Eh....this coaching situation really needs to get figured out. This is starting to get a bit ridiculous IMO.
landing spot. will be interesting to see how he does.
Eh....this coaching situation really needs to get figured out. This is starting to get a bit ridiculous IMO.
I took that picture in your avatar.
All I can do is thank you and give you a +1. Thank you, +1.
So cute when I see people become MGoFriends…. (why is it so dusty in here) tear
I took that picture in your avatar. Has anyone ever told you that you need to sit still more often? And that you look like you were drawn in MS Paint?
It's starting to get ridiculous?
It was either ridiculous or it wasn't the moment that DB said he wouldn't be making a decision until after the bowl game. Nothing has changed since then.
The escalation with these commits starting to question those commitments should send some kind of signals to our athletic department that maybe they're not going about this in the correct manner. Still can't figure out how a bowl game is going to answer any more questions that might be out there.
It's obviously more complicated than the outcome of a bowl games.
I don't totally disagree with this, but it still doesn't explain the prolonged wait? Other schools haven't had problems making coaching changes before bowl games. We're losing commitments at positions of need and potentially losing more, yet nothing changes from the AD. I give him credit for sticking to his word but what's the cost going to be after the Gator Bowl when Crawford is a Hurricane and Hart is a Gator (hypothetically and among others)?
The only commit we've lost is Sousa. And that doesn't sound a whole lot like it was DB's fault. My guess is the wavering ones will get resolved somewhere in the vicinity of Jan. 2. In the meantime, hypotheticals are as useful as Denard's shoelaces.
What if Harbaugh is coming here, but said it had to be announced after the bowl game? Is it better to have a 5 week waiting period with or without a coach? Is it better to play a bowl game with or without a coach? Is it easier to attract recruits with or without a coach? I'm guessing that Brandon has his reasons for waiting and I highly doubt he hasn't made a decision yet.
PSA: Please refer to joeyb's avatar.
That is all.
That's actually a valid point, but a whole different discussion. Because no decision has been made, the people who are mad at DB are mad simply because they don't like the way he's coming to his decision, without even knowing what the decision is.
Now, once the decision is made, and you don't like it, that's a new discussion altogether. If DB made all the correct moves to get Harbaugh, but you just didn't want Harbaugh, then can voice that at that time. But until we know what the decision is, we really can't fault DB for how he's going about making it.
I have a strong feeling, however, that if JH is our coach in Jan 4th, there will be far more M fans in favor of it than against it.
DB isn't the man many here are claiming him to be. In clear terms that aren't at all ambiguous, I mean he would have been lying this entire time and has no integrity whatsoever.
In the scenario I provide, there are three options, as far as I see it.
1) Fire RR and wait 5 weeks to announce Harbaugh.
2) Fire RR and announce that Harbaugh is our next coach, which might backfire and cause Harbaugh to not come here.
3) Keep RR on to help us win a bowl game and keep as many recruits in place until Harbaugh gets here. This requires a lie about why he is waiting.
So, he can either be incompetent, a (possibly incompetent) liar, or a competent liar. I'll take the competent one.
David Brandon has said he's waiting to begin evaluating the coach when the season is over. He hasn't stated anything about what the result of the evaluation will be, since in the words that did come out of his mouth, he hasnt' even started yet. Which means even he doesn't know.
There is no lying going on. There is just the lack of a review, because it's not time for a review.
Out of all the possibilities of the review, many people have foolishly decided the result is to fire Rich Rodriguez and hire Jim Harbaugh.
I admit that's still a possibility our of all the possibilities, but there is no evidence at all it's likely.
Yes, this part is painful. We are witnessing what's it's like to be a child of a determined parent who can only teach the lesson through patience and a commitment to their belief.
The long term lesson is that every Athletic Team at the university will get to finish their entire season without any drama about a "change". They will be measured on the results of their complete season, which of course has to be over to complete.
Now I don't see anywhere that this means David Brandon can't act any time he needs to in making a decision. If Rich Rodriguez drove Denard out to a bunch of bars one night and was pulled over for a DUI, I'm pretty sure a decision would be make quickly.
