But Sam seemed to imply it was the coaches more than Danny that have cooled. Possibly prioritizing other positions. Did I hear that right?
Bad Vibes on Danny O
and O'Brien got his "firm" offer after summer camp. Ugh if this is true
Danny will end up at Tennessee. The numbers are just getting too tight with this class.
I am genuinely curious to know the reasoning.
I logged in just to bump you back up to zero. There has been a rash of negs lately that make no sense.
I didn't neg ya, but my guess is that it's a residual effect of an earlier thread that went WAAYYY too deep into the reasoning behind moving his visit.
He scheduled his visits to Tenn (and MSU) long before the announcement date was set, so the subsequent visit plans shouldn't really matter either way.
Normally, announcing before a visit is a good sign for the schools previously visited. I don't understand why this logic is incorrect in this case.
When recruits announce prior to completing their visits don't they generally just cancel the remaining visits?
Plus, wouldn't a recruit just wait another week to see Tenn before committing?
I'm not saying he's picking M, but I don't think his visit date to Tenn has any real significance.
The fact of the timing of the visit is insignifigant, but the fact that he has not canceled said visit is very telling.
What is so telling about the fact that he didn't (yet) cancel upcoming visits to both UT and MSU? Someone can correct my if I'm wrong, but recruits don't usually cancel visits before their announcement.
we know where he's going. Why announce if you're Not going visit Tenn or MSU, then we know he picks M.
Gotta keep the anticipation!!!
That's sort of my point: recruits don't cancel pre-planned visits - they just move their announcement date up.
I think it's pretty rare for a recruit to announce before a visit for the school he has yet to visit - doesn't mean it's not going to happen here, but it def goes against conventional wisdom.
For example: recruit X is planning to go visit schools 1-5 on the next five weekends. X set's an announcement date before visit three. It's pretty rare that X announces for school 3, 4 or 5. If so, just wait for the visit to announce.
He wanted to announce the day before his homecoming game. Its not like he moved it up to some random date.
So he is going to announce at the big event during homecoming that he is leaving the state of Michigan , Uof M and MSU, to go to Tennessee? Seems like he would want that time to make a positive splash. I think it will be Michigan or MSU.
Announcing he is getting a full ride scholarship to play football if the top football conference in the country is pretty damn positive. From your M centric viewpoint it might be a negative but to most, this is a tremendous accomplishment and opportunity for Danny O.
Not for the crowd in attendance. Look up above your post. I am saying Michigan or MSU
You are the first person whose view makes sense to me. Maybe Danny O is such a Michigan lean that he feels guilty about visiting Tennessee at this point. By announcing the week before, he might just be avoiding having to make the visit. I do think he feels some loyalty to Tennessee since they were the first top flight program to take an interest in him. Little known fact is that O'Brien called the Michigan coaching staff right after Pipkins committed. Probably to verify whether they still wanted him. If they say no, the spot is taken, why does he visit for the ND game? His chance to be a Wolverine had to still be there. The staff either told him "yes" or "maybe". "yes" and he is a Wolverine in two weeks. "maybe" and it is wait until the final recruiting numbers shake out. Both are possible. I am hoping that the answer was "yes"
All my guys from Powers, have been saying he's going to UT for about 2 weeks now. I wish we had room for Danny, but I think the Michigan coaches really think they can get Garnett&Banner, and probably Dunn as well. The final 4 of this class, are probably going to be those 3 and Payton.
I hope I'm wrong, but I'd bet both Garnett AND Banner coming to Michigan is a stretch.
it's too much to take that many ol one year. I think they should stock with what they have and take another 4-5 next year to help regain some kind of balance.
In the same vein, they should take 2 dt to make up for recruiting under rr and help stabilize dt numbers.
Personally, I am always somewhat leery of the "coaches cooled on the guy" line which often gets dragged out when a player we all want suddenly seems to no longer be interested in UM.
Note: I am not calling you out nor am I really taking issue with Sam (after all, Sam is the man!). Just expressing some general skepticism over this oft-used recruiting statement.
