Ok state or Oregon could have beat Alabama. Alabama has a terrible offense. I think Oregon D holds them down just like LSU pretty much did. This game was bullshit! I think Michigan had a good year, but I agree Alabama will be tough to beat in the South. I wish or bowl games were at home like the SEC and USC.
Championship Game Boycotters
That's the great thing about college football, you may never know. No one thought we would go 11-2 and we did. Although, I do agree it will be a very difficult game to win, we do have a shot. We all know Hoke will have Team 133 ready. I will be there with bells on and all my Texas buddies will be doubting us. We WILL be ready to go.
Can we not begin talking about how badly Michigan is going to get beat by Alabama next year. It's still a ways away. If all of the NFL-ready Juniors leave from Alabama, who knows what can happen. Lets enjoy spring and fall practice and then start speculating about the game. Next year's Alabama is not going to be the team that played last night.
Can Borges learn how to combat teams that bring pressure. He obviously had no clue this year despite his vast experience. Alabama will bring pressure as MSU and VT did this year. Can Borges come up with something to offset the pressure is the big question?
Trolling seriously? This is a major concern. Look at lack of offense in both games and to say it's not a concern is a joke.
First, we will have to live with the fact that despite our very good offense, elite defenses (I'm thinking in particular of Lil' Bro this season) can and will diminish any offense's productivity. I'm not sure it's fair to expect us to hang 35 on the #2 scoring defense in the country (or whatever they were at the time).
Second, though, you're right. When defenses bring pressure, it takes Denard's arm out of the equation and makes us one-dimensional. Borges has to scheme more blitz-beating plays to keep the opposing defense from stacking the box with eight or nin guys. Yes, the imfamous bubble screen is a good option. But I'm thinking more of the "long handoff" quick slants that were used during the Carr era, as well as the "play that always works", the throw-back screen. I also really like the denard play-action to himself, if that's what you want to call it, where he takes the snap in the shotgun, takes two steps toward the line to get the entire defense to bit on the QB keeper, and then zings out a quick 7-8 yard pass to his receiver.
It'll be interesting to see if Borges adopts a bubble for next year.
I like that Bama won because next year in their first game they will have to overcome the usual over-confidence and potential letdown that comes from winning it all the prior year. It's really beyond dispute that they have more talent than us, but that doesn't always translate to victory. We have a shot but with three new starters on our d-line in their first game, and Bama returning four starters on their o-line, I'm not feeling too sanguine about our chances.
Do you think then winning will have anything to do with next year. Saban was pissed at their only penalty last night in the middle of the fourth q.
Why is TCU ranked 14? They barely beat LA Tech, clearly they are not as good as people thought they were.
How can you say Okie State or Stanford wouldn't have beaten either Bama or LSU? The difference between '06 and now, is that in '06 despite everyone saying Michigan and Ohio State were the best, we split up the former No. 1 and 2 against other teams. This year it was, "well we know their the best so they should play each other". We can talk about how great Bama's D was, but honestly LSU doesn't have a great offense to begin with. How do we know the passing attacks of Stanford or Okie State wouldn't have shredded them?
the only thing that made that game anything but irrelevant is (a) the BCS requirement that the winner gets the BCS & coaches' poll crowns and (b) the writers lacking the guts to stick to their guns and make LSU #1.
i checked in occasionally but didn't watch, and frankly i regret having checked in at all. fuck the SEC and fuck ESPN.
is the fact that I like to watch paint dry. It is very exciting.
Seriously, it is hard for me to get excited watching a 40 yard field goal over and over. I hope we kill Alabama next year and get to see Saban cry.
On TCU, that was your typical disinterested "why are we here, playing La. Tech?" performance. Not an ounce of celebration when they won. It's hardly fair to say they shouldn't be ranked high for playing a close game in that one. In bowl season you have strange results like that.
Co-sign. This happens a lot in bowl season, motivation is a big factor in these games and playing in a "consolation" match when you had higher goals is a hard thing to overcome.
Oh I totally agree. I guess I should have put the /s tag in there. The OP was using the fact that UM and OSU didn't win their bowl games as proof that "they weren't the top 2" so I applied that logic to another team. If TCU really cared I'm guessing they would have won by 3 touchdowns
Wait, so what does this have to do with championship game boycotters?
