New Jersey alone is worth the move. Anything else is gravy.
Mike Lantry, 1972
New Jersey alone is worth the move. Anything else is gravy.
If Rutgers is better than "other expansion options" (and I say that with a bit of a smirk), then you need better expansion options. Rutgers is a steaming shitpile in every way but school population, as far as I'm concerned.
P.S. OP, you must be really, really bored.
I wish I could give you -15,071 for this. Rutgers is terrible in every way and adding them to the B1G would represent everything that is bad about money's domination of college athletics.
Rutgers frankly is not a bad expansion candidate. Basically the equivalent of a state school, academically strong, although their athletics are mediocre. They add just enough of the east coast markets to be valuable.
I am just against expansion is all.
shh, it's a lot better to be arrogant asswipes about the quality of other universities while pretending that Purdue is somehow better since we've been playing them longer or that Central Pennsylvania has more to do with Big Ten country than north Jersey since PSU football is better
The huge alum base doesn't matter if they don't show up at sporting events.
My only concern is whether it would help Michigan in recruiting or not. I've followed recruiting for a couple of years now and have seen many top prospects hail from NJ and MD. With these two schools the Big Ten is possibly adding, does that increase Michigan's recruiting clout with some of those kids? Are they more likely to go a bit farther west, knowing that there could be a game or two that their friends/families could easily attend each year?
Oh, and BEAT OHIO.
is if the divisions are reorganized and the protected crossover eliminated in order to face schools in other division more often to avoid the current SEC setup. My ideal scenario if Maryland & Rutgers are added:
Central Division: Michigan, Ohio State, Michigan State, Illinois, Northwestern, Purdue, Indiana
NW/East Divsion: Nebraska, Penn State, Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota, Maryland, Rutgers
In this setup, most traditional major rivalry games are preserved within division (except Little Brown Jug) and creates natural East Coast partners with Penn State in their division. The NW/East division is a little awkward, but I think both sides will be happy not to be cut off from rivals (like Wisconsin is right now) that any other division breakdown would cause. Eliminating the protected crossover would allow 2 rotating interdivisional games per year versus 1 per year like the SEC has right now.
All I really care about in conference expansion is that schedules get more competive for our rivals and main competition. MSU and Ohio both have peaches of cross-over schedules coming up the next two years, while Nebraska also misses Ohio the next two years. We get to miss Wisconsin, but UM really ended on the short end of the stick during the conference re-ailgnment. Whatever happens, I want MSU, Ohio, and Neb to get tougher schedules.
Another positive: If we bring Rutgers in the fold we could probably swing the whole cast of the Jersey Shore coming to a game in the Big House, not just The Situation. Take that Mark Hollis /s
Especially with the implementation of the playoff, the logical direction is the formation of a handful of super-conferences. Those will be split into divisions, essentially expanding the playoff system by way of conference championship games.
So we're likely to see a "Big Ten" of 14-16 schools, which will hopefully be split into logical divisions (think geography) that provide the bulk of a regular season schedule. It is, though sometimes painful to contemplate, a reasonable way to develop the crowning of a national champion by means other than algorithms or voting. A secondary benefit could be that "non conference" scheduling might include more out-of-division conference games than MAC schools which would return some of the old opponents in a different way. And an early season UM/Nebraska game will put more asses in seats than UM/UMass.
Of course we'll lose the cosy nature of the conference composed of Midwestern state universities of mostly high academic caliber, but things like that will always lose to money. Are Rutgers and Maryland the best fits? Maybe not, but first choices might not be available either.
I hear you, and I understand exactly what you are saying.
I will be negged by what I am about to say, but I firmly believe that the big 12 is tenuous at best, and better schools will be who are better fits both geographically and academically will be available. I see both the academic and athletic entente BiG wants to form, however, several schools from the dismantled big 12 would be better when the time comes, both economically and competitively.
Again, I know nothing!