The other thing everyone forgets, that was a clear statement from David Brandon, as recorded in the Crain article that started all of this, was that he uses more than Wins and Losses as things to consider during his evaluation. And for me, the only thing I don't like about what Rich Rodriguez has done is only get to 7-5 this year. Every other aspect of how he has managed the team, built recruiting pipelines, lead by example in his activities outside of football, etc. has been done extremely well. OR there is no other reason to fire him except, "I don't like that we lost to Michigan State because my friend at work won't stop teasting me"
Now, yes, recruits are stating, "hey I only want to go to Michigan if Rich Rodriguez is my coach". But these are only some recruits, (go back and read TomVH yourself to find the other recruits who state, "I want to go to Michigan because it's Michigan") and they haven't yet enrolled at another University. So what has really happened in the past few weeks where Brandon has stated nothing?
From my point of view, all that is happened is that they completely fabricated stories that Journalists are calling "reporting" these days are getting fewer and farther between, and readership has moved on to other topics where facts actually exist.
For me, I find the psychology of what David Brandon is doing very interesting, and I can't wait to see what happens next to the rats in the maze when they can't find their cheese next week. Will they remember that they will get now cheese until Jan 2, or will they again squeak loudly about "the unfairness of the universe", and "will someone please think about the children who want to commit to Michigan"
it's enthralling, really it is, way better than "Real Housewives of Beverly Hills"
I have no idea why my wife watches that crap.
It is technically noise, but when you continue to see these types of articles popping up, it's hard as a fan to not want to see something resolved soon before the class breaks apart, which is possible.
Well, it's a good thing that coaches, players, and school administration are all more important than what the fans want. We are observers, not included in the process. Just sit back and watch instead of feeling like you're a part of it.
Feeling like you're a part of it? Isn't that what a fan is? I'm aware that observing is all I can do.....doesn't mean I'm going to absolve from throwing my two cents in every once in a while.
How about you abstain, rather than absolve?
Seriously, if you want Michigan to be coach-less right now, or have Greg Robinson as the interim coach because RR was dismissed and Barwis, Smith, Tall and Frey followed him out the door, along with a number of RR recruits, then your admonition for David Brandon to make up his mind right now makes perfect sense. Also, if you'd like David Brandon to have Jim Harbaugh reject the Michigan job a la Les Miles in 2007, then firing Rich Rod right now is a splendid decision.
If, however, you'd prefer for the team to have its full complement of coaches, for RR to finish out the season, and for Stanford to be allowed to prepare for a very, very big bowl game without intermeddling by David Brandon, then just be patient. January 4th is not far away at all. If a commit, or a fan, can't wait 21 days to see whether RR or JH is the coach, well, get a hobby.
Posts like this are what keep many people from even expressing their opinions on this board. Why not do yourself a favor and abstain from knocking somebody for simply having an opinion. Now leave me alone to my hobby....watching porn in my mother's basement.
If DB keeps RR, we are going to need another batch to keep our guys and finish up strong. I hope snake oil is cheap.
almost immediately as to RR's return or a contract has already been agreed to be a new coach. There will be less than a month for recruiting and it must fall in with this schedule:
January 30: Quiet Period
January 31-February 3: Dead Period. [Note: Feb. 3 is "national signing day," the first day that recruits can sign a National Letter of Intent for their school of choice.]
To EE's it would be nice to know who their coach is going to be. How valuable would it be to have Dee enroll early get to work with Barwis and go through spring ball? To those possible recruits looking for a new destination because of a coaching change it would be important to know who the coach is going to be.
I can hear RR now, "Hey "big time recruit" sorry you had to go through that coaching change at Miami. I would love to have you come to Ann Arbor for a visit so we can offer you a scholarship." "Big time recruit", "But, coach are you still going to be there if I come." RR, "Good point, nevermind."
this class will fall apart. The instate guys will stay committed, but I doubt if many of the others do. Unfortunately, a three star in Michigan where HS football is weak is not a three star in the talent rich states.
It may fall apart even if RR is retained because of DB's timeline. As EEs chose other schools and players like Cooper walk away because of the coaching termoil. We can't even take advantage of the firings at other schools.
Disagree. I doubt that (a) many people would back out of a commitment to Michigan if RR was gone and Jim Harbaugh took over (gee, I don't want to play for a coach with NFL connections and history, who just went 11-2 or 12-1, and had players as Heisman finalists two years in a row); or that (b) Harbaugh wouldn't put together a fantastic 2011 class with the remaining month before NSD. After all, his current class is better than that of MICH.
