the just released schedules were a flat-out statement that the B10 doesn't believe SOS will matter in playoff selection
Carr allegedly advised 2008 commit to flip to Iowa
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:08 PM | 
Now this I can't agree with....
Now this I can't agree with....
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:03 PM |
This is one way to look at it....
This is one way to look at it....
...but not the only way. First, let me say:I agree with you that it is a "non-factor and no one should be upset by it at all.
However, here is another equally reasonable interpretation:
1. Carr offerred Weinke as a QB. He thought he was good enough to play QB for Michigan. Carr sent the kid to play for another Big Ten team and potentially set Michigan up to face a kid Carr thought would be a pretty good QB.
2. Carr didn't have to lie. He could have just not responded. Wienke had other people to listen to and Carr could have just said "firgure it out for yourself" or "I don't feel comfortable giving you advice about where to go now that I am no longer coach."
I agree with you that it is a "non-factor and no one should be upset by it. I just think it is mroe reasonable to acknowledge Carr didn't handle it well even though he was a good coach and good guy. In the end, no harm , no foul....move along.
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:38 PM |
My 2 cents
My 2 cents
I can't think of many reasons that I would advise any student to go to Iowa instead of Michigan, no matter who coaches the football teams.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:15 PM |
Degree wise that's true, but
Degree wise that's true, but
Degree wise that's true, but if playing time was a serious factor in his recruitment, it was obviously the right move, regardless of how he developed since then.
August 22nd, 2012 at 6:21 PM |
PT
PT
Actually, it seems to me that he had as much reason to hope for PT as anyone, especially if it was already known that Mallett was transferring. Not in a pro-style offense maybe, but playing time nonetheless. It doesn't seem like the custom of a man who was proud of being an educator first to tell a kid that his chance of playing was not good- that he should give up and go elsewhere. (And did he not know about Shaun King?) For instance, what would have been his advice to a discouraged young Tom Brady when he was far down the depth chart? I suggest that maybe Coach Carr was influenced by mixed emotions, understandably so, and may have given him some guidance that he would not have appreciated as much had Gary Moeller given it to Scott Dreisbach. Do unto others, etc.
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:41 PM |
Carr should have convinced
Carr should have convinced
Carr should have convinced Coach Rodriguez to switch schools
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:46 PM |
Bad Era
Bad Era
On so many levels.... Let's just let this be for the history books
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:48 PM |
That is old news.
That is old news.
He was honest with recruits and they wouldn't have played with Rich Rod. It also freed up scholarship for the offensive genius (genius outside top 25 opponents, which is all WVU played). What is the problem with bring honest Urban? Rich Rod drove our program into the ground. Three and out was Bacon kissing RichRod's ass for letting him follow him around. I was a huge Rich Rod fan, but I realized I was wrong, and some haven't. Koombayah singing RichRod sucked!
[Caved troll is caved. Sorry, Mobile app users.]
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:51 PM |
Interesting that 69 people, to now, don't give
Interesting that 69 people, to now, don't give
a crap about this. I number myself among them.
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:54 PM |
Still don't care. Live in
Still don't care. Live in
Still don't care. Live in the now.
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:56 PM |
QB is now a punter.
QB is now a punter.
Wow that did work out amazing! RichRod fans #weberetarded
[Caved troll is caved. Sorry, Mobile app users.]
August 22nd, 2012 at 1:59 PM |
If Carr really did this, he
If Carr really did this, he
If Carr really did this, he was doing both Weinke AND Rodriguez a favor. Rodriguez would NEVER have recruited Weinke.
August 22nd, 2012 at 11:09 PM |
Hoke would've never recruit Denard as a QB.
Hoke would've never recruit Denard as a QB.
would you have the same opinion if RR advised Denard to transfer.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:07 PM |
Carr was no Bo!
Carr was no Bo!
Carr was no Bo When it came to "The Team!" I'm just glad he's retired and we have Hoke. Under Hoke "The Team" mentality is BACK.