I agree with your statement. I really did only catch the tail end, so I was more looking for confirmation from someone that heard the whole segment. I agree its interesting that every time a recruit picks another school there is someone claiming "the coaches cooled".
"If Pipkins decommits or doesn't pan out into an instant contributor, the 2012 DL is going to be scary in not a good way"
Wormley, Strobel, Godin, and Brown might have something to say about that. This isn't a Ondre Pipkins or bust DL class we have here.
It's hard to say that those guys are being outplayed by Brink, since Brink has been playing the 5-tech and those guys are 1- or 3-tech players. And Heininger is also more of a 5- or 3-tech tweener, not to mention that he's a fifth year senior. Ash is a RS frosh and Q is still two years younger than Heininger and in his starting his second year on the DL.
Let's not worry too much about those two just yet, and I wouldn't completely discount Wilkins either.
I agree with your last paragraph, which is why I agree that Heininger is ahead of Ash and Q. I don't see why Brink is ahead of them. Plus, Brink doesn't get that much more PT than Q. Anyway, those two aren't going to play the same position. Ash is a RS frosh, cut him some slack.
That said, for the coaches to turn down a highly rated DT at a position of need, it must mean that they are feeling pretty good about our chances with Banner/Diamond, Yuri, Dunn, and Payton/Darboh to finish out this class.
It's safe to assume we'll finish strong, either way.
Of course the coaches know better, blah, blah blah, but the interior of our D Line looks horrendous after Martin and RVB graduate. I'd frankly rather have Obrien than Dunn or Wright.
Have you seen our running game this year? I think Dunn could come in and contribute right away.
I think the staff sees Pipkins at the nose, and Wormley bulking up to play the 3-tech position. I'm not sure Danny O would crack the depth chart above either of those two.
BEHIND those 2 because after next year there isn't one. Seriously, the DT depth is beyond scary and WAY WAY more concerning than our depth at RB..
BWC is here for another year with signs of possibly beginning to "get it"
In 2012, Pipkins will be a frosh and Q will be a junior. Those will be our top two NTs. BWC will be a senior, Richard Ash will be a sophomore, Chris Rock will be a freshman, Kenny Wilkins will be a sophomore and Godin and Wormley will be here. Two of those will be our 2-deep at 3-tech. At the 5-tech it's dicier with Brink, Heitzman and Strobel. However, with all of the guys at 3-tech, a guy like Rock or Wilkins or Wormley or Godin could play 5-tech instead. At WDE we have Roh (Sr), Black (Jr.), Clark (So), and true frosh Brown and Ojemudia.
That's not a 2-deep of 8 All Americans, but I don't know if Danny O'Brien makes or breaks our DL for the next couple years.
You use this word "walk-on" far too much. Just because they are walk-ons does not mean they can't also be solid players. Some guys fall short of hype, and some guys exceed it. And in the case of Heininger, he's one of two 5th year seniors on the DL, and one of a handful who has in-game experience, so it's not a surprise he's getting more reps early.
There are a lot of guys who don't see the field a lot as a RS frosh and then figure things out as an upperclassman. The first 2.5 years Demens was in the program we heard nothing about him, and now he's a solid starter as a junior. We don't need all of them to pan out, just one to start next to BWC.
I think it's safe to predict that between Q and Pipkins, there will be a decent starter and a solid back-up at NT. That spot will not be a bright spot on our D, but I don't think it will be a liability either. Assuming BWC starts at 3-tech, we have Ash/Wilkins/Rock/true frosh to back him up. Someone from that group will emerge as at least a back up. Brink/Heitzman/Wilkins/frosh will hold down the 5-tech well enough.
Let me say that I agree DL will be the weakest spot on the D next fall. I think they'll be adequate though, and I think the back 7 will be good-to-great which should make up for it.
Ohio offerred Stroebel as a 3 tech.
It is producing 226.7 yards per game and 6.7 yards per carry. Our top 4 running backs are averaging 7.0 yards per carry (same as Denard) as a group and have scored 5 TDs in three games.
