He was also emphatic about not spreading it out. 7-5 here we come.
Honestly, Hoke needs to grow a pair and pull a Mack Brown and fire Borges. Maybe not now, but def at the end of the season.
landing spot. will be interesting to see how he does.
He was also emphatic about not spreading it out. 7-5 here we come.
Honestly, Hoke needs to grow a pair and pull a Mack Brown and fire Borges. Maybe not now, but def at the end of the season.
I still doubt that Hoke would do so unless there was extreme pressure from Brandon.
they've been buds for years and it's fairly obvious that they're on the same wavelength. I think Hoke would go down with Borges rather than fire him
I don't want to see 2009 all over again. Way too many Ohio fans there. That was embarrassing.
We are not the 2009 team. This team is young and talented. They will get better. The game with Ohio will be hotly contested.
I wish I could maintain this level of delusion. Ohio is overrated but they're far better than us.
Agree with your premise, but I have faith in this team getting better each week.
OSU went undefeated last year, had the game at home, and we played them close. A lot of people think we blew that game. It's not inconceivable to think that we'll be competitive, although I understand the pessimism.
However, keep in mind that last year's team had lost 2 games already at this point in the season and barely survived against a bad Air Force team at home.
"Alot of people think we blew that game." You mean the day many of us turned on Al for doing basically the same thing he did on Saturday?
Well, people's main complaint was that they went away from running the ball with Denard at RB as he was the only effective rusher we had. Reports were however that Denard was injured in the 2nd half, which is why we went away from him.
These are the types of things fans are sometimes completely unaware of. They put it all on the coaches, but on occasion, shit happens. One of your best players gets injured and you try to work around it, but the other teams are not just empty suits. They have intelligent coaches as well, and are able to take advantage of another team's misfortune.
All things being equal, one team losing a key component of their team necessarily puts them at a disadvantage. There isn't always a way to scheme your way out of a hole. We like to pretend that there is, but that's not reality.
Even if Denard was hurt, was running Vincent Smith up the middle 20x really the next best option? Last Saturday looked like a repeat of that inane play calling.
Honestly, some folks around here are getting delusional with how bad they think it is. Look, Saturday wasn't pretty, and neither were Akron/Uconn. But they're 5-1, and are one made field goal or one less circus catch away from 6-0. They didn't get blown out by PSU, unlike in 2010.
ANd let's not forget that they still beat ND, handily. You may not think that's a quality win, but I still do. ND beat Arizona State, and MSU. Don't forget ASU beat Wisconsin (obviously thanks to the refs...but still, they won). They're not a bad team.
And also, college football is just weird sometimes. Oklahoma easily beat ND and then gets stomped by a flailing Texas.
And as a disclaimer for the above, I'm not saying that the offense isn't a major concern. Because it is. Especially the play calling combined with the futility of running the ball because of the offensive line. But, some folks around here are getting out of hand with the "this team sucks, throw away the season, fire Borges" talk.
It's just one loss. There's still too much season left to know where this team will end up But it's still just one.
(edit: meant in reply to goblue20111)
Use some common sense. This is year three. The only reason you're disappointed with 5-1 is because they worked freaking miracles in year one.
I never said he should be fired. I was responding to the post above.
Did you watch akron, Uconn and especially the Penn state game? We could easily be 2-3 right now and probably should be 2-3. The defensive coaches worked miracles, the offensive coaches didn't do anything special and the offense has gotten worse year to year and week to week.
If Hoke loves Michigan as much as he says he does then he won't let Borges's play acting as an offensive coordinator continue
We could be 2-3 because we gave up over 40 points to Akron and UCONN. And 43 to PSU. The defense worked miracles?
How soon you forget all the turnovers. Use your brain.
And Borges threw all of those. Now I really wonder why he keeps trying to run the ball!
Your argument/bitchfest was we gave up a lot of points. I just explained why we gave up a lot of points.
idiotic Borges apologist and need to stay off the internet for at least the rest of this season
For accuracy's sae, the defense gave up 21 to Akron and 14 to UConn.
*Also took near miracles to beat 2 of the absolute worst teams in college football, and have shown an incredible lack of player development at key positions, namely qb and interior line.
Borges is the QB coach and OC. denard regressed under his watch. garnder has not improved at all. the play calling is pathetic. this all points to one thing: get rid of BORGES.
how can anyone do a thorough review of Borges and NOT conclude that he has failed as both QB coach and offensive coordinator?
NONE of our QB's have improved in their decision making (AND IT AIN'T FOOTWORK - MORON) and the play calling in the PSU game is proof positive that Borges in indeed a MORON.
It's Hoke's job to be the CEO of this football program ... and while it tough to fire an employee (and several of us have had to this in our job), this needs to be done because in 3 years Borges has failed to get results in HIS area of responsibility. Football has changed over the last 10 years and Borges has not. Sadly - the truth is that this team will never win a B1G championship with Borges as OC.
So what about 2011? Was that a massive failure of a season?
What about last year, when he took a guy who had been playing WR the whole off-season and first half of the year and turned him into an extremely competent QB overnight?
Do we just pretend like those things never happened?
I can see where you're coming from as a lot of the criticisms with regard to play calling and line play have been valid, but let's not go overboard here.
You're being hyperbolic, and a negative nancy with some of the rhetoric.
We were a judgment call from the Booth review of that TD pass by Va Tech of a loss there. We didnt play well on O that day at all. Our D won that game and some clutch kicking by Gibbons and way too much credit is given to Borges for that win by some of our fans capping a pretty good season by our D.
I have yet to see Al Borges put back to back good gameplans in for us... Sad
We still won the game along with 10 other games that season, and you didn't address any other points I made.
2011 - the year Hoke would go for it on 4th down from the Michigan side of the field, or call for a fake FG. Everything was new and shiny ... with no experience there was no precedent, no predictability.
Well the shine is gone and EVERYONE knows about the PREDICTABILITY.
PSU used 4 defensive tackles as their D-line and then put 4 LB's against us AND Borges calls run after run after run, even though PSU was never going to be able to defend the pass. LastHoke - you have plenty to say ... but the facts are the facts, and Borges just doesn't understand it.
Seriously, your wall must be littered with awards. Borges is better at his job than maybe 80% of his peers. He just isn't perfect like you. Take a step back and look at this. Is it fair to judge an offensive coordinator who has to work with that offensive line? With a quarterback who seems to be targeting the other team? This is year 3. And Borges has been part of 24 wins. It's time to build. I've seen starting over. It's for the birds.
Denard regressed because he will never be a non spread option run first QB. You can blame Borges for square peg/round hole, but Denard was never meant to be a Pro QB anymore than Borges was meant to be a Spread option coordinator.
Devin has yet to play the equivalant of a full season (only 11 games). Yeah, he studied in the offseason, but nothing, NOTHING, beats game experience, which is what his problem is. Most of Devin's mistakes are mental. He is regressing in his mechanics becuase he is panicking and letting the mistakes compound. This will be fixed as he gets more and more starts under his belt.
Borges has by no objective means been a success in his 2+ years here (quite the opposite), but simply removing him and Funk will not magically fix all of the mistakes.
But it seemed to me like DG turned a corner from his previous mental funk in the 2nd half against Penn State. Obviously only time will tell if I'm right. I sure hopes so, because we need him to make plays, and he needs to show Al that he can be trusted again. We can't run MANBALL against the rest of the schedule and expect wins. We need DG to be the DG that torched ND.
And more than anything else, we need to stop turning the damn ball over.
It's also incredibly stupid and just completely ignorant of, well, basically everything.
If we're comparing this year so far to basically this same point in 2011 (if you'll allow me a bit of leeway to make my point).
We are 5-1 coming off a bad loss to PSU where we basically gave the game away and showed 0 semblance of a running game (outside of our QB).
In 2011 we were 6-1 coming off of a bad loss to MSU where we showed 0 semblance of a running game (outside of our QB).
In fact, that team and this team look remarkably similar.
A QB who was equal parts dynamo and disaster. Who turned the ball over way too much, and essentially carried our offense. He was also bailed out by the exceptional play of a few big play wide receivers.
A running game that basically didn't exist until 8 games into the season, but had shown 0 signs of life up to that point (we've obviously yet to see if the 2013 squad can do the same).
A defense that was very good, despite lacking depth in a few key areas.
Granted, that team definitely overachieved thanks to a favorable schedule, that saw their only 2 losses come on the road.
One to a solid Michigan State team, and the other against an Iowa team they should have beaten, where they gave the game away thanks to turnovers and an inability to consistently move the ball (sound familiar).
It sucks that we lost, but it's far from the end of the world, "We're finshing 7-5," doomsday scenario that a lot of people are attempting to paint.
I'm a bit surprise the OL has played so poorly. I know youth is a big factor but even our two seniors are not having stellar years. Worried that coaching may be a factor but we shall see by 2015. PSU DL is in the middle to bottom of all teams. NE, MSU and OSU DL will ravage us. The rest of the schedule we may be able to block somewhat. I predicted 8-4, so even going 7-5 will be close to the mark most expected this year. Too many fans are unrealistic thinking this was a 10 plus win team!
People were saying the exact same things in 2011.
People were also starting to shit all over Beilein last year before they made their NCAA tourney run, talking about him being incapable of maximizing the team's talent and saying that he was getting out coached.
Now, he's the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Wait until the team loses a few games this year, people will be right back to saying the same dumb shit about him.
Remember when he couldn't recruit and was totally incapable of bringing in top tier talent to Ann Arbor?
Welcome to the internet where everyone has an opinion and isn't afraid to share it. Oh, I forgot, that everyone is an expert too.
That said, we need better play selection instead of try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try again (shortened for the sake of brevity).
It was true--at that time--that our recruiting was not at the level it is now, and it is true, that results on the court then were not what people hoped. Because both of those things are no longer, does not mean they were not at one time.
I would argue that it wasn't true, and it was always blown out of proportion by the naysayers, especially with regard to recruiting. His 2nd year was one of the biggest turnarounds in school history and we made the NCAA tournament for the first time in a decade. People were still complaining and a lot of people were actually calling for his head after his 3rd season, ad claiming he couldn't recruit at all even though at that point he had nabbed a number of high level prospects and unearthed quite a few gems in the rough.
