bdsisme

November 11th, 2010 at 2:05 PM ^

Note these are MBA rankings (not always equal to undergrad rankings).  If you're investigating MBA programs, it's also important to keep in mind the schools' rankings in terms of your concentration (Finance, Strategy, Operations, etc.) -- those are ranked as well, and they can vary a lot by concentration (Operations was once #1 at Ross, while Finance was #10 at the same time).

Joined: 09/19/2010

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WolverineinSB

November 11th, 2010 at 4:03 PM ^

Most people think that rating is a joke. People who go to ND cant understand that. Im from South Bend so Im not just trying to be mean. Its a good school but not even a top 20 school according to a lot of people who have gone to ND i have talked to. Most people think a ND grad may have been in the selection process to cause that.

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steve sharik

November 11th, 2010 at 4:55 PM ^

...that still uses concentrations is Wisconsin, IIRC.  All the top MBA programs don't have them anymore, everyone just gets an MBA and can structure their electives 2nd year as they see fit.  So you can be as concentrated as you like with those.  If you're going to do it that way, yes, check the concentration rankings.  If not, you don't have to.

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Lutha

November 11th, 2010 at 10:37 PM ^

It's a relatively young program (est. 1976) that's only recently zoomed up the rankings due to recruiting students with high GMAT scores.  Yale is a clear outlier if you chart b-school ranking / average GMAT among the top schools.

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jblaze

November 11th, 2010 at 2:07 PM ^

caught this priceless quote about #24 ND (down from #20 in '08)

"The Mendoza College of Business is one of the premier business schools in the nation with an awesome alumni base and the ability to place graduates all over the country. Most business schools besides the top few are regional schools, whereas the Notre Dame name carries across the country like no other school's. No matter where you are from, if you tell people you are going to Notre Dame they are impressed. The same goes for employers."

Even their B-School quote screems arrogance. Wow.

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BlueCE

November 11th, 2010 at 2:16 PM ^

It is nice, but it is just another ranking and like all most things dont make sense.  I know very few people that would go to Chicago over HBS/Wharton/Stanford.  And no way MSU is a top 20 program.


Still, always good to get some positive publicity, and I don't think anyone would say that Ross is not a top 10 program.


Same thing with undergrad rankings.  Coming from the buss side I've never heard of someone going to Notre Dame over Wharton (or Ross).  I forgot which is the ranking that has Instituto Empresa in Spain as the top MBA program in the world.

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jrt336

November 11th, 2010 at 3:06 PM ^

I've talked with my uncle (who is getting an MBA at Broad right now) and it is a good school, but top 20?

Here are US News' top 20-Harvard, Stanford, MIT, NW, Chicago, Penn, Dartmouth, Cal, Columbia, NY, Yale, UM, UVA, Duke, UCLA, Carnegie Mellon, UT, Cornell, WUSTL, and USC. That's a good top 20.

MSU has a great supply chain MBA though.

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GoBlogSparty

November 11th, 2010 at 3:15 PM ^

yeah, they are simply average in the traditional MBA areas (finance, marketing, etc). They are exceptional in a few areas that probably boost their ratings (Supply Chain Management, Accounting & Info Systems, etc). I believe their undergrad SCM degree is 2nd currently to MIT. I have some friends who graduated with that degree and are doing pretty well for themselves.

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BlueCE

November 11th, 2010 at 5:46 PM ^

Exactly... I have friends that graduated from Broad.  It is not a bad school.  But I don't think it is top 20 just because I think there are at least 20 better schools overall (I agree, by degree it is all different rankings).  No insult intended, it was just that in my opinion (which may be biased given my industry) I think there are at least 20 MBA schools that should be ranked ahead of MSU.

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VectorVictor05

November 11th, 2010 at 2:56 PM ^

Booth has carved out a serious niche in the valuation, hedge fund, private equity crowd due to their well publicized alumni in that arena....not to mention their reputation in macroecon.  School's reputations are tied to their specialties.  Someone said it above, but it depends entirely upon what specialty / career path you are interested in which ranking you should pay attention to.

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BlueCE

November 11th, 2010 at 5:49 PM ^

Yeah, they are good, though I would say Wharton/HBS still place a few more people in those industries.  For Econ Booth is #1, nothing is even close IMO. If I wanted to go to a macro hedge fund I would go to Booth before any other school.


And yes, rankings depend on specialty. 

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HermosaBlue

November 11th, 2010 at 4:35 PM ^

Fundamentally disagree.

USNWR is all input metrics - pre-MBA GPA, yield, acceptance rate, etc.

