of the rest and already has in part.
August 10th, 2012 at 8:41 PM ^
There were rumblings about this a few months ago. Some Pittsburgh broadcaster, who is known to be a bit Bombastic... talked about it... and it was dismissed as shock jock stuff but that was the ONLY guy who predicted the Sandusky scandal months before it happened.
Edit (after a google search): Here is the link. It was Mark Madden
http://www.nesn.com/2011/11/jerry-sandusky-rumored-to-have-been-pimping…
August 10th, 2012 at 9:15 PM ^
A lot of people in the CiC have been speculating about this, namely the related to Penn State. I've heard people from the other football crazy schools in the B1G talk about how even if Sandusky was buddy-buddy with the legendary head coach, someone in risk management should have had alarm bells go off, gone around Paterno, and gotten the BoT to act. I was hoping this was just more bored breakroom talk but it makes sense. Sandusky did get way too much protection for being just an above average defensive coordinator. I wonder who else gets implicated in this. There have to be skeletons in the closet though, otherwise they would have jettisoned Sandusky in the wake of 1998 or 2002. The main reason you don't go to the authorities is a fear of what other skeletons they find in the closet when they come by to collect Sandusky.