There were people claiming he couldn't take the program "to the next level" as late as the start of the NCAA tournament last year.
It was however true that all of the negative nancies and chicken littles claiming the sky was falling ended up being completely and totally wrong.
It also showed that given time and a deal of patience that the right coach can succeed.
Hoke has had a great deal more success through 2 1/2 seasons than Beilein had through 3.
I will never understand how someone can live like that. Blowing every little thing out of proportion. a few wins and we are title contenders, a few losses and we might as well fire everyone cause they can't do anything right.
Building something takes time. Everyone wants there to be a quick three-years-or-less window for championships, but the fact is that that doesn't happen unless you already have a strong foundation for success and Rich Rod left anything but a strong foundation behind. I can't remember what the diary was called, but someone did a thing about third year coach success rate for championship coaches and almost every name on there followed a coach who had a solid, if not outright spectacular, foundation, to the point where the new guy just had to keep recruiting for a year or two and maybe tweak something in the Offensive or Defensive schemes (usually not both) and boom, championship(s)
Saban is probably the only exception to that rule, and even then, Mike Shula had a 10 win season the year before he was fired, in addition to a winning record.
Building something does take time, but it also takes a successful foundation. Borges has proven that he is not that.
How exactly is this year so similar to 2011, other than at one point we lost our first game on the road? In 2011, the team got better as the season went along. 2011's version of Akron/UCONN was Eastern Michigan and SDSU, and we won by a combined scored of 59-10.
But the real difference between this year and 2011 was that our first loss was at MSU, our toughest road game of the year. In fact, we lost our two toughest road games of the year. Add in that Northwestern and OSU weren't as strong then as they are now,
Just because in 2011 we were 6-1 and finished that season 10-2 doesn't mean that everything will be fine this year. How do we feel about Hoke and Borges now if in 2011 Purdue and Illinois were replaced with PSU and Wisconsin and we ended up 8-4?
The point is that we don't know, so there's no reason to get our panties in a bunch about it. If you want to call the season dead and over with, that's fine. I'd appreciate you then not spreading that sort of negativity to the rest of us who will enjoy seeing how the rest of this season plays out.
The similarities between this season and 2011 are in fact numerous, and a lot of the criticisms are exactly the same. I also compared this loss more to the Iowa loss from that year. Look, I'm not saying that the outcomes will be the same, but my how quickly we forget.
Your idea of common sense hurts my brain. I can't begin to fathom how you think 2011 is the only reason we're disappointed now.
Have you watched any Michigan football this year? 5-1 doesn't begin to speak to how bad our offensive scheme and execution is.
Denard did, multiple times, and then they sat him for almost the entire second half of the OSU game that we should have won. *This response is for the comment above about how Borgess/Hoke worked miracles their first year. Not sure why my response bounced way down here.
you got to do what you got to do. AL is the reason we lost to Sparty,iowa,nebraska,ohio and penn state!!!
What did he say regarding this?
Because he is not ready for the Shane Morris show. This is not a controversial position.
and hire GERG?
umm... NO THANKS.
Why would anyone want to listen to this moron. I saw everything I needed to see last Saturday from row 79 at Beaver Stadium (and by the way Penn State - spend a little money and paint that erector set and get some real restrooms ... place is a dumpster).
If Borges is clueless doing HIS JOB, why the fuck would I want to listen to him. I was really hoping no one would show up to his press conference ... that would have been a "statement".
I doubt that Hoke would actually fire Borges, even though it is the obvious option. I'm in favor of firing him right now and giving Hecklinski and Jackson a chance as co offensive-coordinators for the final 6 regular season games. I think it's time Dave Brandon steps in and tells Hoke that Borges has to go.
economics? weather? poetry?
This thread will not end well.
Edit: Very odd. After watching the video, what is Borges doing with his hand and the middle of his chest? Does he have a 3rd nipple he's rubbing and pinching?
loosening the noose that is tightening around his job.
He's clearly nervous. Subconciously he knows he's in total denial. Really frustrating to see the defensiveness and a total lack of accountability on his part. Not good traits in any coach/athlete/employee/person.
He is picking at or rubbing something during every interview. Usually it is on his face. It is incredibly distracting and a bit disturbing.
I offer no accompagning psychoanalysis with this observation, but there is plenty to speculate about (smile).
The sad part is that the team is so talented, that even with the highest turnover rate in the nation and absolutely no running game, we could still beat almost every team on the schedule. Excising all the running plays from the 3rd quarter of this recent horror, our offense was pretty efficient and Gardner was on target with most of his passes. We even ran a play-action pop pass at one point which was an easy 10 yards.
Then all of a sudden it went away.
It's clear that if we just put a 00 set out there every play, our offense would be humming.
Nothing makes me happier than running into 10 man boxes. More!
That was sarcasm. When a team can make you one dimensional, you are no dimensional. All those great passes you all love so much don't have time to develop if the defense doesn't have to defend the run.
Conversly, all of those runs aren't going to work if they don't have to defend the pass. I don't tihnk any sane people are suggesting abandoning the run game, but I think it's pretty clear that the talent on this team is best suited to pass to set up the run instead of the other way around.
When Devin is throwing interceptions like it's his job (as he has been prone to do at times this season), it's hard to throw to set up the run.
As a coordinator you have to go into damage mitigation mode at that point.
There is not a lot you can do if your QB can't throw and your offenseive line can't generate the requisite amount of room for the running game to be effective.
Short passes. Short passes. Short passes. Short passes. DG get's into trouble because he arm-punts the fucking ball into 2 or 3 deep coverage all the damn time. It's a travesty that Drew Dileo has been this under utilized when he has shown the ability to be exactly what this teams needs (find a hole in the D and sit in it).
Devin has also thrown interceptions and been incredibly inaccurate on short passes and timing routes. It's not like he's only throwing picks on balls 15+ yards down field.
Your brother Al is just an incredibly bad offensive coordinator. I'm sure he is a nice guy.
Both of his INTs in the PSU game were short passes. One was to a D-lineman!
"When Devin is throwing interceptions like it's his job (as he has been prone to do at times this season), it's hard to throw to set up the run."
Gardner regrouped rather well in the second half and was playing at a much higher level. The coaches should have used his momentum to 1) win the game and 2) build his confidence for the rest of the season. Gardner could have won that game. He was/is the best/only option at this point.
The offense put the team in position to win the game on multiple occasions. You can certainly argue the play calling should have been more aggressive, but the bottom line is two easily makeable field goals were botched, and our defense gave up an 80 yard TD drive with 47 seconds left on the clock and PSU sans timeouts.
That's not on the offensive play calling at all what so ever. You can try to pin those things on Borges, but that doesn't make it true.
Hi, Al. How's it going?
27 carries for 27 yards but fuck it, at least we weren't one-dimensional!!!
Feels like there's absolutely nowhere for Funk to hide. Everybody, all of the bodies, are talking about the o-line issues and I don't buy the comment "something, something, youth, something." Indiana has a young line also and they've suffered injuries to boot. We have the requisite talent to do better than we've been doing.
Seriously fuck Borges. He needs to be fired as soon as possible. Guy is brutal.
Patience. It will come soon. Hoke might go down with him.
You remind me of my parents which is a good thing. I'm not a patient person and it just annoys the hell out of me when people continue their course when it's not working.
I'm not a genius and I've been wrong before which is why I like your comment about me tempering my distaste.
if hoke wants to go down with a complete incompetent OC, ok. he's done. borges is horrible. there is little or no evidence to suggest otherwise.
A lot of the same people that were calling for RR to be fired after his first season, and who were calling for kovacs to be replaced every year before his senior year. Some people are just not happy with what they've got and just don't have the patience to let someone complete their job. Agreed that I'm upset with the playcalling and Borges in general, but damn guys, pull yourselves together. Shit.
One problem with your scenario, this isn't Borges first year. It is his third year and his offense has gotten worse rather than better.
even if changes do need to happen, everyone here sounds like a fucking 10 year old who wants the fancy toys of one of their friends but has to settle for something perceived to be less.
people around here need to pull their shit together.
There are reasonable complaints and then there is whatever the hell has been going on here for the last few days.
It's totally ridiculous.
You are correct, those defending Borges are clearly not reasonable human beings. It would be like someone trying to defend Gerg's defenses under RR.
Those two comparisons are absurd and completely ignorant of context, making you the unreasonable one for even attempting to compare the two.
I think the O-line should go in a different direction (away from Funk) and not that Borges should be fired, but that start trying to win games using the strengths of his actual team rather than his imaginary team. The O-line is terrible. There is no reason we should be pushed around by every team we play (with the exception of Central). How can Akron come into the Big House and be a 3 yard catch away from a win? What other excuse besides poor coaching can their be?
How can we beat Notre Dame by 11, CMU by 50, and Minnesota by 29, and then turn around and beat Akron by only 4, UConn by only 3, and blow a game at PSU?
Maybe we're a team that is still rebuilding with an incredibly inconsistent quarterback?
Or maybe we have some of the worst coaches in college football who have somehow managed to "Mr. Magoo" their way into several excellent recruiting classes, a BCS bowl win, and a 75% winning percentage?
1. Denard was a better passer as a sophomore first year starting QB under RR than he was as a junior and senior under Borges. He did not imprive at all under Al. That is a fact that indicts Borges.
2. Borges is directly respnsible for losses at Iowa and MSU, arguably OSU last year. And culpable in a couple of others. This is an opinion, but very close to a fact I think.
3. This last game is not the first time that almost incomprehensible lapses in paycalling and offensive strategy have occured. Even to defenders such as yourself.
4. Devin has not improved in decision making or passing with a Spring and Fall for Borges to coach him. Granted, 11 starts in, we would expect some inconsistency, except that Devin has been here for 4 years--3 under Al. There are plenty of examples of first year junior or senior starters stepping in and playing better than Devin is right now (passing).
I think all of the above points, at minimum, to a problem. Whether it justifies outrage is another matter, but I think fair analysis would conclude that criticism of Borges--not just for last game-- is warranted.
1. Was he a better passer, or did he move from an offense that was specifically tailored for his skill set to one that was not specifically tailored for his skill set?
2. It is definitely an opinion, but I wont disagree with you that they play calling has been questionable to bad at times. However, give me the list of schools who absolutely love their offensive coordinator and I will guarantee you it's a very short list.