The freakout people are having because Stephen Hopkins had a few unproductive carries against ND is getting ridiculous.
because Smith is starting.
O'Brien looks like a great player and seems like a nice kid and I wish him well. However, the class already includes Pipkins and Godin at DT, and a host of DEs that could move inside. Competition for playing time and 'being the man' will be tight. I like the class as it stands and if we only land one more player, such as Payton, I'd still be very-very happy.
Early evidence suggests our '13 haul will be top 5-10 again. In the very near future we'll have a squad capable of competing for BCS championships.
I unbuckled a month ago and I'm kind of over recruiting for now.
The truth is that if he wanted to be here he could have committed earlier; prior to Pipkins or when Matt Godin committed. It will be easier for him to find playing time at Tennessee and maybe, despite my maize and blue glasses, that's just the best fit for him.
Good luck to him; I'd be glad if he came but if Tenn. is the right fit then fair enough. I'm sure he won't be going to Sparty so he can get his ass handed to him for years by Kyle Kalis and his nasty streak. Better the SEC.
Why is everyone saying that Godin is going to be a DT. I thought he specifically said that Mattison recruited him to play the 5-tech spot.
First time in awhile where I did not like Sam's gut feeling. That's a bummer.
This sucks. He looked like he was having so much fun at the ND game on field when he came to the student section. I wish we could know what really was happening.
Well, if not Michigan - hopefully he is Tennessee bound.
He's looking elsewhere.
It's not crippling and opens up opportunities elsewhere.
I won't care too much unless he ends up at MSU. I'd love to have him, but at least we already have an elite DT in this class. Pipkins is one of the nation's best at any position. We are going to fill this class out with 4-stars, this will just make room for one of the others.
Having said that, who knows, maybe Danny still wants to come here at which point I'll be happy. Just don't go to a school where the coaches name is used as a synonym for douchebag.
Dantonio is a Dantonio.
Could this just be a front,so that his actual announcement on 10/6 is still a surprise or relief? Lets hope so.
I don't think Sam Webb has ever aided a recruit in "throwing people of the scent" by declaring a gut feeling about a player heading elsewhere. Unfortunately, this seems pretty conclusive that Danny O will not be sporting the winged helmet.
Almost all the signs have been pointing to us not getting him. DT's have been saying all summer that we'd only take one DT. Then after Pipkins committed there was some confusion on his part on whether or not we still wanted him. Had we really been going after him hard and told him that we would hold a spot for him no matter what there never would have been any confusion.
When O'brien said that Hoke was cool and told him to take his time his time most people read that as a good thing but I thought we were slow playing him. Just seemed we would take him if a scholarship opened up or something. With 6 players already committed to the D-line and 3 of them potentially being able to grow into the 3-tech position I can see how the coaches maybe weren't going that hard after him.
And with a visit right after a commitment date it just seems like the final nail in the coffin.
Aziz Shittu, come on down!
Its between Cal & TAMU. Doesnt look like we're taking another DT in this class...
After watching the middle of our DL struggle and knowing that Martin, RVB, and Heininger are graduating why wouldn't you load up on elite DT prospects? Other than WR there is no other position that needs attention this badly. Unless they think they can move some of the recruits from DE to DT I don't see why you wouldn't put the full court press on an in-state DT who has played well. This sounds like Hankins all over again!!!
If you want to try and find a positive in it, if they (the staff) think spots are too tight for O'Brien then we're looking pretty good for a bunch of the other big names on the list.
Let's not forget that Wormley, Godin and Strobel could all rotate between 5- and 3-tech.
Im not hugely athrilled with anyone except Godin switching to the 3tech..
Wormley is athletic and fast not a squat huge immovable object (think we would waste his far superior talents putting him inside)
And Strolbel is a SDE if ever I saw one. The point in the 4-3 over of the SDE is to be able to take on a TE and T combo stand up and prevent them from chipping off to the SAM. On passing plays, its chuck the TE and beat a T 1 on1 .. that is Strobel all day.