Also, regarding the talent level: you give every other school in the country what amounts to an extra recruiting class over a 5-year period, and you'll see a smaller gap in the talent level between SEC teams and everyone else.
I came here to sympathize with all the colleagues that skipped watching the championship game due to the hate of both schools. I watched the first quarter hoping that a sinkhole would open up and swallow both coaches but, alas, no such luck. So I went to the DVR and watched Manchester United vs. Manchester City instead. F- the championship game and F- defensive struggles.
but I watched the whole game and thought it was entertaining. I think it's sad that people need tds in order to enjoy a game. Other than the LSU offense (which played scared), both sides played well and there was a LOT of hittin going on out there.
"Regarding those bitter about Michigan not getting another shot in 2006/2007, I drink a lot of Michigan Koolaid, but as it turned out, Michigan and Ohio weren't the top two teams that year."
And this rematch prevented the possibility of any similar revelation happening this year.
This board is so much more reasonable than other schools' boards....but get real. Oversigning or whatever the reason may be, that defensive talent they displayed last night is nothing like any other team out there.
its really not, this issue as much as any other has shown that
Basically, LSU, ranked in the 70s in offense, were 2 of the top 3 offenses Saban saw all year. That is correct, Arkansas came in at 27 (I believe) and then the next best offense they saw was LSU twice. To say their defense is superior is stretching it a little. Actually, your argument about this dedense and next year is just horrible.
Exactly. Had Michigan and OSU replayed in 2006/7, it probably would have been a hell of a game. One of the teams would have won, and we would have said, "see, that proves that they were in fact the two best teams and now X is the clear champion". It would have been equally (no more, no less) absurd than the current situation.
among many other things that people are choosing to ignore is that LSU whipped both the Rose Bowl and Orange Bowl champs.
Yup, they sure did. That doesn't change the fact that if we're talking about a one-game "anything can happen" situation signing up for a rematch is absurd.
I fail to see the relevance - no one is arguing that LSU should not have been in the championship, and no one is arguing that WVU or Oregon should have.
The only relevant question is whether Alabama should have been invited, and the ex post facto argument that Alabama is now 1-1 against LSU is not admissable.
They lose a lot....and I do like that it is the first game of the season.
Bullshit on all three.
Two teams from the SEC West played each other. One of them won. This proves definitively that they were the two greatest teams in the country. QED.
The best team in the SEC is the best team in the country. This is because the best team in the country is necessarily the best team in the SEC. That's just science.
Agree and to take it further we should all probably just bow down before the SEC, like ESPN does, and anoint them champions of football for the next five years.
I probably dislike the SEC more than OSU and MSU though I am originally from out of state. We need to do everything we can to try to beat Bama next year. We do that people will actually say we are back, though we think we never left.
You couldn't really prove anything, even with a full playoff....but are we all watching the same games here? I know there are no direct comparisons, but when I see 270 pound DEs and 240 pound LBs getting to the sidelines with the same speed as the RBs, I realize that they were in another league this year. For the love of God, the LSU team that steamrolled the entire season didn't get the ball past the 50 until the 2nd half.
exactly true against Georgia in the SEC championship. They didn't get a first down nor past the 50 in the first half. The secone half Georgia fell apart and LSU ran away with the game. But LSU's offense is at the very least not consistent and that takes some luster off Bama's defensive performance.
Does it really make no difference to you that LSU avergaged about 40 a game against teams not named Bama?
Did you watch the Fiesta bowl? The discipline with which those two teams executed game plans on both sides of the ball was a thing of beauty. Maybe the talent according to recruiting services wasn't as high, but that game was just as impressive to watch and much more entertaining in my opinion.
I was disappointed in the lack of athleticism in the back 7 of both of those defenses. Both of those offenses are great, but it's a lot easier when both defenses have significant and obvious weaknesses. I'll take the well coached freaks any day.
And I was disappointed by LSU's inability to get past midfield and Bama's inability to make it into the endzone before the game was already over.
Fortunatey for us we have denard with another off season of learning al's system. Anytime dilithium is on the field we will have a good chance
If a championship is to be truly national, you don't let two teams from the same division of the same conference have a rematch. I didn't watch the game, but I would have to think that OK State or Stanford could have stayed in the game with LSU, too.
