Can someone eventually give brief recap? I'd like to know what our fearless leader had to say.
Brian about to appear on WTKA
It should also be posted on the wtka website shortly after its completed.
Get Moose and Squirrel!
I'm legitimately worried about Brian here - he may just sit in the chair and rock side-to-side when Brady Hoke is brought up and they'll have to throw to a commercial.
I know I'm not Brian but last night I layed in the fetal position sucking my thumb everytime I heard the name Brady Hoke...
There goes your workday....
Since when do we throw to a commercial? Is this because Tacopants used up his eligibility?
BHGP has a piece on the CC situation here. Not saying anyone will like it but it brings in a different perspective.
Thanks for this - I don't agree, necessarily, but in the comments someone finally said what I've been thinking - Brian Kelley would have been a good hire...
Why? Brian Kelly would have been almost identical to RR. Unless he was more flexible in adjusting his offense to the current players when he came in, and then maybe.
I actually agree with DB (can't believe I just said that) that Michigan needs a defensiveminded coach who has a deep understanding of Michigan and the Big Ten.
Wouldn't have been anything like rich. First of the fanbase would have backed off about his ties to Michigan because he coached two schools successfully here. Also he could have adapted his sysystem better than rich could have. Less people would have left etc etc.
It's about the person. Listen to Sam Webb who said it like it is RR had no chance here as he wasn't accepted by the powers that be (Big money donors, down in front crowd) because he wasn't like them. Kelly would have the same problem not to mention an issue with inner city recruiting after his comments at Central.
of a homer on crack. Iowa is not a better job and there is no way they are going to have better facilities in 2-3 years.
Sometimes it takes an outsider's view to see things clearly. But I agree. This article is mostly an Iowa fan's wishful thinking. True, they have been better than us the last 3 years. And true it has been unexpectedly difficult to lure a big name coach to Michigan. But they are still Iowa.
They were supposed to contend with a senior laden team but instead imploded and finished 7-5, then a bunch of scandals. While they did win their bowl, 8-5 is pretty poor for a team that started ranked #9 in the polls.
But they do have Michigan pinned pretty well. Dissatisfied with the success of Carr (although he didn't get run out), dissatisfied that Rod wasn't Carr, and a bit full of ourselves because of our history and pageantry. Iowa may not be a better job, but the Michigan job isn't as desirable as I'd hope it would be. The scariest thought I had when reading the front page article yesterday of "Non-Hoke Options" was - "Are any of those guys going to want to come here?" For every one, there's a strong possibility Brandon calls and they say "no thanks" and hang up.
Biggest problem I had with the article was the assertion that we ran Lloyd out. Lloyd left on his own terms.
And, truthfully, I wasn't all that sad to see him go. The diarist the other day said it best when he described Lloyd as a good coach and a good man -- but not a great coach.
I was never a big Lloyd fan (admittedly had to eat some major crow in 1997) because I hate Lloyd Ball. I thought it cost us far more games than it won us (Brian once did an analysis that supported that feeling), allowed for the possibility of an Appy State, and guaranteed that, other than a miracle like 1997 (Lloyd Ball would have cost us a few games but for the fact that we had a Football God on the roster), Lloyd's ceiling was always going to be 2 losses, with a mean of 4 losses. It frustrated me to no end that we seemed to have the ability to open it whenever we wanted to -- we had a great bowl record against the SEC -- but instead chose to curl into the fetal position against the Pac 10 and even the preseason MAC cakes (we can't let ND know we can do more than run up the middle, run up the middle, run up the middle...).
I was really excited about RR because I thought his aggressiveness would put the ceiling at 0 losses but understood that the tradeoff was the potential for more than 4 losses. I was willing to accept the bigger swing because I'd rather win a national championship more than once in 60 years, even if some seasons would be ugy.
I kind of have the feeling that, after the wild ride of the last 3 years, the fan base (maybe even me, I reluctantly admit) is willing to go back to the play-it-safe-but-never-win-big mentality. And that's why Hoke seems like a likely candidate.
I love how after the last 3 years our fans still take 9- and 10-win seasons for granted like they just magically grow on trees. Can we please stop bashing Lloyd and give him the credit he deserves for being a great coach?
is to be expected. After the Mizzou game there was talk about competing with any of the SEC teams (despite the B1G implosions of the regular season.)
That said, the general sentiment I've seen on BHGP is that they want Michigan footbal back on its feet. Minnesota? Not so much. jNW? F*ck 'em to holy hell.
Given Brian's comments on how Brandon handled the situation thus far, it was interesting to read Fast Company's analysis on the same. Fast Company is a business magazine, if you haven't heard of it before, so they bring a different perspective, I suppose. Here's the link: http://www.fastcompany.com/1714730/dont-let-hysteria-get-in-the-way-of-deliberation
Thanks for posting a different perspective.
355 comments and counting.
These guys have more to say about the situation than we do.
I agree with some of the other guys here in that there is no way Iowa can even begin to match Michigan's facilities in 2-3 years. Everything we have is brand new or in the process of being renovated.
It's not that they have more to say; they just don't have their posting privileges partially suspended.
Remember this, Greg Schiano, let me repeat that, Greg Schiano decided that Rutgers offered more long-term promise than did Michigan. He turned them down, with Ryan Mallet on the roster. Alum Les "LSU Fans Wish I Were Nick Saban" Miles decided he had more long-term promise in the vacillating confines of Baton Rouge than in Ann Arbor
because there's little or no truth in that quote. First, it's pretty well established that Martin never offered the job to Les Miles, so there was no "decision" for him to make. In addition, there's no reason to believe Schiano thought he could win more at Rutgers -- that seemed to be a question of comfort and acceptance from the fan base, no matter what the won-loss record.
I think I like his work better when he's playing the regular fan than the college football expert. Because while he does a pretty chart, I don't know that you can "chart" some so human involved as football. But he has a talent like no other to feel the pulse of the fan, and a way with words to perfectly express it in an entertaining way. "Brady Hoke Sucks" doesn't strike me as a knowledgeable football assessment. But reflecting how the average fan feels? Yup.
To me, it isn't that Brady Hoke s*cks. He has had his moments as a coach and seems like a genuinely good guy. How could you not like him after seeing this?
No, what s*cks is that a guy of his overall stature is being strongly considered for a job of ... this stature. As others have intelligently noted, Brady wouldn't be in the conversation if you replaced "Michigan" with "Penn State" on his CV. His accomplishments are unimpressive when placed alongside those of Patterson, Harbaugh, et al.
What does this mean? I think it means that the brains of many Michigan fans have turned into mush. (This didn't necessarily happen recently.) They're itching to turn back the clock to ... what, exactly? I'm not sure. But, I've been reading ridiculous ideas like "Hire Hoke and get a cast of all-star assistants." Um, yeah.
Northwestern's coach, who has a completely unimpressive record. Everyone has candidates based on intangibles rather than record.
Fitzgerald is 36 (as opposed to 53). You could at least make the "age upside" argument (however shaky) with him.
As well, he has, unlike Hoke, coached for a few years at the highest level (i.e., BCS) of college football. He has had modest success at a place where there isn't much *tradition*. I certainly wouldn't call it "completely unimpressive." How many coaches have won big there in the modern era? (I realize that he falls short of Gary Barnett.)
Aside from "Defensive Line Coach, Michigan," what exactly does Hoke bring to the table in terms of intangibles?
I tried to go "apples to apples" with the interviews.
Which one would you take? I'll take Fitzgerald. It's not even close. Brady (bless his big old heart) sounds like Lloyd Lite in that interview. He doesn't sound like a high D-1 coach to me.
is give Hoke a chance?
Well, maybe. My two cents:
Cent #1: Brian's and other prominent MGoBloggers have to be careful here in stoking the anti-Hoke sentiment/nascent rebellion. The tendency for groupthink -- wherein folks adopt their fearless leaders' epinions with minimal debate -- on this site is considerable. (I'm somewhat reminded of DailyKos.com's sky-high support for John Edwards early in the 2008 primary season, if that means anything to anyone.) At worst, if Hoke gets hired he comes in with a large segment of the fan base ready to pounce on every misstep, real or imagined. Which is exactly what we (MGoBlog readers, that is) were critical of Carr faction folks of doing regarding RR three years ago.
Cent #2: Hoke deserves a fair hearing. His track record strikes me as, while less impressive than Harbaugh's or P(e/a)tterson's, better than or on par with those of people like Tressel, Dantonio, Bielema, Kelly, and (less, I'm going there) Chizeck (sp?). And unlike most of those guys (i.e., or at least the Dantonio and Bielema), he's not a prick.
Hoke's record is nowhere close to what Tressel or Kelly had accomplished. Both of them had won multiple national championships in lower divisions. The problem with Hoke is that aside from his great 2008 season, and to a lesser extent, his most recent 9-4 season, his record is woefully uninpressive. Hell, aside from those two seasons, he only has one other season in which his team finished above .500, and in that year, it went 7-6. Based upon his overall body of work, he's not qualified for this job. That's the problem with his coaching candidacy.
OK, maybe I should water down my point a bit. I will claim that none of those guys had a Harbaugh-like resume, especially if you consider "But he has no Div.I experience" a legitimate objection (and it was certainly made).
But if you want to focus on former assistants with mediocre records, how about Chizik -- 5-19 at Iowa St. to coach of the year in 3 or 4 years.
If you're going to this argument, then how can anyone be so high on Rich Rod? He is a 43-43 career coach that, save three seasons AFTER MIAMI (YTM), BC, AND VTech left the BigEast, didn't and does not have much of a track record of success.
Bottom line is that you cannot look at a candidate and say well, inferior competition, rabble rabble rabble...
If Hoke is the higher, I think it would be good for the University. If Miles is the hire, I think it would be good for the University. If Coker is the hire, I think it would be good for the University. You following me?
Sure, makes perfect sense -- so, in other words, since Rodriguez was the hire, it was good for the University.