Im not high on anyone of these guys mostly becasued they are all 6'5.. which tends to make it more difficult to get under the pad level and keep leverage on the inside (see BWC)
The 3 tech is a penetrating defensive tackle and therefore doesnt need to be an immovable object. I actually think if Wormley comes in and plays his Freshman year at about 280-290 he will be at a great weight. Also, while being tall definatley makes it harder to play with great leverage there are many players in college and the NFL who do so at 6-5 and even taller. I think Campbell's issues stem from a lack of coaching during his youth football days through high school.
I don't like throwing that out, but if you can't trust this staff to evaluate their needs on the DL what can you trust them to do?
Going into next season we will most likely have no proven players at DT except for arguably Campbell, who will be a senior. When you have so many question marks, you have to have numbers. I was as pleased as anyone to see Pipkins commit, but (as with any recruit at any position except maybe punter) he is a prospect and there is no guarantee that he will be effective at the college level. The position would look a lot better with O'Brien, a high school DT with a DT build, than with "maybe we can move one of these tall, lean DEs to tackle".
If there's one position group that people should stop questioning about recruiting, it's D-line. Hoke is a D-line coach. Mattison looks like he knows what he's doing. We also have our uber recruiting Beyonce coach there.
If they are in agreement that they probably don't need another DT, it means they have some sort of plan about that spot, or are worried more about other spots (OL and WR come to mind). I'd trust their skills over all of the people FREAKING OUT MAN on the internet on the hypothetical commitment of a highly rated high schooler.
Sam was really talking up all of the other defensive linemen already in the class (Strobel, Godin, Wormley as possible DT's) but I would still like to get O'Brien because he already plays DT in HS. I don't think any of our other guys currently play DT besides Pipkins and we are sooooo thin at DT after this season.
I also noticed Sam mention that we are not really the leader for any of the O-linemen we are still pursuing. He feels we have the best shot at Diamond and Banner, but that we are merely in "good shape" not the outright leader for either.
I'm too lazy to Google for it, but this would be the perfect place for one of those "I HAZ A SAD." cat pictures.
Based on both of those bits of information, I can't help but wonder if the Final Four might look like: 2 WR (Darboh and Payton), 1 DB (Wright) and 1 RB (Dunn or "other").
Come on down, Yuri Wright.
O'Brien's recruitment has been one of the most difficult ones to understand. At various times, Michigan has been out of it, at others we've been the favorite. At times, he's supposedly cooled on us, at others the coaches supposedly had cooled on him. Who knows how it will end? I hope that he goes Blue, but if he doesn't I hope that he goes to Tennessee as I would hate to face him for the next four years.
We tend to forget sometimes that these are kids. It's especially easy to forget with linemen because they are physically huge. Kids are prone to changing their minds, and you never know what "hot button" is going to work and what one isn't. No recruit is going to ruin a great class with his absence. There are plenty to go around. Also, as one poster mentioned, Mattison and Hoke should be trusted, and they will find a way to put a decent defense out on the field.
I definitely agree that I don't want to see him end up in EL, though. I hope a little bit of "southern hospitality" goes a long way in this case.
Please be wrong Sam. I've had visions of Pipkins and Obrien caving in the middle of opposing O lines for months. Please don't crush my dreams
Mine were already crushed when Sheldon Day committed to the Domers. Man, I wanted to see Pipkins (NT) and Day (DT) crushing fools for 3-4 years. Then, I finally got over losing Day to ND when it seemed like we had overtaken UT for O'Brien and now....crushing despair...again.
(Hyperbole used for dramatic effect)
as much as I would like to get the top talent in the state, we are by no means short on talent in this class at DL, I would almost prefer getting Dunn, 2 WRs and Banner
Yeah Sam made it sound like it was less about Danny O cooling on Michigan and more about Michigan cooling on him. I think the staff decided if they are only going to take one more defensive recruit they might rather have a DB like Yuri Wright. 3 of the final 4 spots will go to an offensive player (Diamond/Banner, Dunn - fingers crossed, and Darboh/Payton) and only one will go to a defensive player so I have no problem with it.