The only thing this discussion does is prove that there should be a playoff and that every major conference champion should get a chance. Why bother to have a conference championship if it doesn't mean anything?
At this point, all a conference championship does is get a team a good bowl slot.
I don't like the "plus one" argument, but even it would be better than what we have now. I wouldn't mind seeing OK State vs Bama next week. I would definitely tune in for that one.
Sometimes the conference championship hurts too. How many times have you seen the Big-12 Champion go somewhere and the 1 loss team that didn't play in the Championship go to the other BCS slot?
Best team ever like the team was talking? Oops they lost, disregard.
The only good thing about that game:
My wife won $109 for 3rd place, if only LSU could have f*cking scored she would have had almost $200 for 2nd place.
Unfortuntely none of that money will be spent on me, most likely it will go towards shoes....
If my gf gets a little extra money for her bday or something it's "I bought this coat" not "I paid my credit card off."
I boycotted alright, I did it in a peaceful way too. I got so bored by the game that I fell asleep. TAKE THAT BCS!!!!!!
I cleaned the kitchen while my wife watched Antiques Roadshow.
That's how you boycott a BS game.
But as we've seen before LSU still finishes with a better seasont then Alabama one more win and a better strength of schedule. Dumb game, a blowout is just as terrible to watch as a fieldgoalfest
how did LSU finish with a better season? explain how a team that does not hold the trophy have a better season than the team that won the trophy?
That's like sparty logic. We had to play a championship game that only counts if we win. 21-0 says it all.
Right. Based on their resume, LSU is clearly the best team in the country, and Alabama beat them soundly. That makes Alabama the best team in the country, and LSU beat them. So LSU is the best team in the country.
ESSSS EEEEEEEE SEEEEEEE!
LSU beat two BCS bowl champions in the nonconference while Alabama beat...Penn State? LSU was the SEC West and SEC champions (trophy), Alabama is neither. LSU beat Alabama once and Alabama beat LSU once.
The season as a whole was much better for LSU.
I was going to boycott the Championship Game but decided that since it would be the last bout of college football until next season I would watch it. So I turned on the pre-game show and started to hear the SEC slurp fest and turned it off. It's all well and good that the SEC has won the last 6 championships but that's kind of easy to do when the perception is that the SEC is world's better than everyone else anyway. Like it or not, perception still helps quite a bit in getting into the Championship Game in the first place. Now admittedly, the SEC team has to earn that victory there but they have a leg up when they are already pre-ordained to be there in the first place.
I did end up turning the game on for a bit but when I saw that it was basically a snoozefest, I turned it off. I have no dog in this hunt. I could have cared less who won. If LSU would have won...great. If Alabama would have won, what does that prove?
As for the game against Alabama next season...we'll see. Alot can happen between now and then.
Anybody still wishing Michigan would have hired Miles. I guess only those that like boring football.
I don't disagree with anything in the OP. While the game was boring, those two defenses are in an entirely different stratosphere than the rest of college football.
If OK State plays either of those teams, Brandon Weeden spends the majority of the game on his ass.
Maybe. West Virginia and Oregon seemed to put up a lot of yards against LSU. LSU had a very solid and opportunistic defense this year, but they didn't dominate like Alabama's. I think Oklahoma State's offense would have made a decent showing against LSU.
I disagree. Considering Bama moved the ball pretty well the entire game, its hard to think OSU's offense wouldn't have been at least as successful.
You're overlooking the most important factor, though: OK State doesn't have ESS EEE SEE speed.
...or a defense.
Maybe not. We'll never know.
I just want to know the viewer rating for the game. Hope it was down a lot.
but I didn't watch it either. It was more out of boredom than principal. I am a little worried about the prospect of denard facing that Alabama defense but that is mostly because of what I saw with Al against teams with agressive dominant defenses. Still optomistic though. Can't help but to think this team is trending up despite losing some of my favorite all time wolverines in Junior, Martin and RVB.
sorry double post
I watched the game I'm not a big grudge guy but no, they did not get it right.
The precedent set in 06 was that there should be no rematches. 2nd best team or not.
you guys need to go to law school before you use the word precedent
Precedent was set in 2006.
