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http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-bigten-expansion
I'm sure Jack Swarbrick wasn't just there from the free food. 4 1/2 hours seems like a long time for a meet and greet.
Added to that Orangebloods.com is reporting that the Irish board of directors is split 50/50 on whether or not to join the Big Ten FWIW.
http://texas.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1091537
It is getting very interesting out there.
that ND would play in the Big Ten Championship game if they finished in the top 25...
of the Big Ten Championship Game; regardless of their participation.
They ought to be in if they receive any votes. So many of the voters leave them out in order to satisfy their own inferiority complex that it's more of an accomplishment for ND to make the Top 25 than for any other team to do it.
/heavy s
Notre Dame annexes the Upper Peninsula if they join the Big 10.
I am hoping ND joins, they should have come instead of PSU IMO.
What I'm wondering is who are the other teams that would come in if they go to 16
I have Rutgers, ND, Mizzu and Neb but I can't think of another one. Syracuse? Colorado?
Kansas?
I am thinking the SEC takes Clemson, GT, FSU and Miami leaving the ACC to take the Big East leftovers and East Carolina to make up for Rutgers.
Rumor out saying Boise might go Mountain West, Colorado might now go Mountain West, that would be 2 really good additions for that conference.
No way GT joins the SEC as GT is an excellent school, academically.
As for B10 - Neb, Mizzou, and ND are possibilities....if we go to 14 those sound likely... If we go to 16, is Pitt still in the picture? I'm guessing Syracuse is as well.
I pray to sweet, tiny, college football fan Baby Jesus that Rutgers does not end up in the B10. Seriously they blow. They had a good football team that one year and that's all they've ever done athletically. And their academics are shitty. And for the 170th time.... No one in NYC gives a shit about Rutgers. Seriously. This notion that Rutgers joining the B10 will translate to 15 million New Yorkers suddenly clamoring for the BTN on their cable boxes is preposterous. Yet it keeps coming up....can we finally put a rest to this?
I continue to be amazed at the lack of perspective people have on the ACC. East Carolina to the ACC is a complete and total joke. It's like MC3 to the Big Ten. It's a geographical fit, so it must make perfect sense.
East Carolina joining the ACC is about the same as Oakland joining the Big 10 in terms of fit. I had relations there in Greenville and I can tell you that it is about the 4th tier of school in North Carolina. But you're right, if the geography is there it's getting mentioned.
I've got it! Forget EC, go for Appy St in the ACC!
Hey, their promotional videos do tell us that their faculty and staff are "best in the country." Also, they are HOT HOT HOT, which always counts for something.
Missouri, Nebraska, Notre Dame, Syracuse, Rutgers
And I'm sticking to it.
Pulls the D.C. and Baltimore area viewers for the BTN. That's my kinda thinkin'.
I think you pretty much hit it on the head.
Best case for me- Texas, Texas A&M, Nebraska, ND, Missouri or Pitt
Best case logical- Missouri, Nebraska, ND, Syracuse, Pitt
Most likely to happen- Missouri, ND, Nebraska, Rutgers, Syracuse
Man I don't like Rutgers in the B10 ;/
Oklahoma for Mizzou or Pitt but the rest sound good to me in your best case.
but that is an even worse chances to happen than Texas to the B10. Maybe I should have added a dream section?
...I think if the miraculous happens and Texas accepts the invitation into the Big Leagues than I just feel that everyone would logically come to the next step of pursuing OU. They are a good school, part of the AAU, a strong brand name. I could be totally off base, but if I connect the dots I think the sooners make sense if Texas is aboard.
I hope people are finally coming to their senses and realizing that Rutgers can't outdraw Syracuse, Pitt, or UConn in their own buildings much less bring anything to the Big Ten.
This goes here now.
So much for having a dull offseason.
This story is as nauseating to me as the Greg Paulus saga from a year ago. I just don't give a shit what ND and Freakbass do.
Screw Texas and Screw Baylor. Baylor is nowhere close to Colorado just cause they had 1 good basketball season. ECU goes to the ACC opening up a spot for Baylor and they would be comfortable right with Rice and Houston and Colorado doesn't get screwed.
Zero percent chance ECU goes to the ACC.
ACC will take UConn and whoever may be left of Pittsburgh and Syracuse (I think ACC loses Miami and FSU to the SEC) and get back to 12 (They have no interest in Rutgers... what does that tell you?).