It might impact some of the specialized players on offense (RB, QB...) but just about everybody else would probably be happy with the chance to play for Harbaugh in A2.
This I do agree with. I honestly believe that Harbaugh will be a much better recruiter at Michigan than RR will be/ever was.
Harbaugh would not have done a substantially better job recruiting if he had to deal with all of the negative press and irrational personal attacks that RRod has had to deal with.
Well, that's all part of the gig. And maybe you're right, but maybe that something that makes JH more attractive, that he'll likely get less negative press.
But I think there's no doubt JH is and will be a great recruiter. He was a star college football player for Michigan and had a long NFL career with multiple teams. His brother is a current NFL head coach and between the two of them they know just about every coach in the NFL, assistants included. JH's assistants usually have NFL ties as well. For the guys we're recruiting with NFL aspirations (likely almost all of them), this is very attractive.
In addition to that, JH has fielded successful college football teams, and he has had two Heisman finalists in as many years (were they both runners-up?). Playing for Jim Harbaugh you are in good position to have team success, individual success and set up well for the NFL. Couple that with the winningest program in NCAA history and that's an attractive sell to recruits.
Your opinion is fact, IMO.
You're passing out bad news too close to XMas. Whats next...
Makes 0 sense at this point if RR is retained.
It'll be ok... It'll be ok... It'll be ok...
If I were a top recruit to Michigan, and I thought Brady Hoke may replace RR, I would de-commit too.
Our only hope is that DB makes a decision ASAP and RR or JH can get these kids to re-commit.
Whoa, rad dude.
DB told me that the delay has no effect on recruiting! If I were RR or someone that mattered (and actually had a premium subscription) I would just forward articles to DB all day talking about the negative effects his inaction is having on our recruiting...just to show him how amazingly stupid his comment was re: recruiting.
Our (arguably) top 2 commits are on the verge of looking elsewhere or already are. The dozens of comments from current players, commits and prospects talking about how they don't want RR gone or (with commits and prospects) how Michigan will no longer be on their list in RR leaves. The numerous top targets that have scratched Michigan or committed elsewhere, some citing the coaching uncertainty as their explicit reason for dropping us. Compare this to the sparse comments received from recruits that the coach doesn't matter--which may or may not be genuine, Dee said similar things re: committing to the school rather than the coach--and it's pretty damn obvious that there's an effect.
Sure, some may be re-swayed in our direction by whoever the coach is in the 3-4 weeks they will have to throw something together. But it's a hell of a lot easier to get an initial committment than to force a kid to decommit somewhere and come to Michigan. And the coach sure as hell won't have a lot of time to do so. As we have seen, many will not risk waiting till the last second to commit somewhere, for fear of other schools filling up at their position.
than one recruiting class. You simply cannot base your decision to retain or release a coach on the whim of recruits.
because that's precisely what I was suggesting we do. Fail.
DB has the information he needs to make a decision and could have made one in a way that doesn't damage recruiting nearly as much.
By the way, having a subpar recruiting class or one filled with attrition haunts the program for years to come. Do we want to have some classes with very few seniors again in 4 years, whoever is the coach? I don't. It's not something that can be dismissed out of hand like so many are willing to do.
So, you think it's better to have the team prepare for a bowl game without its head coach or a number of assistants ( I can think of at least 4 that would leave the second RR was fired ), and that it's good to prepare for a bowl when many of the players are thinking of maybe transferring?
And, you don't think giving RR a contract extension, or hiring Jim Harbaugh the first week of January, won't have a galvanizing, positive effect on recruiting WHEN IT IS NEEDED THE MOST, THE MONTH BEFORE SIGNING DAY?
Thank goodness you aren't Athletic Director.
How would firing Rodriguez today improve recruit retention, out of curiousity?
...of the current players on the roster who may leave if Rodriguez is gone. Decommiting recruits are an inevitable result of any coaching change in any program (i.e. Florida, Miami, PItt right now) but there is just as much concern for potential transfers.
I sincerely hope Brandon takes EVERYTHING into consideration. Until then, though, there's not much fans can do except wait it out.
He didn't say that it had no effect on recruiting; he said that recruiting was a year-round event. If DB has someone lined up to coach after the bowl, and he fires RR now, that's a month out of the year that no one is recruiting. How does that go against what he said?
If he wants to be Michigan's coach he should be here now not wait another month. Unless, of course, he is a former player and alumnus that threw the program and academics under the bus. If it's him to hell with him.
