The Brady Hoke Style...

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March 28th, 2011 at 11:53 AM
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GoBlue21
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The Brady Hoke Style...

I received an email from a buddy of mine that I would like to share with everyone. We all know that Brady Hoke "gets it" at Michigan and this is just another example...

The following was sent to me by a fellow UM grad who lives in Seattle.  I thought the group might be interested in the coaching style of a true “Michigan Man”!   The first two items below have been given out in speeches to alumni groups (as has the "Strikes Policy") - so it is not secret.   (1) The beginning of each team meeting:   Hoke walks into the room and yells "good afternoon" ... the team is then expected to respond with great passion and enthusiasm "good afternoon."  Then Hoke says "championships" ... the team is expected to respond with great passion and enthusiasm ... "42" ... the number of Big Ten championships Michigan has won.  The Hoke says "Michigan" ... the team is expected to respond with great passion and enthusiasm ... "132" ... the number of years Michigan has played football.  Finally, Hoke screams "beat" ... the team is expected to respond with incredible passion and enthusiasm ... "Ohio."   (2) Also, when Hoke is introduced to the alumni group he says, "Don't applaud for me" and then asks any former players to stand - and has the audience applaud for them. Hoke says, "This is not about me - it is about YOU and the Michigan tradition."   This all goes over big of course.   +++++++   (3) One other thing -- the main emphasis in practice as far as the D goes: missed tackles. A kid who misses a tackle barely escapes with his life (figuratively of course) ... kids getting this treatment say to their friends after practice, "I will never miss another tackle again."  



 

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March 28th, 2011 at 11:57 AM | Good Stuff (Score:1)
brewandbluesaturdays
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He does truly seem like he gets it, and I hope that is reflected on the field. As we all know, his perception at Michigan will ultimately come down to wins and losses and I have a good feeling about where he will end up in that category in his time at Michigan.

David Cone is my homeboy...

March 28th, 2011 at 12:37 PM | wiping ass (Score:1)
Mitch Cumstein
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aren't all men supposed to wipe their ass away from their balls?  I just figured that was the right way to go about it.

"A flute with no holes is not a flute. A donut with no hole is a danish"

March 28th, 2011 at 5:42 PM | My only issue with the "Hoke (Score:1)
jmblue
Joined: 11/07/2008
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My only issue with the "Hoke Gets It" reminders is the implication that RR was oblivious.

Maybe you're looking for something that isn't actually there.  If Hoke had gotten the job three years ago, there'd probably be a lot of the same articles written, but would people have taken them as a knock on Lloyd Carr?

March 28th, 2011 at 8:01 PM | I agree with you Hail 2 victors but (Score:1)
no joke its hoke
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RR wasnt given a chance from day one! He could have came in a won the Big Ten the last 3 years and there would still be a group that would have hated him. I hope that doesnt happen again at Michigan and I wish Hoke all the luck in the world and I think he will do fine.

Vice.com

March 29th, 2011 at 2:16 PM | Whether or not Hoke "gets it" (Score:1)
BlueTimesTwo
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Whether or not Hoke "gets it" more than RR did, he is benefitting from the perception that he does.  While this has the side effect of unfairly dumping on RR, Rich is no longer our coach.  For the time being I just hope that this perception helps us in the media and with recruiting.  Especially at a time when OSU is getting a lot of bad publicity for their coach acting like a dirtbag, it doesn't hurt to have the media on our side for once.

"People who love sausage and respect the law should never watch either being made."

March 28th, 2011 at 2:19 PM | Straight off of Scout (Score:1)
Maize and Blue ...
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Not paraphrased or anything.  Word for word off of a pay site.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:01 PM | Ugh.  RichRod's problem was (Score:1)
wile_e8
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Ugh.  RichRod's problem was never that he didn't "get it" and wasn't a "Michigan Man".  His problem was that, for whatever reason, he couldn't put together even an average defense.  Of all the points in the email, only the third is relevant.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:10 PM | I could not agree with you (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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I could not agree with you more. The whole "Michigan Man" thing is idiotic, overused, and basically meaningless. And what does Hoke "get" that Rodriguez didn't, exactly? That winning is important? That Michigan is a hugely successful football program? That OSU is our biggest rival?