Who invited Swarbrick? This was a scheduled meeting. Did Delany call the ND AD, or did Swarbrick call Delany.
Also, the Texas Rivals article is pretty insistant that the Big 10 is targeting ND ONLY right now. I think this is a mistake If this is being communicated to ND. This removes all the pressure from the Irish and only stands to further their entitlement complex. "The entire landscape of college football depends on if we join the Big10 or not."
The only thing I can see is if the Delany has had this plan in mind all along: Look, ND, all hell is about to break loose. You either join us now, or the whole system collapses and you will have to join something anyway. We are good either way, and you are screwed. Join now, join later. We don't care...
Pretty cozy for Swarbrick to be at the Big Ten Presidents' meeting to talk expansion. This probalby means they have been having more of a regular dialogue than Swarbrick's comments would lead everyone to believe.
As for why focus on ND, Delaney has done a good job on this so far and he is probably trying to be careful not to do something that would make getting ND more difficult. For example, whatever money getting ND brings, it will be split over 12 teams if only ND is added but over 16 teams if ND is added along with four additional teams. Second, the more teams you add, the more scheduling problems you have in terms of maintaining in conference and out of conference rivalries. I would rather see B10 get ND and stay at 12 or 14 teams than go to 16 teams and not get ND because they want to play Navy, Stanford, and USC every year but a 16 team conference makes that nearly impossible.
I say work with ND to get a deal both B10 and ND can live with while making it clear to ND that we will almost certainly be snagging 1-3 Big East teams if ND drags their feet or throws up roadblocks in terms of unrealistic conditions. The fact that Swarbrick was at this meeting is an extremely good sign.
Im so sick of people saying scheduling problems are a reason not to expand. The Big Ten and each school pay people to work out schedules. Its their job. How hard is it to schedual 14 or 16 teams? the NFL schedules 32, Next you'll say its really hard to find officials for that many conf. games.
huge respect if the Big Ten can add ND and only ND. Team 12 is so, so much more valuable than teams 13-16 because then you get the conference title game money. The SEC I believe made 15 million off of that game alone. You get a national brand name school, can better market the BTN in the Northeast (subway alumni, etc.), and don't have the worries of whether a 16 team conference can work--history hasn't been kind.
But boy would JoePa be pissed.
I say we make JoePa happy...
huge respect if the Big Ten can add ND and only ND. Team 12 is so, so much more valuable than teams 13-16 because then you get the conference title game money. The SEC I believe made 15 million off of that game alone. You get a national brand name school, can better market the BTN in the Northeast (subway alumni, etc.), and don't have the worries of whether a 16 team conference can work--history hasn't been kind.
ND is the absolute linchpin behind all conference moves. If the B10 offers and ND accepts, I think the conference will stop at 12 schools. This means Nebraska and Missouri have nowhere to go, meaning it is suddenly much easier for Texas to keep the B12 together, and the Big East can also breathe easier about being raided by either the B10 or the ACC. The PAC10 stays the same, too, and the only notable move is by Boise St. There would be relative stability within BCS ranks, which I think is actually a positive thing.
If ND declines a B10 offer, then it's WWIII and chaos reigns supreme.
I agree with MGauxBlue about ND's sense of special entitlement. Regardless of what happens, your typical Domer's ego won't fit inside St. Peter's itself after all this is done. Gah.
I think the Pac10 is looking to go to 16 even if the B10 stops the expansion at 12 with adding ND. Outside of Texas, theres alot of schools upset about unfair revenue sharing.
I also doubt ND is the first to join the B10. I think they will only join the B10 out of necessity. Who knows though.
It IS interesting. Notre Dame could possibly keep everything from collapsing by joining, but by not joining they can create seismic shifts and then need to join, anyway.
toward the Big Ten in the past, I hope you are right. Other than being in need of a real playoff system, the FBS doesn't need any major change. Superconferences are fun to speculate about, but in the end, I think general stability is better for the sport.
I am not sure that this young buck Pac-10 comish is going to be happy with 11 schools. We have heard all along that the Big10's motivation was to get a championship game. Adding Boise puts the Pac-10 in the same spot the Big10 is now: 1 team short.
Also, the Pac-10 needs to go big or go home. Boise is only a catch in football, with the rest of their athletic and academic portfolio unfit for the Pac-10. I think that if the Pac-10 does anything, it is still going after top flight academic Big12 schools (Texas) and whatever baggage comes with it (the Texas Legislature.)