But I have noticed you trolling regarding this game heavily so I will chalk it up to that.
According to this, ratings were down 11%. Which is about the only good thing (anti-BCS statement) that came out of last night's game. I don't know if I trust the number as it isn't sourced, but there it is, FWIW.
Oh, and to answer a question that someone had on a different thread about ESPN3 and its impact on ratings. A friend of mine works for Nielsen, he says there are a few different categories which track internet viewing, to quote him, "The sexiest is called TVandPC." So the down ratings this year are not a result of online viewing as a few here were postulating
I will agree with everybody that this was a boring ass game to watch....as expected. These offenses aren't much to write home about and I don't think LSUs offense this year will be able to hold a candle to Michigan's next year. But given Michigan's need to run to the outside in order to be successful, it's going to be really tough to move the ball.
I don't think you can really say those were the definitively best teams. There are 120 teams, and each team plays 12 of them. With how important match-ups are in football, this system cannot say anything for sure.
Lsu beat the living crap out of WVU and Oregon, two BCS bowl winners. Oregon destroyed Stanford and Alabama took care of LSU by 21 last night. You think oak state that lost to Iowa state would have a chance against Alabama ? Honestly, those teams were by far the best teams in the country.
Who cares whether OkState would've beaten Alabama or not? Alabama shouldn't have had a shot. The question is whether OkState could've beaten LSU, and nobody knows the answer to that. End of story.
amazing you actually believe this, you should watch a tape of last nights game
You should watch a video of the 2006 Michigan - Ohio game. There is no question they were far and away the best two teams in the country...oh wait...nevermind.
Whether or not Alabama was the #2 team at the time, that is a fair argument in saying that if you don't win your conference, you shouldn't get a crack at the national title. I think it goes against the principles behind having a playoff, but I respect that argument given the current system.
Michigan beat Notre Dame who beat Michigan State who beat Michigan. Different teams will match up differently based on varying strengths and weaknesses. To me, that leaves too many variables to say any given team is clearly the best, let alone two teams.
c'mon man, facts and logic? where is the blind emotion?
Until you are ready to shift to an eight game regular season that is meaningless or pay student athletes the bowl system must exist. I just don't see how students are going to play a sixteen game year which is what it would take to have a post season tournament. I don't mind the BCS. I watch as many bowl games as I can. There is still an sense of youth and fun in college football. Add another month and it becomes even more of a business.
how is a regular season is "meaningless" when a playoff follows? this counter point to the bcs vs. playoff debate is lucid and does not hold water. regular season performance is what gets a team into a playoff.
when you refer to a 16 game year you must be refering to only two teams. cause every team plays a 12 game regular season, two teams out of every conference that has a championship game plays 13 games and both of those teams also play in a bowl game which brings the total to 14 games. so you are not able to see how 2 more games can be played? it is quite easy, teams that would make it into a playoff would not be the teams playing in the ESPN Needs More Money Bowl Presented by Depends.
Seeing as you're arguing for an inter-division rematch for the NC, you already think the regular season is meaningless. I don't get your point.
LSU and Jeffereson added a lot to help that D look good.
Alabama's D had nothing to do with coming out of a time out still looking confused, almost delay of game, fumbling the snap and falling down. Watch the replay the annoucers kept saying look at that coverage but if you actually looked there were plays there if JJ could throw over the top or on time on a slant. Or how about screen pass reciever drop the ball ect. ect. There was as much poor execution on offense as there was "great D". I will agree with the talent and I have seen it in other games against other teams but last night was not a good example of Great D IMO.
The BCS got it wrong. The BCS is wrong. The BCS is rotting the sport from the inside. The boycotters are not boycotting this game, Bama v. LSU, they are boycotting the system. They are boycotting the illusion that the BCS exists independent of its own internal devices seeking one end: profit. Bama v. LSU in and of itself is not objectionable. The winner is the winner of that game, but nothing more. The meaning of the national championship has become obsolete, it no longer has intrinsic value. The national championshiop is no longer an honor, a reward. It is a product.