Saban got crucified when he left MSU before their bowl game to go to LSU. RR got crucified when he left WVU before their bowl game. Maybe, this coach wants to start off on the right foot. Wouldn't that be something to have a coach with the media on his side?
That may be the case in most circumstances for coaches leaving. JH wouldn't have to worry about the media being on his side, I think they would trip all over themselves jumping on the bandwagon. Anybody but RR.
But the coaching uncertainty is lurking no matter what DB does. No matter how forcefully he comes out and endorses RR, you're still getting negatively recruited just based on the last 3 years of results, and the uncertainty that persists. Furthermore, this tack makes it look like you're giving him one more chance, rather than evaluating objectively based on progress. Not really a stabilizing force IMO.
Negative recruiting is gonna happen this year no matter what DB does/doesn't do. I'm sure there is a lot going on that we don't know about, I'm just going to trust that he is approaching the situation the right way. IMO the only thing that can really restore confidence is a strong showing in the bowl game with a finally healthy and rejuvenated team.
If RR stays he will likely receive a contract extension in order to stop the crazy speculation about his job status. If RR goes Jim Harbaugh will undoubtedly be hired, and he will arrive fresh off an 11 win season, at worst, and continue his excellent recruiting prowess (a current class at Stanford which is better than MICH's) and secure an excellent class for MICH.
I don't get why people are worried. If these kids want to play for RR, they'll have their clarity within 3 weeks. If they want to de-commit because Harbaugh is the new coach, (a) they're being stupid because Harbaugh is a fantastic coach with NFL connections; and (b) Harbaugh will undoubtedly replace them with players eager to play for MICH, for Harbaugh, or for both.
Either way, the month of January will be fantastic for Michigan recruiting. Stop worrying, everyone.
Fucking seriously. I agree with every word you said (typed?), yet it's been said a million times and so many people don't get it. Dallas Crawford is not going to sign an LOI in the next 2 weeks. There's time, chill out.
Why is it that all of the knowledgeable posters aren't so concerned, but everyone else is ready to crucify DB? People just want to get upset, it seems.
Thank God for your wisdom and Knowledge, if it weren't for the intelligent bunch, we ignorant f**ks would be left to squander in our on shit.
Thanks for shining a light on our shortcomings.
This is your chance to chill the fuck out and be one of those knowledgeable posters to which he is referring or one of everyone else.
One side : Brandon knows what he's doing, he must be right.
Other-ish side: It's POSSIBLE that waiting on a coaching decision could hurt recruiting.
One side is claiming that the strategy is practically infallible while others are simply questioning it. They are then criticized for talking with a foot in their mouth because they have no idea what David Brandon is thinking because we're not involved in the process, yet in the other hand will claim they know exactly what Brandon is thinking and that it's the right decision. Apparently knowledgeable is synonymous with ability to make arrogant assumptions.
Really, the one side, the side that I'm on, is not saying DB is infalliable, they're (I'm) saying to chill out for 2 weeks instead of flipping out, and to trust that maybe DB knows more than we do. I'm saying I think there's a good reason he's doing what he's doing, and although I'm not exactly sure what that is, I'm willing to let the Earth continue to spin until I find out.
If the other-ish side was really just questioning his "decision" and saying it could possibly hurt recruiting, this thread would be 8 posts long. But your other-ish side, at least most of the people on that side, are saying "Fire DB, he's doing more damage to the team than RR ever did, there's no excuse for him to wait this long, our class is fucked. blah blah blah." That is not questioning anything, that is assuming they know the whole story and making a judgment on what hasn't already happened.
If someone said "I'm really not sure why we're waiting this long, but I'm interested to find out why and I'll voice my opinion on DB's decision once it happens" no one would be up in arms. But that's really not the way it's gone so far.
don't necessarily mean knowledgeable poster.
You can say whatever you want about RR, but the reality is there is very little quality talent that are RS seniors, seniors, and RS juniors. This is not his fault. He is in the process of building something here and has almost every significant piece back for next year. He has had two recruiting classes of his own and brought in some other players (Roundtree, Odoms, Shaw, Omameh, and Barnum) while keeping most of LC's last class (Martin, Stonum, Demens).