And save your "Mikey math" for someplace else. Rodriguez was 60-26 at WVU and 15-22 here, for a overall head coaching record of 75-48. At that rate, he could have gone 0-12 for the next two years and still had a winning record -- more than Hoke can say.
but i'm not impressed with Hoke. he's at a blip of the radar school where he's had moderate success. his biggest selling points are that he "almost beat" some heavy hitters. who may very well have overlooked SDSU completely and simply wanted the W and nothing more. by this logic, Wisconsin is only 3 points better than SDSU. omgz!
he's campaigned so hard for the job, and that's admirable, but his resume of "success" in of itself a hindrance - if he were so good, why did it take 5 years to put the MAC on its ass? and he left before he could prove it was continued success rather than a fluke season. now he's had a 9-4 season in which, if he were as good as he's being built, his team should have nuked a 6-6 BYU team that was a UTEP bowl away from a losing season.
You know what's really damn weird? Brady Hoke, Lloyd, and to a lesser extent Miles and Bo all kind of talk the same way.
I'm guessing if you slowed down the speed of this clip (which would lower the pitch of the voice) and closed your eyes you would swear you were listening to Lloyd.
add Ron English to that list
But I'm on the 2b part. They were talking about the law were the job has to be posted for a week before It can be filled so 12th Jan for a target date unless there is a loop-hole M can get around.
nothing posted yet on the UM job search site (i'm assuming i was looking in the right place - umjobs.org). i know we are a public university and all but I actually thought someone was joking when they said we had to post a job listing online.
It'll appear soon enough.
online - we have this requirement in my company for openings too so internal employees can apply - but we often post a notice on a corner of a bulletin board in the break room
It may be posted on a board in the lobby of SH or Tappan where anyone could walk by and see it - but it doesn't HAVE to be online
But that's how the U does it. I don't know where you work, but public law requirements wouldn't allow a "posting to the general public" be on a board in the lunch room. I don't know what public requirements your business is subject to, but if they have the same requirements, your company is flirting with a lawsuit.
there is an entire print (= not online) journal devoted to publishing academic job listings in my discipline, and the reason it isn't online is that chairs of departments at public universities think they have to post jobs in print. it's not actually true that they can't do this online--posting online can count as posting in print--but the point is that any given job listing needn't necessarily turn up online.
I guess it just depends on the organization....my company, for one, requires that we post all new job listings online. they have a couple of fairly important positions posted - i.e. Chief Compliance Officer - so I would have thought they might be required by law as a public institution to put all postings online. i was actually looking forward to reading the job description and the required/desired qualifications.....
followed the last coaching search. Anyone can apply. Literally.
They post it for legal reasons, but already know who they want to hire.
I think applied last time, just so I can say I was a candidate for the Michigan Head Coaching job (thinking I wouldn't have another chance for 15-20 years. Uhm, yeah...)
I had not found mgo, so I was reading mlive. There were numerous posts about that the listing had been found online and people were applying just to say they had. I would be surprised if the same thing didn't happen again.
The new coach would have to get interested recruits lined up in a day for next weekend otherwise he will have only one weekend to bring in visitors before the dead period and NSD. Yikes!
Can someone eventually summarize? Thx
Like the front page, after saying the press conference was horrible, and saying Brandon should have just said "I talked to Harbaugh, he said 'no'", rather than dancing around it, or said nothing at all rather than killing it.
They summed up DB JH comments as if he goes to the NFL UM saved face by saying he was not a candidate, BUT if he goes back to Stanford UM is F&^ked. As we know though these guys only now 1% of what's going on but that’s what the national perspective is going to be.
After the bowl game. That took it (and Brian) from the razor's edge to over it.
And don't bring up Tony Dungy.
would DB be able to claim he decided to fire RR the night before but then also say he was talking to Harbaugh about coaching at UM? that violates NCAA policy at worst, at best it just throws the whole 'this was a process' claim in the trash.
people getting way too hasty to trash DB on this. not you M-Wolv but others.
I was just summarizing Brian on the radio. I didn't think a "turn on the radio post" would turn into this, but I should have know better with the limited posting.
Brian definitely sounds despondent but he is not (his words) pussy-footing around with his distaste for Brandon's mishandling of this situation. I totally agree.
Someone posted this last night, but mgoblog is again inverse/bizarro world and at odds with public perception.
Every neutral/reasonable/casual/etc fan I've talked to is Very impressed with Brandon and the way he's handled this. They like him and saw him as exceptionally professional and "really looks like he knows what he's doing."
Harbaugh said no. That's a bit of an embarassment to M, but it's not on DB. National search is the next step, which yes, painful, but it's the appropriate path. We all thought he'd have had that completed already - probably naive in hindsight.
Is just glad Rich is gone.
Looking like you know what you're doing is vastly different than actually knowing what you're doing. Brandon has a week to walk the walk.
To be fair, I also think the average college sports fan thought UM should keep winning 9-10 games a year for eternity, regardless of the talent level, injuries, etc. I mean, there is a loud group of people who are calling for Mack Brown to be fired a year after the team played in the BCS title game. So just because a couple of fans are like "oh yeah, good job firing RR" while ignoring the fact that signing day is a month away and trying to bring in a big-name guy and having him set up is virtually impossible in that time frame, that doesn't make it a good move. Plus, TV and radio personalities know that if they bash Brandon too much, he can make their lives more difficult in terms of access later on down the line.
Personally, I think Brandon dropped the ball here. There was always a chance that Harbaugh would leave UM hanging when NFL money started sniffing around, and he should have had some backups in mind. The coaches at BSU/TCU/Utah were known commodities, as was everyone else on the list. Maybe you don't contact Dan Mullen before the bowl game out o fairness to RR, but I honestly feel that Brandon dropped the ball in not having a successor either in-hand or close. Starting a coaching search now will submarine this recruiting year, which will rear its ugly head in a couple of years when the new guy struggles with a depleted senior class and (what a minute, this sounds familiar) people start calling for his head after a couple of growing pains.
1) it likes to do so
2) JH was not introduced yesterday
3) no one else was introduced yesterday
1) ... and everyone follows Brian's lead
2) he didn't want to come
3) maybe a back-up plan could have been in place. But... it was probably a toss-up or near it before the bowl game on retaining RR. The plan was most likely wait for the bowl result, and have JH as the back-up. Getting obliterated in the Gator Bowl changed a lot of minds - Brian's, some players (reportedly), dumb fans like me. Why not Brandon? If we win that game, I don't know if we even offer JH the job. But after 52-14, RR is not an option. JH says no. What do you do now other than a national search? I think you'll agree it's not realistic that he would have had Patterson/Peterson/Fizgerald already in hand as option C. Too many balls in the air. Maybe he should have hired JH after OSU (and maybe he tried to), but waiting for the bowl result was the decision he made.
Difficult to swallow, but well said. I'm of the mindset that even though this is a horribly aggravating process, we have to find the right long-term answer. We can "what if" all we want (and this is what the MGoBoard is for, and usually I really enjoy that) but until the on-field results prove us wrong, we have to trust Brandon because he's decided to take the reins alone.
I think this is a very good summary.
What if DB had hired one of Brian's short-listers in December? Everyone would have gone freakin nuts. WE WANTED JH!!!! So he waits, can you imagine if DB had tried a poach job on Harbaugh and failed which he would have. The carnage from that would have been horrible. Its the same reason RR got strung up early in his tenure.... some bad breaks. Be reasonable. I think DB appraised the situation late in the year and saw how dicey it was and went with this plan and stuck to it and now the emotional side of the fanbase is freaking out.
My main point is this... If Harbaugh is the main target but it's not known if he's available, you either poach or move on early or wait. DB waited till he could find out. He would have been vilified if he moved on and it would have made us out to be douches if we tried to poach and lost out- which we would have. Im gonna try and be reasonable. DB is in a very tight spot here... we will see what he's made of but so far I can't see where he's blown it.
I'm not sure Brandon is just now starting his "national search". It sounds like he has been looking at candidates and maybe even having discussions with them for awhile, as any CEO would do in normal sucession planning. When the new coach is named (hopefully by this weekend), I think we'll find that the first conversation between Brandon and the coach wasn't on January 6.
I agree that it's doubtful that he is just starting his search, but I have no idea why he said it. It makes it seem like he was waiting for no reason whatsoever. Even if he was unsure on RR, you still have to begin looking for a replacement. Does looking for a replacement really harm RR's credibility and viability as a HC more than letting him just twist in the wind for a month and a half does?
I think that we should all just wait and see what happens; last time the coaching search was an absolute debacle and we had a great hire (not in retrospect obviously). Though, I'm terrified that this is going to drag on and we're going to end up with someone not fit for the job.
I don't think you can let on that you talked to candidates about a position when the current hire is still there. For future references and struggles of whoever is the coach, they have to know the AD has 100% faith in them, and will always give them time. If the coach is spending time looking over his shoulder and dealing with rumors and X and Y person were contacted about the job he's currently in, that kills motivation and trust and creates and promotes a bad atmosphere. You can't have that.
I feel like Brian keeps us rational. Everything is backed up with analysis. Regular readers of this site are the die-hards. Most of us are probably young and not involved with the old-school boosters who just want to throw old money at coaches and ram the ball up the middle.
We also aren't like the younger, casual fans who think Les Miles is a good pick because he was at Michigan like 30 years ago.
As a blogging community I wish we had some sort of power. Maybe we can get Brian to write a letter to Dave Brandon about how we feel and all sign our names and our affiliation
IE: Joe Blow - M Fan since '88, football season ticket holder.
I respect the thoughts/opinions of the MGoCommunity much, much more that an "outside" Michigan fan. People that read this blog are generally much more educated about football in general and what is going on within the program. I'll take educated opinions over uneducated opinions any day.
And I disagree that the national view is that Brandon has/is handling this well. I am an out-of-stater (like many of you) and I think the national opinion is that Rodriguez is at least as good (if not better) than any other coach Michigan will get. True, Michigan has lost some prestige by losing the past several years. But I believe the national sentiment is that Rodriguez got a raw deal because of the internal forces in the fan base. Just read the unbiased opinions of the sports reporters (who I could care less about) - they basically shape the national sentiment.