3. I'm not a "defender" and this isn't an either or thing. Just because I don't believe Borges is the worst coach in the world, who deserves to be at minimum fired at the end of the year, doesn't mean I'm his number one fan. Can we all try to be even a tad bit nuanced here, or are we going to continue to consistently ignore me saying time and time again how the play calling has been at times bad or problematic?
4. Devin has regressed, but saying that also ignores the fact that Borges took a guy who had been playing WR for a full off-season plus half of the regular season last year, and turned him into an extremely competent QB overnight. Perhaps Devin's regression has had something to do with the offensive line play coupled with an extremely inconsistent running game? There might be more to it than Borges somehow failing Devin or screwing him over with bad coaching.
Criticism is definitely warranted, but calling for his head on a pike or saying derogatory things of a personal nature are not.
I made a rational post pointing to serious problems with Al's coaching IMO, which are cause for serious evaluation at season's end. Personal comments are out of line I agree.
To #4, I think it's a bit much to say that Al tuned him into a good QB "overnight." Devin had plenty of practice experience playing QB for us before the move, and I don't think Al gets any special credit for his performcnce last year, any more than Mike Sherman got when Tanneyhill moved back to QB at A&M. And even if he did deserve credit, then the blame hammer should fall even harder for his coaching given this year's regression, which you acknowledge.
Don't count on getting any information to backup the claims of the OP. There are multiple posts on the espn michigan forums spouting this same garbage with absolutely no evidence to support the claim. In fact if anything the evidence would suggest that the D Coaches have done a good job considering the injuries/attrition they have experienced.
This is why I can't place the blame on any of the coaches yet. I look at it that Michigan is 5-0. Most reasonable people predicted Michigan to finish somewhere between 6-6 and 8-4. With the defense this young and inexpereience the team is in great position to hit the high end of those guesses if not better. If anything I would give the coaching staff including Gibson credit for holding the D together.
Are we supposed to reflexively assume the coaches are right or not? Yes for Borges but no for RR? What's the difference?
Evidently ridiculous is in the eye of the beholder. We couldn't run all game, but you say it was ridiculous to do anything but run to win the game.
Sound strategy is to hand Fitz the ball because that was clearly the strength of our game the previous 3.5 quarters?
Yes, you can blame Gardner for the delay of game, I won't argue that. But is he more culpable than Hoke who's coached and played more downs than days Gardner has walked this earth? Is Gardner more culpable than the coach who said that the fault was with the coach because it was teh coach's responsibility to watch the clock and call the timeout?
I like Hoke still, although not quite as much as a few days ago (he had always had balls until then), but Borges has got to go in this bozo's opinion. That is as plain and simple as your concept of strategy.
Running the ball is the right strategy, but how about trying a different form of attack. Plowing Fitz into the line behind 2 TEs and a fullback had been proven To be ineffective.
I think it totally unfair to pin the delay on Gardner. Could he have called TO, sure but so could the coach on the sideline who in the seconds right before a snap ought to have far fewer distracting than Gardner. Hoke owned this mistake and said so in his presser.
Man, Borges really grinds my gears.
Has anyone considered the idea that maybe Hoke is the one putting pressure on Borges to stick with the power run? I mean after all, it was Hoke who paraded out the man ball thing at his opening press conference.
I remeber Borges talking about liking what the Patriots do. My fear is that Hoke is the one preaching power running to the point of absurdity. That said, I doubt Hoke micro-manages to the extent of saying yay or nay to bubble screens. I doubt he'd complain if a future OC wanted to run them.
It's easier for people to just blame Borges rather than consider that our issues might be a bit more systemic and further reaching. There was a time when Schafer was the reason for our terrible defense and not something deeper...
Did anyone think it was Schafer who was at fault? I never did so maybe my memory is hazy. I was seriously impressed with our defense that year. Worst scoring defense in a long time that year, but the D was on the field for 60-70% of the plays each game!
Schafer's firing was always a scapegoat move in my opinion after that 3-9 hell, but maybe that's my revisionist brain at work.
I actually think Shafer was a good coach. Our D seemed to start games real well, but by the 5th or 6th time the offense went 3-and-out, they began to wear down. There was nothing anyone could do to make that defense anything other than statistically terrible.
Just a gut feeling...
But I think Al might be our best hope of convincing Hoke (behind closed doors) that things have to change. He's certainly the one taking the heat. I think this might be why he was trying to dig through his chest in the video... Rather than my first impression that he was just on the defensive and feeling the pressure. After further reflection I'm not so sure Al is the problem.
Yes, I have, and it is concerning. I wonder if Borges would call different plays if he had the choice, but with a Manball Mandate, he has to call yet another run for PDT.
that fat bas***d pissed me off and I stopped watching. I'll read the transcript tomorrow.
I went to his wikipedia page and his resume is pretty impressive. I don't know what to think now.
Are we really going to do Sparty's job for them and start making fun of our own coaches?? Seriously get a fuckin grip everybody. Question the play calling all you want but name calling and pictures of Uncle Fester have no place here.
It's has been an utterly disgusting display.
His resume is not impressive. It's just long.
but is it normal for him to constantly be plucking at his manscaping like that? Or is that a tell that he doesn't want to be there, and somewhat guilty that he is to blame for what went on Saturday?
I've never seen him act like that and I watch almost every interview. My opinion is he was pissed and didnt want to be there but was trying to keep it together.
But who wouldnt feel that way!
must be drunk.
Not that anyone cares, but I know that at least for me, I do have my own nervous habits which would communicate clearly that I am agitated and really don't want to be where I am. That's sort of how I read it.
In any case, it is true that - by the numbers - Devin's performance was a significant uptick, so even despite the turnovers, there was that. I have to say that the tone and level of detail in the presser was not exactly shocking.
I used to think that the limitations in passing was Denard's fault, but now I am thinking that it really was Borges failing to develop it. Devin is regressing. And the major part of that is due to the fact that Borges is not making it easier for him. Devin is constantly facing third and long and he knows it. When he does pass, it is so obvious that the defense is blitzing and putting a lot of pressure. This is not an environment where quaterback can relax and succeed. Borges needs to simplify things and let the QB take easy yard when they are there. Without that base, they end up forcing things which lead to turnovers. This is just going to get worse with Shane as he won't have the legs to give him an out when in trouble.
What about all the times we've seen where receivers have been open and Devin either didn't see them or threw it late? That's not on Borges. Devin got over confident and lackadaisical against Akron, and as a result he lost his confidence and is now trying to get it back. He looked very good on a lot of throws on Saturday, so we'll see what happens from here.
Damaged confidence. He can make the throws, there's just a second of doubt now. Devin is a great player, he's just pressing too much and being put in suboptimal positions. It makes me really sad for him that his potential is being squandered. It kills me to think that kids would have been better of going to another school besides Michigan. But I truly think Devin would be a first or second round draft pick in a competent offense.
All these teams are stacking the box because of Devin's tremendous accuracy and decision making skills eh?
If you put any merit into Brian's picture pages, teams are stacking the box because we telegraph our run plays to the point of insanity, with no hope of checking out of them. So it's not that defenses disrespect devins passing abilities, it's that our offense makes it clear that we are running and has no built in check downs.
I trust that Brian will pick the 5 plays(out of 80) that make Borges look the worst because after disparaging Brandon, that is pretty much his goal in life.
Really? Do you genuinely believe Brian has a personal vendetta against those guys? Does he just hate Brandon's hair, and Borges' lack of hair? Why would this be Brian's goal in life?
I think it's pretty clear that Brian dislikes stupid corporate money-making intrusions into our tradition rich program, and he dislikes stubborness and the inability to adapt and play smart football. Much of the fanbase agrees, which is why this blog became so popular. Feel free to disagree with Brian in a rational way, but you have no evidence to suggest Brian wants to disparage these guys because it's simply his goal in life.
he had like 30 runs to choose from. i think only 2 gained over 5 yds. so it's pretty easy picking to find pathetic run plays.
I trust that you will be showing us your own work to back up your gibberish as well.
Here's your "5 plays (out of 80)." Now show your work.
Yes, seriously. Teams are stacking the box because our coaches were too quick to give up on Devin, and unfortunately it's affecting his psychology. My opinion. These guys are affected by failure and lack of successes, believe it or not. The Minnesota gameplan was like a slap in the face to Devin, especially after all the work he put into being a passer in the offseason and the great success he had against ND (we would've been throttled by ND if it weren't for him, by the way). He hasn't responded well to failure, but you let him work through that, especially against Minnesota.
I don't blame Gardner, I blame his O-line. I'd be nervous as hell back there too. Remember Joey Harrington and what happened to him behind the Lion's O-line. He was conditioned to dump the ball within two seconds before he was punished. There is no way Morris could be effective right now.
This is classic fan-thinks-he-knows-coaching speak.
/ Larry David
I'm bummed about your recent travails with points, but am glad you are commenting, as I remember you from the haloscan days. Bend it like Gingell.
I don't want to think about Al Borges.
Dude is going to rub a hole right through his chest.
Mumble mumble mumble "we sprinkled in a little power here and there" mumble mumble mumble "and then we had some big plays" mumble mumble "then we lost" mumble mumble "we made adjustments."
FUCK! That game sucked.
Borges looks like a man being questioned in a murder case. He was definitely feeling the heat there. Im sure he is under a lot of pressure, regardless of Hoke's vote of confidence. That lends credence to the fact that Hoke had a different take behind closed doors. The other thing I noticed is that they praised Gardner. That tells me they are still trying to build him up, as a three turnover contest usually does not solicit praise. His ego must still be reeling from the last month or so... As a side note, Saturday was my first away game I've ever attended. I wish I would have been the one who got maced.
Even though you're totally guessing - I thought the exact same stuff. So we must be right!
Your post lends credence to the fact that you're projecting. Or not. It's kind of fun to play armchair QB (or coach, as the case may be) and this is a sports blog. But I think it best to leave the armchair psychological analysis behind. Nothing Borges said or did lends credence to any of your assertions.
"The power game wasn't that good, but you can't just get away from it"
The fuck you can't. Thats exactly what a coordinator is supposed to do; stop doing the stupid shit that doesn't work especially when something else is.