If you played sports in HS, how would you have fared as a freshman playing varsity football? This is where we are on defense due to reason beyond control (how excited was everyone over JT Turner's commit, Vlad not getting his speed back, some missteps with admissions) and only time is going to change that. Next year Woolfork will be an upgrade over Rogers. They have to replace Mouton (bad Mouton easy, good Mouton hard), and everyone else is back with a year's more experience and time with Barwis. Throw in at least 6 RS on D and this years recruiting class and competition should heat up.
My personal feeling is no coach can be truly judged until his first full recruiting class has finished their senior season. RR's are just finishing their sophomore season.
I agree with most all of this post (including your first sentence). I don't mean to say that I think RR needs to be fired. I'm pretty on the fence when it comes to who will be our coach next year, assuming JH and RR are the only options. I think both of them are good coaches who will succeed in AA. Let it be known I certainly don't want RR to go if it's not for JH. I'm completely OK with giving RR his 4th year as well.
My stance is more about DB's methods than about who he ends up picking. Because I think he'll probably pick JH, I'm less upset about the wait. I think a lot of the people mad at DB for waiting to announce aren't actually mad about the wait, but more about who they think he'll pick. This is a valid concern, but one that's not being vocalized well, IMO.
I was just playing off of the distinction that he made between knowledgeable posters (who sit back and wait for facts before they criticize) and the people who freak out over nothing. The knowledgeable posters aren't the ones who have the most points; they're the ones who know that complaining about something before it even happens is ridiculous, especially when the event never actually happens. Like Dee Hart committing to Auburn. Like Dee Hart committing to Bama. Like Dallas Crawford openning up his recruitment. Like no recruits being willing to commit until they know who the coach is. The only bad thing that has actually come out of this so far is the Sousa decommit, which no one freaked out over, because he was most likely going to be a career backup.
Whether RR is kept is beside the point. The argument is based on DB waiting 5 weeks to make/announce the decision and how it is hurting us. Well, it hasn't. So, sit back, calm down, and wait until the press conference to find out the facts before you make any judgements.
BTW, it's Woolfolk. Folk. F-O-L-K. WoolfoLk.
well said, jg... These are the kind of posts that earn people MGoProfile invitations.
See what I did there...?
If they want to de-commit because Harbaugh is the new coach, (a) they're being stupid because Harbaugh is a fantastic coach with NFL connections;
Oh I get it. They're stupid because they want to do something with which you disagree.
I wonder if a contract extension is possible without having ever beaten a Big Ten team that finished the season above .500 in the conference, let alone Ohio State.
But I do agree with your basic premise, which is that Brandon is going to try to do something to tamp down the uncertainty for the immediate future. Maintaining the status quo just extends the uncertainty another year. A different approach would be to announce that Michigan will honor the rest of Rich's contract, and the next evaluation of the football program will come after the regular season in 2012. The head coach either gets a new, long-term contract at that point or he's gone. No more in-between.
Finally, here's one other probable reason why Brandon is holding off: the best thing that can happen for Michigan Football and its recruiting right now is to beat Mississippi State. The best way to do that is maintain the current coaches and allow the team to focus on preparation.
There is more to life than playing for a coach with NFL connections. Like playing for a coach you've personally bonded with.
Face it -- if you're a four-star recruit, most schools want you. You choose the school you want to go to. People need to get their heads out of their asses and realize that these kids have choices, and a big part of their choice is playing for someone they trust and respect. If they trust and respect Harbaugh more than any other coach out there, then they'll stay. If there's another coach they trust and respect more, they'll leave. That's why coaching changes can be disruptive.
People who think a Harbaugh hire wouldn't be disruptive are on crack.
I didn't say it wouldn't be disruptive, or that it wouldn't be, but it wouldn't be bad, especially not for recruiting or for public relations surrounding Michigan.
Wayne Lyons, for example, has Stanford and Michigan in his final five.
I believe that the "quiet " period for recruiting is coming up, which will quiet a lot of the decommit tallk. Although I'm sure many schools disregard these rules. Looking at you Lane.
I agree 100%. People who want something done now before the bowl game are short sighted and don't understand the long term consequences of DB's decisions.
Besides, how many recruits have ACTUALLY decommitted? Oh wait, that would be ZERO.
What difference does it make if David Brandon says on December 16th that "Rich Rodriguez will be our coach in 2011" or if he says "Rich Rodriguez is going to be fired and we're starting to look for a new coach"?