Unanimous opinion from ND, USC, Cal, Stanford & Spartan fans that I know and watch football with here is that a rabid and uneducated fanbase fucked this up early on and David Brandon caved to their whims and took the easy route thinking he had a popular choice as a replacement in the bag. No he doesn't have a replacement and is likely finding out that not too many coaches are very high on stepping into the void that has been created.
They are all quite knowledgeble sports and college football fans and have no influence from Detroit area media and from a somewhat objective viewpoint they think a proven coach who can take his pick of jobs that open up in the next few years would be crazy to take the smoking crater/toxic black hole that is is the M coaching vacancy. Seems like a dicey career move unless you are a nobody with something to prove. As my USC friend put it, 'why would a coach go somewhere that he could be hated from day 1 for his accent and his wife's wardrobe before even seeing the field? Where I would be looking at a depleted roster and at most 3 years to show results or be shown the door?'
My Sparty friend here openly hopes and prays that it ends up being Hoke because it is so surely a step backward and if nothing else 3-4 (oh wait, coaches only get 3 years to rebuild) more years of turnover and rebuilding. I openly hope and pray it is not.
I feel like Brian keeps us rational.
I love Brian, but I don't know if I always agree with this. Certainly not right now. I don't think his response to Hoke's (potential) candidacy is rational, and it's sending people over the edge.
Brian's really PO'd that there will likely be a head coach of this team not named Jim Harbaugh. He doesn't sound excited about really any of the candidates.
Unless Brandon pulls a rabbit out of his hat, there aren't many coaches aside from Harbaugh to get excited about in the first place. The fact that Brady Hoke continues to get thrown out there as a name should speak volumes to the talent pool of viable coaches.
I didn't mean to imply that he was wrong. I'm being cautiously optimistic that there's a diamond in the rough somewhere. And we're not going to know how any coach is going to perform for Michigan until he's on the Michigan sidelines. That's naive but until any new coach proves me wrong, I've got to have faith that Brandon hires the right guy.
Or at least that's what's keeping me sane/sober right now.
I'm for the optimism, but there isn't a diamond in the rough out there unless somene like Mullen leaves Miss St. AND brings Diaz, or UM is able to pry Patterson/Peterson from their homes. I think Brandon dropped the ball here and will scramble for a replacement, but for all the talk of his pimp hand the only one being slapped around now is UM.
already got hired away from MSU
Can't have Diaz. He just took the Texas DC job...
So are we resigned to the fact that the next coach will be a failure and another bad fit before he even gets here and coaches a season? I refuse to believe that. It's like we're saying the results of our coaching search are a failure when we haven't even made an offer yet.
I totally agree that Brandon hasn't handled this well at all. This has gone on for too long and if this is the route he wanted, it should have been taken place before the Bowl game. We can stop talking about his "pimp hand" because it's his show that, the best that we can perceive it, has gone poorly. But I think you and I are talking about the process and the results of the coaching search at the same time and even though they're related in some ways, I'm defining "results" as on-field W-L record, regardless of the name of the coach.
Diaz is gone to Texas, BTW.
There are no more coaches. We missed on Harbaugh and there are no other options. This is why the 49ers and Dolphins want Harbaugh. Because if they don't, they will have to play football next year without a head coach.
If the point was that there are no more sexy/glamour hires, well then yes, that's true. But there was only one of those anyway. And JH did not want to come here
I guess I'm saying we shouldn't call this search a failure if we get a less-glamorous hire than we expected when we first thought JH was interested in us. I'm just saying wait until whoever we hire has a chance to put a team on the football field to make some conclusions about the results of this coaching search.
I get the feeling we agree - your response was just a little more sarcastic than mine. But I couldn't tell so I'm sorry if I'm unnecessarily defensive.
Sorry if that wasn't clear. My bony finger of sarcasm was pointed directly at bronxblue
actually have a lot of returning starter pending transfers. This is something RR didn't have when he took over.
And a fairly easy schedule, if RR and new D coordinator on board, we probably would have won 9+, so I'm expecting at least 7 next year barring transfers yada yada
Do you not understand the phrase "diamond in the rough" or are you simply omnipotent?
...Hoke could change his name to Jim Harbaugh. Would that work?
Brian thinks DBs comments regarding Harbs yesterday stem from a little anger because JH "sort of gave us the middle finger."
"press conference was a disaster.......inexcusable for Michigan AD to torpedo JH"
(???? Brain really thinks there was a little FU back and forth between harbaugh and DB? I don't agree at all.)
"There's no excuse not to call the guy 2 seconds after the press conference and say "the job is yours""
--Brain, how do you know he DIDN'T do that? Harbaugh is still the coach at Stanford. There has to be some form of decorum between two institutions, doesn't there? I think Brian is being a little presumptuous. Perhaps, though, he has more inside info.
"Just come out and say it......drop your corporate speak or keep the wall up"
Man, talk about a dude frustrated.
...is exactly what DB is looking for. Crap!
Here's a little juxtaposition for compare and contrast purposes:
Harbaugh told DB PRIOR to the conference that he's not interested in the UM job. That's why it was ok for DB to say it doesn't look like Harbaugh is coming.
In fact, Ross (owner of Dolphins) contacted DB yesterday to inquire about the Harbaugh situation. Ross didn't want to get in a bidding war against his alma mater. DB told Ross that Harbaugh isn't interested in UM and gave Ross the OK to pursue Harbaugh.
brian said that or you have a source for that? i can't listen to WTKA on my work computer.
The stuff about Ross I got from an article on ESPN's front page about JH meeting the Dolphins.
I can't listen to the WTKA broadcast either. So, my comment about Brian getting the situation wrong is based on the summary provided by listeners (I assume they're providing accurate summaries...)
Yeah, because ESPN is so reliable, right? It may be true, but I wouldn't treat it as fact just because you heard it on ESPN. The most trusted source providing info about Harbaugh not going to Michigan would be his brother, in my opinion.
It came from Mortensen who is much more reliable than the college clown parade they have.
Sam Webb said the same thing this morning
Ross donated $100 million to the university and sits on Mary Sue Coleman's advisory board for intercollegiate athletics. Brandon had to know that he couldn't say, "No," and it wouldn't matter if he did.
Good for Brian, couldn't agree more.
Hope he's keeping a lid on the Hoke hate, or perhaps gobbled some Xanax for breakfast. If you've been reading this blog long, you can see he's learned a lot about the nuts and bolts of football, but it's not clear to me that he's ever seen the game from the inside of a helmet at any level, while a lot of actual football people regard Hoke highly.
I for one don't see the Hoke hate. Sure, he isn't the most qualified candidate around, but he has had multiple head coaching jobs (experience is a good thing). He has improved from job to job. And the number one reason I don't hate the idea of him coming is that he really wants the job. I think there is something to him wanting to be the Michigan coach that takes us to the top rather than someone that needs to be coaxed here with some extra coin.
If anything I see Hoke's lack of credentials as more of an unknown than as a negative. Who really knows if he will succeed or not?
All job applicants will really want the job, so I think by "really wants the job" you mean "is a Michigan man". If that's your number one reason then, to be consistent, Ron English would be on your short list too. Is he?
It matters, but I rank it lower than experience and results.
"Won't leave us for the NFL in 5 years, so we're doing this all over again." Which with Harbaugh, or some other candidates who don't see Michigan as the ultimate job, isn't a sure thing. Anyone would want it. But want it over ANY other, versus just taking it because it's a better job? Smaller pool. Maybe not just "Michigan Men" (or that even all of them feel that way; see: JH). But it probably doesn't hurt. But it's not a requirement (see: Bo).
Dear Lord, I hate the "Michigan Man" term. Didn't it come up with Bo's comment about a specific former basketball coach? I don't think it was intended to be included in football coaching job descriptions for all eternity.
weren't "Michigan Men". They were pretty damn successful though.
The term is jaded. Originates before Bo too:
“But do let me reiterate the spirit of Michigan. It is based upon a deathless loyalty to Michigan and all her ways; an enthusiasm that makes it second nature for Michigan men to spread the gospel of their university to the world's distant outposts; a conviction that nowhere is there a better university, in any way, than this Michigan of ours.” (Bacon)
is that maybe Harbaugh or some higher profile candidates might leave us with a staff where we can hire from within. Obviously the only way anyone is going from Michigan to the NFL is with major success, so if even they left they might also leave us with a future head coach on board.
I don't have anything to base this on, but I just don't see a Brady Hoke staff being composed of anything more than career position coaches.
Is the most overused term out there. That is not at all what I meant. I meant that he sees Michigan as the ultimate destination. As apposed to a candidate that has been around a few BCS schools and had some success and some failure who would only take this job if he was given a massive pay raise. There is a big difference. Hoke would probably take this job without getting a dime more than he is earning now. He wants this job. I'm not saying that is a reason to hire him, but I'm saying that is a positive from where I am sitting. Also, if Hoke is unqualified, English is massively unqualified.
I just hope Hoke isn't vilified the second he gets here if he is hired. After all, once he is hired, we're stuck with him for at least 3 years and complaining about it and predicting massive failure won't help anything.
Hoke may very well be vilified if he gets hired, if only because I think there are a lot of us that feel that if Rodriguez was fired then Michigan better go out and get a proven entity to lead the team. Hoke is by no means proven and if he is hired its because either someone thinks he's great or partly because he coached at Michigan previously. I can't help but believe that Brandon is being pressured by outside (or internal) sources to bring in someone with a Michigan pedigree. I'm not sure that is a good thing or a bad thing, especially given the reception Rodriguez got on day one by some.
I sincerely Hoke is not the choice. I would not have considered firing RR to replace him with Hoke. However, I agree with you about him being vilified. If he is the choice, I want to be proven completely wrong.
I agree to disagree. Put it this way: would you take expected wins of 9/year for 20 years or 10/year for 5 years? I'd take the latter and then worry about the next coach in 2016.
Nobody that Michigan is considering is going to be the next Bobby Petrino or Lane Kiffin, who would leave the team in shambles a year after they were hired. Most coaches in CFB will stick around at least until their first contract expires. And frankly, if they make the team better and earn the right to a pay raise in the NFL in a few years, there are worse problems. That's why I still consider proven success more important than desire to stick around for life. And maybe they change their level of desire once they come on board. Has any coach ever left Michigan for another job in its history?