Boise's not going to the Pac 10. They're going to the Mtn West. This now gives the Mtn West a real shot at breaking into the BCS via the auto qualifier formula. And BTW--- the Mtn West presidents had to take a real deep swallow to allow Boise in... they're a pretty proud second tier conference when it comes to academics.. Utah, Air Force, TCU, BYU all take their academics seriously.
I agree--I think this whole thing is a rouse to get ND to join the B10.
Does this ruse have you aroused?
That second article flies off the tracks a bit towards the end, but overall made some sense.
If the B10 goes to 16 teams and Colorado is there to take, I would think it is worth a look at least. It is AAU and if we picked up Syracuse as well we could have some great chances to make up for Stewart/McNabb embarrassments. Plus I always have kind of liked both the state and University of Colorado.
How about picking up (if they would come): Syracuse, ND, Neb, MO, CO? Just no Rutgers please. They would become like the ugliest among many ugly stepsisters and their name sounds like dry-heaving after a rough night at Frasier's... Not that I would know anything about that.
ND joining the B10 with everything else remaining static, I have to admit that after all the feverish speculation involving teams from New Jersey to Colorado to Texas, Nebraska, and Missouri, simply adding ND and stopping there seems anticlimactic.
I also didn't mean to imply earlier that Boise is a candidate for the Pac10; as W-in-Ex says, they're going to join the Mountain West if they move anywhere. I agree they're not a fit at all with the Pac10.
It's kind of like your first time at the nudie bar.... you go in with a lot of reluctance, hoping you can just see some boobies... but after five minutes in there, you really want to borrow $200 from your buddies and go to the VIP room, but alas, you find out there's no sex in the Champaign Room. So you go sit down and you see some great boobies, but it's still not the Champaign Room, even though you originally just wanted to see boobies.
Key: ND = boobies, Texas = lap dance, Conference absorbing armageddon = champaign room
I need to drink more....
It'll always be Champagne, Illinois (pronounced Cham-paag-ney).
I have been trying not to go crazy with the expansion garbage, but here is something I have been thinking about since the Pac-10 craziness first hit: what if Delany tells NU that it should keeps its options open, preventing Osbourne and company from giving the Big12 its glowing "Hazzah, we're staying!", which in turn fires up the Pac-10's "Big12 South offer cannon". THEN when ND is shitting itself, Delany immediately calls Texas and offers membership. Suddenly A&M, Tech and even Baylor skip hand-in-hand to the Left Coast and Texas can say, "look, we have two offers, we are going to take the one that makes the most sense for us. The step-sisters are going to be fine either way."
I don't think this will happen in a godzillion years, but I was feeling left out of the crazy expansion game.
we would just be inundated with versions pertaining to conference expansion. They would be hilarious.
If the B10 waits and waits and gets stiffed by ND and other conferences, Delaney = Hitler
If ND rejects the B10 and then gets left out of the subsequent shuffling, Swarbrick = Hitler
If Neb and Mizzou leave for the B10 but the Pac10 decides not to offer UT and the other five B12 schools after all, Deloss Dodds = Hitler
I'm sure its been discussed ad nauseum but I have no idea what to think about ND joining the conference. It seems like they are the best fit both athletically and academically and the Big Ten wouldn't have to become a super conference after they join.
The problem is my level of disdain and the sheer satisfaction they get by knowing the Big Ten wants/needs them so badly makes me sick. I wish we could just steal Texas and be done with it.
You hate to cut off your nose to spite your face, but in this situation it is really tempting. ND doesn't deserve a second chance to join B10 and get all the free money it brings on a platter.
On the other hand, TX has been about as much of a bully in the B12 as a member can be. I have a feeling the Pac16 is not going to find this merger as "perfect' as it looks on paper right now. Having TX in the B10 constantly threatening to leave unless they get their way on issues would be a disaster. Look at what they are already doing to the Pac 10 by forcing them to take Oklahoma State, Texas Tech and Baylor? The Pac 10 will never be the same.
Delany has to hope that just swinging ND is going to keep the rest of the nation at status quo. We (Michigan and Big10) are going to be screwed if the Big10 has positioned itself to be the last of the 12 team conferences just in time for the rest of the nation jumps to the 16 team supa' conferences.
It would be better to be the Palace (one of the first modern sports arenas, opened in 1988) than to be Joe Louis (one of the last old school arenas, opened a few years earlier).