That, plus the OP's moronic Calvin peeing avatar just pissed me off.

(I'm also really happy to hear that the D is focusing on tackling.)

I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:13 PM | Are you honestly denying that (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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Are you honestly denying that Brady Hoke has more of a passion and understanding for Michigan Football than Rich Rodriguez had?

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 12:24 PM | The point is that passion and (Score:1)
wile_e8
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The point is that passion and understanding for Michigan Football is irrelevant.  What matters is fielding a solid defense and winning football games.  If Rodriguez had done either of those, all the derping derpers would have came to a much different conclusion on Rodriguez's passion and understanding of Michigan Football.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:31 PM | "The point is that passion (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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"The point is that passion and understanding for Michigan Football is irrelevant."

So, do people really believe this?

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 12:34 PM | If we repeat RR's record (Score:1)
wlubd
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If we repeat RR's record (15-22) for the next 3 years, I'm pretty sure Hoke's passion and understanding isn't going to mean much to fans. Winning cures a lot.

Twitter

March 28th, 2011 at 12:36 PM | I don't know that I'd go as (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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I don't know that I'd go as far as to say it's "irrelevant," but I think it's way over emphasized. No amount of passion will make up for a lack of coaching ability.

Having a Michigan super-fan as a coach is fine and good, but I think of it this way, will extra passion and emphasis on Michigan tradition translate to actually winning any extra games? I'd wager no.

I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:49 PM | "extra passion and emphasis (Score:1)
jg2112
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"extra passion and emphasis on Michigan tradition" probably helps with recruiting. Better recruiting will mean a better defense.

So, indirectly, I think you're wrong - emphasis on Michigan tradition means an emphasis on defense, which means more wins.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:53 PM | Fair enough, I'll acknowledge (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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Fair enough, I'll acknowledge that Hoke's Michigan passion probably plays very well with recruits (it sure does with the media, and I definitely like it, even if I'm skeptical of its on-field effects).

I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

March 28th, 2011 at 5:46 PM | Tradition (Score:1)
Cope
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actually does win games. Guys believe in it. Because of it guys believe they are supposed to win. You walk into a room with national champions all over the walls and you begin to believe you're supposed to be the next. The mental edge is huge in sports- it's as fundamental to championships as technique. Because when it gets tough and no one has anything to give left, the guy who is mentally tougher (believes the most) wins.

This is true in any sport.

A Journey of Father and Son
http://mysonsfirstbible.blogspot.com/2013/05/15-things-you-may-have-miss...

March 28th, 2011 at 6:16 PM | Exactly right. Notre Dame's (Score:1)
maizenbluedevil
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Exactly right.

Notre Dame's program over the past 10 years exemplifies exactly this.

Oh wait....

 

CJK5H

March 28th, 2011 at 11:26 PM | Of course there's more to it (Score:1)
Cope
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But if you don't understand a tradition of success is a huge mental edge in the big games if used by the coach to inspire the team that they are better than the opposition, then you don't understand coaching.
There are certainly other factors. Even other factors that coaches can use to inspire. But a history of success in which the athletes believe they deserve to win is unquestionably a decided advantage. This is a factor that only champions and successful coaches realize.
If the preparation is there, the mental battle is everything.

I don't know if Notre Dame was preparing well, nor if they were utilizing this. Hoke seems to.

A Journey of Father and Son
http://mysonsfirstbible.blogspot.com/2013/05/15-things-you-may-have-miss...

March 28th, 2011 at 11:30 PM | You can neg all you want (Score:1)
Cope
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but I proved what I know by coaching top level teams

A Journey of Father and Son
http://mysonsfirstbible.blogspot.com/2013/05/15-things-you-may-have-miss...