Exactly. I wanted to break my computer after he said that. Dude is clueless. He just doesnt get it. He's a stubborn, arrogant son of a bitch. Michigan will be a consistent 3-5 loss team as long as he is our OC.
Rember when Coach Beilein said, "I am going to have my center shoot threes and run the 1-3-1 come hell or high water, because that's what I do"? And then remember when Michigan played for a national chamionship with Jordan Morgan nailing shots from deep and with the team running nothing but the 1-3-1, because Beilein willed this into being rather than adapting? That's what happened, right?
1) not sure if it is delusional or just phrasing, but "not that good" rubbed me the wrong way. It was horrible
2) Quick, someone send video of the 2007 Rose Bowl to the fort. USC figured out they couldn't run against M's d and throw every down. I'm not suggesting we adopt that, but the poinnt is you can adjust.
So, I was about the click that link and then I decided to look at this instead
Not getting that 7 minutes of my life back. Still much more entertaining than watching Al Borges nervously massage his chest which cannot be unseen.
If we had a creative young OC we would be undefeated and ranked in the top 10 by now. I mean with convincing wins in all our games so far.
You are delusional dude. Last time I checked big Al wasn't throwing picks to the other team left and right, he wasn't blowing assignments or getting destroyed on the OL. I also didn't hear too many complaints about the play calling against ND.
I know he rubs some people the wrong way and his play calling sucks sometimes, but get serious, we're not a very good team with or without him. I don't care what sort of newfangled scheme you come up with, guys still need to reliable execute in the trenches and not turn the ball over. Maybe we pull out the PSU game without him, but we'd still look ugly doing it.
1. At what point do we run out of combinations to try?
2. And does it even matter if we go into predictable run sets anyway? If I'm Indiana's defensive coaching staff, I still devote half of of my prep time this week against exactly what Michigan showed at Penn State. We were at the game. My wife, a complete football neophyte, kept asking me why Michigan kept playing "all bunched up."
Does your wife have any interest in being an offensive coordinator?
She kept saying "I hate the play where they just run into the line." She knows little about the nuances of football, but even she was able to figure out that you can't run through eight guys.
Yeah, the guy who was, in the coach's opinion, 3rd or 4th best a couple of weeks ago is going to come in and solve problems. How about employing some different tactics? Give the players an opportunity to be successful.
How cowardly. Change the setting of the press conference and only upload 5 mins of something that's usually around 15mins. Wow
It only lasted 6 minutes.
Thats What She Said!
^^^By far, the best post of the day.
It couldn't possibly be because they're busy coming up with a gameplan and fixing the problems with the team.
Because talking with the media is so important.
Even when things are going great they never answer a single question in pressers and are at times stand-offish, so what makes you think they're going to be anything other than curt coming off a loss?
but firing the O-coordinator mid-season is like spilling a 5-gallon drum of blood in the shark tank just before going for a swim.
Mack Brown has dumped a couple of coordinators that the last couple of years and all it has gotten him is a stopwatch ticking down to his removal.
If Hoke is going to change assistants, you do it quietly behind the scenes when no one is looking. Maybe make a back door offer to Cam Cameron when the season ends. If he bites you make a change. Maybe he knows of a great Oline coach as well.
It's a slight upgrade.
Agreed. Feed him discount bananas from Meijers and call it even.
Meijer, not Meijers
I don't understand the love this guy is getting right now. If anyone watched the Ravens before he got fired, Cameron is all about running it directly into stacked boxes on first and second down. I would rather keep Borges.
That's with three ranked teams on the schedule. Also, before he was in Baltimore, he was at Indiana where they put up points and the Chargers, where they broke quite a few team offensive records. Baltimore might not have worked out last year, but he has a very solid resume.
We are averaging 39.5 pts/game. Granted our defense has scored some, but LSU's probably has as well.
The grass is always greener.
Wow, tha't an amazing stat. Especially considering we've played a schedule equally as hard as LSU's.
No, wait . . .
The point is it's easy to just look around and say "hey that guy has a Michigan connection and the team he is coaching is scoring more. Let's hire him."
Hell, our opponents are scoring 2 more points a game than LSU's (and their incredibly hard schedule as you point out). Maybe we should fire Mattison while we're at it and hire Chavis b/c it is so easy to just swap coaches as get the expected result.
I agree that hiring Cameron wouldn't solve anything, but your example is terrible because if I was absolutely forced to replace Mattison and could magically hire anyone, Chavis would probably be in the top 3 of my choices.
Jesus, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Get a new OC already! Its almost Wednesday following that ridiculous shit show.
Why God? Why?
Louisiana Lafayette just ran a QB draw on 3rd and 7 to pick up a first down. Hire their OC now!
Regarding the interview questions - as if I need someone else to hate on besides Al.
Reminds me of Lloyd after the 2007 Rose Bowl loss, wherein he said something to the effect of, their game plan was optimal and they were not going to change it (even after getting stymied in the first half and blown out in the second). Really?
There is cowardice behind such stubbornness; change requires us to admit fallibility. Lloyd was effectively blaming the players with his inflexibile rhetoric -- and Borgess implies the same. "Change our tactics? Why would we ever do that! If we can't succeed, it's not the fault of our plan, that's for sure!" While not explicitly stating so, reason dictates if it's not the plan at fault, then it must be the agents executing the plan.
What is most frustrating about this rhetoric, IMO, is that the players take the heat for not being able to execute these pristine game plans, while not being put in a position to succeed due to said game plans. Though, I suppose this prepares those student athletes going pro in corporate America for what to expect...
That was one of the more conservative game plans I've ever seen. 3-3 at halftime and only USC remembered their passing game. To be fair, USC was getting pressure, causing us to keep our TE in to block most of the game.
That was one of our most frustrating losses ever. Both teams wanted to run in the 1st half, but neither could. It was 3-3 at halftime.
In the second half, USC adjusted and went to the air. Michigan still kept trying to run. Game over. USC in a blow out.
My biggest fear in the Hoke/Borges hire is that we would get DeBord 2.0. It would be the 2007 Rose Bowl on a continuous loop. But Hokes willingness to be aggressive and Borges' willingness to run the spread with Denard made me believe that that fear was unfounded.
But now I'm not so sure . . .
In that clip, hopefully his ass is in the hotseat and he knows it. He needs to get canned. he blows at least 2 games on his own every year. If he stays it will be really hard to think we ever have a shot at an undefeated season
Amazing how everyone is a body language expert all of a sudden. You're all reading into his mannerisms way to much. He clearly has a bug bite. Plus he always looks uncomfortable. The man clearly is not the healthiest and gets short of breath easily. Go watch the Mattison interview. He's acting the exact same way. My guess is they were trying to squeeze these interviews in and were in a hurry because they had a lot of work to day with the team. Imagine that.
If Borges really doesn't understand why the running game isn't working then we're doomed. The solution to 9 guys in the box is not to put both tackles on one side and try to block them all, it's to get the ball outside of the box. How does he not see this? He's only been an OC for like 30 years
If Devin weren't tossing the ball to the other team every 5 attempts. I didn't come here to dog on a player, but you have to see that the tailbacks were at least hanging onto the ball...? Punting is ever so much better than giving them the ball in the red zone.
To beat a 10 yard cushion: bubble screens
Plays that are bad to beat a 10 yard cushion: 10 yard curl
I still think Borges is somewhat accountable since some of those throws came in a tough 3rd and long situation that resulted from the "run Touissant in the middle" plays in the first two downs.
I understand the youth of the OL makes it harder for Borges, but I still want to see some level of game time adjustments, adapting to our team's and the opponent's strength/weakness....rather than repeating the same fruitless play over and over.
Putting your QB in constant 3rd and 12 is not going to help his accuracy or turnover rate.
Not to mention his health and psyche.
Yeah, you didn't come here to dog on a player. You came here to defend a shitty gameplan to the death.
We lost a road game to a two point dog in multiple over-times. Many, many improbable things happened. If they had thrown a pick in overtime you'd be calling for Borges's head. How are you even complaining about offense? We scored 40 freaking points. The obvious goats are at QB and Pk...If you want to look at a coach...What the heck has Funk been doing the last three years? These guys are big enough...shouldn't the line have a clue what they're doing by now?
Give me a break. This has been well discussed already: we scored 24 offensive-generated points before OT to a team that was just shredded by Indy-freaking-ana! But - yeah - fire Funk too
That only scored that many points late when PSU was going for it on 4th down on their own side of the field?
Indiana has a better offense than Michigan does right now. Indiana has a top 3-4 offense in the B1G. What's your point again?
if indiana has a better offense than michigan, then fire everyone.
Many people have been frustrated with Borges for a long time. This game was particularly glaring because the tailbacks ran 30 times for 27 yards while PSU was giving away lots of yards to the WRs. I don't expect him to whip the line into shape overnight or to coach DG into Joe Montana by season's end. But why not take free yards? In basketball, if your center is wide open under the basket, you pass the ball to your center even if you have a guard-based offense. But the current offense not only doesn't do this, it doesn't leave the QB with time to audible into a screen or hitch even if those plays were in the playbook. Michigan's gameplan is two-dimensional, failing to take advantage of horizontal space and failing to use time to the Wolverines' advantage.
Indiana hit them for fucking 40+, AND held them to fewer points.
The gameplan was incredibly flawed, if you can't see that, there's no helping you. Penn State has one glaring weakness, their secondary, and they hung them out on an island all game so they could stuff 8 in the box, because Borges was giving them a free down!
People keep on making this comparison, as if suddenly the trasitive property works in sports.
Indiana, which has a better offense and is designed to be a passing spread is, guess what, a better passing team. Personnel matters. What you do as a scheme, system, etc matters. And Michigan can't just be Indiana for one week because Indiana just had success against PSU.
Indiana was up 19-17 after the 3rd quarter. Indiana, which scored 23 points in the 4th quarter, has one drive that started in the third quarter, and then had a 33 yard drive for a TD and a 9 yard drive for a TD, and a safety when PSU was desperate.
Indiana was at home where they could communicate much easier. Michigan played at night in Happy Valley.
Michigan's offense wasn't good, but everyone likes to bring up the Indiana game as if that's what Michigan should simply be able to do. Well Indiana is a good team with a really good offense, and the circumstances are completely different. The comparison is weak at best, and not nearly as strong enough to justify "INDIANA PUT UP 40+ POINTS AND BORGES DIDN'T! BURN THINGS!!!"