With Godin, Wormley, Pipkins, Strobel, Ojemudia, and Pharaoh I think there are plenty of guys who are on the DL (with Godin and Wormley as possibilities to play on the inside). I think CB may be a bigger priority because Standifer may move to safety and therefore Terry Richardson would be the only CB in this class. And as talented as Terry is, it is not a sure thing that a 5'8-9 170 lb. CB will ever see the field. Yuri Wright is a stud and given the choice of him or Danny O I'd take Yuri.
I think Danny will be a stud but I think with scholarships low, we need to address our needs more.
If I had to choose between Yuri Wright and O'Brien, I'd also take Yuri. Being greedy, I'd still like both.
It makes me feel better when I remind myself that this is just one recruiting class. Each year this staff is going to bring in more quality defensive lineman, so in a few years our depth will be outstanding and the players will know the system and be all coached up. There...I feel better now.
yes, given the limited schollies and the # of top recruits on the board, i still question the FB scholarship. i would think we could get an adequate preferred walk on at FB.
I also thought I heard Sam say that either Banner or Garnett as being a Washington lean at this time. I can't imagine that we pull both of them, and I am really starting to think the Diamond ship has sailed as well. Webb also touched on him and said he was up in the air and looking hard at Wisky and Illinois.
The DT position is the only one I'm surprised about with this coaching staff. If they want to be able to rotate the DL, they don't seem to be recruiting enough for rotating the interior. Maybe they are just really high on some 2013 guys, and feel fine with Godin and Pipkins for the interior in this class.
Godin and Wormley both project to the 3-tech or 5-tech, and the staff knows the current players more than anyone else. I guess they're satisfied with BWC/Pipkins/Godin/Wormley at DT, and while thats very young and thin, I dont think O'brien adds as much to that as, say, Darboh would add to our WR situation.
"I dont think O'brien adds as much to that as, say, Darboh would add to our WR situation. "
I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head here. The complete lack of an emergence of a go to WR and RB has played a big role in this, in my opinion.
It's difficult for a "go to wide receiver" to emerge when the quarterback is spraying the ball all over the place. He's completed only about 43% of his passes over the past couple games, and not many of those incompletions have been drops.
but the pre-season practice reports were not glowing of the wr corps either. The point is I think the staff has weighed the relative need of taking a second DT versus getting skill positions on offense and determined that those skill positions are a more pressing need given the play to date and the current makeup of the recruiting class.
I'm not sure I disagree with them, if that is indeed the case. Or perhaps this is all spin out of Webb and O'Brien simply was never going to go to Michigan, which is certainly possible.
I'm not saying you're entirely wrong. All I'm saying is that quarterbacks and receivers are reliant upon each other, and with Denard throwing the ball the way he has, it's not difficult to understand why a "go to" receiver hasn't appeared. And if Denard was throwing the ball inaccurately during practice as well, then I don't know why practice reports would have been glowing for the receivers then, either.
and that Denard's struggles are affecting the WR.
But wouldn't it make more sense for a 2012 recruit to look a Gardner or Morris as the QB that will be throwing to them? Denard will be a senior when they are freshman
The things 17-year-olds do rarely make sense.
I'm in total agreement here. It also might say something about our future formations. We've been bringing in a lot of linebacker types lately as well as DE/DT tweeners like Godin and Wormley. It could be a sign that Michigan is transitioning to the 3-4. In two or three years maybe we'll see a line of Godin/Pipkins/Wormley up front and then guys like Beyer as OLBs. To me, this seems like the best explanation unless some of the guys who are listed as DEs are going to fill out and move inside. I just question whether we have the depth to give guys like Wormley that kind of time to develop.
If that's the case, bringing in Payton and some of the other WRs we've been targeting would be good. Our depth at the WR position isn't overwhelming.
BWC is a senior next year. After what does our 2 deep look like at NT.
As it stands we'd be starting BWC and Pipkins next year (unless another DT on our depth chart blows up). We'd then have a year to grow one of the current DEs into a 3 Tech. Keep in mind in the 4-3 under, you have a DE playing like a DT. So clearly some of the DEs being recruited as a DT like substance.