Regardless, if Hoke is the coach I'm not going to do what all the old timers did to RichRod.
it won't bother me. Anyone who comes here and truly wants to coach Michigan will end up as a Michigan Man whether they want to be or not, assuming some success.
At this point, I don't really care who the coach is. What I do know, is that if the same actions occur again, the results can't be much different. I made the mistake of looking at some of the comments on the Michigan FB page. If they are typical of the fan base outside MGoBlog, I am very afraid.
Handcuffed and Paralyzed by the 70s
I don't understand the Hoke LOVE, actually. No one would be talking about him if he wasn't a position coach for Michigan way back when.
And no one would believe Harbaugh would ever come here if he hadn't played QB here. The whole idea of someone having connections with the program being a candidate is that it increases the chances they would want to come here, as well as increasing the chances of success as they understand the culture they will be moving into. It isn't the end all be all, but it can be part of the picture.
Maybe no one would believe Harbaugh would come here, but he would definitely still be at the top of the list. Like Desmond Howard said after the presser, Jim Harbaugh could have been QB at Minnesota and he'd still be a desireable coach here and at other programs.
I think you overstate the increased "chances of success" by someone who coaches at their alma mater.
What will you do if Hoke is the next coach?
Suffer temporary frustration, try not to freak out, pray for the team, and attend every game next season.
I think you'll find that a lot of the people who were RR supporters are the kinds of people who are particularly unnerved by the thought of Hoke getting hired (for the simple fact that we feel RR is a better option).
And those very same people who were RR supporters will support whoever the new coach is, because the love is for the school, not the man, not some mysterious ethos about how the offense runs, not whether the guy is a hillbilly.
It's the anti-RR crowd who never "accepted" the coach that they didn't like, and didn't fully support him the moment he set foot on campus.
No one would be talking about the hottest college coaching prospect going to the highest profile college opening? They're not speculating at Patterson because he was a QB for Bo.
The meme of having to have played football to "really" understand it is total bullshit.
I've had a ton of trouble loggin in the last two days, and I finally got it to recognize me. The login at the top still looks like I'm not signed in, but I am. Wierd. Maybe the system can't handle the press conference yesterday and is experiencing a Y2K kind of glitch.
Can anybody cut out the Brian interview and post it streaming from this site? I am working and this is the only site that I'm allowed to surf besides espn and work crap...
"I think they could get Fitzgerald or Mullen, but the other guys, I don't know"
"peterson, patterson, and whittingham are all about the same guy" - we read about this yesterday. Brian thinks Patterson is probably the strongest of the 3 due to defense.
"I'd roll those dice (on Strong from Louisville despite only 1 year of head coaching experience).
now taking calls.
On Fitz and Mullen. I'd be thrilled to get either of them - really don't think we could do any better.
He has a worse resume than Hoke, that everyone hates.
Biggest thing is he could keep Denard and salvage this class. On top of that he's got Midwestern recruiting ties, and his unimpressive record comes at the smallest fish in one of the biggest and most competitive conferences. Yes, his record's not impressive, but he's exceeded expectations for his school over an extended time period. He has made them a perennial bowl team.
Except the big conference. And Northwestern is a far better program than any Hoke took over. NW has been middle of the pack going on 2 decades now, and have had 2 coaches who had a lot of success before him (one Fitzgerald played for, the other he coached for). He hasn't really limited the program much, and certainly hadn't reached new highs for it.
Is that bringing in Fitz wouldn't take us back to square one, whereas bringing in Hoke would. I'm not as down on Hoke as Brian is, but I'd rather have given Rod another year than completely start over for someone with as little track record as either of these guys. Since Fitz could come in and keep some grease on the spread n' shred wheels, I think he's a better fit.
I know Hoke is a defensive guy, so I'd be really happy if he brings in a spread run OC. Just because I really hope we don't have three more years of, well, the Rich Rod era (and I don't mean that as a knock against him).
Fitzgerald has outperformed Randy Walker, the second coach you claim had "a lot of success."
Has he won?
Fitzgerald took over a team that was basically hitting .500 and occasionally making it to a bowl game; after 5 seasons, he has them a step higher (almost always hitting .500 and making it to a bowl game). Neither Walker nor Barnett had "a lot of success" at Northwestern. Walker's best season was 8-4, and three of his seven seasons ended with 4 wins or fewer. Barnett had the back-to-back bowl years, but didn't break .500 once aside from that. In any event, I think at this point it's safe to give Fitzgerald credit for where the program is.
At Ball State, Hoke took over a program "expertly" piloted by Bill Lynch to the six-loss level (fill in IU joke here) and took five seasons to get it back to that point. He had one mediocre season (7-6, bowl loss) and then the 12-1 part of their 12-2 season. It's possible that he would have continued to succeed there, and that the combination of decommits and inept coaching buried the Cardinals, but it's also possible that he got really lucky and got out before that was recognized.
At SDSU, Hoke took over from Chuck "can't chuck long, can't chuck short, can't chuck over the middle" and got some pretty good results after only two seasons, better than his BSU career and something Fitzgerald didn't do ... but there's nothing yet that tells whether or not that will also be a one-year wonder.
I think it's a mistake to dismiss the "big conference" part ... one of the questions about coaches at non-elite schools is whether or not they can recruit in an AQ conference. (See Hawkins, Dan.) Fitzgerald, after all, is already doing that; Hoke has yet to try. A better question would be "Can he recruit at elite levels in an AQ conference?" Barnett went to Colorado and had about the same level of success he'd had at Northwestern (which for some reason got him fired at CU; they may have regretted that once Hawkins came in). Obviously if Fitzgerald were hired and did that here, he wouldn't last much longer than RR.
Peterson and Patterson look better because they've had significant success at non-AQ schools, including bowl wins, but that still doesn't mean they'd win at the same level here, and besides IME it's irrelevant: Patterson's going to be coaching an AQ school and Peterson, as said elsewhere, doesn't seem interested in coaching anywhere else. (That may change if the MWC loses any more schools.)
I guess it's all the same thing. All available candidates are flawed ... the trick is figuring out which flaws won't matter.
A one year wonder. Does that make him a two year wonder? Because that's all the Northwestern coaches have had. Two particularly good years, and a lot of mediocre one's (like Hoke). The difference is that Barnett had much higher highs (Rose Bowl and Championship) after building it from the worst team historically in the Big Ten, and Walker, who also won a championship, did it while instituting the system that Fitzgerald runs today (which is apparently very hard if the last 3 years here are any sign). Championship results while doing more heavy lifting.
a perennial bowl team?
If this site were not broken, I would +1 that. Why does Brian like Firz but not Hoke? Hoke has a better resume, does have Michigan ties (which I actually think are important to connect the hot mess that is currently Michigan football with the storied past) and looks to this job as his ultimate career dream.
Except that Brady Hoke has a losing record over his career while Pat Fitzgerald's is the opposite. Except that Hoke's losing record comes from schools in the mid majors while Fitz's comes from the Big 10.
I'm not saying that Fitzgerald is an ideal hire but if we're going to hire somebody without experience in an AQ conference at the very least they should have a career record with more wins than losses.
Push Charlie Strong! Best candidate available that we have a realistic chance of getting, if you ask me.
I would be shocked if Strong left Louisville. Louisville can and will pay him, for one. It's a very profitable department with deep pockets. For two, at Louisville, he works for one of the best AD's in the nation in Tom Jurich. If DB turns out to be half the AD Jurich is then UM is in better shape than it looks. Third, all reports state that Strong is very appreciative to Louisville for giving him the chance to coach, finally, and in the (kinda) South. It is widely believed, especially by Charlie Strong, that as a successful DC for one of the best football teams in the nation for seven years, he was passed over for numerous coaching jobs because he's black (and, more to the point, because he's black and has a white wife). The Louisville community has embraced CS and he's done so back. I think, at this point, having CS on that list is probably Brian being delusional, perhaps even moreso than Petersen et al. I'm not saying CS is necessarily a Louisville lifer, but he's not leaving now.
I've seen this elsewhere, but I'm not sure about the idea that Charlie Strong has pledged undying devotion to Louisville just because other southern schools had their heads in their asses. It might be true that he wouldn't come, but the fact that he's only been there a year cuts both ways - he may feel worse about leaving the place that gave him a big break so early into his contract, or he may not have had that much time to put down roots there. And, while Louisville's athletic department has a suprisingly large budget - around $50M in 2009 - that's still a little more than half what UM's athletic revenues were in 2009. Also, the athletic department apparently had to donate 250k to the university's general fund a couple of years ago, which makes you wonder exactly what kind of shape Louisville is in as a whole.
Again, maybe he won't come, but I think it's worth seeing what a few million dollars a year would do to his opinion.
Again, I have no idea about Charlie Strong's undying devotion, either. It's just a hunch. And, admittedly, Louisville's "surprisingly large" (why surprising?) budget also reflects down numbers on football, as brought upon by the entire fanbase losing faith in the terrible, terrible coach CS replaced. I'm sure the revenues will be up now that Krag has been "Bagged" and replaced with a competent coach. For Jurich's part, it's unlikely that he lets another good coach leave. He will pay whatever Michigan will, within reason. Also, if I'm CS, it would be hard, after the past three years, to not think of the Michigan environment as somewhat toxic. Not when he has a job wherein the fans and administration love him already. Why would he take the job in this environment, given that he'd know that a good portion of the fanbase would hate him coming in and that he'd have to struggle early on, most likely?
I guess you can say that about any of the names on the list, though.
Also, the athletic department apparently had to donate 250k to the university's general fund a couple of years ago, which makes you wonder exactly what kind of shape Louisville is in as a whole.
has Brian discussed the state of mgoblog.com? I've not been able to fully sign in for two days now -- and I'm going through withdrawal. For some reason I can post comments, but I can't start threads -- wanted to post something about the Daily's article on Denard: http://michigandaily.com/content/former-coaches-weigh-possibility-transfer-michigans-speedy-quarterback-robinson. Also the only way I can access mgoboard content is via the right column -- otherwise I'm going back to the page as it stood late Sunday or early Monday. I've tried three different computers and different browsers so that's not the issue.
much of the site due to volume - seems this CC stuff is a hot topic :-)
not sure but seems he's trickling the access back in to not crater the server farm in his basement
Love that the volume is so high because this is where the most reliable information is coming from.
