well that's just, like, your opinion, man
Austin Grandstaff verbally committed to OSU
When Grandsaff decommitted, he specifically requested UF and UM. UF responded and we slow played him. Thad saw an opportunity.
I'm a broken record but I don't see UM getting 2 top 100 2015 guards and the Ukrainian kid needs to be a priority. I can't fathom why we banked that scholarship.
The truth hurts *shrugs*
How did Michigan slow-play him? My impression was that they were working to get him to campus ASAP.
He decommitted in Feb, asked UF and UM to recruit him, UF had him on campus in March.
It seems like his OSU visit switched from unofficial to official pretty quickly. And they ultimately can't make the kid come to AA. But maybe there are details I'm missing.
I think we are slow playing other targets until Brunson and Coleman decide, which is fine, but very risky.
People won't like this comparison, but Coach Beilein's recruiting style is somewhat similar to what Jim Tressel's was: focus on a relative handful of guys and stick with just them until they make their choices.
And then when Allen just committed to UF, I assume they were off the table and OSU has him on campus at the perfect time.
Grandstaff was my D&D Mage's name. Funny coincidence.
Looks like a nice fit, but I trust this staff has a plan.
I trust Beilein. He may not have been getting enough love from Michigan which would be because Michigan thinks there are better targets.
There are probably some people who think we won't get two top 100 players. I wonder if we should have gone after Huff or Sviat harder. /s
I don't think Beilein will bad 1.000, and this may be a miss he'll regret. But people around here act like like the past couple of years were all a mirage because somebody UM was kinda, sorta interested in went to a rival. It's just silly.
I still don't get how Matta does it. Ohio continues to crush it in recruiting. Grand staff was a perfect fit for our offense.
And I was just thinking that I hadn't visited the site all weekend and I was frankly expecting bad news more than I was any good news.
Oh man, you're right. UM is screwed. There's no way UM could ever compete with OSU and their basketball team.
/ Looks at 2013-2014 championship banner
// Next to Final 4 banner
/// Next to Elite 8 banner
//// Looks at NBA draft boards
The 2012 class was very good to UM.
As was the 2009, 2010, and 2011 classes, which produced 2 first round picks, a second round pick, the 5th consensus all-american in Michigan basketball history and the NCAA national player of the year. But you're right, that 2012 class was the only good one Beilein has had.
Can't count on recruiting anomallies and luck to continue.
You know, UM does have a couple of highly-regarded recruits coming in. But whatever, definitely stick to the narrative you have in your head.
And yet, every accomplishment he listed occurred with 1 group.
You didn't have to make a double post sound more dumb by making two different dumb points. We won a B10 title with what you call "luck" in Burke and Hardaway and we won one with great recruiting in Nik and GRIII and Walton. Actually, we won one with great recruting AND "luck," unless you want to call Levert a highly ranked prospect. We wouldn't have been close in the championship game unless one of our "luck" recruits hits 6 threes in the first half while our other "luck" recruit that turned into the NCAA player of the year was in foul trouble. I'm not sure what your point is as we have 2 top 100 guys in the next class and even though you like to think you know recruting better than Beilein, you don't. So you don't know who we are getting in 2015, but you are already saying that we will have to rely on luck. We had plenty of success before that one class (unless you think winning the B10, setting an NCAA record for largest margin of victory by an 8 seed, upsetting a top 5 team for the first time in 11 years and then doing it again a couple weeks later, pretty much resurrecting a program with the likes of Novak and Douglass and making the dance with two walk-ons at PG unsuccessful), so please just shut the fuck up. You say you are confident in your opinions, but I am confident that your opinions mean jack shit. You being arrogant doesn't mean you are right, it just means you are prick. If you would like to think that recruiting is doomed and banking scholarships is a bad idea and blah blah blah, please, by all means, go for it. But if you could come up with some new material, I would appreciate it.
not going to read that nor do I care
I think he got under your skin a little
I've been listening to him babble on about how questionable Beilein's decisions have been since he accepted both Dawkins and MAAB's commitment. I would like to come into a basketball thread and not have to listen to him be an arrogant prick. I get it, he doesn't like when guys on our radar pick other schools. What I can do without is him thinking he is smarter than Beilein and stating things as fact when he has zero idea how the roster will look in two years.