You offer a lot of great analysis, which I am not taking issue with, but there is at least one thing that is worth pointing out about Indiana. They have our old OL coach. In the wake of the past four games, a number of people have tried to excuse our OL performance because we (a) are too young/inexperienced, and/or (b) don't have enough talent. Indiana/Coach Frey had to start two true freshmen last year - one at LT and one at G. Both were three star recruits, and combined they had one non-Indiana Big Ten offer offer among them (to Illinois). Given what Indiana is accomplishing with young, inexperienced, and relatively lightly regarded recruits, this idea that Funk and Borges need 4 years of coaching up 4 and 5 star talents before we can expect competent line play is crazy, in my opinion. (Not saying you are arguing that, but a lot of Borges/Funk apologists appear to be.)
Don't get that wrong, this line was never supposed to be good (much like Indiana's isn't good, they get by). But, like Indiana, they should be able to get by. Now, Indiana has made things a little easier on their OL. They run zone and zone and zone. I
've strongly agreed with Magnus in the past, run man or zone blocking concepts. If Borges still wants zone stretch as a change of pace, fine, run it once or twice as a change of pace so the blocking doesn't need to be great to succeed. But trying to run everything out of a base means you do nothing well, making the experience issues even more apparent.
Now, schematically, are fine, seriously. The things Funk is teaching these guys is also fine, trust me, he didn't forget what proper OL technique is. And people claiming that this team isn't making progress at every position honestly has on blinders. The issue is they are not making improvement at the trajectory they should on the offensive line. They should be getting better faster and becoming more consistent. Now, youth, switching line ups, those thigns don't help, but it's still not been pretty. Some how, the way he is teaching is not getting through to the players. But I know how Hoke's coaching staff works, it's prided on instruction and technique, and Funk is part of that methodology. So he's stressing and trying to teach those things too, but obviously it's not getting there, which is an issue.
Just ahead of MN and everyone is much better than Purdue! It is sad to say that we may be somewhere in the middle! Even though we have talent something horrible is going wrong since we are slipping backwards. 10-2, 8-4, now probably 7-5 or 6-6 this season. But I still say Hoke should be given through 2015. If we are still 8-4, then it may be time for a change unless Dave is happy with 4 or 5 loss seasons. I guess I'm no longer confident that we will rise to elite level under Hoke and his coaches.
We could also just be the sort of team who plays to the level of our competition and win 9 or 10 regular season games.
We are 5-1 right now.
In 2011 with a similar team and schedule we were 6-1 at basically the same point in the season and asking ourselves a lot of the exact same questions about the team. We ended up finishing 11-2 with a BCS bowl win.
There are some concerns, sure, but there is no reason to act like the sky is falling.
Can you please list your resume as a coach?
I'd like to know what D1 programs you have coached for and how extensive your background is that you are able to make such flippant remarks.
I'd also like to know what psychic detective agency you work for because apparently you are able to see into the future as you know for certain that there is no way this team can win 9 games?
This staff has won 11 games before, you know that right? Apparently you think it's impossible for them to do, despite evidence to the contrary.
Please tell me about your understanding of "offensive philosophies" and "execution of said philosophies." I'd really like to hear your take.
How are players "not yet ready for the schemes" when they have been in the program under this coaching staff for 3 years?
If you are a coach, how comfortable would you be with people outside of your program, with no knowledge of what is going on with your players and coaches, judging you and giving you advice, particularly internet commenters?
Also, a cursory glance through you comment history reveals that you seem to spend an inordinate number of comments talking about getting hammered and/or getting high. How do you balance these things with being a successful football coach at the highest levels (assuming you are one)?
I also see that prior to the season you predicted we would go 12-2 and then later bumped it down to 9-4. Now you're saying it is impossible for us to win even 9 games. What does this say about your prognostication skills, and how can we trust anything you say anymore when you shamelessly pull a Skip Bayless like that?
You also predicted we would lose to UCONN 21-7. I'm beginning to sense a pattern here of terrible predictions on your part.
If you could answer any of my questions that would be great.
Michigan 33 UCONN 20, so he's got all his bases covered. But Indiana will either win 48-30, or by 47. Which actually aren't the same thing.
I mean disagreeing is fine, but people shouldn't be calling other people out on their knowledge; especially not with that track record.
Running power is not the problem. Running it into 10 man boxes is. I guarandamntee you that when our WRs start getting 10 yards a pop the defense will take men out of the box. Then the power will work. Shoot, even run power out of the gun. The 49ers seem to do it just fine.
This isn't the first time Al has thrown up a stinky rotten turd of a gameplan, and (even more unfortunately) it won't be the last. He'll do this again, seemingly for no reason. He can call a good game, and every once in a while he does, but any layperson can make a convincing case that the majority of our losses under his tenure are due to him steering us towards defeat.
I want a coach who'll at least try to win every game, and not just some of them.
they will change offensive line and try the same plays and see if they work. Borges had better broaden his playbook because he has got to be auditioning for his job next year. They cant run block, its obvious, what is he thinking? Every game this year could get uglier from here on out if they dont change. The entire coaching staff needs to get their heads out their asses after that debacle in State College.
At this point, I actually bet our O-linemen CAN block! If you give our guys a gameplan that isn't so blitheringly predictable, then those defensive players aren't firing off exactly where they KNOW the play is going right after the snap.
If the defense has a split second of hesitation or doubt, that's all the time our O-linemen need get the jump on them and gain leverage. If our guys aren't constantly being outnumbered and out-slanted then I bet they would be able to execute most of their blocks just fine!
People claim "reduce the playbook as the players aren't getting it" after the first 4 games. Guess what, they actually did that, not because fans told them to but because it was the right idea. Well, they still aren't having great success, but now people are claiming for an expanded play book.
After the first 4 games people said, "Give DG easier reads/passes" and Borges has done such to get some of his confidence back. Now people are saying to not run the football and let DG throw all the time as if he didn't have 3 turnovers in this very game in agreement with his past.
I'm not saying that Borges is perfect, but people want it every way but the way that they saw didn't work. Well, I'm sure after it happened Borges would have wanted it a bit differently too. But everyone just changing the argument doesn't make them right. The OL is and has been the issue, dating back to last year. Some of that is youth, there is some leeway there that I have given Funk, but he hasn't developed them to even where they should be with youth.
It's the blatant predictability and total lack of adjustment that bother us. You can't run against 8 in the box with 6 blockers, it's not going to work, yet even Penn State knew that Borges was so fucking stubborn he would try, they stacked 8 in the box against 6. They left a mediocre to bad secondary out on an island because they were so confident Borges had NOTHING to counter them just throwing extra bodies into the box.
And as much as it sucks to watch, a lot of people should, particularly the first half when Borges wasn't trying to bleed clock. Michigan ran into 1, maybe 2 lines where the defense had an advantage in the box, and neither of those times did they have a numbers advantage playside. This isn't meant to be a "you're completely wrong", I think people are generally forgetting what really happened most of the game.
People are cherry picking isolated events, putting them in a vacuum, and claiming that's the full picture when it's not necessarily.
If RR were still coach, the QB on every play would have looked over at the sideline for a potential audible (OSU audibles into hitches and screens several times per game under Meyer). They could have taken advantage of the way PSU was lining up in the second half but seemingly don't even have the basic structures (the ability to audible and the necessary plays) available in the offense to do that. This is frustrating...I understand that Borges does some things well, but everyone would understand being frustrated with a basketball coach who simply refused to allow passes to his small forward no matter the circumstance. That's Borges.
I think you've pretty much nailed it.
You say "there is some leeway there that I have given Funk, but he hasn't developed them to even where they should be with youth". Did you see something specific in the PSU game that has shifted your opinion? If so would you explain what that was? If not would you explain what you expected to see by now and why at this point your opinion seems to have changed.
You're running power and your center targets the wrong guy. That's your base play and your center of all people is doing it wrong.
Your pulling and your puller flat out whiffs a LB, not even touching him, and that complete miss is the difference between 10 yards and 4 yards.
OGs consistently making poor fundamental mistakes with their feet on zone stretch and not getting their hat on the playside of the defender's hat.
It's these simple things that are not getting done that are getting irritating to me. I get pass pro mistakes, those will happen with youth. I get occassionally not picking up your assignment, it happens sometimes, people mess up. I get not coming off combo blocks well at times, that's youth. But consistently missing guys, not blocking the right guys, not getting leverage... I really didn't expect these things to be good at this point, I expected them to be pretty bad at this point, but they still have improved to pretty bad.
Now, that said, I would be fine with Funk coming back next year. I think next year is the tell all. Sometimes it takes a little longer for things to click with some players. Because he has been with Hoke, he's an important part of recruiting, and he has performed in the past, I'll not be fed up when he's kept around at year end, because the youth excuse is very real to an extent. But he's riding right at the edge of that extent still being valid.
I appreciate you taling the time to explain and the knowledge you bring to the board.
I'm certainly no coach and don't claim to be expert at football, but I have to think breaking in a new center and two new guards at the same time is compounding the problems. If each one of them makes a mistake every sixth play that could mean half your plays have a glaring mistake (there is, of course, the possibility that two or even all three screw up at the same time). I also think Taylor Lewan has been playing injured most of the season. He was wearing a boot at one point, and he never returned in the PSU game. I realize that linemen almost all have aches, pains, and minor injuries over the course of the season, but Lewan doesn't seem like he's playing at the same level he did last year.
Especially all those parts where he is defending his quarterback. And explaining things that anyone who has watched even a little bit of football should understand.
I have a feeling this was your response no matter what.
While it's clear to me that some flexibility on Borges' part would be helpful, I'm starting to wonder if the overall youth on offense, and especially the middle of the offensive line, limits his comfort with beating creative.
"there were sometimes where we targeted (our O line blocking) well but still didn't move the line of scrimage" coachspeak for they overloaded the box and it didn't matter what we did.
my take is there will be more spread passing included. the questions asked were stupid (again) talking about running Devin more.
I also read his body language as someone who was borderline incensed. Maybe at his in game calls, maybe at his overall strategy, maybe at the plan for the team.
Also notice what he didn't say: there wasn't a word about Fitz or the receivers.