The BCS pitted the unanimous #1 against the team that a significant majority of coaches and media voted #2, please explain how that is wrong other than the fact that you disagree with the vote.
way anybody voted. I am not angry with the outcome. I don't think the wrong teams got voted in. The BCS did not fail, the BCS did what it was supposed to do, but it is just a meaningless endeavor. People who are in charge of voting voted, and the formula spit out LSU v. Alabama. I just don't care about the BCS national champioship game any more than I care about the Outback bowl or the Sugar Bowl. I care most about the bowl that my team is in ( and even then that game means less to me than any conference game my team plays is) and all of the rest of them just kind of blend together. Some games are good, some are bad. Last night was bad, and the winner got a shiny football.
Because we already saw this game played in Tuscaloosa. Playing it again only generates more controversy than there was already. Having Bama face LSU given the disparity in their season strengths and the previous meeting was the perfect setup for controversy. LSU's full body of work this year still looks better than Alabama's, even after losing 21-0. But it's tough to argue that wasn't the best two teams out there last night. Hello controversy.
All the BCS does is try to determine who the best two teams are and pits them against each other. What it doesn't do is create a "settling" game that best answers the question of which team had the best season this year.
It's about creating the drama of a single game, not finding a true champion.
So you're having two different conversations now. One conversation is "who deserves to be in a #1 vs. #2 game after the season that was?" and the other is "Who should be playing each other to determine a national champion of college football?"
And ultimately I have little interest in championing one case or the other because neither team is worth rooting for. Miles and Saban are both great coaches and great recruiters, but they're also the two biggest Gordon Geckos of a sport that we feel has become way too Wall Street.
The whole thing just sucked. The only rooting interest for anyone who likes college football was for some kind of massive scandal that finally ends the SEC's 'permanent majority.' The reason to hope Okie State would get their shot instead of Bama was not because they had a better season, but because it's a more interesting game, and Oklahoma State at least provides a team worth rooting for if you, like most good people, hate the SEC West and dream of the day it is exposed and sundered and shamed back to obscurity. Not that the sell-outs (which OK St is, plus see Oregon last year), or the fascists (see: Ohio State), or the Hollywood elitits of USC or the self-aggrandizing Texans or the jailbird Canes or the academic joke Seminoles and Sooners were much more worth root roothing for in previous years. I don't think I liked Nebraska so much back then either.
So I guess what I'm really saying is I'm a cranky Michigan fan who doesn't really like National Championship games unless Michigan is in them. And it's my sense that despite what the TV guys would prefer, most fans of college football really go in rooting for their team and nobody else -- not the conference, not the storylines of programs hundreds of miles away. The National Championship concept for this sport itself is the flaw is what I'm saying. There's 120 teams -- they play unbalanced schedules of 12 to 14 games and the best team among that 120 will only beat the median team 3/4 times.
So really it's a regional sport and half of what makes it great is the game-day experience, not the outcome of the games. By that I mean I'd take a Blimpy Burger, a few shots of spiked cider at jamiemac's van, a half-time show by MMB, and a game of catch in the Blue Lot over watching any NC game since the BCS started. Add a few rounds at Ashley's to that and you've just beat any college football game ever played that Michigan wasn't playing in.
To draw this back to the topic, that's why it's okay not to watch this game, and to root and argue for whatever creates the most embarrassment for the participants and the system. What we're really rooting for is college football not becoming the NFL, not Okie State's deservance of a shot at the title this year or Bama's case versus LSU's. If you watched that game and it moved you to say "Alabama is the best, end of story!" well you've left out the fact that Alabama never gave anybody an excuse to visit Ann Arbor on a football Saturday this year, and that's the best part of college football.
Let's compare UM vs Ala vs LSU with their classes rivals ranking over the past 10 years:
Say what you will about so called coaching abilities as being discussed here, but look at the rankings of Saban's classes at LSU (1 and 2 in 2003 n 2004) and at Alabama (3 #1's and 1 #5). The guy can flat out recruit, and that might be why he is a much bigger success at the college level than at the pro level.
- Why did the BCS get it right? LSU had 5 first downs all game. They were manhandled. How can you say that OK State wouldn’t have played better? LSU’s Offense was terrible. OK State is an offensive team and beat a good Stanford team (with Luck at QB).
- How are you qualified to judge about the level of athlete?
- Michigan and Ohio losing Bowl games in 2007 means nothing. Alabama and LSU could have lost to OK State or Stanford or …, but they didn’t. Why? Because they played each other and somebody had to win.