I think the imperative thing is to get a nose tackle a year to keep depth there. Also anyone who can't develop as 1-Tech can compete for the 3-Tech spot (as BWC seems to kind of be doing). I really don't need to heavily recruit 3-Tech when you can fill it by growing your large DEs to fill it or moving a failed 1-Tech into it. It's a "tweener" posistion for lack of a better word.
The thought of that makes me whince. I realize that it might happen. I don't mean to knock the kid, but how many true freshman DTs are ever very good?
I cringe as well. Hopefully BWC is fully online as a 1 Tech next year and Pipkins can rotate the 3 Tech with a few others. Then Pipkins shifts to 1 Tech after BWC graduates.
This reminds me why I think that Michigan won't be a real Big Ten title contender until 2013 or even 2014. They seemingly just won't have the D-line to do it until then. There's too big a gap between Martin & RVB and the 2012 class.
Probably 2014 because even if we take an insane DL class in 2012, they would still be true freshmen for that season. ND has shown some promise from their insane DL class for 2011, but their line clearly isn't elite yet.
Aaron Lynch looks like he's going to be a top ten draft pick. That kid is unreal for a true freshman...Kelly is going to turn them into a national title contender, I tells ya.
Let's not completely forget Q and Ash. They aren't getting rave reviews right now, but they're not going to be true frosh either. I think a rotation of Q and Pipkins at nose and BWC and Ash at 3 tech is very likely.
Brady Hoke is a D Line coach. I wouldn't worry.
Something has changed. O'Brien was our lean, and now is leaning elsewhere. Sounds like one side or another cooled on him.
Kind of sucks, because we could probably have had Schutt instead of O'Brien.
But that is in the past. This class will still be solid. Wormley, Pipkins, Godin, and maybe some others are headed for the DL. This is a very solid class defensively, though O'Brien would have made it stronger.
Finishing out with 2 WR, Yuri Wright and/or (God please) Shaq Thompson, and a RB (again, God, Brionte please?) would be awesome. Banner at OL would be great, and I think he is leaning our way.
So yeah, sucks, but won't hurt us too bad long run. All's well that end's well.
Yeah, the Schutt thing makes zero sense to me now. I'm very confused as to what the staff is thinking regarding the future of our DL.
Between Pipkins and O'Brien I'm not sure which one of them would be idealy suited for doing that.
I don't think we can get too worked up over losing any one player. If I were building Michigan like the team was a video game (that's how it works, right?), I would want O'Brien. Otherwise I'm inclined to give Hoke, Mattison, etc. the benefit of the doubt (assuming they've really cooled on him). If O'Brien wants to go to Tenn, well then hey, the Smoky Mountains are a great place to go hiking.
Cue the banjo music.
"hiking"...no thanks. Deliverance?
Very weird recruiting strategy on the D-line here by this staff. The only guy in the class who's a lock at DT is Pipkins. With our depth chart, we need at least two. Even three would have been nice. Maybe Godin can overacheive as a 3-tech or maybe Strobel or Wormley can grow into the 3-tech spot, but why would you lock yourself into that strategy? Especially when you need guys who are ready to contribute as true freshmen. And for all we know, Pipkins could be a bust. We've got lots of eggs in a few unproven baskets right now.
the millions of dollars we are shelling out to pay the coaches come in... and why you do not get paid millions of dollars to assess what we need.
Have some faith that our coaching staff knows what they are doing.
I have heard this rationale a lot in my posting days. "Trust the coaches". It's not irrational. But I'll be damned if some decision makers don't do some things that are obviously dumb when they do them. Carr keeping around Hermann for about five years too long and then bringing Debord back to Michigan. Dave Brandon letting the Michigan football program decay in limbo for a month in a half, essentially without a coach. Kirk Frerentz stupidly kicking the ball on every single fourth down regardless of distance and situation. UCLA hiring Rick Neuheisel as their coach. Rich Rodriguez loading up the roster with questionable 3* slot receivers on offense while his defense was in shambles. Les Miles's brain melting down whenever the clock goes under two minutes. Luke Fickell saving his timeouts for offense. All stuff that looks dumb before we know the results, and then is proven to that way when we get the results. Sometimes as a fan I feel like a backseat driver and I'm watching the car head towards a brick wall at 50 miles per hour. I'm told that the driver is an expert and that I should trust him, but that car is still headed at the wall at 50 miles per hour.