There is one school in the Big 12 currently with a better academic profile than Rutgers
seriously, it's ranked higher than 3 or 4 current B1G schools... let's stop pretending it's Buttfuck Community College and Beauty School because it's not as good as Michigan
Born and raised in Mi, but worked for many years in NJ and northern VA. Rutgers and Maryland have never had respect in their own back yards and bring little to the Big Ten. Just No!
Rutgers, Maryland and GT are all bad for the big ten. They bring nothing sports wise to the table. Rutgers has a decent team once every 5-6 years. Maryland Used to begood at basketball and haven't been for a while now and GT has a couple decent years in football and thats about it. All three would be bad for the big ten. I don't want either of them.
Is easy to say, "no not them." But who would you take instead?
But if we had to add 2. Then VaTech and Virginia. Academics and a built in rivalry.
It's easy to detect your bias Mr. VA.
But, facts are facts.
I don't get why you are so hell bent on expanding as if there is a mandate from the NCAA or do it for the sake of doing it.
Corporate parallelism: Don't reorg and fire all your talent and then wonder why your biggest competitor hired all those people away from you. Well, cuz that would be bad for business and alienate the people you want to keep around and cultivate.
That's why everyone is getting pissed off about this topic. To hell with expanding if it means watering down the great product you already have. BIG had a down year, so what?!? who is to say we don't win the next five MNCs. What's more possible that scenario or Rutgers and the band of merry brothers from the acc doing more for our conference geopolitically.
Can I come to willy wonkas place and sip from the chocolate river too!?!? F me! So sick of it...
I don't think ANYBODY here is hell bent on expansion. Jim Delaney is, apparently. And I'd guess he has reasons for wanting to do this, and I'd guess they make sense to him and the conference presidents and ADs. So none of the above isn't really an option at all.
For womens basketball only???
Agree 100% with your statements. Rutgers doesn't bring any excitement on the field, but off the field is another matter. It's not often you get to add the dominant instate school in a talent rich state with a 9 million population, very high median income. and close to major media markets. Academics are decent to boot.
In the long run, the trickle down effects of this expansion should benefit every team in the B1G.
This is expanding for the sake of expanding. If the B1G can't pick up some quality like what it got in Nebraska, then don't bother expanding. Wait for the next wave of realignment, see what conferences are falling apart, what schools are looking to make a move, and if there is a good target, go after it.
I know Big Ten football isn't at it's finest these days, but seriously, this conference can and should do better than Rutgers and Maryland.
You made the case for them not to be a member of the BIG. The same ole greener pastures argument.
Average to terrible football program, which drives all revenue in this conference and at each and every school athletically. No added value!
They are a big school that offers little in add value. Name one major undergrad, graduate or gov funded research program that above and beyond what we do in the BIG? Zero!!
They blow assholes in every other sport!!! Another no added value!!
New Jersey is a hot bed for recruiting? That's is a weak ass argument. Illinois produces as much talent. Northeast isn't a highly regarded recruiting territory, not to say there is nothing but seriously there is no comparison to even the Midwest. Are people salivating to get into New Jersey for recruiting purposes? What PSU!!?!? They can have it! They have some quality, but not quality plus quantity annually. No added value!
They are a horrible choice and seriously everyone get off it!! If we let them in, we all should be irate at how low this conference will stoop to grab an extra million. That's all it will be. No one, and I mean no one on the east coast gives a rip about Rutgers. I lived on the coast so I would know! Their tv revenue increase would be so minimal, in actuality it would hurt us more to add them.
BIG be smart and stand pat! We have a great conference now! There isn't greener pastures! If expansion is absolutely necessary, I will bet my lot we can find better schools. Mark it down!
You really need to read how the BTN revenu model works. Maryland and New Jersey are more lucrative states than Indiana, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, and Indiana. High school talent wise they are also better than those states.
If the conference only cares about money and TV ratings then we are all doomed. Seriously, business is business, a buck is a buck, but what we love will die a slow death and we all will hate it.
Dude, you are just like me, you know nothing about internal BIG network strategic planning and branding.