Rodriguez is on the hot seat, whether David Brandon says right now that Rodriguez will return in 2011 or if he waits until early January.
Rodriguez might be fired, whether David Brandon says so right now or says it in early January.
The end result will be the same. The kids know Rodriguez is on the hot seat even if they stick with Michigan and he returns in 2011. They know that he could be gone after their freshman year, regardless of what David Brandon says. They'll either stick with Michigan after January 2nd (or whenever Brandon makes his announcement), or they won't. There's no reason to fret about it.
Will people please just cut-n-paste Magnus' response when this "stuff" recirculates during the next three weeks.
R. Lee Ermey is right, if RR is retained, he is still on the hot seat and that is not changing regardless of the bowl game. And at this point, we are pretty close to the dead period anyway.
I can understand the frustration with DB right now, no one wants to see us losing committed recruits. Just have to be patient and we will have our answer soon enough.
I've been trying to say this for weeks, but you put it much more succinctly.
a mere re-affirmation of RR's status post-bowl game will be sufficient for recruiting purposes. Won't DB have to give RR an extension along with the dreaded vote of confidence? Otherwise, this will just be self-perpetuating, with the same questions about RR status being asked by the Class of '12 recruits starting February 2011, no?
I agree with an earlier comment -- STOP WORRYING ABOUT DEE HARD AND OTHER COMMITS regarding the coaching change. Just STOP.
This isn't the Lakers. You don't make a coaching change (or not) based on the feelings of one or two 17 or 18 yr olds who aren't even on the team yet. The issue is the long-term future of the program, not this year's class.
If no change is made, RR gets extension, we look better to recruits (although he is still on the "hot seat" anyway). If Jim is the new coach, we maybe lose a few recruits (and, yes a potential 5*), but, he might sway some kids who aren't even on our radar yet (think: Roy Roundtree), maybe pluck some from the Stanford class, etc -- you just don't know. Personally, if Harbaugh comes in, then Dee Hart might not be the prototypical runningback he'll want, even if he keeps the spread with Denard at QB / omniback / "back" or whatever position the electorate thinks he plays. Got me, I have no basis to know.
DB has made his bed, he's waiting until January, so stop worrying about it. Or, better, if you're worrying about it, keep it to yourself.
For all the problems that people blame on RR. I think DB is doing way more damage to our program than RR has ever done.
I think you should step back and keep perspective. Brandon has done a lot of positive things, and virtually the ONLY "negative" thing (as some of you see it) is this whole "I'm going to wait until after the bowl game to make my assessment."
Meanwhile, Rodriguez himself has been around for a few years and his coaching, hiring decisions, recruiting, and personnel decisions are largely the reason that he's on the hot seat in the first place.
But never mind all that. Brandon MUST be doing more damage than Rodriguez BECAUSE DAMMIT A COUPLE RECRUITS MIGHT GET THEIR FEELINGS HURT AND GO ELSEWHERE.
All of the other things DB has done are secondary. Just as Martin will be judged by the Rrod hire more than any other decision, DB should be judged by this decision. So far, the indecision makes him look bad and is hurting this program. In the end, if Harbaugh is hired, no harm no foul. It may be worth taking these hits if DB views Harbaugh as the ultimate prize. But if DB keeps Rrod and even signs him to an extension, there will be no excuse for this delay. He could have done those things the day after Ohio St.
OK Mat. Let's say DB has decided, as the leader of our athletic department, that JH is the best man for the job. Now, let's say JH says, "I owe it to my kids to coach them in the biggest game that most of them have ever and will ever play in. It would be bad form for me to quit on them before that. I'll take the job starting Jan 4th." Both of those are quite likely to have happened.
Now, if DB says, again assuming he thinks JH is the best man for the job, "Sorry Jim, we absolutely need you to to coach us during the month of December, so I'm going with RR or someone else" then I would absolutely want him fired. That's ridiculous.
Luckily, that's not what he's doing. I don't think he's waiting just for the hell of it. He has a plan, but none of us know exactly what that is. Depending on how it plays out, we might never actually know. But your suggestion of "Get JH immediately or not at all" is seriously, completely, unequivocally, batshit stupid. Also, pretty dumb.
I think what you said of JH is admirable. But, what about the kids that he will be coaching and his new job. Does he owe it to them as well to give them all his attention. We do need him to start working with the team ASAP if he is thinking about switching offensive philosophies.