Also, didn't Brian say there were 5000 people in the liveblog during the press conference? My guess is that at least double that are viewing this site over the course of the day and most of us are addicts that refresh the page 5 times a minute as well.
Maybe the lock downs can be turned into beveled guilt to help buy some better mgoservers?
I wouldn't say most of the info here is reliable.
Been stated elsewhere, but the board functionality is limited due to the number of hits it is taking since the entire community is looking for coach search info
Is from the App, and due to things they need to fix in the off-season, things posted from the App appear in the right column, but not on the MGoBoard.
An HTTP 403 error occurred. Your vote was not submitted!
I'm not posting from the app.
Currently I can post to these, but not to front-page topics. I can't upvote (or downvote) either; that part may work only through the app, I don't know. I haven't used my Touch since one of the upgrades wiped out my saved-game data.
The only way to comment on the main page threads, rather than posting on the boards, is from the ap.
Create threads now? Posting was enabled, but has starting new threads been fixed yet?
i know he is like 60 but better then Hoke, I kno UCONN is looking at him but i think we could land him. I'm getting desperate but Hoke=Doom
Fulmer... o god, now I'm about to go all Cook-on-Hoke...
I hate you for seriously mentioning Fulmer in connection with Michigan. Maybe you don't remember Fulmer's crying about Woodson winning the Heisman over his precious Peyton?
(I don't really hate you, for the record.)
For the love of all that is holy, put that thought out of my mind. My soul may explode.
Fulmer should not be an option! I live here in Knoxville, am married to a die hard UT fan, Fulmer was in same position that LC was, the game was passing him up. Again horrible idea!
"I don't want a coach in his mid 50s just because he used to be a coach here."
"Pinkel is a guy I looked at but he's too old"
A caller presumes that since Brandon said "The search has begun" that the search truly just started yesterday. Am I the only guy who doesn't believe that?
"Everyone has question marks because they're not named Jim Harbaugh"
Brandon must be removed immediatly.
the bowl game "was a game changer for me. If they lost by 3 points RR might still be the coach"
Posted on ESPN - Supposedly Ross is offering in the $7 Million plus range after confirming with UofM that they are not getting positive feedback from Harbaugh.
Initially, sources said Harbaugh was cool to Peterson's approach on behalf of the Dolphins and Ross. But the Stanford coach's interest grew warmer in the 48 hours after his Cardinal soundly defeated Virginia Tech with Ross among the spectators at Dolphins Stadium, sources said. Wooten said he also was told that Harbaugh was not very receptive to the Dolphins' initial approach.
Furthermore, Ross had dialogue with University of Michigan officials to ensure that he would not be competing for Harbaugh's services with his alma mater, sources said. Ross, who is one of Michigan's largest benefactors, was assured by a Michigan official that Harbaugh was not reciprocating interest in the college's now-vacant head coaching position.
Chris Mortensen is ESPN's senior NFL analyst
Is there ANY chance these 3 Michigan Men are choreographing this whole thing? I know I'm being an idealist and wishful thinker, but........?
until I can convince myself of just that.
I believe that is a real possibility. I don't know that Ross is involved, but I do think it's possible that DB is giving JH space to vet the NFL thing with some of the intense scrutiny deflected. Given their long-standing relationship, it seems unlikely to me that they won' t talk in the next day or two.
If Brandon has not already spoken to Harbaugh then I'm going to jump out of my 25th floor office window.
When Brandon was going through his whole "It's my belief Harbaugh will be in the NFL" stuff yesterday, my hope was that maybe he was faking us all out, and he was going to unveil him in 48 hours.
But why on earth would he do that? It's not like it makes Brandon look better if he pulls off JH 3 days after everyone was hoping he'd pull him off. It's not like Harbaugh looks better if he gets to do one more NFL interview.
It makes no difference. So, no, this isn't choreographed. It's just an ex-Michigan player who isn't interested in coaching here.
Don't you think if you're JH that you wouldn't want to vet the NFL, especially how your stock has risen, the money involved, the family hx of NFL jobs, etc, and regardless of desire to coach at Michigan. I think he would be crazy not to. And, JB is going to know this (maybe even discussed with him) and feels best opportunity to get him is to let him go through that process. Don't know, obviously, but agree with earlier response about comments to media never fully reflect nature of actual discussions.
that's not choreographed. To me, choreographed doesn't mean DB is just hoping that JH looks at the NFL options and then makes his own decision that he'd actually like to be at Michigan.
Choreographed to me means that JH and DB are in on some kind of plan.
Maybe JH and DB have a deal and this is all window dressing. Maybe JH said "I'm going to take a couple interviews just to see, but expect that I'm coming." Maybe the idea is Harbaugh makes it seem like he's going to take the Miami job to convince his family that they're going to have to move, and then they compromise that they'll move but stay in a college town.
I don't know. I mean, these scenarios could be possible. But the most likely circumstance is probably the correct one, which is that JH simply wants $5-7M a year and be in control of an NFL team.
I've been a major Harbough fanboi since about '84. Have always looked forward to the day when he came back to coach. And I can see his side of things, if UM turned him away when he was trying to get into coaching. But if he is turning his back on us now when we could not need him more, and he's doing it for a $7M soulsuck in the NFL, I am ready to close that door forever. This is a potential point of inflection in our modern history. On top of football credentials, wanting to be here, dreaming of being here and seeing this as the ultimate job are important qualifications.
A former player/ alum doesn't bash his former program and university over academics in public. If it's really a concern of JH's he should have done it in private. He claimed to bleed Maize and Blue yet burned his bridge here. Are you really surprised that he's not coming to coach?
Well, thanks Mr. Ross. Appreciate your loyalty to the school.
Its a big ruse! Ross is throwing around the idea of lots of money, to throw the 49'ers off the scent of Harbaugh. Miami still hasn't even fired their current coach. With the thought that Harbaugh is going to take $7-8million from Miami, The 9'ers go in a different direction and then Miami decides to retain Sparano and suddenly there is little ole Harbaugh with no NFL place to go, so he takes the Michigan job.
Well played Mr. Ross.
I like you're thinking son.
+1 for you.
Brandon didn't fire Rodriguez until after the bowl massacre and is taking heat for (presumably) not looking beforehand ... there's nothing to say Ross isn't doing the same thing, only openly. And when you expect to be a playoff contender and watch your team lose 7 of 8 at home, including its last three (against teams with 4, 5, and 6 wins), it's probably a good idea to start packing up your office.
Honestly, it shouldn't take much to throw off the 49ers anyway. They're basically Cincinnati West: just another example of how family-run businesses don't succeed in the NFL. All it should take is one person suggesting that Harbaugh will be an excellent NFL coach and York will hire David Shula or Bruce Coslet.
But hey, if it means Harbaugh will end up in Ann Arbor ...
beg to differ.
Thanks, I needed a happy delusion.
I think the worst part about waiting until after the Gator Bowl to fire RRod is missing out on Al Golden. Turning around Temple was the most impressive thing done by any coach in a while...probably even more so than reviving Stanford with Andrew Luck. Also, with his Midwest ties he probably would have been a good candidate to come to Ann Arbor rather than U of Miami. Just seems like he would have been the perfect coach for us, and much more valuable than "sticking to a plan" or having consistency through the bowl game. It also would have pissed the hell out of Penn St!
He wasn't impressed with that hire.
I would've definitely been onboard with hiring Golden. I don't remember where Brian colored himself unimpressed, but I do know that Golden was three-quarters of Al Groh's recruiting mojo at UVA and UVA put together some hella good classes when he was there. Golden resurrected Temple and frankly he's one of the people I'm thinking of when I say that January is too late for this because most of the better candidates have been picked over.
Few weeks back, they were asking him about the new hires at the different schools, and was kinda meh about it. He was even less excited about Pitt's hire. That one proved right.
Yeah, except that you never would have really known whether you could have got Harbaugh.
If we all agree (and I think we do) that Harbaugh is by far the best choice, it is/was worth taking a chance on.
Not defending waiting this long to get started, but if we agree that:
1) Harbaugh is by far the best coach available
2) He was not going to entertain any other offers until after the Orange Bowl
3) We didn't want to go through 6-7 weeks without a coach at all
Then maybe this really was Brandon's only course of action (of course it would have been swell had he been at least speaking with other candidates)
That's worth a +1.
I do not like Harbaugh. He bad-mouthed Michigan's program and student-athletes to make his own program look better and, for that, I will never respect him again. That said, I guess I had better learn to like him if he ends up coaching at Michigan. Damn my loyalty to Michigan getting into the way of my dislike of an individual!
I'd plus one this if possible. He would have been a great choice.
Turning around a program doesn't necessarily mean success at the next place. Hell, it doesn't even mean continued success at your current school. To me, Schiano's turnaround at Rutgers was more impressive than either Golden's or Harbaugh's, yet Rutgers looks like they might be back to a bottom feeder already.
The only way to guarantee success is if the guy you hire has great success at two or three places, or a prolonged (6+ years) period of success at one school, everyone else is a crapshoot. Anyone that says differently is fooling himself.
"I think they should hire Greg Robinson just so they can fire him again." - ouch.
"I still think if you're Pat Fiztgerald and you're 36 do you really want to spend the rest of your life at Northwestern?" - they probably asked the same thing of Joe Paterno or Bobby Bowden.
Craig Ross and Brian Davis both are high on Fitzgerald.
Caller just asked about Butch Davis? wtf? Why don't we find out how Pete Carroll enjoys the pro game and see if he's interested?
"Do not think it's Harbaugh....I think that ship has sailed or is close to sailing"
Brian also reiterated "I DO NOT want a coach in his 50s just because he was an assistant here before" I get the sense Brian doesn't want Brady Hoke. I don't know though.