So here we are, with only one DT on our entire roster right now that we trust enough to consistently play in place of a walk-on. We only have one blue chip DT in our 2012 class, and we are not aggressively trying to shore up that position by pursuing prospects that top programs around the country want. I"m scratching my head trying to figure out what the thought process is, and why we would want to bank the future of the defensive line on such thin ground.
Ash could be a beast. After a year and a half of very strong D-line coaching anything is possible.
I'd settle for solid back-up right now.
We have NO depth at DT!
Right now we're playing SDE's at DT, BOTH are RS seniors, and we're getting pushed around everywhere.
If Q or Ash was good enough, they'd be in the rotation now. Why turn away O'Brien? It just doesn't make sense.
Martin, Heininger and RVB are going to be gone. Campbell is coming on, but he hasn't even been in the starting lineup. We need depth in the middle to free up Black and Roh on the outside.
FWIW, a couple of fellow referees have worked a couple Powers games. They have been unanimous in saying he wasn't very impressive. I was hoping otherwise. Maybe he camps real well? Just thought I'd pass that along.
Yeah, I've read the excuse that he's playing some defensive end and that it's somehow taking away from his strengths...but if you're an elite 290-300 lb. athlete, then playing DE instead of NT shouldn't suddenly make you look average. My opinion is that if he were truly awesome, he would dominate from anywhere on the defensive line.
This would be unfortunate, but I think some of you are overreacting. For one, Godin seems to be impressing everyone these days. Also, remember that these kids will be true freshmen next year, so the "depth" point is important but more relevant in 2013 and beyond than for next year.
I thought the OP was a high 4 star, possibly a candidate for a 5th star. I've been impressed by his in-season posting, he finishes posts and enjoys a good glass of chocolate milk after a workout.
But how is his (mouse) pad level?
Not sure but I heard he has loose hips that he keeps on a swivel (chair).
Wright is a better player overall. I think Wright has NFL potential, whereas O'Brien might be just a guy. I understand we need depth on the defensive line, and I would be all about grabbing another DT if he's good enough...but I'm not sure that O'Brien is worth turning down someone like Wright.
Care to give us a (speculative) TTB recruit score for Wright and O'Brien?
I only talk about players who play for Michigan.
then would you care to explain....THIS!!!
Damn. That was supposed to be a secret!
Well played, sir, well played.
Do you think O'Brien would still be "just a guy" playing next to Pipkins? I think the two would be an absolute interior line-destroying combination together.
If Pipkins is going to be super awesome, then does it really matter who you put next to him? We could put any other "just a guy" type there and he should be just fine.
Mike Martin is a very good, and it's not like our 3-techs are lighting the world on fire.
6 DL recruits break down. I know Pipkins is a NT and Mario and Brown are WDE. I'd assume Strobel is a SDE. Can he 3-tech it too? Do Godin and Wormley fall in as 3-tech/5-tech types like RVB?
Some people think Strobel is a WDE, but I don't see it. Godin is a 5-tech or a 3-tech. Wormley is a 5-tech or maybe even an offensive lineman; I think he would get destroyed as a defensive tackle.
Are you not high on him?
Yeah, I'm not a big fan of his abilities. Well...I think he has a lot of ability, but perhaps not the will to maximize it. He looks kind of soft.
It's hard to tell, but okay.
if he isn't coming here, I think the coaches will be happy with moving a couple of the DE's into the middle like Wormley. With Pipkins we'll be fine. But, this will make signing a couple stud DT's next year a pretty high priority I'd imagine. Besides, getting Dunn and a Banner/Garnett pair would more than make up for losing out on O'Brien.