My predictions have come true. Next up, Brunson.
I'm not sure you can say "next up Brunson" when Brunson seems to be a higher priority then Grandstaff. I mean, I'm just assuming since Brunson has an offer and Grandstaff never received one.
Next up as in "my next prediction to be true or false"
Thank you for the clarification.
Weren't you going apeshit after we picked up MAAR and Dawkins because you said we were going to also get Huff? So when you say your predictions have come true, you mean other than the ones you conveniently forgot you made and were wrong?
What ? We didn't get Huff because of wing depth just like I said.
I didn't know Hardaway and Morgan were in 2012. Man, Morgan must have a different eligibility clock running for him to have been a senior this year.
Just stop it. You're wrong. It's okay; I am all the time. But making even dumber and dumber posts to prove your faulty logic won't help.
I said the 2012 is the foundation for
/ Looks at 2013-2014 championship banner
// Next to Final 4 banner
/// Next to Elite 8 banner
what is wrong with that statement?
Well, Hardaway had quite a bit to do with that Final 4 banner.
And Morgan certainly played a big role as well.
No one said they didn't but there was only one constant.
There was the head coach, Morgan, and Hardaway who obviously played major roles.
Yes, 2012 was a great recruiting class, but with Burke and Hardaway gone UM arguably had a better overall season, winning the conference title and doing so with a couple of freshmen playing big minutes. I'm not one to argue that this class hasn't been great, but I take issue with the idea that this is some aberration or all of the past success is attributable to a single class.
Hardaway played last year? Surprising because I didn't see him a minute in 2013-2014. Keep denying the talent in 2012 class didn't catapult UM, if it makes you feel better.
Actually, he is sort of right. The way you write it makes it sound impressive, but most elite programs have more than one NBA draft pick per class. Both the 2009 and 2010 classes were mediocre, and while Burke was obviously huge, he was still the only player from his class to do anything.
Most of the "success" you reference before the 2012 class are things nobody really cares about with the exception of the shared conference title. NCAA largest margin of victory for an 8 seed? Really? Beating a top five team? Making the dance? That's not really how most basketball fans define success.
Most successfull basketball programs also don't go on probation for one of the largest pay-for-play scandals in NCAA history and they also don't miss the dance for 12 straight years. I didn't say we were elite, but thank you for saying I did. My point wasn't that we are the best team in the country nor was it that we are elite by any means. My point was that Beilein has always exceeded expectations, so unless he just forgets how to coach, we will be just fine with our two top 100 recruits this year combined with our 3 top 100 recruits from last years class...considering his recruits get better every year and we as a team get better year after year. I didn't think I really needed to explain why winning the B10 and making the dance before 2012 and then continuing to get better as we get more than 1 good recurit per class was a big deal but apparently I do.
Just to let you know, your whole "angry 13-year-old starting puberty" writing style makes it a lot harder to take you seriously.
Looking at your posting history, no one takes your "witty" responses seriously either, so you'll have to forgive me if I don't hold your style-critiquing in very high regards.
I don't really care. If you want to act like a child, you're free to do that.
Nothing moves a discourse along like making fun of a person on the internet. Why didn't you also add that he should get out of his mom's basement while you're at it.
If you look at historical, year-to-year success in college basketball you could make a serious argument that MSU has been the most consistent national power since Izzo arrived. Them and Duke, I guess. Duke has a decent number of NBA selections (though the ones you remember aren't always the "best"), but MSU has been a consistent power for going on 2 decades with relatively few high-profile draft picks.
Yes, UM benefitted from a great run by the 2012 class, but this team has been on an upward trajectory for 4-5 years. And yes, in hindsight beating a couple of teams and making the tournament aren't huge, but all teams have to start from somewhere, and before Coach K showed up at Duke they were a good NCAA team but nothing close to the dominant run they've had. Kentucky has been fantastic at times and a trainwreck/on probation other times. Same for teams like UNC and UCLA, who can alternate from national contender to meh year-to-year.
This run probably isn't sustainable because few teams will have back-to-back great seasons out of young kids who aren't "guru-approved", but the idea that UM is somehow going to fall behind teams like OSU because "look at all the starz" ignores the fact that he's had great players before and sometimes they haven't worked out nearly as well as people expect. And given how the college game is going, I trust a coach who can make good players work in his system than one that relies on getting studs and hoping they stick around long enough to be great.