March 28th, 2011 at 11:40 PM | I didn't neg you dawg. I (Score:1)
maizenbluedevil
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I didn't neg you dawg.

I actually somewhat agree with you, see my post below.

However, some people act as if it's the difference between success and failure.  

Can it contribute to success?  Yes.  But the way people talk about tradition and Michigan Man emotional ra-ra borders on magical thinking or voodoo or something....  as if having a Michigan Man who understood the tradition at the helm for the past 3 years would have somehow negated the effects of having a decimated defense, a kicker who couldn't hit field goals, etc.

 

CJK5H

March 29th, 2011 at 12:16 AM | Ok (Score:1)
Cope
Joined: 10/07/2010
MGoPoints: 1060

I read that post and this one and I agree a lot. Perhaps my post about a page down is more balanced on what I actually believe. I agree it's ridiculous to think that an inspirational speaker can put in what months of practice have not. I also was not talking about RR vs. Hoke. I see that many people are and at this point it's prob best left alone.

However, I'm sure RR was an emotional leader and I have no idea what he said in the locker room or if he "got it," whatever it was. I only think that I really like what Hoke is saying, the tradition that he's drawing upon, and that he understands a part that is hugely important to motivation in the practice room and at game time.

I think part of the problem is because nothings happened yet, only the mental coaching (ra-ra) that people have heard, there are still a lot of questions and probably hurts in relation to how quickly Hoke is being accepted by many as opposed to RR. I can understand that.
(Btw- I didn't assume you negged me, it's just surprising the stuff people will neg on here)
EDIT- I only got involved bc people were commenting against the effect of tradition, which I know is powerful. Your points seem valid and strong, as well.

A Journey of Father and Son
http://mysonsfirstbible.blogspot.com/2013/05/15-things-you-may-have-miss...

March 28th, 2011 at 12:57 PM | So, in your mind, does Hoke (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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So, in your mind, does Hoke have "a lack of coaching ability"?

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 1:03 PM | I never said that Hoke had a (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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I never said that Hoke had a lack of coaching ability. I'm just pointing out that being a good coach is more important than being passionate about a specific school.

I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

March 28th, 2011 at 1:09 PM | Part of being a "good" coach (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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Part of being a "good" coach is being passionate about a specific school and being able to sell that passion to the alums, the fanbase, players, and potential recruits.

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 1:16 PM | No one would have questioned (Score:1)
wile_e8
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No one would have questioned Rodriguez's passion for Michigan Football if he had won football games.  But he didn't, so he must not be a Michigan Man.

No one questioned Bo's passion for Michigan Football, despite coming from the MAC, having no ties to the program before the hiring, and doing assistant coaching at Ohio St.  But he won football games: Michigan Man.

March 28th, 2011 at 1:41 PM | We'll just agree to disagree, (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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We'll just agree to disagree, I'm afraid.  You seem to be unwilling to acknowledge the role emotion can play in the outcome of a sporting event.  One of the trump cards U-M has over almost every other program is it's rich tradition and history.  It's what makes it a special place to play.  It gives you something to play for -- something besides a scheme.  Why you wouldn't embrace that and play it up to your fans, alums, players, and potential recruits, I'll never understand.

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 3:09 PM | My point is that the fans, (Score:1)
wile_e8
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My point is that the fans, alums, players, and potential players care more about your record.  Whether or not those people think you "get it' or are a "Michigan Man" or embrace the program is entirely dependent on if you win games.

EDIT: I guess a better way to respond to what you said would be to say that I think whatever Hoke has the players say will help him win games about as much as putting OSU logos on the tackling dummies helped Rodriguez beat OSU: not much if the defense is atrocious.

March 28th, 2011 at 3:46 PM | I think Hoke will be much (Score:1)
raiderblue
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I think Hoke will be much better at motivating and inspiring our players, which in turn will probably lead to a much lower attrition rate. You can say passion doesn't matter, but RR did not have the same passion for Michigan football that Hoke has, and I think that does matter on the field. Nobody is saying this replaces talent as a coach, but it is a bonus to have.