Coach Hoke says "Hi"!
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:10 PM |
(No subject)
(No subject)
-- Hot ice!
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:13 PM |
I love how anyone who isn't
I love how anyone who isn't
I love how anyone who isn't praising Carr is being negged for trolling or flaming. Why have an open forum if you just want everyone to agree with you?
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:33 PM |
You're being negged because
You're being negged because
You're being negged because you bring no actual information or cogent points to the debate. As evidenced by your Tressel/Carr comments that first got people negging you. At this point you're either being delibrately dense or trolling. Why have a voting function on this open forum if we can't use it?
If you'll note, justingoblue and myself exchanged comments on how Carr should have handled it. We're both at 5 score for those comments right now since we were civil and I think both of us had a fair point (I even upvoted him). There is no blind personality cult voting as a bloc, but the board is intolerant of those who don't back their arguments up with logic or links. It's even less tolerant of voting related gripes.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:35 PM |
So I'm supposed to believe
So I'm supposed to believe
So I'm supposed to believe that because two long time posters got upvoted, that the system works? Now who's being dense? Certain posters on here could reply with, "my hamsters name is Charlie." and it would get upvoted.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:37 PM |
my hamsters name is Charlie
my hamsters name is Charlie
my hamsters name is Charlie
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:39 PM |
I rest my case.
I rest my case.
I rest my case.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:44 PM |
Shoe fly.
Shoe fly.
Shoe fly.
Blank.....Blank......You're not looking at the big picture here.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:47 PM |
Well, that proves
Well, that proves
It wasn't the punctuation that was getting him negged.
"I love him, he's a great coach, he's a great mentor, he's a great friend. He's every single thing you want a college coach to be, and he does it flawlessly." -David Molk
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:50 PM |
My apologies I'm replying
My apologies I'm replying
My apologies I'm replying from my iPod at work.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:55 PM |
Hey, I was saying that WASN'T your problem.
Hey, I was saying that WASN'T your problem.
So it must be something else.
Though it does seem like you latch onto some topic every two weeks or so and get bombed for it. Might want to work on your delivery.
"I love him, he's a great coach, he's a great mentor, he's a great friend. He's every single thing you want a college coach to be, and he does it flawlessly." -David Molk
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:14 PM |
I usually only post on things
I usually only post on things
I usually only post on things I feel strongly on, which would probably explain the lack of tact.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:52 PM |
I was going to fix it, but
I was going to fix it, but
I was going to fix it, but had to run and put Charlie back in his hutch.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:53 PM |
Should be...
Should be...
..."My hampster's name is Charlie." With correct spelling, you'd have gotten to 5 more quickly.
LSA '89 - MBB Natl Champions, Big 10/Rose Bowl Champions | @MGoShoe
August 22nd, 2012 at 6:54 PM |
very well done,
very well done,
hopefully it was posted as fast as I read it.
Also, good to know even more about your family!
"He stood there like the house by the side of the road, and watched that one go by"
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:58 PM |
He speaketh and Creation!
He speaketh and Creation!
He speaketh and Creation!
Abort, Retry, Fail?
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:38 PM |
Also please explain how the
Also please explain how the
Also please explain how the majority of Michigan fans defending Carr saying he did no wrong, is not comparable to the OSU fan base saying Trasel did no wrong? Wether or not you believe one was right and one was wrong the quickness in which the fan base defends their old coach is comparable.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:46 PM |
Tressel v. Carr.
Tressel v. Carr.
Tressel: Lied (in breach of his employment contract and NCAA rules) to keep current players elegible. Tressel admitted lying, was fired by his employer and censured by the NCAA for his actions.
Carr: At absolute worst, advised an ill-fitting committ to look elsewhere for playing time without permission of the current head coach (who would have, under pretty much any circumstances, never extended an offer in the first place and was honoring a past offer). For this he was...later thanked by the recruit in question and nothing has been said by former Michigan coaches.
Go Blue!