But you must be... the guy behind me Saturday exclaiming to the whole section how Denard isn't draftable to nfl scouts. You know all! Lol!
Horrible decision if this comes true. Absolutely horrible.
OK, your 20 exclamation points shows you are against Rutgers. But terrible football? Blows assholes? I think you went a little too extreme the other way. By the way, Ohio State, Penn State, ND, Auburn, UNC and Wisconsin all have commits from NJ so far this year.
I honestly don't care about my exclamation points. May be you should get a clue and quite pointing out how horrible this is for all of us.
And so what about jersey recruits. Should we all start pointing out how many Ohio based recruits are on dI rosters champ!?!?
Yeah good luck with that logic.
Maryland to vote on Big Ten invitation tomorrow, Rutgers could possibly announce on Tuesday.
I absolutely hate this.
Rutgers? Maryland? Are you kidding me? Do. Not. Want.
The article I just read on ESPN talks about Rutgers "offering up the New York market," a meme that gets repeated so tirelessly when Rutgers is mentioend in B1G expansion speculation that it's apparently become fact-y enough for actual media outlets to state it as if it's real.
Guess what? NO ONE, and I mean no one in NYC gives a fuck about Rutgers.
Newsflash: Rutgers isn't even in the same state, it's in Jersey which may as well be on a different planet than NYC.
Saying Rutgers will offer up the NY market is akin to saying Arizona St. would offer up the LA market. Vague geographic proximity does not equal "offering up" a market.
Rutgers (and Maryland) in the B1G is absolutely retarded, unless one thinks that watering down our product and making it less of an actual "conference" is a worthwhile trade-off for the illusion of gaining a market.
That's the reality of what's going on here. Ruining the conference in exchange for smoke and mirrors.
New Jersey and Maryland have a combined 15 million population and fertile recruiting grounds. That alone is worth it for the B1G. New York is just gravy.
My head is going to explode with anymore talk of jersey and Maryland being fertile recruiting grounds.
Not even close! Midwest produces far more talent annually. Just cuz someone says it doesn't make it true. Reminds me of that state farm commercial where the chick says it can't be wrong if is on the Internet. Enter French model...
Seriously, just go to Rivals and check how many 4 stars New Jersey, Maryland, Michigan, Illinois, Ohio and Pennsylvania pumps out yearly.
I know 4 stars isn't exact, but you'll be surprised to see New Jersey has 1 more 4 star than Michigan this year, the same number last year, and 1 more 4 star the year before that.
We really are adding 2 very decent high school football states.
You are lost dude, east coast doesn't give a crap about these schools. To hell with star ratings on a couple recruits.
They don't care. I lived in metro dc, they don't care how many times must it be said!
If this happens I would email Brandon day and night voicing displeasure. I am tired of hearing brand image and then we go and grab two or three no name schools that do nothing for us as a conference. I don't know what you are smoking or drinking but pease tell so we can all live in your world.
You obviously have no idea how the Big Ten Network generates revenue, nor are you willing to listen.
Email Brandon email Delaney all you want and they won't care because they've looked at this with a fine tooth comb and concluded that in the long run this expansion will benefit every school in the B1G
Just know that all the hundreds of millions dollars of renovation going around in the B1G is directly due to the same motivation that is driving this expansion.
No, sorry not appease your need to be right, but you are convinced it is good out of some machevalian don't pick on the little guy complex, rather than look at what's right in front of all of our faces: horribly mediocre members who will marginally increase revenue and our national or world wide brand.
Will no name recruit from jersey that you desperately want chose a big ten team because it will come to bischaotway New Jersey twice in a decade to play Rutgers on the big ten network?
Seriously, that's what you pinning your hopes on to benefit the conference and Michigan!?!?
You know what will generate some revenue champ? And I am calling out my alma mater as well, win some damn games and especially in the bcs or playoffs. You know what will get those big time recruits you covet from jersey, win some damn big games!