Urban Meyer's name has popped up but the 3 people in studio have resoundly shot that down.
caller says he's friends with a member of the Nebraska Board of Trustees and he claims the Nebraska faithful are worried because Michigan has contacted Bo Pelini.
abrupt end of segment
Why waste O2 on those?
Bowden was 46 when he left west virginia for FSU. I think he probably would have jumped ship from Northwestern.
Commerical 1 on wtka- for water damage...RR is being sued for water damage to one of his real estate house dealies.
Coomerical 2 on wtka- flow from progressive ("live from progressive" is always on) but still ARG!
The ad world is killing my soul...must kill someone!
the ad world is killing my soul, too, but only because I work in the business.
Find me a job!!!
There talking about how UM doesn't pay their assistants and on how M will change. Just FYI. McGee was way down the list at $200k ish.
And top flight coordinators in the SEC are getting close to seven figures.
As long as we're just throwing names around, how about Vince Lombardi?
On second thought, no...RR said even he couldn't make this right...
that so many people have the feeling that the sky is falling. First of all, in times of coaching search/negotiations, don't believe everything that you hear. Agents put out information to the media to spark buzz about their respective clients and to play one team vs another for more money. It's how the game is played. If you're a coach and you're interested in a job, you don't call the hiring team and say "I'm interested." You have your agent talk to the media and put out a rumor to let the team know there is interest.
Also, I guarantee that DB did not begin his coaching search just yesterday. Have you heard of coach speak? It's the same thing. What is he going to say? I just decided to fire RR, but I've been searching for a new coach for months? Come on. Is this coaching search extremely important? Yes it is, but let's think rationally for one second and realize that DB had to say what he said yesterday.
Caller asked about Mike Barwis, Sam say he is still employed by M for now, But Sam say we will not know if he will stay until the dust settles.
has said Barwis is staying, and Mike Martin is coming back too.
Having a job is generally better than not having a job. At least it's more lucrative. Since Barwis is under a separate contract than the football staff, he'd have to resign, which would mean no buyout.
His strong ties with RR may see him leave if/when RR gets another job and has permission to bring him along. Until then, don't see Barwis leaving without employment.
built him his own Thunderdome probably means they'd be happy to keep him long-term
Brian, along with 85% of people on this board, are being freaking ridiculous.
First, the complaints that Brandon "botched" the process are way premature, until we see what happens. As others have said, the job needs to be officially posted for a week -- perhaps Brandon already has a coach lined up but is not revealing it until the required time period has passed. We know the man plays his cards close to his vest -- why don't we wait a week and see who our new coach is before ranting.
In any case, what could the man have done differently? Harbaugh said no -- that's not for lack of effort on Brandon's part. The only other option was to fire Rodriguez before the bowl game, so we would have had more time for a search. Is that what you people wanted? If Brandon had fired Rodriguez in December, only to wind up not landing Harbaugh anyway, Brian and everyone else would have been freaking out that Brandon is the biggest idiot ever, if we had done well in the game Rodriguez could have come back, etc. If you're going to complain about the process, offer a feasible solution.
Second, the comments about Hoke are ridiculous. Over the past few years I seem to recall annoying lectures from Rodriguez supporters every time somewhere dared criticize his performance, to the effect that "recruits read these boards, you're making them not want to come to Michigan," etc. Yet these same people now feel comfortable lambasting the state of the program, ripping a potential new coach as UNACCEPTABLE, effect on recruiting be damned. Funny how criticism is OK when you're the one unhappy about the state of things.
That's not to say that criticism can't be countenanced -- more pointing out hypocrisy -- but the level of criticism being thrown at Hoke as a potential higher is irrational and idiotic. Most people saying "anyone but Hoke!" know absolutely nothing about him beyond the fact that he looks a little goofy and doesn't have a tough-sounding name. The man is extremely respected by his peers, knows defense (!), has turned around two joke programs in his last two jobs, and has a reputation as a good receiver. Is he the most exciting hire every -- no (I, for one, and clinging to hope that Brandon will shock us by announcing Bill Cowher - j/k). But below the radar coaches have succeeded in the past and will succeed in the future, and the crazed chicken littled crying about the sky falling before even hearing the man speak need to take a fucking xanax.
Boom plus 1'd (in my heart)
No, no, no -- I meant that he's "higher" on Brandon's wish list than . . . ah fuck it. I also called him a good "receiver" rather than recruiter. These are the things that happen when you rant.
I totally understand- hopefully you weren't offended. I only meant it as good-natured ribbing...nothing more.
I needed something to focus on other than doom- even if that something was an e-misunderstanding on the internetz.
No, I got you -- just playing along.
make MGoBoard... something something.
a thousand times yes
I think you're missing the basic point. It's not a good idea to "start" a coaching search in January, unless you have to. I know he probably has a list of names, and probably has sent out feelers, but in the eyes of casual fans, and more importantly, in the eyes of recruits, he has basically just started.
The decision should have been made on Dec. 1st. Give the program optimal chance for success. I also believe that Brandon endorsed Rodriguez for next season, the bowl game wouldn't have been such a disaster.
What has people upset is the belief that if we hire Hoke, it's only because we couldn't target anyone else at this point in the game. An idea that is very reasonable. Brandon may surprise us, and I agree, Hoke may turn out great (all coaching searches are essentially a crap shoot, in my opinion), but I think it's fine to be upset at how things have been handled.
I think you're missing the basic point. It's not a good idea to "start" a coaching search in January, unless you have to. I know he probably has a list of names, and probably has sent out feelers, but in the eyes of casual fans, and more importantly, in the eyes of recruits, he has basically just started. The decision should have been made on Dec. 1st.
No, you're missing the point. If he had made the decision to fire Rodriguez on December 1st, and still didn't get Harbaugh, 95% of Michigan fans would have been even more outraged than they are now, and rightfully so. He gave Rodriguez a chance to earn another year -- Rodriguez failed. And there is virtually no difference in the potential coaches available to us now from those that would have been available on December 1 -- maybe the Temple guy, that's it. And we wouldn't have offered another coach until Harbaugh turned us down in any event, which wouldn't have happened until after the bowl game.
Firing Rodriguez in December would have been stupid, wouldn't have put us in a better position, and the Rodriguez supporters would still be whining about how he should have gotten another year.
Give the program optimal chance for success. I also believe that Brandon endorsed Rodriguez for next season, the bowl game wouldn't have been such a disaster.
That's convenient wishful thinking with no evidentiary basis in reality. Brandon gives Rodriguez a shot to keep his job, Rodriguez screws the pooch, and now its Brandon's fault that he didn't just give Rodriguez the extension before the game in which he screwed the pooch. Makes sense to me.
We obviously aren't going to agree on this. But you honestly don't believe there was a better chance of hiring a coach not named Harbaugh that the fan base could be happy with in December than right now?
You don't have to just look at the guys we could have hired who took other jobs, but also guys that don't want to leave their current jobs in January but may have considered it in December. That month is a huge difference, both in recruiting and vile that will be heaped upon a coach for leaving at that time. It's why Tennessee, a program with just about as much prestige as ours, had to settle for Derek freaking Dooley, coming off a 4-8 year at Louisiana Tech.
Handling a potential coaching change, especially when the fan base only seems interested in one replacement, is never easy. Some people will always be upset. But there's a reason these things are usually handled in December and not January. To say that Brandon has handled the situation well is to be willfully ignorant.
"The only other option was to fire Rodriguez before the bowl game, so we would have had more time for a search. Is that what you people wanted? If Brandon had fired Rodriguez in December, only to wind up not landing Harbaugh anyway, Brian and everyone else would have been freaking out that Brandon is the biggest idiot ever, if we had done well in the game Rodriguez could have come back, etc. If you're going to complain about the process, offer a feasible solution."
OK, feasible solution: KEEP RODRIGUEZ. I feel perfectly justified and comfortable in my ire toward Brandon, since what I've been saying all along is: Only fire RR if you can definitely land Harbaugh. Monkey's Law of the Jungle: Don't let go of the last vine before you grab the next one. This is not the right time for the program to go through the usual instability a coaching search demands. Not in January and not three years after the last one.
OK, feasible solution: KEEP RODRIGUEZ.
That was probably Brandon's plan before a 38 point loss to the 5th place SEC West team. After the bowl game, keeping Rodriguez was no longer feasible. That's on Rodriguez himself.
I don't think we saw any new problems in the bowl game that we didn't know about. The defense was horrible - that wasn't new information.
I find it hard to believe that the bowl loss was the determinative factor after having 3 years of history to base the decision on. I agree - we did not see anything different in the bowl game than we saw in the second half of the regular season. Michigan lost terribly to a better team and looked very bad doing so. I would be dismayed to learn that loss was the determinative factor. It may have been "comforting" to Brandon in making the move, but I would lost respect for Brandon if he hadn't already made up most of his mind as to how to proceed before the bowl game.
is that Brandon had determined prior to the bowl game that a) he wasn't excited about keeping Rodriguez, but b) with a relatively small number of names being tossed about as available candidates and the best one not available until very late in the hiring cycle, the best option would be to keep RR and force defensive changes (new coordinator, etc.) for the coming season. A 9- or 10-win season in 2011 would have put doubts to rest for a while, and anything less would have removed all doubt.
But after the bowl, another season with RR would have been disastrous if it ended similarly ... Brandon went from "there isn't an easily-obtainable upgrade" to "here's the door." (I actually wondered briefly if Brandon would actually keep RR around for another year just to spite ESPN and company, but the fallout from another bad season would probably take him down too.)
Maybe that's just projection. I'd have preferred one more chance, seeing if it would work with a solid DC (assuming one were available and interested), but hell, I didn't even watch the bowl all the way through. I can't defend that.
I don't think we saw any new problems in the bowl game
No, we didn't. We saw the exact same problems as in the regular season, even though RR & Co. had 15 practices to get his guys ready to play one game. The team mailed it in in the second half and got destroyed, and there were rumblings that players were no longer buying in. Meanwhile, the parents of players were coming to Brandon and complaining about RR. Given all this, I don't think he had much alternative. If you still believed in RR, great. But a lot of members of the program (not to mention a huge number of fans), it seems, did not.