Of course we can compete with Ohio. I've just never understood how Matta became such a recruiting monster.
Oh and Ohio has all of those accomplishments and more under Matta so I'm not sure you should be shrugging.
Funny, there are OSU fans who think Thad's recruiting took a two year break before the 2014 class.
Urban must be letting Thad use some of his Kool-aid
Jalen Brunson named his final eight yesterday:
2015 5-star G Jalen Brunson cut his list to UConn, Villanova, Mich St, Kansas, Purdue, Illinois, Michigan, Temple. https://t.co/lv1GrxRvdt
— Jeff Rabjohns (@JeffRabjohns) May 3, 2014
And Seth Towns is visiting Michigan soon:
2016 Columbus, OH Northland SF Seth Towns among the Michigan targets standing out at Spiece tourney in Ft. Wayne. Will visit U-M next Friday
— Sam Webb (@SamWebb77) May 3, 2014
I hope Ollie goes to the NBA. A nuance for Brunson and Battle.
Dammit. OSU is absolutely raking in talent these days. On 247's composite ranking, they got the #16, #30, #58, and #182 prospects in the 2014 class, already have the #36, #38, and #89 prospects in the 2015 class, and hit big with this year's transfers. Hopefully Matta screws it all up.
How did this board get so damn pessimistic???
It's a very vocal minority.
Okay, guy, I'm one of the most optimistic people here, but the fact that basketball has been awesome lately doesn't mean that the only reasonable response to bad news is, "Who cares? We're awesome."
I think Grandstaff would have been great here and it sucks that he's going to OSU. I don't remember saying that we're doomed. We'll be fine.
OSU has always been able to recruit; they've struggled at time turning that talent into performance on the court. But again, there seems to be a subset of this fanbase that just wants bad stuff to happen to UM, or at least want to look for the dark lining to everything.
Yes, OSU has been doing well recently in recruiting. But let's see how those kids play this year before we annoint OSU a juggernaut.
Same response to you as to the guy above. And piss off with the "just wants bad stuff to happen to UM" thing.
Plus, the "Matta sucks" talk is way overblown. He doesn't. The guy's first season at OSU was 2004-05. If I counted right, he's won five Big Ten regular season titles (outright or shared) and three conference tournament titles. He's also been to the Final Four twice.
There's no way that I'd trade Beilein for Matta, but Matta's not nearly the dope that people around here claim sometimes.
But the big knock on Matta, is his track record of producing quality NBA players.
The big knock on Matta is his inability to produce a successful/creative offense.
I certainly didn't say Matta sucks; I totally recognize how great he's been as a coach for OSU. But I'm also not going to get too bent out of shape because he's recruiting well; the guy has always done so and yet UM has found a way to compete. It should be noted that until this year, his recruiting classes were lagging a bit, and I've read enough on 11W and other places to get a sense that some fans were/are concerned if the team is regressing with his defense-heavy, deadball style at pops up when he doesn't have top-flight NBA talent.
And I'm not saying all fans want bad things to happen to UM, but you'd be purposefully myopic if you didn't see a strain of the fandom that likes to bitch and moan about UM and the perceived "failings" of the athletic programs. Hell, Drew Sharp is a national-ish writer whose career is based on that.
Listen, I think we're on the same team here when it comes to being realistic about UM sports; I do think this will hurt UM if they don't find a suitable replacement, and I don't buy for a second the theory that Beilein can turn 2* kids into superstars a la Dantonio at MSU. UM needs to keep bringing in high-quality kids who work for their system and have NBA potential. But I'm not going to get bent out of shape every time a kid who would be a good fit doesn't sign with UM because, hell, most schools miss on lots of kids.
Of Reanimator. Just tolling from the other side of the argument
yeah he's pulling in quite a bit of talent.
I'm not sure how they do it...Ohio State basketball takes a clear backseat to football, yet Matta gets blue chippers to commit
Why does he remind you of Nik? Because he is white?
Because he's a 3pt shooter, but yeah I guess just pretend it's what you said.
Your avatar helped in delivering this message well.
Is this kid "more than a shooter" like Nik? Hahaha.