It's similar to what was happening against UConn. Guys sometimes got to their blocks, but then their technique didn't give them any push, because of leverage, hands, feet, whatever. They found the guy they were supposed to block then essentially didn't block them.
Borges basically blamed the problem on the personnel. WHAT!?!? How about the fact that your dumbass gameplan had 6 blockers trying to block 8 guys in the box who were all running RIGHT TO THE BALL on the snap!?!?!
This jerk is exactly like RR blaming his team's defensive failures on his personnel.
I don't think we were watching the same video.
Losing 1 game with a healthy Gardner is better than starting 6 games with a healthy Shane Morris. It is what it is.
This is a false choice.
Nobody is talking about running Devin like Dennis Dixon. We are talking about being more flexible and using what the defense gives you.
Devin's not going to get hurt calling an audible and throwing a quick hitch to an uncovered slot reciever.
But the idea that bubble screens or quick throws to the outside are some kind of panacea or fix all is equally ridiculous.
Just because a defensive back is giving you a 10 yard cushion, doesn't mean the play will get you an automatic 10 yards. It doesn't even mean the play is guaranteed to work.
Yes, they should run them more, but if our running game is as DOOM and DEATH as people are making it out to be, running two or three bubble screens per game is not going to help much at all.
It also still doesn't address the main issue of not being able to run inside, which is important for any team, period.
Go watch the Packers game from last Sunday. They literally had 2 healthy WR's in the 2nd half and still had a 100 yard rusher. Why? Because they kept the Ravens honest by continuing to pass which opened the run.
They also have the best QB on the planet not named Peyton Manning, and we have Devin Gardner.
No offense to Devin but that comparison is unequivocally absurd.
The fact that you could make it as if it is somehow an even remotely relevant point is beyond words.
The bubble screen is not a "fix-all," but it acts as an adjustment given what the defense is presenting to you - an adjustment that Borges refuses to make. Giving a WR 2v2 on the outside with a blocker and already having a 10-yd cushion seems more likely to succeed than our power rushing attack which continues to do literally nothing. It takes the OL out of things and will obviously keep the defense a bit more honest and less likely to completely stack the box.
A flame about this high....
Even if people are going to be reactionary and emotional, which fine I get because that's sports, can some of you try not to be such fucking assholes? I'm sure that Borges doesn't enjoy it when the offense is crappy and I'm sure he's working his ass off. By all accounts he's a good, nice guy. Even if you don't like his offense, at least be civil.
And you lay a giant fucking turd in a huge game like that...people are gonna be assholes...
How much of that salary are you paying for...?
Seriously, what is this nonsense?
We can never make fun of the Spartans for "Spartying" it up on RCMB if this is how we're going to react every time we lose a game. I mean, we could still make fun of them, but it would make us look like a bunch of massive douche-nozzles totally lacking any kind of self-awareness (which is another hallmark of "those kind" of Michigan State fans).
I understand complaining but this is so far beyond complaining. It's also just generally embarrassing behavior overall regardless of circumstance.
We lost on the road to a decent Penn State team in 4OTs.
Yes, it sucked.
Yes, we should have won.
No, we were not going to go undefeated this year.
We're still 5-1, which is a good record for this team.
We are still going to win 9 games (which is what I and I believe most other people predicted).
We are still firmly in the hunt to win our division and possibly a Big Ten title.
Yes, all of those things being true doesn't change the fact that losing sucks.
This attitude that is becoming pervasive around here, that we need to have a complete meltdown when Michigan doesn't win every game by 20 points, let alone losing a game (something that happens to almost every single team, sometimes every single team, in any given season) is totally absurd.
We don't need to fire half of our coaching staff mid-way through the season.
We don't need to bench half of our starters, including our quarterback, mid-way through the season.
We are a team most people pegged for 9 wins at the start of the season sitting at 5-1 at the half way point.
Yes, we have issues, but we're OK, and our issues certainly don't merit the level of vitrol and visciousness that is being directed at certain coaches and players by asshole fans.
But chalking this up to frustration with one game is simply inaccurate. There are a lot of people on this board who hung with RR to the bitter end, but we will vent our frustrations when we see something not working but being tried ad nauseum...I hope that your prediction re: winninng 9 games is right, but you can't just say, "they're going to win 9, so stop worrying." You don't know that, and the season is about to become a lot more treacherous.
We don't need to bench half of our starters,
Borges starts it off saying he is going to open up the competition. What are you saying / watching. Winning isn't everything...but in this case - we didn't win.
The tone is about right here - PSU is depleted and we are not. Borges takes no responsibility and you are asking critics to calm down. Apologize much?
None of what you say makes any sense. It also doesn't have anything to do with anything I stated.
You said, and I block quoted your words, that we don't need to bench half our starters. If you believe that then you disagree in principle with what Borges said. He led off the presser with his pledge to re-open competition. He is open to benching the starters.
I ask you now - do you understand that point? Do you understand that your statements aren't reacting to what Borges said? In fact your statements aren't reacting to the football that Michigan has played of late. You are reacting to the reaction of the board- which doesn't push the envelope one bit.
I am a fan. I'm passionate about it. I don't like losing. I hate losing when we play poorly. This most recent game goes beyond that. We played not to lose. Coaching is an issue here. If you would watch these pressers and offer an argument to the contrary derived from them then I would be grateful. Instead you sir are trifling with a fan's passion - which is rightfully disheartened with the play in three of the last four games.
I'm not for firing coaches mid season, but I am for coaches who take responsibility for the way their team plays. Leaders take blame in defeat and give credit in victory.
A game? This is arguably the fifth time Borges has cost us a game with his play calling over the last three years. I get that some people, including myself, may be overreacting, but you're completely overreacting in the opposite direction. Maybe he shouldn't get fired today, but it's certainly come to a point where it's a valid discussion AND a reasonable option.
Where are the reporters that ask the REALLY HARD questions, like, "Did you actually watch the game, or did you just push the simulate button and watch for the blue line to move?"
2 losses, if one of them comes to MSU or Nebraska, virtually nullifies any hope of a Big Ten Championship. The difference between 6-6 and 10-2 is just bookkeeping at this point. This staff needs to pull out all the stops against MSU on November 2.
A great guy who won a national championship.
When he was matched up with a once-in-a-lifetime defense.
I don't remember a lot of teams beating down his door to be their OC when he was available after Lloyd left.
Congratulations. Along with "Credence Tapes" I'd like to give you the "Glass is 0.031% full!" award for this thread.
Do you really think DeBord's "genius" had that much to do with the '97 championship? That was a low-complexity offense that any number of guys could have run. UMich had a very good year largely because it had NFL talent in all the position groups, highlighted by a once-in-a-lifetime DB. More NFL talent than Nebraska, in fact. (Few people realize this.)
DeBord was also a guy who, among other things, left a tire fire at CMU.
I suppose that you could have led an offense that won a national championship? Tell me. When did it happen? When did you win the Madden Crown? Did they give you a trophy, or was it one of those BW3's half-banner things?
Part of me feels bad for Borges because I'm sure it's a frustrating spot to be in. Then I remember that he makes a half million a year and that there are people who deal with much more frustration and stress every day of their lives, and I don't feel that bad any more.
What does it take? Honestly ask yourself, what are the expectations?
This should be simple; it's talked about regularly.
A Big Ten Championship.
This will not happen with the current coaching staff. The mentality/philosophy, the essence of Manball on the West Coast is forever alive in Ann Arbor.
9-3 is my expectation, with a bowl victory. IMO, with Borges' time being now. He has this season and if Hoke deems otherwise, it may be back to the drawing board.
this is your day
Being one of the guys you'd probably accuse of doing that, it isn't really the isssue at all.
As has been said by me and those of my ilk, ad nauseam, you are free to complain, just don't be a complete dick hole.
Seriously, is it that hard to just not be a raging cuntbag, or is that impossible for some of you?
There is complaining, and then there is being a complete asshole who is either consistently negative about everything or who consistently blows everything out of proportion ( i.e., "FIRE EVERYONE!" "PULL THEIR SCHOLARSHIPS!").
Also, frankly, fans policing other fans has been a hallmark of this board and is one of the reasons people have enjoyed coming here over the years.
I don't care if it's online or in real life, if you're being a complete and total asshole (especially with regard to sports) you deserve to get called out and told to kindly shut the fuck up.
Seriously, like 4467667 things had to go wrong for Michigan to lose at night, against Penn State, in Happy Valley.
There is no reason for people to be abandoning ship like they are.
A pretty pervasive trend in US culture these days is the demand for instant emotional gratification. Specifically in this case, people want the experience of feeling right without putting in the work to be right. Not to mention the almost complete abandonment of civility. But I digress...
This is not a binary argument of "Borges right or idiots wrong"... lots of pricks spouting off and in the wrong, but Borges is not beyond critique either. They stacked the box because they felt no threat from our pass -- why weren't we exploiting the mismatch with Funchess? Missed opportunity, I vouch. Our inability to run was amplified when we abandoned the pass almost entirely, late in the game. Up 10 at the end of the game, you run clock... up 7? Better score, otherwise you abdicate the outcome of the game to the other team's will. OT? Better score. Yes, yes, Gibbons should have rabble rabble. The probability of a FG being blocked or missed is real, and is why you don't simply rely on the FG. The coaches' plans and decisions effected the outcome.
So, plenty of room for critique, but there is a right way to do it, which is to be civil and stick to the facts. Sad to see this board abandon facts for tabloid-esque speculation... "oooh he's tugging at his shirt! What does this *mean*? It's obviously significant!" "Guys, for real, those gestures indicate that he is criminally insane. I saw it on CSI." Sad, weak little minds.
I e-gree with most of your post.
None of what I said, I find to be particularly ridiculous. My main point is effectively, "Don't be an asshole."
Apparently people have a huge problem with that, because every time I say it, it seems to attract very defensive people who (perhaps no so) shockingly act like assholes.
Not once have I said anyone is above criticism or that no one can complain about anything.
In fact, I've said people are free to criticize whatever they'd like, or complain about whatever they'd like, just don't be an asshole.
You can make plenty of well reasoned points as to why you feel a certain way without being a complete and total asshole about it.