I think people were expecting to see improvement after weeks to prepare for one opponent and to get healthy. The defense being awful wasn't a surprise, and we knew we couldn't kick, but the offense falling off the face of the earth (again) was bitterly disappointing.
Had we lost 52-35 or something like that, I would have continued believing RR deserved another year. A 38 point margin of defeat though, was atrocious. I've looked through past seasons a couple of times, and 38 points appears to be our largest margin of defeat since the end of the 1935 season.
I was hoping we'd see new wrinkles and better execution and...something to make me believe the offense really was on its way to becoming a juggernaut. Instead, it was a few moments of brilliance coupled with mistakes, poor execution, and lack of scoring.
In short, I expected to see a team which was motivated and seemingly well prepared to put its best foot forward. I didn't feel at all like that's what was on display. For me personally, that was what prompted me to throw my hands up and say "I give up. This just isn't working."
Not that losing by 38 to anyone is ok, but Mississippi St. is/was a good team. The SEC West is the best division in football. Being 5th isn't so bad when you're sitting behind Auburn, Alabama, LSU, and Arkansas
Fuzz (if I may call you that), I like most of your post. Really, I do. But I think you went off the rails a bit on Hoke.
He's far from the worst option and I'd never take an "Anyone but Brady" stance, but I'd be very disappointed if he got hired here.
Please watch some interviews of the guy and let me know if you see presence / intelligence / intangibles anywhere near a successful BCS coach. I just don't see any of those with Hoke.
For what it's worth, I never saw them in satisfying amounts with Rodriguez, either. I had hopes that his "football IQ" would be enough. Alas ...
I agree that it's much better for us all to chill out a bit and wait for the denouement before we freak out. But as I said on another thread, that does not mean that the criticisms of Brandon aren't valid to a large extent.
I wouldn't think it would be necessary to enumerate the reasons why a January coaching search is undesirable, but here goes:
- Recruiting. Having your program be coachless, and unable to take visits, right when some of your best prospects are making up their minds, is obviously a recipe for a poor recruiting class. Check out the interview with Webb in the DFP today - we're almost certain to lose out on some top defensive prospects as a result of this. A new coach will have enough challenges meeting expectations for near-immediate success without having to drag along a bad recruiting class.
- Any candidate we bring along now will be creating an identical headache for the program he is leaving, increasing the chances of the kind of public spectacle we saw with RichRod/WVU or Kiffin/Tennessee. For a coach making the jump from a mid-major, like Hoke, this is less of a problem. But for people like Fitzgerald, Mullen, Pelini, Gundy, it has to be a significant consideration.
- Dumping RichRod in January made it a great deal more difficult for his assistants to get jobs for the coming year. A prospective new coach who is trying to figure out what kind of guy DB is has to notice this. And a corollary to this is that it will be more difficult for the new guy to find assistants right now.
- Coaches are, in general, less physically and mentally available right now as they hit the road closing out their recruiting classes. I'm sure Hoke will be thrilled to get the call whenever, but for a number of other prospects, I'm sure they'll be thinking "why the F didn't we have this conversation a month ago?"
- Edit: And by far the most obvious, you give yourself much less time to get it right. A several week process started in early December is no big deal. Now, the closer you get to NSD, the more the impression of a program in chaos takes hold - exactly what DB said he was trying to change. So you can't really afford to spend much time wooing or negotiating with any one candidate, even if you think he's the best choice.
So yes, Brandon absolutely should have fired RR in early December. Listen to that presser again: every reason DB listed for making the change was as true then as it was yesterday. As I said on the other thread, I think DB fell victim to the executive's tendency to stick to the decision process, and ignore current circumstances. But sometimes, it's a bad assumption that tactical circumstances don't affect long-term outcomes. DB absolutely can still pull this out, but he made it far riskier and more difficult for everyone involved by waiting.
As to Hoke, I really don't have the qualifications to assess how good a football coach he is. He may well be very good, and if he's the pick, I'm going to support him because the alternative is to stop being a Michigan fan. But his resume is not very impressive, and his personality is hardly scintillating. These things would matter a lot less if he were chosen over a bunch of other top names after an extended search process. As it is, a Hoke hire would almost unavoidably be seen by many as a second-tier choice forced on us by a rushed January search process, fairly or not. And that's hardly the way to generate unity in the Michigan base.
An aside, OT to your post: I'm not impressed by the argument that the mid-January Tressel hire worked so well. I suspect that Tressel is, in fact, the exception to the rule, and that there just aren't many or even any other examples of successes like it.
Consider yourself virtually "+1"-d.
As Ed McMahon used to occasionally say to Johnny, "You are correct, sir." I'd give you a satchel full of points if I could. Alas, I can only quote Ed McMahon.
DB's doing a fine job and his presser did nothing to change my mind. It's not DB's job to puke out every detail of every contact he had with everyone just so we can squeal like a bunch of chimps about the good and the bad of it--I don't want Chatty Cathy as our AD. You'd have to be an idiot to think that the search began yesterday. DB even discounted that by stating that having a "Plan B" is something that has always been contemplated.
As for the Brady Hoke angle, I've got no problem with the guy. The guy we just let go had a monstrously good run in the few years prior to his hire--and he failed here. The stories of wierd coaching hires that turn out special (Pete Carrol at USC, Bill Belichek with the Pats) are legion. Lets all relax and trust our AD. I think he's earned as much.
There's also something to be said about a guy who adores M as much as Hoke does...a guy who has the balls and moral honesty to tell his current employer that his career goal is to coach someplace else. To me, that's refreshing. It's the fabric of a guy who will clearly communicate the singular importance of beating OSU and MSU rather than just "awe shucks"-ing through a muddled remark about how all of the games are important. Does his M love make him a better coach. At the very least it makes him a much better recruiter. And yes, the guy can coach. That said, he's among many qualified candidates. Perhaps he won't be "the one" but damnit, he's not a steaming pile of coaching crap either. Yeesh.
When "Brian on WTKA" gets over 100 posts...
so, how was everyone's christmas? Did everyone get what they wanted for kwanza? Do you even get anything for Kwanza? I really have no idea and no I am not going to look it up.
We LiveBlogged a press conference yesterday.
I think we've jumped that particular shark...
EDIT: Video evidence:
than to Hoke. Clearly not the brightest spark that ever came down the wire, from the interview posted above, but probably wouldn't destroy the program. Brian's going to need to cool it in his antagonism--which borders on rudeness--or cement his status on the outside, increasingly isolated--not through a principled response to this complete cock-up, but hot-headedness.
I've got news for people, too. We have stopped being an elite program. As I said when Lloyd quit, unreasonable expectations were going to be the death of UM football. Now we try to make Michigan a contender once again, period.
And the search for someone who is a Michigan man is the stupidest, most corrosive bullshit ever, the Hanta virus of Ann Arbor. Martin went out of his way to get someone who wasn't one, now we're going for one? Unmitigated horse-pucky. First time I ever agreed with that mediocrity Henning--that horse ain't going back into the stable. Stupid people never knew how good they had it with Lloyd, and we'll never know how it might have been with RichRod. BUT that truly worthy goal of competing and being in the 9-10 win range was within our grasp WITH him for next year, when he could finally have his players on the field, no excuses. With NO VIABLE REPLACEMENT in sight firing him was a disaster. BOTTOM LINE: Firing Rich Rod in November would have meant the possibility of preserving the recruiting class and team and possibly winning next year. Now we are ABSOLUTELY assured of another long hard transition.
Fielding some good competing teams and being in the big games with kids who graduate should be the goal now, down the road. This is a massive rebuilding job, and not just of a football team.
I don't care if the fans thought Brandon acquited himself well yesterday; he looked like a scared guy who knew he had f'd up.
it seems like everyone wants this person that doesn't exist. If JH doesn't come, then who? Not Hoke, not this guy, not that guy. Miles is probably the most viable candidate. Does 10 wins consistently at LSU mean anything? End of story. Quit your whinning.
Can't upvote, but +1 to you sir.
Miles wins because he (over) stocks his program with regional recruits and has an open checkbook to hire assistants. He may be able to grab assistants when he's here, but the recruiting situation - and the academic standards - will be far, far different at Michigan. There's no guarantee he'd win here.
Beyond all that, dude's an absolutely shady, unscrupulous character. I want Michigan to win, but I'm not willing to trade having a head coach who lies to his players before cutting their scholarships or runs the type of shitshow that was going on at Okie State before Gundy took over. Just like last coaching search, there will be people like you who don't give a shit about all that and would become The U North for more wins. I hope you never become the majority of the fan base (or that you haven't already.)
a corndog fool and a prick to boot. You think people made fun of RichRod's accent? Stop--through the prejudice--and listen he was a bright, bright guy. Miles can't string two sentences even to finish his third-grader's homework; the discontent would begin two seconds after the celebrations that he was coming. And--what's more--he ain't coming.
Why doesn't Brian discuss Miles? I understand and agree with his distaste over his oversigning but that doesn't mean Brandon isn't considering him. Brandon was talking about spending $$$ so I don't see the buyout as a huge problem and LSU fans certainly haven't ade him feel entirely safe at his job this year. I'm not advocating, I'm just saying it's a possibility.
That's way over the top and frankly, disrespectful to the gut that runs this amazing site. If you want to disagree with Brian, or think that he is being WAY overly dramatic, fine. Maybe he is. Maybe his hate of Hoke is over the top.
But, this is his blog. He created it, runs and and keeps it as the best forum for UM football. It is downright disrespectful to come on to his blog and personally attack him.
You, my friend, are very lucky that the + / - feature of this blog is broken, or you would be seeing the inside of a Bolivian jail from many members of this fine community.
Brian hates Lloyd Carr? That's the stupidest fucking thing I ever read. Seriously. That's the MGoPosting equivalent of Two Girls One Cup combined with the giant distended anus picture.