March 28th, 2011 at 3:58 PM | I guess saying that passion (Score:1)
wile_e8
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I guess saying that passion for Michigan was irrelevant may have been a bad word to use for it, but as far as factors that help win football games, it's pretty far behind teaching your players how to tackle correctly, not lining up your linebackers in a position to fail, and getting your kicker to make more field goals than they miss.  And, while I'm sure Hoke's passion for Michigan will have a positive effect on the team, if (when) the team starts winning more games it will have more to do with getting the defenders to properly deploy zone coverage and not committing drive killing penalties and turnovers that prevent the team from having point totals equivalent to the gaudy yardage statistics than embracing the program and being a "Michigan Man".

March 28th, 2011 at 4:01 PM | Passion (Score:1)
MichFan1997
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I have it in spades for Michigan. Wouldn't help me coach the team. So as far as where it is on the list of things that help a coach...probably right at the bottom. I'm guessing most coaches enjoy and love the jobs they have, or else they probably wouldn't be doing it.

Follow me on Twitter @gfraley05

March 28th, 2011 at 4:10 PM | Enough with the strawmen already (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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Nobody is saying that passion is the sole qualification for being the U-M coach.  Give it a rest.

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 6:28 PM | Passion (Score:1)
raiderblue
Joined: 01/23/2011
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This wouldn't help you coach the team because you are not a football coach. That's probably why you don't understand that Hoke's passion is good for the team.  There is just more positive energy coming from Hoke than was coming from Rich Rod. In any case, if this doesn't translate to wins it doesn't matter.

March 28th, 2011 at 3:59 PM | Hoke has 342.49 passion (Score:1)
MichFan1997
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Rich Rod only had 29.20 passion

Follow me on Twitter @gfraley05

March 28th, 2011 at 6:50 PM | You (Score:1)
raiderblue
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are an idiot.

March 28th, 2011 at 2:11 PM | I heard RichRod used to tell (Score:1)
BigBlue02
Joined: 06/29/2009
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I heard RichRod used to tell alumni and fans to go fuck themselves and stick their traditions up their ass.

I am also very passionate about Michigan football. Where do I sign up to coach? I do love how people say RichRod didn't show any Passion for Michigan football....and then in the same breath make fun of him for getting emotional and singing at the banquet. I guess being passionate about Michigan football only counts when you are well liked

March 28th, 2011 at 3:32 PM | Amen! And by "well liked" (Score:1)
mGrowOld
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Amen! And by "well liked" you must be referring to the media who decided quickly that RR was bad and needed to be punished and Hoke is good and must be rewarded.

Am i the only one who reads the OP and thinks that stuff is a bit......well....forced? Seems rehersed versus spontanious.

 

 

March 28th, 2011 at 3:03 PM | I think this is where we just (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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I think this is where we just differ in our opinions and perceptions. There were clearly huge chunks of the fanbase (including alums and former players) who didn't think Rodriguez was passionate enough about Michigan (which is just another way of wording the whole "Rodriguez just didn't get it" argument).

I don't think anyone would argue that Rodriguez didn't have a problem selling himself to the chunks of the fanbase who thought he didn't "get it." I just think that this whole "Rodriguez shouldn't have been here and he failed here because he didn't get Michigan football" is dumb, overplayed, and way over emphasized.

By the way, I think it's oddly appropriate that this back and forth is with someone named "The Barwis Effect," something that has recently been heavily debated and (arguably) more or less debunked on the boards.

[EDIT: Just to clarify, I meant it's appropriate because we're debating whether not or Hoke's passion is a contributing factor in performance, much like the board was debating whether or not Barwis significantly contributed to performance. I wasn't implying that "The Barwis Effect" the poster has been debunked.]