People would like to think that they're offering reasonable analysis or complaints, but most of the time people are just unholy asses about things, and I'm positive that anyone who has ever modded a liveblog can attest to that fact.
It's just an endless shit spiral of "this sucks, that sucks, he sucks, fuck player x, fucking coach x, this is bullshit, fire him, pull his scholarship, UNACCEPTABLE," and a bunch of other pointless nonsense.
I just don't understand how people can consistently be so negative all of the time. What is the point? What is the benefit of it?
Do you really need to post every single shitty thought that goes through your head online?
Do we really need to have an epic meltdown after--not even every loss anymore, sometimes we have them after wins?
We don't have to act like every bad thing that happens is the end of the world, and doing so doesn't make you "care more" or a "better fan."
The man who says, "I love my girlfriend so much that if she left me I'd kill myself," doesn't love his girlfriend more than the guy who says, "I love my girlfriend so much, but if she left me I wouldn't kill myself." He has an emotional disorder.
Right, and I agree with most of what you wrote as well. Not much point trying to convince those with blind convictions that they're full of it, though... "does not compute" for them. Sign of a bad computer.
My point of contention is simply with your statement that "so many things had to go wrong for us to lose." Our tactics at the end of the game left the door open for an unlikely sequence to burn us, when there was a chance for us to clinch the outcome and crush all hope. Perhaps an aggressive plan would have burned us as well, but I think there's something to be said for going down swinging, instead of watching your fate be handed to you and leave thinking "What if..."
Fuck it Dude. Let's go bowling. Oh yeah and I'm still pretty sure we beat State. Both of 'em. Mark it, Dude.
Yes, a million things had to go perfectly wrong...the 80-yard drive on 3 somewhat circusy/lucky catches, to missing 3 game-winning field goals are examples of that. And at the same time, the coaches help put Michigan in the situations which things could go wrong. See, running the ball up the middle in the first OT rather than actually going for more yards and setting up your kicker for an easier field goal. They might as well have attempted the field goal on the first play of OT.
While I generally agree with the notion that the discourse ought to be held at a high level with insights not bitching. But you water down your otherwise quality post at the end when you complain about others complaining.
And guess what? Most of those things that went wrong were the same things that went wrong earlier in the season. Borges is terrible at getting Devin in rhythm. The guy ran the same play 27 times without success.
Man must have a wicked mosquito bite on that chest of his. Practically dug a hole
@ The Last Hoke. I completely agree with many of the points you are making, including people acting like complete dicks and that a 5-1 record really isn't that bad. However, the real problem with Borges is that we are very lucky to be at 5-1 in spite of Borges, and honestly there are lots of games in the last 3 years that we won in spite of borges. He has shown that he is stubborn in regards to placing the current players in the best position to win and he never shows in game adjustments.
There have been many games the last few seasons that had it not been for some last minute miracles, There have been maybe a few very good games by him, but a few over 3 seasons is not good enough for the kind of money he is being paid.
I e-gree that Borges has called quite a few stinkers and that he and Funk should be on the hot seat for the performance of the offense.
I'm not going to demand that they be fired immediately, because I feel like that would be a terrible decision.
I'm also not going to demand their blood be sacrificed to the blood god, or that coach Hoke publicly raze them. That wouldn't solve anything, and would only be a negative for the program.
Maybe my expectations for this team were slightly lower than a lot of you (who it seems thought we were going to go undefeated or something), because 5-1 seems to be about right.
This team seems to play to the level of their opponents, so I really doubt we get blown out in any games this year. Maybe one, but who knows.
It's just funny to me how it seems like the majority of the board views the Akron, UCONN, and PSU games as totally indicative of our future, while acting as though the Notre Dame, CMU, and Minnesota games were all one off flukes.
If there is anything we know about this team it's that we don't really know much of anything.
Anyone preaching doom and gloom is just being a negative nancy.
Remember in 2011 when our running game outside of the QB position was utterly nonexistent, and then we flipped a switch in the 8th game of the season against Purdue? Who is to say that wont happen again?
MSU's offense looked like complete and utter dogshit the first few weeks of the season. I mean, it looked completely unsalveagable, and they've turned things around significantly.
We've seen this coaching staff tinker with things and find ways to make it work. We've seen Borges call good games.
Let's not whitewash history because it's more fun to have an MGoMeltdown circlejerk.
My expectation is simple. I expect the coaches to put the players in the best spot to win regardless of, or maybe despite, whatever shortcomings the players (individually or as a group) might have. I don't have a problem with us not winning per se and I don't have an issue with players failing to execute assuming they are putting forth effort.
Well we are one play from 6-0. But why think of it like that right?
5-1 is a pretty darn good record.
If the team is "flat out not good." then, how is 5-1 a horrible record? 5-1 might be a horrible record for a team that is great, but sounds pretty good if you buy into your premise that the team is not good. Also, how does the fact that they came close to being 3-3 have any bearing on whether 5-1 is horrible?
People are treating it like we are 1-5. This team is young. This team is frustrating to watch. Play calling is frustrating. The O line is horrible. But, they will continue to grow and will compete. We all expected them to beat Penn State. It didn't happen. Get over it. Exciting times are ahead for this team.
Is that this staff has convinced itself certain things are true, mainly by repeating them over and over again. You can say whatever you want, but it has to be proven on the field. It simply hasn't been. Borges is borderline delusional with this stuff. So is Hoke for that matter with his "I have every confidence in my O coordinator and O line coaches."
Yeah, in the beginning of the video he said he didn't want to turn the ball over in overtime. Then he said he trusted Devin and Devin has made leaps and bounds from 2 weeks ago. So I trust him to run to the middle of the field and fall down. Pathetic.
I completely understand now. Borges had money on PSU (+3). Michigan had a 7 point lead and were driving despite his best efforts so he was late to get the call in, caused a delay of game, and suggested a punt instead of a field goal to push the game to 10 points. He then prayed that Penn State would miraculously drive the field and tie the game. They pulled through for him. In overtime he had Michigan right where he wanted them. His strategy was for either PSU to beat him with a touchdown or he was going to kick field goals so that if Michigan DID win, the bet would push... and he would break even. Al Borges hit his bet Saturday night. You go, Al Borges.
Come on, everyone! You have to give Al credit. It's not easy to be the author of the worst RB performance in the history of Michigan football! It's not easy to call for your QB to spike the ball with the clock stopped on first down! It's not easy to come up with a way to not only tip your run plays, but also come up with a brilliant new way to also tell teams exactly where the run is going to go! These are innovations! This is the future of football!
To me, the gameplan just seems like a severe overcorrection on Hokes part in reaction to the turnover tornados that were the Akron/UConn games. I don't think Borges wants anything to do with this unbalanced line fiasco and I don't think we will see it anymore this season.
Once again its Borges fault. This is all I hear from a delusional fan base that wants blood for saturdays disguting defeat. I was pissed off about the performance as well. I have now moved past it. I'm sure the team has as well. Its time to move forward. I am certainly glad that so many of you have given up on this team. This staff knows what the problems are and guess what we cannot and will not have any influence over what they plan to do going forward. Yes, we should have been undefeated going into November, but guess what we got beat. Is it Al' s fault? Hoke is the boss and he goes down with this ship one way or another. He will not fire anyone and he will stand behind his staff. He is that type of guy. I have scanned his tenure as a head coach and have found that he has never let anyone go previously. He is a loyal guy. Overall I think he is ultimately at fault for all the bad decisons. He should have called timeout when Devin lost his helmet, He should have called timeout late in the game to avoid losing out on a field goal that would have gave us a two score lead. He is at fault, but in life we live and we learn and I expect them to make the adjustments that are neccessary for this team to have a shot at the Big Title.
once again, many on this board has proven the knee jerky nature of many in this community.
And they say women are emotional. sheesh.
What a bunch of Chicken Littles.
This comment section is pretty horrible...
Fergodsakes people. One thing we can all rest assured of is that Hoke cares more about Michigan Football than he does about some allegiance to his ol' pal Al, or any of his coaches. And I have no doubt that every one of his coaches knows this. There is friendship, and there is Michigan Football. They know that Hoke will support them outwardly, professionally, but they also know he will also fire them if their work is not up to the standards of Michigan Football. The traits that manigest in that way are the same traits that lead recruits to like him.
If we continue to regress, or not progress, on offense, I have no doubt Hoke will make personnel changes. He knows this, his coaches know this, and you folks should know this.
His hand keeps wanting to choke him. Damn you hand, why couldn't you muster the courage to choke him???!!! FINISH HIM!
I have never seen someone so nervous to talk about something he is supposed yo be an expert in.
Bo would be ashamed of this blog today.
But, he would also be very ashamed of 27 rushes for 27 yards against supposedly inferior competition. I think that everyone's inner-Bo is channeling that frustration this week and Borges/Playcalling/Coaching/Funk are taking the brunt of it.
I can't blame Fitz for the line issues, but maybe Green can steam roll a couple of defenders for a few extra yards. Honestly, he can't be any worse.
Have you watched Green this year? Guy goes down really easily for a big power back. I don't think the rb is the problem. They aren't world beaters but they aren't getting much help either.
His hand keeps wanting to choke him. Damn you hand, why couldn't you muster the courage to choke him???!!! FINISH HIM!
I have never seen someone so nervous to talk about something he is supposed yo be an expert in.
What I find utterly amazing is the ability of the Borges apologists to claim any sort of football knowledge while simultaniously defending insanty. I'm ok if you want to want say Al is a great guy, a wonderful neighbor, someone you'd like to have a beer with or spend a lazy Sunday chatting up movies but there is no way in hell you can defend his playcalling. It's so bad we are being MOCKED nationally for it. Do you guys get that? Borges play calling has become a national joke on virtually all football boards for how increadibly, amazingly bad it was. And yet you guys want to defend it for reasons I cant begin to fathom.
I do not think he should get fired mid season unless we've got somebody better on staff who can take over and I dont think we do. But I sure as hell want Hoke to tell Al this shit has to stop and stop right now or he will make changes at the end of the year. That is what bothers me the most - the fact that there is nothing that indicates anybody on our football team finds the debacle of last Saturday's play calling problematic while the rest of the country laughs at its stupidity.
I didnt like being the brunt of football jokes after the horror and I sure as hell dont like it now.