BW, with an emphasis on output metrics, is basically a customer satisfaction survey on 2 levels:

1. How grads feel about the value they received; and

2. More importantly, how employers feel about the people they hired from that school.

2 is really the key for most of us, because we go to business school not only to learn, but to get a better job.  Schools that produce high quality, well-reviewed graduates attract more prospective employers and create more opportunities for students who attend those schools.

Do you really care that (for example) Stanford admits lots of kids with high undergrad GPAs?  Is that how you measure a school?  

Personally, I think it's much more important to know that Stanford MBAs are highly regarded and sought after by employers in the industry in which I want to work after grad school.  

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jrt336

November 11th, 2010 at 5:22 PM ^

I just don't like BW. SMU at 12? 12? Are they serious? That's #1 in the state of Texas by BW. I'd say SMU is more around 4th-after UT, Rice, and A&M. 50% is from how satisfied students are. Students going to good but not great (MSU) bschools are not going to be looking for the same things as students at Penn or Harvard. People at Dartmouth, UCLA, NYU, UT, and Cornell (all lower than SMU) are going to have better job prospects on average.

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ross03

November 11th, 2010 at 6:05 PM ^

The main problem I've seen with BW is that it's easiliy manipulated by the students.  I can't remember how long ago but there was even a "scandal" where some schools were sending emails to everyone telling them how important it is to give high grades.

If you look at Ross one of the things pulling it down versus others is Teaching.  That's entirely ex-student rated.   That may or may not be valid.  There is a benefit to helping your school look better so the incentive is there to grade it A+.  My experience at Ross was that students didn't pay as much attention to rankings as some of the people (smaller sample size so take it with a grain of salt) that I met from other schools while doing an exchange and during an internship.  As such Ross students might be more willing to rate the teaching the way they saw it versus what would give them a better ranking.  Therefore that component could skew the results regardless of how good the actual teaching is.

That said if someone picks #1 vs. #7 strictly on the rankings without considering specialties, fit, location, etc. then they aren't the type I'd want to pick Ross anyway.  

IMO the rankings should be looked at over a few years - consistently excellent schools are always at/near the top and with respect to trends.  For example Georgetown was consistently rising over the past few years as its reputation got better and better, while University of Washinton's were dropping pretty consistently under (according to an alum I know) a poor Dean.

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WindyCityBlue

November 11th, 2010 at 2:53 PM ^

I don't know why they fell to #7.  BW gives there rankings every 2 years.

I love the absolute meltdown on the BW forums about the rankings.  99% of the board has not received an MBA, yet they seem to know more about rankings than BW, US News, etc

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brose

November 11th, 2010 at 2:56 PM ^

I got my MBA from UNC (#16 on these rankings) and it was awesome.  They like umich undergrads (have had "good success" with them in the past).

Great weather, great program, and great looking women (I was married and couldn't partake, but still...wow)

So any of you all considering MBA programs look down here in the dirty south.

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wolverhorn

November 11th, 2010 at 3:46 PM ^

+1.  I'm in my first year at McCombs at UT-Austin and it's pretty much everything like you said above.  Having never lived outside the midwest, I'm enjoying the change of scenery.

Rankings are really only good for you to narrow down your school choices.  After that, it's a lot about fit.  I know people here who turned down higher ranked schools (some much higher ranked) to come here because they felt more comfortable here.  

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wolverhorn

November 11th, 2010 at 4:12 PM ^

Yeah I would have gone to Ross for my MBA but I got my BBA there, so I wanted a different experience.  Austin's a great place to go to school.

If you ever have any questions about McCombs post a comment or something on my blog (which I haven't updated in a while): wolverhorn.blogspot.com.  (I'm trying to avoid putting my email in a public place but if mods have a problem with the link feel free to remove it.  Wish we had private messaging on this site!)

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ross03

November 11th, 2010 at 4:35 PM ^

At least when I was there Ross pulled a lot of military - I had 3-4 just in my section.  I think it's because Ross tends to put a high value on leadership and most guys coming out have led significant numbers of people, managed huge budgets, etc.   I'd definitely highlight that in the interview.

I also think Ross likes the generalist more than some schools.  It's good in all areas and seems to seek well rounded people more than it values maybe the ultimate quant jock for example - not to say they don't get some, but compared to a Chicago or MIT I think it's much less the norm.  Military often fits well there since they have great "real world" experience, but little "business' experience.  Other schools may value that pure business experience more which would make it harder for someone coming out of the military (pure speculation on this one though).

 

Good luck.

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