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:49 PM |
Reading comprehension must
Reading comprehension must
Reading comprehension must not be your strong suit. I didn't compare Carr to Tressel, I compared how the two fan bases defend them to no end.
Try to keep up.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:55 PM |
Huh?
Huh?
Since when is perception not supposed to be based on actions? Let me take this to an extreme example: let's say Tressel murders a puppy. If the Ohio fanbase still claim he's a great guy, they're delusional, because great guys don't murder puppies. On the other hand, let's say a little kid really wants a puppy, but the puppy in question is a German Shepherd that needs a lot of room to exercise, and the kids parents live in a small apartment. Lloyd Carr tells the animal shelter, "let's find a different home for this particular puppy". The kid might be sad until he finds another, different, puppy, but the puppy is happier with another family on a farm.
His actions here are defensible, even when taken in the worst possible context; Tressel's are not.
Also, I think this is my first ever MGoAnalogy using puppies.
Go Blue!
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:58 PM |
That's because all MGoAnalogies
That's because all MGoAnalogies
involve cats.
"I love him, he's a great coach, he's a great mentor, he's a great friend. He's every single thing you want a college coach to be, and he does it flawlessly." -David Molk
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:16 PM |
Using your analogy, let's say
Using your analogy, let's say
Using your analogy, let's say Tressel claims he killed said puppy because he felt one of his players was in danger. Of course his fan base would believe him, just the same as Carrs fan base believes him.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:30 PM |
What you're missing here is
What you're missing here is
What you're missing here is the degree of seriousness between the two. Going back to what actually happened, Tressel repeatedly lied in breach of contract. The worst thing Carr is alleged to have done on this thread is steer a recruit away from Michigan without the backing of the head coach at Michigan. One of those things can leave you as a man worth looking up to, and one doesn't.
If we all turn on the news tomorrow, and they're reporting that Carr had lied to keep Henne, Long and Manningham elegible for the 2006 Ohio game, he would be ripped into shreds on here, assuming the information was credible. There has been plenty of Carr criticism on MGoBlog, from Brian on down, but this isn't something to get hung up on, especially compared to Tatgate.
Go Blue!
August 22nd, 2012 at 4:19 PM |
I am in no capacity comparing
I am in no capacity comparing
I am in no capacity comparing the severity of what Tressel did to what Carr did. However, According to Bacon, Carr did much more than (allegedly) steer a single recruit to Iowa; he offered to sign transfer papers for his players before RR ever got to campus. I understand the respect and admiration for Carr, but I feel like Michigan fans overlook that fact.
You'll be better and you'll be smarter and more grown-up and a better daughter. . .
August 22nd, 2012 at 5:09 PM |
If you want to include that as well...
If you want to include that as well...
that's fine. I still think Carr deserves the respect he gets, especially when taking a look at guys like Tressel, Paterno, Kelly, Petrino, ect. who all had scandals related to integrity issues. I might think Lloyd went about things the wrong way, but I think he's always been honest and tried to do things the way he felt was best.
Go Blue!
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:38 PM |
Ok. Let's assume this is
Ok. Let's assume this is
Ok. Let's assume this is fact--that Carr offerred to sign transfer papers before RR ever got to campus. Bacon reports this based on what players told him. But guess what's missing? The context. Those using this as evidence of Carr's treachery seem to assume that this offer was made with suggestions that they should transfer and not stick around to see what RR is all about. But what if the offer was prompted by players grumbling about a new coach and Carr told them, "stick around, talk to the new coach before you make a decision, but if any of you are such pu$$ies you can't man up and talk to the new coach before making a decision, come by my office, and I'll gladly sign.
Same offer, two completely different motives. Since Carr didn't sign any of the transfer offers, it really seems doubful he was actively working to push players away before RR set foot on campus.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:56 PM |
Yeah but Carr had integrity
Yeah but Carr had integrity
Yeah but Carr had integrity and didn't break any NCAA rules, therefore defending him isn't blindly illogical. It has nothing to do with reading comprehension, rather it has everything to do with whether the person's character is worth defending without serious bias.