I can't get with this at all. A championship game in a 12 team conference would be just as good as with a 16 team conference from all I can tell. Plus less teams = more tradition preserved via rivalries and trophies and such.
Really I don't care how many teams we add as long as we can still be the "Big 10" and we don't include Ruyt-grs. (I swear, it feels like I'm hiccupuking just saying it.)
it is all about the money. Expanding means more viewers and therefore more profits. Lets just hop that we don't get "The Michigan-Ohio State Game" presented by Gatorade or Pepsi, with ads all over the field. That would be fucked up in so many ways.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=1909426
The deal got cancelled, but it's been real close to happening before.
... is looking like one of the major beneficiaries of this whole process. Can you imagine if they could pick up Nebraska, Kansas, Kansas St., Colorado, Missouri, Iowa St. and Boise St.? Add TCU, Utah, BYU and you have a pretty solid conference! Even without Nebraska and Missouri, it still would be a major step up.
Wonder what the Domers' reaction was in finding out Swarbrick was at this meeting. Gotta be some surprised Irish right now.
Curious as to his reaction.
You should probably start your 5th expansion thread of the day to ask about it.
You seem upset.
I like the 16 team config, but I have to agree with the sentiment that Rutgers sucks. Schiano has done a good job there recently but they have been a non-entity in football for like forever. I haven't lived on the East Coast for a while, but I can't imagine that even in the Big Ten that they would get any headlines in NYC. It is a Pro sports town plain and simple, as is Boston.
I like Maryland, ND, Neb, Mizzou and maybe Kansas or Pitt. Viva Chaos!
Maryland? I know they do football, but what else do they do?
Yeah, I'm wondering what the typical Domer thinks of all this. Do they think they have to hold their nose to join us? Are they inundating Swarbrick with threats of violence if he decides to join? And is it the Notre Dame AD's decision alone, or does the ND administration make the decision? Irish?
The Notre Dame board is split 50-50.
Looks like ND is going to lose the USC game, if they don't join the BIG TEN(14/16) they lose UM/MSU/PUR. At least they'll always have the service academies.
The God Father scenario is looking more and more realistic.
Notre Dame, Nebraska, and Missouri seem like they could be able to push the BTN into being carried nationally. Even if it isn't, Nebraska and Notre Dame are two huge name schools and Missouri brings in STL and KC. Let's do this.
Yeah, I'd like to be able to save that $5 a month I pay just to get the BTN. And what sucks is even though the only channel in the sports and game tier I watch is the Big Ten Network - they probably get 10 cents or something, unlike in Big Ten territory where they get a dollar per household.
I wonder what will happen with the schedule when expansion is done. How many non-conf games will be scheduled. I don't like 4 non conf games as it is now.
My guess would be if 12 teams in B10 then 10 conf games and 2 non-conf. If 16, i would hope all 12 or 10 and 2 again, to provide competition against the other super conferences.
I feel like ND, Missouri, Nebraska, and Pitt, are natural choices, and I like Kansas more than Syracuse even though they both bring about the same thing to the table
Amazing. Humans have been making shit up forever. The internet just makes it ridiculously easy to spread the poo.
I really have no idea what they would do for revenue in the long term. I would imagine that eventually ND would lose a lot of their "respect" amongst college football. Remaining one of the few independents with three super conferences.
Does anyone know what ND is planning to do if they don't join?
If they don't join I would be all for getting them the hell off the schedule for good. Let them play a round robin with Army and Navy.
The SEC and Pac-10 don't seem interested in ND. If the Big Ten goes to 16 teams and ND isn't one of them, the only 'BCS' conferences left are the Big East and ACC. If the Big Ten sets the trend to go to 16 teams, the Big East will be a 'mid-major' football wise after all the dominoes fall.
It would not surprise me at all if ND joined a ravaged Big East. It gives them what they always want...an easy path to a BCS game.
ND can stay independent as long as there's an all-Catholic non-football Big East composed of:
Notre Dame, Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette, Seton Hall, St. John's, Providence, DePaul
I still think they go to the Big Ten and join a pod of Michigan, Michigan State, Notre Dame, and Purdue.
If ND is going to join a football conference, it's going to be the B10. That's the geographical fit and that's three of its rivalry games. It's only in the Big East in basketball because the Big East was weak enough to not require it for football.
ND ADs have been there before
Please dear God let this happen.
What are BK's views on this? Is it possible that he is pushing for ND to join the Big 10?