6'5'' shooter with a good feel, limited foot speed and lateral quickness, and excels in ball screens, hand offs and stagger screens but can put it on the floor.
anddddddddddddddddddddd hes white.
and he is white. It's fine though. It is what most people do anyway. White players are always compared to other white players. You know it is true.
While it's never good news to hear a Michigan target has chosen the dark side, Grandstaff wasn't at the top of our list. Brunson and Coleman are. And I don't think Grandstaff is another Stauskas.
As for recruits being moved by Michigan's recent success, I think they are just not as dramatically as one might expect. Chatman, our top 2014 recruit, is a stud and a 5 star according to one recruiting site. And our other 2014 recruits are nothing to sneeze at. Wilson has moved up to #65 or so on one service.
If Michigan doesn't land either Brunson or Coleman, you would have to start wondering about the judgement of these high school kids. Michigan has been a top 5 program in the past couple years, has arguably the top coach in he country, runs a clean program and is turning 3 stars and 4 stars into top NBA Picks. Go figure.
Jesus, how are these kids not clawing at each other to get an offer from UofM? Grandstaff (nice wizard name) is a perfect fit for Beilein. Well, hopefully Beilein snags Jalen Brunson, Coleman, or McQuaid. Brunson is a star in the making but there's just something about Coleman that intrigues me. Maybe it's his size (6'4) and court vision....Either way, one of these three would be great.
Young and dumb. They go for the fancy recruiting pitches and buy into all the BS some coaches lay out. Beilein won't win those types of battles. Like MAAR's dad said, JB was very direct and honest. If a kid can't see how his staff develops players, then too bad for them.
The bag man visits them and they go somewhere else.
Ohio State has been very good over the past decade, reguarly appearing in the sweet 16. Florida just went to the final four and their coach won it all twice.
There are other good schools out there.
Beilein proves recruiting ranking dweebs wrong yearly.
Not one shit is given.
I have never heard of this guy before
6'5" sharp-shooter out of Texas. #36 overall (#5 SG) in the 247 composite rankings. Decommitted from Oklahoma State in February, and the smart money seemed to be on Michigan, OSU, or Florida. Visited OSU this weekend.
Osu in softball so this doesn't affect anything.
Expected to see the usual disparaging and questioning of these kids' judgement / intelligence, shady recruiting tactics, and other general sour grapes in this thread; got it in spades.
Beilein's recruiting is a bit less "blow smoke up your ass" and more "work hard and prosper, kid". Some buy into it, some don't.
Keep in mind we've already seen quite a jump in recruiting results. Zak and Stu were MAC prospects.
Michigan is targeting Kyle Ahrens and Matthew McQuaid. Both are shooters so as long as they get one of the two, losing Grandstaff isn't a big deal though it hurts that he committed to OSU.
Beilein is doing a fine job recruiting, don't get your panties in a bunch.
Stars or wins. Incoming Chatman is a 5 star. I'll take the wins.
Yes, Beilein is recruiting so poorly that Michigan has been unable to succeed in either the Big Ten or in the NCAA tournament.
This will fall on deaf ears, but fans who get this enamored of particular prospects really shouldn't follow recruiting.
Are you kidding me?
This program was in absolute shambles, Beilein came in and has made us very competitive. Two Big Ten titles, two deep tournament runs, and he is developing first round nba talent. I'm going to enjoy these good days, because I suffered through the Ellerbe and Amaker days just like many of you, when I often wondered if this program would ever be competitive at a high level once again. Not to mention, how sweet it is to give our in-state rivals competitive competition. I don't think this program will ever reach the ability to recruit year in and year out like Kentucky, Kansas, Duke, but I do have the confidence in Beilein to build teams who can compete with those programs year to year.
So I guess it's just an illusion that Manny Harris, Darius Morris, Tim Hardaway Jr., Trey Burke, Nik Stauskas, Glenn Robinson III and Mitch McGary were good enough to go the the NBA. And that Caris Levert is virtually a lock to go early after next year. And that 4-stars Walton, Irvin, Donnal, and Wilson, and 5-star Chatman are all going to be playing in the upcoming season.
You deserve a kick in both balls. That is if you have two.
Beilein has typically NOT gotten elite recruits, but we do not worry because he and his staff are some of the best talent developers in NCAA basketball. Trey Burke is the perfect example. The oh so great
if you ignore the talent in last 3 classes.