A few years down the line, when the entire B1G is winning the college football arms race, and winning games because of this, I won't make fun of you too much.
Fuck New York.
What is redeeming about that city/state? They ship their shit to A2 to be bitchy sorostitutes and douchebag frat boyz.
Jersey shore douches are New Yorkers.
I went to B school with a bunch of kids who did their undergrad at Rutgers and Columbia. Assholes. Every single one of them.
Rutgers fan here. Rolling my eyes at the hate here and omg so much flat out wrong information, lots of ignorance.
First of all NJ is part of the NYC Market...thats 8 million people so when NYC market is brought up yes it includes NJ and thats alot of people. You dont necessarily have to have the 5 boroughs. RU has steadily increased its attention on NYC evening news. Their game Saturday was the lead on all the NYC stations. To say no one cares is wrong. Ratings wise, RU has brought the highest ratings for any ESPN game in NYC and I believe have about 7 or 8 of the top 10 ESPN broadcasts.
As far as on field performance, RU did not fully invest in the program until around 2000. We are a young program but have grown alot in the last 12 years. This year will be our 7th trip to a bowl game in 8 years. We have won 5 of those 6 bowls. We are ranked 18th in the BCS poll and are on the verge of winning our first BE title and a getting a BCS bowl bid probably to the Orange. Our APR is in the top 10. The school has a squeaky clean image until two current Big 10 schools. We bring in top notch academics and are a large state school fitting very well with the mission of the Big 10.
Attendance this year is avg about 47-48K which is our highest ever in a 52K seat stadium we expanded 5 years back. The current BE slate does not really excite the area but with Big 10 schools coming in sellout are a virtual lock.
I see other schools like Virginia and Syracuse brought up..huh? What do they bring you. They are not good in football and bring no market. Syracuse cares only about basketball and has no market and no football fans
So yeah you guys are skeptical. Our program is hardly as bad as you make it out to be. Given the chance RU can be very successful and has a very high ceiling right now
Rutgers is #68 in the US News rankings. That's Moo U. territory. Hardly "top notch" as you say.
46 Penn State
56 Ohio State
**57.583 conference average
**57.615 conference average plus Maryland
**58.357 conference average plus Maryland and Rutgers
**58.385 conference average plus Rutgers
72 Michigan State
I can't condone taking a shot at Rutgers' academics, using USNWR rankings, without taking a shot at the conference overall.
Let's see, Half of the B1G is in the top 50ish where the top 25 are mostly private schools.
In the context of my post, it was right on. I compared Rutgers to Moo U. For some reason, you decided to get on your high horse and change the comparison.
No one in NY cares about Rutgers, but as an alum in NYC I wouldn't mind turning games @Rutgers into de facto home games like @ Northwestern can be for the Chicago area fans.
I see a few of us were considering this "advantage" around the same time I was logging in & typing up my comment.
I don't think that Rutgers is a fantastic add for the B1G but I am thrilled that, living in Connecticut, I'll be just a couple hours drive away from being able to see Michigan play.
...Totally selfish plan, let's get Uconn to join up
There are a lot of alums living on the east coast who don't get to see their teams play unless they go back for homecoming or some other games. My daughter in DC has traveled to Happy Valley & C-bus for games. Not everyone who graduates from Michigan lives in Michigan (or within driving distance for a game) after graduation.
Do you think Bo gave a rip about selfish alums on the eat coast? No! Moe, RR, Hoke? No!
Seriously, this isn't a Michigan issue, it's a BIG issue. We are a member of a conference, and I can't imagine anyone being ok with this beside penn state and shameless money grabbing from people who are retarded in the wrong position.
You are wildly assuming alumni in NYC or suburbs would drive two-three hours to a half empty stadium in New Jersey. And you forget what 50k actually looks like when you sit in a 113k stadium every other Saturday. That's fing small man!
No offense and this is ridiculous but both Maryland and Rutgers are red and white primary colors. Seriously, how many teams in the big need the same colors? Just saying