Oh, and in case you didn't notice, Mississippi State didn't pay the two hundred grand for Newton, because Newton's not at Mississippi State.
from his take on Lloyd. He criticized Lloyd's gamesmanship and thought he was ready to go (and he was). Snarky, maybe, but I never saw Brian being cruel about Lloyd. And my criticism of Brian now is an appeal to think carefully. . . because I admire him and what he has created here.
P.S. As soon as I hear someone say "get a haircut"--well, Nixon is well and truly dead, man. Move forward a few decades, if you freakin can.
You Were Killed By a Bear and I Am Sad." Brian's feelings on Lloyd and the end of his era are complicated and not as you present them.
When Two Girls One Cup gets thrown into a coaching discussion. +50 to you
the whole don't hire Miles thing is getting on my nerves. So sick of people
Plenty of other Michigan blogs out there. Why exactly are you here then if you can't stand the person who runs the site?
Brian doesn't need you to run to his rescue, seriously. People can disagree with him, it's fine. This guy took it over the top for sure though. Just because he's here doesn't mean he can't express his opinions about how Brian is acting (in a more constructive manner, of course), which, is kind of childish.
I think he would be a great fit. He didn't succeed at Miami, but I think he fits a lot better at Michigan.
As Desmond put it, he did all the right things at Miami, but he didn't win. I would prefer a coach with a weaker resume and apparently stronger morals ... no complimentary cars or oversigning here, please.
I guess the problem is that he's got a resume like Fitzgerald's, but at an elite-ish school. (Hanging around .500 in the ACC seems easier than doing so in the Big Ten.) So then you'd have to make the case that there are factors here that would help him do what he couldn't in Coral Gables.
Mullen would be a great candidate it available. First he kicked our ass. Second, living here in FL I can say that Florida has not been the same since he left. Also, he is young, a great recruiter and it wouldn't take years of change to compete. He could basically be up and running next year with Denard.
Bo Pelini - I absolutely love this guy. Fiery, defensive focused, can recruit, resurrected a completely moribund Nebraska team. Brandon should be on speed dial with Pelini like yesterday.
I'm not sure he wants to leave Nebraska but dear lord that would be a great save.
KC Keeler - Delaware - great coach, great record, can recruit the areas we want to recruit and I personally believe would come to Michigan if offered. Also very young and hungry. Plus I am a big fan of the no huddle in college. It is harder to prepare for than even the pros.
Mike Belloti - I don't think we can get him but he would have the offense humming and taking the next step. Chip Kelly is a great coach but a lot of those recruits were Mike Belloti's.
Everyone else is a pipe dream or an unmitigated nightmare. As weird as this sounds Bo Pelini is your best bet. Minimal disruption to the current team and has the ability to get the defense churning again.
Mike Belloti is 60 years old. There is no way we're hiring a coach that will retire in 4-5 years.
I think he would be a great hire, I've brought up his name several times. I think you run into a similar problem with him as with Fitz though. Keeler is Mr. Delaware. Player and coach, he loves it there and is a local hero. It would be hard for him to give that up to go to a place where people are hating him immediately (b/c he isn't a big name hire).
But the main question I have for Brady Hoke is, "Did you see why the masses wanted Lloyd out"? If Hoke comes in and runs plays like Mike DoBord, it won't work. And since Brady worked under the old guard, has he changed?
I live in SoCal and have watched more than a few games this year because my roomate went to SDSU. That team resembles nothing of a Lloyd Carr Michigan team....just saying. People are way to quick to jump to conclusions about a guy who, in recent years, has quite frankly, kicked ass. Plus, it doesn't hurt that he really has a passion for MICHIGAN, not another dollar in his pocket.
The masses didn't want Lloyd out. It was a small, but very vocal, minority that wanted Lloyd out. To the extent that people did want Lloyd to step down, aside from this minority of people, it was only during the last 2 years when he was obviously ready to retire and slowing down.
I would add that the masses were generally content with Lloyd himself, but just wanted him to tweak his staff and approach to the game (take more risks) somewhat. That's pretty normal coach-criticism.
I don't remember anyone asking for Lloyd to step down while we were undefeated going into Columbus in 2006
You aren't going to get Mullen. If Florida can't get Mullen, Michigan won't get Mullen.
And on the topic of Harbaugh and Hoke. Harbaugh is not coming here. The reasons are probably multitudinous but at the end of the day he has a pro football ego. That is what people have conveniently forgotten. Jim Harbaugh is one of the most egotistical coaches out there. This is neither negative or positive - it is realism. And he wants to prove himself on the biggest stage to say he proved himself on the biggest stage. I also think that he will not succeed at the level he perceives he will. You can't pick your players in the pros. The great pro coaches were great NFL coordinators. They understand the NFL game AS A COORDINATOR. Meaning they draw up their own schemes, face constant match ups everyday and understand the speed of the game. The great thing about college is you can just get whatever talent you want (either recruiting them like Michigan used to do or giving them a used car dealership like Ohio State does). Harbaugh will miss that decided advantage of impressionable kids that are hand picked listening to his every word. Oh well - he'll learn.
Bo Pelini is your best bet if you can get him. Shame we couldn't get Al Golden - he will do very well at Miami,
Interesting contrast between Singletary and Harbaugh by Mike Lombardi, former candidate for 49ers GM position: nfl.com
If we hired him, he might be our best defensive player.
I wonder if Brandon's going to make an overture to Mike Gundy. I mean, if Pat Fitzgerald is an option, why not look into a better version of Fitzgerald?
How old is Gundy?
Gundy want the Texas job if it came open? Would he want to come to the Midwest where he has no ties whatsoever?
He is a very underrated coach but I suspect he doesn't want to leave the southwest area
Worth a shot. You never know what can happen if Brandon opens the checkbook.
I'll preface this with saying it's not my personal opinion, but I'm pretty sure Gundy would fall into the same 'outsider' column that Rodriguez landed in with the old guard at Michigan. Where Rodriguez was seen as a bit corn-pone, Gundy would come across as a Southwestern car salesman. Not saying that's right, but I guarantee he'd have the same rough ride as Rodriguez.
Also primarily an offensive-minded guy, no?
His background is offense, yes. I can see how that'd be a turnoff, but I think it'd be a mistake to make that a deal-breaker.
Also, there are really only three candidates that would satisfy the "no outsiders" crowd: Harbaugh, who doesn't want the job; Miles, who is sleazy and was reportedly torpedoed as a candidate in 2007 by the old guard; and Hoke, who is mediocre. Confining the search to those three to satisfy "those people" would be a disaster, frankly. Whatever the size and volume of that wing of the fanbase (I'd say it's debatable, but they certainly exist) they should be ignored for thinking that the only thing that can make you a Michigan Man is having worn the colors once before. They're like the redneck father in the old joke who learns that his son's fiancee is a virgin and tells him that "if she ain't good enough for her family she ain't good enough for ours."
Well, whoever comes next will have a big advantage over RR. He's coming after three abysmal years instead of 40 straight winning seasons. Also everyone's so tired all but the most fanatic RR supporters will embrace the new coach. While RR would have been strung up at 7-5 in 2011, the new coach can say 7-5 is just his first year and that now that his system's in place, the sun will come out again tomorrow. I'm not saying that's right, but that's just the way it is. You never want to succeed Dean Smith, you want to succeed Dean Smith's successor.
Please and thanks.
It's segment 8-10 entitled "Sam with Brian Cook". I apparently don't skim lists very well.
Brian might not be happy about it, but Miles is at the top of the list (well, after JH) and it seems he does want the job. Brian at least should be comforted that Brady Hoke is no one's first choice (thank God).
I know that Brian and some on this board have listed the "options" but at this point, we don't know who is available. When we did our 2007 search, NOBODY mentioned RR. Nobody. Becuase nobody knew we had a shot to get him. For all we know, DB might unearth another big name coach that would be willing to leave his stable job to come here.
EDIT: Also, When Lloyd took over the team, he was not a "big name" hire and he won a National Championship, several B10 championships and took us to quite a few Rose Bowls.
...Kirk Ferentz. Of course.
Ross is not working for Michigan here. He took his CEO of FB operations and his GM with him to meet with Harbaugh. They are out to get Harbaugh to coach Miami in the NFL. Unless Harbaugh has a massive change of heart, he is not coming to Michigan.
Parcells is still the guy calling the football shots in Miami, and if Harbaugh were to gain control, Ireland may be OK, but I get the feeling that Parcells won't (he has a huge ego too).
Parcells is done at Miami. Did he not retire during the season?
Yes people are sounding a little despondent but good part is that I think we've all learned a lot about big league coaching and where our school's program fits - and people are having really intelligent discussions about it.
I like Brandon. Hell, I am hardly a Republican and I probably could not last in the same room as him very long. But he isn't a dummy by any stretch and, given the challenges, he is taking all the key points under consideration in going about his work.
Why Coach Rod did not work out in Ann Arbor is complicated, but from the day Brandon began as AD he has made it his business to understand what was going on with that. He could still really mess this up because there are plenty of ways to do that, but I respect how he is going about things right now.
At best he's a less attractive candidate than Hoke.
At worst he's a mediocre coach doing mediorce things at a mediorce program.
But I think he's a better fit than Hoke, because he runs the same system, and he's a very good coach at a very poor program doing mediocre things. I see both him and Hoke as largely unwritten pages, with the biggest difference being that Hoke would be a messier transition.
I don't think he's "less attractive" than Hoke at all? I mean, how so? Northwestern is at a severe competitive disadvantage. Probably the worst competitive disadvantage in the whole country outside of Vanderbilt. No history, crippling academic requirements, small alumni base, lousy crowds. I think having a decent winning record there is light years more impressive than one at San Diego State.
Agreed, the simple fact that he's coached in the Big 10 against our identical schedule with moderage success puts him lightyears ahead of Hoke.
If JH backed out of an informal agreement with us at the last minute, and used us to leverage NFL teams, I will take back my support for him and forever deem him a turd.
Even moreso if he actually is interviewing for a job in a position that is still filled (unless Sparano has been fired)...
Brandon has shown a propensity to float things in the media. We all agree on this, yes? I think he's floating Hoke. To test the waters. And maybe to set thing up for a bigger name coach. Everyone would then seem pleasantly surprised.