As for DB, I agree if he thinks JH is the best candidate, he really doesn't have anything else he can do if that is what JH wants. Since everything is kept so secret and no leaks, I hope he has had time to critique other candidates to find out JH is the best.
Of course this is all speculation that DB has already talked to JH and made up his mind.
Do you honestly think DB hasn't given a response because he's being "indecisive?" Because if that's who you view this, then I have nothing to say because we just disagree on a major facet of this discussion. I think he's waiting intentionally, not because he hasn't made up his mind. If you disagree that he should wait, that's another issue, but since we don't know why he's waiting, it's hard to say you disagree with why he's waiting.
If you think he isn't waiting, but he just can't make up his mind despite having enough information to do so, then you and I are not anywhere near the same page.
HI can't see any reason why waiting is a good idea, which is why I have a negative view toward DBs approach here.
how many times does it need to be said? I've seen it laid out here in this very thread at least ten times already. There are at least two scenarios in which it would be wise to wait.
I am gonna buy you and your friends a beer when I come to SoCal. I enjoy reading your posts.
If the LA is Louisiana, I'll buy you all two.
Harbaugh is the guy we need and we are very lucky to have the connection that could make it happen. Other schools with vacancies can forget about it. The guy is the hottest name out there not because of myth or false analysis by observers. He is the hottest name because of results.
Thank you Nate, it's Los Angeles. You can bring that surfer babe in your avatar with you, if you'd like.
Brandon is thinking long term and will base his decision on long term. He took the job to fix football. It is near and dear to him.
The Rodriguez must stay crowd can likely count on one thing: If he does stay it will be unequivocal and long term, at least publicly. Otherwise, no defenseive coordinator worth having would take the job with a lame duck coach installed.
Literally NOTHING has happened yet other than a couple kids saying "Umm, yeah, I might look elsewhere." Every single prior commit is still committed (except a couple guys who were going to disappear anyway).
David Brandon should be "judged by this decision"? You mean the decision to wait until the season's over to make a personnel decision? A decision in which he might decide to keep the status quo or he might choose to go in a different direction?
Some of you people need to "judge" things so quickly, before things even play out, that it clouds your own perspective and judgment. You demand action and repercussions right this instant. Just let the damn thing happen. This could be the greatest thing to ever happen to Michigan. It could be the worst.
I have no damn clue why so many people are bitching about this on December 16th, like they know the outcome and it's going to be terrible. I know you feel like you're going to die if David Brandon doesn't call you up personally and tell you his decision by 8:00 p.m. this evening, but trust me, you will live until January 2nd or 3rd or 4th to see how this ends.
The world is not ending.
FYI, Wayne Lyons is being recruited by Jim Harbaugh at Stanford. Once the coaching situation is figured out, everything will fall into place.
I don't see anything wrong with DB putting together a press conference re: CC (which no doubt will be national news worthy, ESPN) right now and announcing RR will be retained as coach. He could always research after the bowl game and fire him anyway. Coaches/owners/ADs have done this for years. Nobody would even bat an eye at the fact that the first announcement was a complete show. It would firm up recruting for the time being and IME be a good solution to the problem at hand. I am not saying it is right or ethical or anything, but it has become so commonplace. Hell Saban did just as bad or worse and now he is glorified in a fucking commercial eating a cookie with Herbie and the Gang of Morons. It's all about the wins, unfortunately.
The reason he hasn't yet shows that RR may not be here next year.
I disagree, that's the wrong thing to do. It hurts our credibility as an AD and University and will turn off recruits even more if DB goes back on his word. In the end, what difference will it make to "shore up" recruiting for 2 weeks? That will only make damage control that much harder if RR is not retained. People need to stop worrying about the short-short-term so much. What happens between now and Jan 3/4 is meaningless.
I disagree that the next two weeks are meaningless. It is prime time for recruting now that most seniors are done with the season. I agree with the point that it doesn't really matter because nobody signs until Signing Day, but I would bet that 100% of recruits make up their mind more than 5 minutes before they sign. This is just giving reason to kids to look elsewhere, IME. And as we like to say "if we get them on campus there is a shot." We are giving other places that shot.
Starts a recruiting dead period. So while you are right that in the next two weeks recruits could be deciding and thinking over their options, I don't think you can call this recruiting "prime time" (assuming people follow the rules).