At first read, I thought his name was Alex Gandalf. Needless to say, I am disappointed too.
JB can't land the big fish.
Those worried about Cole Huff picking Iowa can find something else to worry about:
BREAKING --- Nevada transfer Cole Huff has committed to Creighton, source told @CBSSports. Two years of eligibility remaining. Story coming.
— Jon Rothstein (@JonRothstein) May 4, 2014
And ZagsBlog reported that Tyus Battle, a five-star shooting guard in the 2016 class, will visit Michigan on June 6. See this article.
I thought Battle was a PG? Could certainly be wrong.
I know it's only one or two posters but I really don't get the continued questioning of JB and his recruiting. While he hasn't pulled in a class of nothing but 5 stars, he still has a roster littered with top 50/100 players and has done well with quite a bit less. He won a conference championship with two borderline top 100 kids (Burke & Hardaway) and three 2/3 star types (Novak, Douglass and Morgan). Even with the losses of three future pros, he will still have a team that is considerably more talented than 2011-2012 squad. Good pick up for OSU but I think UM will be just fine.
The thing about Beilein is that he has made a living out of scouting and snagging who-dat prospects that either blow up late in the recruiting cycle, or get to Michigan and develop quickly.
It makes you wonder, much like we wondered about Rich Rod - if he can find diamonds in the rough, what can he do with the cream of the crop?
Well, getting the cream of the crop has meant that Beilein has been forced into wander into unchartered, dirty waters of basketball recruiting - AAU, boosters, under the table deals, etc etc.
I think he's about reached his apex: a smattering of top 100 types with a 5 star headliner / late bloomer here and there. And a few gems in the rough.
And that's fine. That's great. You really cannot complain about the way Beilein has been running Michigan basketball. The complaints are merely gripes. When Beilein retires, we will all sorely miss him.
I mean, at some point, Caris Levert will be a late first round draft pick in 2015. That's 2 guys (him and Trey Burke) that Ohio State didn't want from their own city, that turned out better rated / higher drafted than anyone Ohio State put out since Evan Turner. That's the stuff of legend.
the attitude of the kids. He wants team players rather than 0 assist shooters. He can develop a player; it's hard to take a "me first" player and change him.
If Beilein wanted this kid I am disappointed he did not get him. But what I am reading in this board is what some people make fun of our fanbase - they'd rather win recruiting championships than real ones. (and yes I know the 2 are related) We didn't win any recruiting championships in bball the past 5 years but somehow won 2 BTT in 3 years and was a Burke non foul away from a potential NC.
Sorry I'll take the basketball situation where we never finish top 10 in recruiting and win actual games and championships over our football situation where we finish top 10 most years and do little with it. Obviously best case scenario is we get top 10 classes AND win with it but since it is not the current case I'll take the bball situation all day over the fball situation.
That said I am puzzled what it takes to get more high level recruits to want to come here - I mean the ones who are top 25 to begin with and not ones like Wilson who start out nowhere, sit out with injury most of their junior year and rocket late (similar rocket late to GR3 and Irvin). Guy is churning out NBA picks AND winning while constantly rebuildig / reloading. I just wish it was easier for a staff that deserves it.
I like our chances with McQuaid. I even think he's a better fit then Grandstaff and it doesn't hurt that his dads from Midland, Mi. This article's from January but for those who haven't heard of this kid, this is good place to start.
It amazes me that the same programs are able to land top notch recruits yet they have been unable to develop their talent such as Beilein. I don't understand why recruits don't see this. At this point I trust Beilein with a three star recruit more than Izzo/Matta with a five star recruit
2015 will be an interesting class and has the potential to be huge...
to all the haters: 3 have three top 100 guys coming in this year to match the three top 100 guys last year and three top 100 guys the year before...
I can live with that...
and as I said before: I will take a year three walton over the best freshman PG available (that is if walton doesn't blow up next year, as I expect him to, and go pro after two)
Hello i like your post, if you like basketball yet,do you want to have a basketball jersey:
Keep coming back
A+++++ rating, would buy jersey again
He wants all the OSUs.
EDIT: Of course now that I look it up, Oregon State may have fired the First Brother-In-Law last night, so...