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:22 PM |
Right or wrong, both coaches
Right or wrong, both coaches
Right or wrong, both coaches claimed and believed they had their players best interests in mind. You just see it differently because you have Maize and Blue glasses on.
I'll use a real life example. I have NEVER read a single nice thing about Gene Smith here, just lots of terrible things. That said I had the pleasure of meeting him and his wife last year at the Big Ten Championship. Gene was one of the nicest guys I have wet met, even though my belter and I were wearing all Michigan gear. He invited us to come to Columbus this year to watch the game with him and his wife.
You perceive him to be a terrible man because he represents OSU, I know this to be false.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:39 PM |
Your Gene Smith analogy has
Your Gene Smith analogy has
Your Gene Smith analogy has nothing to do with this conversation, he gets a bad rep for being poor at his job, not for being perceived as a bad person...
The Tressel and Carr comparisons are apples to oranges in every way. Tressel might have had the interests of his players in mind, but he also had winning a championship on his mind (having said involved players gave him the best chance to win.) Carr thought that a player might have been a square peg in a round hole once RR was hired so he advised him to maybe look elsewhere.
I honestly don't think you can be this dense, sure there are some here who praise Carr, but there are also plenty who dislike Carr for the way the RR years went down. You are getting negged because you don't seem to grasp the discussion and continue to bring it back to OSU's fanbase vs UM's fanbase when it comes to defending recent coaches.
Blank.....Blank......You're not looking at the big picture here.
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:43 PM |
I will just smile and nod at
I will just smile and nod at
I will just smile and nod at this point.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 5:18 PM |
You sound like that ignoramus
You sound like that ignoramus
You sound like that ignoramus who is on the afternoon show on WTKA on Thursday, Dan from Pinckney.
Get over it already. Get off this board and stop spreading your idiocy if you can't face the fact your lovechild rr was a failure of a coach here.
Seriously. Why are people still giving a shit about him?
It's two weeks away from the season with a REAL coaching staff and a team fresh off a BCS win, and people like you are still whining like it's 2010.
When the ADept sells special jerseys and gear, you'll see my picture next to the targeted customer crowd. A sheep.....but a Blue one.....
August 22nd, 2012 at 7:24 PM |
You make it sound like a
You make it sound like a
You make it sound like a bunch of fans on an internet forum may somehow cause bad things to happen this season if they discuss the past.
Feel free to keep your head buried in the sand if you cant face the fact that Carr did damage to the program. I never said RR didn't fail. It is extremely possible that had Carr supported him, he still would have failed. But only an "ignoramous" would insist that Carr advising kids to choose other schools and signing off on transfers would help Michigan win football games.
@2GuysFromWI
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:17 PM |
I don't want to live here
I don't want to live here
I don't want to live here anymore.
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:24 PM |
This is relevant...
This is relevant...
Because during the RR era everybody was thinking "Man, if only we had John Wienke as our qb!"
Special Teams means special times!
August 22nd, 2012 at 4:32 PM |
No way!
No way!
RichRod ass kiss story.
[Caved troll is caved. Sorry, Mobile app users.]
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:39 PM |
Thread jack!
Thread jack!
Anyone know if the practice tonight at Ford field will be open to the public?
If an OSU fan divorces his wife are they still brother and sister?
August 22nd, 2012 at 2:44 PM |
Wienke and Carr-
Wienke and Carr-
both knew we had Threat and Sheridan already. There was no way he could have ran the spread option attack better than those two. Case closed!
O-Fo-Sho
....Carr is not the kid's father and he should have deflected that question to someone else. There is a big difference between what Carr did:
1. "You should probably go to Iowa"
and
2. "As much as I would like, I don't feel comfortable giving you advice on that. You should talk with your coach/dad."
or even...
3. "Listen to RichRod."
Carr screwed up. He is human. Stop going to such effort to defend his clear errors. It makes you seem unreasonable and beholden to him or something.