Players can still contact coaches during dead time. Coaches just can't contact players...
Fair enough, but players contacting coaches can only go so far. You made it sound like schools would be dialing up our recruits and getting them on campus.
This is just giving reason to kids to look elsewhere, IME. And as we like to say "if we get them on campus there is a shot." We are giving other places that shot.
And I'm not saying this whole situation isn't hurting, but I don't think its absolutely killing our class.
except that this statement by me "This is just giving reason to kids to look elsewhere, "
and this statement by you "You made it sound like schools would be dialing up our recruits and getting them on campus."
are exactly the opposite of one another.
I disagree that the next two weeks are meaningless. It is prime time for recruting now that most seniors are done with the season.
How terribly inconvenient, then, that most of the next two weeks are a recruiting dead period.
Edit: Beat to the punch. But still I don't think it's fair to call this prime recruiting time if coaches are not even allowed to contact recruits.
Kids can still contact coaches. Coahces just can't contact kids...
That's a great idea. Our athletic director should be a sleazy dickbag like Nick Saban and retract what he said three weeks after he said it!
You know, if you set your standards low enough, you just might reach them.
Like I said in the post I don't agree with it, but it happens so often and the offenders are rarely villified that it would make sense here, IME.
Thanks for the extra helping of snark and overall dick-baggery we are all accustomed to though, thoughtful.
Person A suggests that the athletic director of the University of Michigan should be two-faced and deceive players, fans, and coaches by giving a public display of support for Michigan's coach when he might not really mean it.
Person B suggests that Person A's idea is dumb and sleazy and uses sarcasm to point it out.
And yet Person B is the one who displays dick-baggery, huh? Interesting...
Like I said (now twice) it happens all the time with coaches around the country. They are not villified and if they win they are eventually glorified. And I don't know if you know this, but not many people outside of this board and Michigan fans could even pick DB out of a lineup. It would blow over in a news cycle and the second "real" announcement (if it would even be needed; only if he fired RR) wouldn't even make the ESPN bottom line. It has happened so many times it is predictable now.
And yes you are a snarky asshole and I think you take pride in that for some reason. It is demonstrable and repeatable. Science.
I guess if it happened before, it's okay if it happens again.
When dealing with people like you - who suggest that our AD lies to the public - I'm not sure that "snark" is such a horrible crime.
But hey, if calling me an asshole makes you feel better, then I'll be your huckleberry.
Looks like I'm back to my old practice of auto negging anything you post. Good times. Vintage.
or a complete asshole. One or the other I suppose.
Hey man, make your point. Or don't. But sinking to the level of calling people names makes you look like a, well, don't do it.
Actually coaches are regularly vilified, especially outside their own fanbases, for being duplicitous about jobs.
But yeah, you must be right, nobody thinks or ever has thought of Saban as a sleazy coach.
WHich one of those statements happened as recently as his "hilarious" new commercial? None, it blew over and he is now glorified. Like I fucking said in the first place. Jesus. Reading Comp. 101.
"They are not villified and if they win they are eventually glorified." != "They are eventually not vilified and if they win they are glorified."
But regardless, the implication that nowadays nobody thinks Saban is a slimebag is preposterous. Practically everyone thinks he is except Alabama fans. A successful coach, obviously, but also a massive bag of slime.
and then we have decommits after the bowl game. Plus a bunch of pissed off players.
I've seen this episode before.
RR will have to wait until after the 2011 bowl game to find out whether he has a job or not. If he's retained, he'll get to deal with all the bitching and moaning about how the recruiting class wasn't as good as it could have been. Which is okay, because then he'll have a built-in excuse up his sleeve for why the depth chart still isn't deep enough. Which will piss off his detractors even more -- and then everyone will have to wait until after the 2012 bowl game for DB to decide what happens next.
the most likely reason for the waiting is the fact that his buyout decreases in the new year.
I don't think the buyout comes into play at this point. RR's contract requires 30-day written advanced notice of termination without cause -- which I believe means we have been within the window where Brandon could still save that $1.5 million by making his decision and notifying RR in writing now.
I expect DB is going to do what he said he would do. He is going to take his time, wait until the full season is over (which includes the bowl), and then make a complete assessment based on what he has in front of him. He doesn't strike me as a shoot-from-the-hip kind of guy whatsoever.
This bowl game needs to come soon so we can keep these recruits