How are we so sure that Hoke is not the one telling Al to go this route???? Hoke doesnt wear a headsset because the plan is the plan it seems. Hoke wants this style and will drive Michigan into the ground to get there. The point was made on saturday. I did the same as a middle school coach, yes I said it (Middle School). It worked come year two because the 6 plays we ran were finally executed so well we were city league co-Champs after winning one game the year prior. I stuck to my plan and it worked. This is the same methodology. Hoke will make adjustments as November looms, but it has been made clear that this is what he wants to do.
So you want us to make decisions based on what the internet says? If not, then what is your point?
Who cares if people are mocking anything about us? The internet mocks everything and every one.
Brian Kelly and Notre Dame were a huge joke most of last year, up until the point they were undefeated and playing in the national championship game, and even then they were still a joke because of the Manti Te'o deal, as well as the fact that they got blown out.
People were mocking Denard "Arm Punt" Robinson all the way to a BCS bowl win and running for the most yards for a QB in college football history.
The internet laughing at us should be so far off anyone's radar. It's also one of the singular dumbest reasons to be upset about anything. Wait 5 minutes for a new cat video to pop up, or a clip of Les Miles doing anything and Al Borges' play calling that one game is 1000 years in the past.
No I want us to make decisions based on sound football practice and logic and in your zeal to defend Al at all costs you seem to have forgotten that. Does it not seem odd to you that literally the entire football universe thinks our playcalling last saturday was laughingly bad and predictable? How do you simply ignore that?
Can I ask what experience you have in organized football? I'm not trying to be jerky here I just want to know. Cause you are definitely the only person I've seen that thinks what we did last week made sense and liked it so I'm curious what your unique background is.
This post is complete nonsense.
I've been defending Al Borges. If you call saying, "Hey, the play calling has been bad at times and Al is definitely deserving of criticism, but maybe there are more issues here other than 'ZOMG AL SUCKS, FIRE HIM!' and maybe we can criticize Al without being complete dick bags?"
I don't know what you mean by "the entire football universe" and no, to be frank I haven't heard much of anyone say much of anything about it. Again, who cares, and why does it make you so angry?
What does my experience playing high school football have to do with anything? I haven't made any sort of schematic arguments of any kind on this thread. In fact, I loathe people without football experience making those sorts of points, because they generally don't know what the hell they're talking about. I think I said one thing about it being hard to set up the run with the pass when your QB keeps throwing interceptions, if you can call that "schematic."
If you can point to me defending our game plan last week, that would be great. Seriously, comb through the thread and go for it.
"When Devin is throwing interceptions like it's his job (as he has been prone to do at times this season), it's hard to throw to set up the run.
As a coordinator you have to go into damage mitigation mode at that point.
There is not a lot you can do if your QB can't throw and your offenseive line can't generate the requisite amount of room for the running game to be effective."
"The offense put the team in position to win the game on multiple occasions. You can certainly argue the play calling should have been more aggressive, but the bottom line is two easily makeable field goals were botched, and our defense gave up an 80 yard TD drive with 47 seconds left on the clock and PSU sans timeouts.
That's not on the offensive play calling at all what so ever. You can try to pin those things on Borges, but that doesn't make it true."
So how are either of those statements defending Borges and the game plan?
I said it's hard to effectively call a good game when your QB is throwing interceptions and you can't run the ball at all.
Doesn't sound like any sort of a pro-Borges statement there, and would you care to argue that point?
Also, one of those quotes I said you could argue that the play calling should have been more aggressive, which directly contradicts your continued insistence that I've been blindly supportive of Borges. I also stated that the offense wasn't solely to blame for the loss, and did put the team in a position to win the game on multiple occasions.
Care to argue that point, or did the 2 botched field goals and 80 yard TD drive with 47 seconds left and no time outs not happen?
You've also conveniently ignored about a dozen posts where I've said the offensive play calling was bad.
In short....You're not only wrong, and being a dick about it, but you're also making a very blatant attempt to misconstrue the things I have said while simulataneously ignoring anything I've said that doesn't fit your very wrong opinion about my position.
I mean, I literally said a few comments up from this:
"I e-gree that Borges has called quite a few stinkers and that he and Funk should be on the hot seat for the performance of the offense.
"I'm not going to demand that they be fired immediately, because I feel like that would be a terrible decision.
"I'm also not going to demand their blood be sacrificed to the blood god, or that coach Hoke publicly raze them. That wouldn't solve anything, and would only be a negative for the program."
Wow. What a ringing endorsement. I'm such a Borges defender/apologist. Look at me.
He has some real-world football experience, I believe. And he is one of the more forgiving people on Borges here. Less so with Funk, but still not too sour on him.
And please, please, stop calling people who maybe don't want Borges fired right now "apologists". That label is utterly ridiculous. It is possible to have a more nuanced position in between "BORGES IS AWESOME YOU GUYS, IT'S ALL DEVIN GARDNER'S FAULT" and "FIRE BORGES FIRE FUNK!" It seems like anyone not on the latter end of the specturm instantly becomes an apologist and is delusional, somehow.
The word apologist doesn't really have the negative connotation many here seem to think it does.
We lost. Everyone associated with the team finds the loss problemmatic. If you think Hoke doesnt question every aspect of that game, inclusing the offensive playcalling, then you have your head up your ass. Use some rationality, and then rationally project some of that on Hoke. Hoke is through and through a professional. There is what happens behind the doors of Schembechler Hall, and there is what happens in front of the media. Very rarely shall the twain meet. Hoke will not throw anyone under the bus - players, coaches, etc. But if you think he has not had sat down with Al and discussed how they can, as a coaching team, improve things, then you are just not being rational. If you think he has not, constructively, communicated to Al that things must improve, then you are again not being rational.
No I dont necessarily think Hoke did that. As I've said before, based on his public statements coupled with the playcalling itself, I am much more inclined to believe that Hoke approved of what was called and liked it and that scares me even more.
There appears to be a mindset on our team that it's somehow not "manly" to take free yards if they are given and that real men call plays where the other team knows where the ball is going to prove how tough we are.
I've played up through high school ball, I've coached up through high school ball and I've recruited for Michigan from 1992-1994. And I've never, ever seen that philosophical approach by any OC anyplace else. Everybody else tries to the opposite (go where the defense aint - not where they are). It's insane.
for a few decades are used to our team being mocked by national commentators. Seriously between dissing the dinosaur style of football played in the big ten (this was in the 70s btw), suffered constant carping and suffered in the rankings.
So if we got used to dealing with the talking heads consistently telling us our team was ranked to highly and couldn't compete with modern football, why would we care about what "virtually all football boards" are saying about the team.
The team has a deeply flawed offense right now. Can't argue with that. Some is on Borges and Hoke, some is not. Suck it up. This will eventually get better. The Oline issues are not simply an excuse, they are a reality that has no quick fix, not by scheme, nor by coaching. Some mitigation MAY be possible, but the offense will be a slow progression all season.
Then you need to stop searching for it (don't know how else you're seeing it), go find something more productive to do, and stop being a teenage girl about it.
I believe it's caused by exposure to Poison Conscience.
Shapeless and painful.
People saying ''It's hard to Al to want to throw because Devin throws picks sometimes'' did you watch the fucking game? You think because Devin threw 2 picks (which Hackenberg did as well, mind you) we should've run the ball up the middle into 9 guys 27 times? What are you smoking? Devin's arm and scrambling ability were what gave us the ability to even take a lead in that game.
Remember in the summer when everyone couldn't wait for football season so the boards would stop being terrible? Good times.
If Al is going to continue to be in denial that we cannot run the ball with what we have and Brady Hoke continues to allow him to call those plays...27 times...and does not step up and tell him to call something else, then it should fall on Brady. Al is just like my 4 year old - he will continue to do whatever he wants until Brady puts him in a timeout.
Borges is taking a bunch of heat and rightfully so, but at the end of the day the buck stops with Hoke. People have been clamoring for a year and half to throw short passes and keep the defense honest horizontally, not just vertically. However, those short passes have never materialized in the offense. If the readers of this blog can see it, then the coaches can too but they just refuse to take advantage of the defense when the db's line up 10yds off the los. If Hoke wanted short passes incorporated into the offensive game plan, they'd be in there. Hoke seems to be lock in step with what Borges is doing or vice versa, Borges is following what the HC wants him to do.
Indiana has no business being a 10 pt dog vs. Michigan in Ann Arbor, but there they are.
If Michigan has been struggling to beat Akron, UConn and Penn State, it may surprise people to understand that Indiana, with 20+ starters back, is better than all three of those combined. And the Hoosiers' loss to Missouri by 17 (and they played them pretty tough at home) is looking better every goddamned week.
Oh and uh, by the way. Michigan is 65th in the nation in passing defense right now.
Saturday will be a gut-churning experience. I agree with you. I think Indiana can win if they have a good day. A lot will depend on our turnovers.
Borges needs to give up coaching the QB and someone else should be brought in. The line is still young so I think another year is warranted. Does everyone recall that the O-Line recruiting was horrible before Hoke arrved? Do we remember that the guys inside are young and inexperienced?
I don't know if we also need an upgrade at the O-Line coaching position, but I think Hoke/Borges deserve another year so at least there is more experience on the line. I do think we need a separate QB coach, however.
of things is the emphais placed on doing things he didn't want as opposed to what actually occurred. There were 53 running plays, OK. And 27 of them by Fitz earned a yard, statistically.
Yet, he says that the idea was to feature the kicker in OT after the kicker couldn't win the game in regulation. And the fear was a TO in OT, which means that playing not to lose was the primary strategy over winning the game.
If you acknowledge that your passer has better footwork and is making great strides. And if you know that he threw three long TD passes in regulation and two to a physically gifted receiver who can overpower most anyone defending him, why don't you milk that advantage?
Here's why: the fear of failure outsized the decision to win the game. The fear of making a mistake, outweighed the decision to push the envelope and go for a TD. And that was signaled by the first response Borges gave, claiming that the staff thinks the world of Gibbons as a kicker, which is great.
But why do you want to leave it up to the kicker if your passer is doing such a good job. You throw the ball with 25 seconds left to move the ball downfield, but you don't want to throw it when there are 25 yards for a score that will give you a victory? I don't get that logic.
That game made me lose all hope for the offense going forward. Mule needs to go.