The SEC Championship game that was played last night....duh
1 Ok St may have played better than LSU but the question wasn't about LSU being in the game, it was Bama and they clearly belonged. Regardless tears for Ok St are so misplaced, they lost to a crap team and almost lost to another, and they were stone lucky to get by Stanford a team that got whipped by Oregon, who got whipped by LSU. Transitive property is not the best tool, but you have to use what you have.
2 He has eyes. You don't have to be a pro scout to recognize the difference bw Desmond Morgan and Courtney Upshaw. The fact that by most accounts Bama will have at least 4 and as many as 6 defenders drafted in the first 2 rounds of the draft helps too.
3 OSU and Michigan losing in those games means everything, the Michigan nations claims to the contrary are a continuing embarrassment. I would have liked to see us get the rematch too but I can accept when I was wrong. Also LSU proved itself outside the conference against the Rose Bowl and Orange Bowl champs, and Alabama dominated a PSU team on the road that came very very close to playing in the Big 10 Championship game.
It would have been LSU vs another team. You are not thinking clearly let go of Bama.
and the BCS got it right, but Michigan didn't deserve to rematch OSU in '07 because they lost their bowl game. Your argument is invalid. How do you know that Michigan would not have beat OSU by 21 in a rematch? Oh, wait, you don't.
c'mon man, a little intellectual honestly please. of course we don't "know", nobody "knows" anything when it comes to sports. But the reality is that the supposed 2 best teams in the nation got their asses kicked in their bowl games. But regardless whether or not that Michigan team was better than that year's Florida team has exactly nothing to do with whether this year's Bama team was better than this years Ok St team.
This is great. Ratings = money, and money talks.
I wonder how much of that was having the game on cable and not broadcast TV.
You can't reference what happened after the BCS title game selection in 2006the as validation for the choices because that info was not known to the voters at the time.
My point from part 1 of the post was to say that they selected the correct #2 team. There likely has never been such a consensus #1 as LSU going into this game...so they obviously deserved to be there. I would say that by steamrolling this #1 team, Alabama deserved to be the #2 team. Had OK state gone in and gotten beat, we would not have crowned the country's best team, since it was obvious from last night that Alabama is the better team......unless you want to argue that OK State with that pathetic defense could have handled Alabama. If so, so be it.
LSU was #1 not Bama. People are mad about Alabama getting in. Wake the f up! This has nothing to do with Bama. Could OSU, Oregon, or Stanford have beaten LSU last night? The answer is clearly yes. Hence, the other team would have been the champ.
You're ruling out OK State without having ever seen them match up against LSU. Where does your argument go if OK State was chosen and went in and beat LSU like Alabama did? You simply dismiss them because they have a "pathetic" defense, nevermind the fact that they went 12-1 with their only loss to an emotionally charged Iowa State team that played out of their minds.
If precedent was set by making sure Michigan didn't play Ohio again back in 2006, then it should have held this year too. The BCS caught a HUGE break in Alabama winning convincingly rather than 9-6 like the first matchup. I would have loved to see a a 9-6 Alabama win and a split championship. That would have been hilarious.
Ok state, Oregon or Stanford would have beat LSU last night the way they played. Mich would have beat OSU. What were the ratings? (hint I know). The game was bullshit and rating proved the disconnect. You are the minority.
This might be the gosh damned dumbest post I've ever read. I should cut off my bald-headed yogurt slinger and slap you with it.
does that mean what I think it does? If it does, cutting it off seems like an extreme reaction, but maybe you're not as attached to yours as I am to mine.
This is idiotic. No, they did not get it right. All they really did is invalidate the regular season game between Bama and LSU. Bama isn't the champion. Right now they're 1-1 with LSU. Ok State may have lost a game to a weak ISU team, but at least they won their conference. You can't say regular season is crucial and then play a rematch championship game. Dumb.
This is not my argument. If you want to add the claim that there will never be a regular season matchup, then that's fine. Nevertheless, all the BCS tries to do is get the two best teams. My opinion, along with a ton of people that know more about college football than anybody on this board was that Alabama was better than Oklahoma State. Had LSU gone out and stomped Alabama, then there could be some weight to the argument that Oklahoma State belonged in this game.