I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

March 28th, 2011 at 2:20 PM | I think one thing that (Score:1)
MichFan1997
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gives people a reason to doubt Hoke's ability is his losing record at mid-major schools

Follow me on Twitter @gfraley05

March 28th, 2011 at 7:00 PM | Mid Major Doubts (Score:1)
raiderblue
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Maybe, but defending someone who's abilty was 15-22, makes me doubt you know what you are talking about.

March 28th, 2011 at 10:47 PM | believe it or not (Score:1)
MichFan1997
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it was actually more like 105-62 coming into Ann Arbor with BCS bowl wins. So excuse me if I can watch a coach with that resume come in and not succeed, and then have doubts that a coach with a sub-.500 record could come in and do better.

Follow me on Twitter @gfraley05

March 29th, 2011 at 1:13 AM | boom. (Score:1)
raiderblue
Joined: 01/23/2011
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Right, so you just admitted that you your analysis of Rich Rod was wrong, you were basing it on the win loss record, while not taking into account other factors. So what makes you think your analysis of Brady Hoke is right, if you are basing it on the same factors that were proven wrong the first time? 

March 29th, 2011 at 10:50 AM | And then... (Score:1)
coastal blue
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One could say that we can't base RR's tenure at Michigan on his 15-22 record and look at the big picture: What he inherited in comparison to other hires, abnormal levels of attrition, the local media throwing pile after pile of undeserved negative press on him, never playing a 2nd year starter at the QB position...

 

 

March 29th, 2011 at 12:30 PM | I don't agree, he inherited a (Score:1)
raiderblue
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I don't agree, he inherited a team of big ten caliber football players, every team has players that graduate and leave early, but they don't necessarily drop to 3-9. This is college football, teams change over every year. The abnormal levels of attrition I would put a lot on Rich Rods player management style, and unwillingness to adapt his style to the players on hand. A lot of the negative press was due to his losing, and ncaa investigation related to practicing. I will admit there were some that didn't like him from the beginning, and were not ready for the change in football philosophy. I was a staunch supporter of Rich Rod, but 3 years into it I lost faith that he could get the job done. 

March 28th, 2011 at 1:29 PM | Anyone remember Muddy (Score:1)
PM
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Anyone remember Muddy Waters?  (the coach, not the bluesman.)  Plenty of rah, rah spirit for the green people up north but not much big time coaching ability.  Just the same, legit enthusiasm is part of the equation - so long as it's matched but coaching ability. Or, to put it another way, motivating players is part of what it takes to be a good coach. One without the other will leave you short in the all important win column.

go blue

March 28th, 2011 at 12:39 PM | I'm sure their are a lot of (Score:1)
wile_e8
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I'm sure their are a lot of people that think RR's failure was somehow tied to his lack of Michigan Man-ness.  I'm sure these same people will use Hoke's future success or failure as some sort of post hoc justification of his Michigan Man-ness, or lack there of.  These people are idiots.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:43 PM | I think you've hit the nail (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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I think you've hit the nail on the head. It's totally a "No true Scotsman" kind of argument.

(I've been eagerly awaiting an opportunity to use this, and you've just given the perfect example of it!)

I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

March 28th, 2011 at 12:56 PM | Great reference! (Score:1)
UM4ME
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Just looked it up, thanks for the link. No TRUE Michigan Man ...

March 28th, 2011 at 1:08 PM | Dude, it's coaching football (Score:1)
MichFan1997
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understanding some mythical bullshit isn't going to help you win. Fielding a good defense and finding a kicker who could actually get the ball THROUGH the uprights was what he needed to help him win, not "understanding" some ill-defined thing.

Follow me on Twitter @gfraley05

March 28th, 2011 at 1:17 PM | So, what is the point of your (Score:1)
The Barwis Effect
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So, what is the point of your signature again?

"[T]here were a lot of people predicting glorious heights for Rich; mostly the same people who are predicting doom and gloom [for Hoke]. Excuse me if I doubt their prognostication skills." -- M-Wolverine

March 28th, 2011 at 1:21 PM | Oh snap! (Score:1)
GoBlueInNYC
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I am this close to going all Dark Blue in here.

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