Stan Edwards speaking about the status of Richardson and O'Brien on Sam's Sunday morning show, the day after the ND game said, and I'm paraphrasing here, " Sam, I sat next to and talked to Richardson and O'Brien at the game last night, I have a good feeling about one of these young men coming to M but not the other, and if you want me to, I will tell you my opinion off air." Sam just kinda gave that Sam laugh and no more was mentioned of it. Right after this, Richardson firmed up his committment.
Say what you want about Stan Edwards, but very few are tuned into the M football program as well as Stan.
I wonder how highly ranked Berkley Edwards is going to be in 2013
IDK but if he is anything like his brother and dad, he would be a welcome addition at M. I found a nice article about Braylon giving his little bro a surprise by showing up at his first game of the season Monroe vs Chelsea
would be nice to get DOB - I'm not a coach or anything or claim to know what the hell I am talking about - I have heard grumblings that he isn't gameplay impressive. Hes a good player but nothing to "omgwtf" freak out if he doesnt commit. Im pretty sure he goes to Tennessee. But what do I know...
Given that our staff (wisely or not) has been stating for many weeks that they were only going to take a couple of DTs, O'Brien would have committed already if he truly had strong desires to attend school at UM and play football. I agree I'd rather have him in Knoxville than EL, just in case he turns into a dominant player.
But if he goes to Knoxville instead of EL, Dantonio will only sign someone else and he might become better then Pipkins or Danny O, then where will we be. Future problems to worry about: they never cease
Anyone knows if Ash has fallen from the edge of earth?, he's a *allegedly warm body that should help us next year
I THOUGHT ACE WILLIAMS SAID O'BRIEN AND BANNER WERE COMING HERE?!!!!! HE LIED TO ME! THAT BASTARD!!!!!!!!!!
Sam has vaguely implied that the staff has chosen to use that scholarship elsewhere and back off on Danny. Now, I am not sure if the staff uses Sam to push a certain agenda or not on who's fault is a prospect that is a local fan favorit does not end up coming to Michigan. However, I do know Sam a little bit, and he wouldn't imply that if he didn't hear it from someone inside the fort.
As for a possible reason that the staff may have decided to look in another direction on O'brien is he is not nearly as dominant in an actual game as he is in a camp setting. I live in the area, and have seen Danny play on more than a few occasions over the past couple years, and have been pretty underwhelmed each time. I doubt the staff has actually made the trip to see him play this year. I believe they usually do that stuff on bye weeks, but it is possible that it has trickled down to them. They were slow to warm up to him. They had to wait to see him at camp just to confirm his offer that Rich gave him. So what Sam has tried to imply isn't out of the realm of possibility.
NOOOOO!!! We must stop top level recruits from leaving Michigan..... or from going to MSU!!!!
Tennesses/USC/Penn State/Oregon/Alabama all must not be allowed to poach the best players from Michigan .... think about the talent that could have been on this team that has now been divided up across the country....
don't leave Danny O'Brien....[[sniffle]] please [[sniffle]]
The "we ought to trust the coach" meme is especially valid here because Hoke is a D-line coach, for crissake. If he's got a grasp of anything, it's the D-line roster. I've got to believe he has a good sense of where things stand and what needs to be done re the roster.
Also: it's only September. We've got more than 4 months left to go before signing-day. If we are indeed short one DL, Hoke has plenty of time to find one. There are many unsigned recruits out there; there are signed ones who can be flipped. M is in a great position right now. It's not O'Brien or bust.
I wouldn't worry too much yet, simply because kids change their minds and trying to read the tea leaves sometimes leaves the reader with massive contradictions. My guess is that O'Brien will go UT because seemingly everyone who visits stays (must be that Kiffin magic), but if not he definitely would be a stronger UM lean than MSU, IME. Either way, this class looks solid and should add a couple more pieces. I'm not worried yet.
how many defensive players do we have and how many positions of need do we have? now how many scholarships do we have? math. it makes the mind calmer.
tl;dr? he's making his decision a bit... late.
but I just have no idea what this means